Muslim Women All Body Swimsuits

[Grog]

I think we've already established that it's a choice for Muslims, too.

More Canadian pocket change:

I think that's too broad a statement for me to agree with...

For some, or maybe even most, it might be a cultural statement, for others something they take for granted, etc. So sometimes it might be a choice, and other times, not. Saying it's a "choice" assumes that individuals live in a vacuum where they don't have to worry about the reactions of others... With a matter as loaded as religious expression through dress, I'm not sure we can take "choice" for granted.

And, I'm afraid, in some cases, it's a "choice" motivated by fear. Fear of rejection, fear of disappointing family members, or fear of being harassed or beaten up by local tyrans who think they should decide how you should dress. I certainly don't think it's a majority. But in tight-knit communities with a Muslim majority, like in some of Paris' suburbs, it's certainly happening.

(And even thinking about it, we could imagine a Muslim girl who lives in a non-Muslim community, with non-religious parents, wanting to cover her hair but not doing so because she fears ridicule or rejection from her parents. It's all relative...)

I just don't think it's something we can make sweeping statements about.

[Grog]

Oh, and just a thought:

I live in a small community (100 people) of graduate students from many countries. We take all of our meals together and share a number of common rooms.

Not so long ago, Japanese Woman X is sitting in the dining hall with her legs crossed. Japanese Man Y, a relatively friendly acquaintance but by no means a close friend, walked to her, slapped her on the knee and said (in Japanese, so I rely on her for the translation) that this was not a proper way to sit for a Japanese woman. There is no reason to believe that it was a joke.

She didn't feel too good about that, to say the least. I can't even start imagining the conflicted feelings she must have had following that event. It made ME very mad. But I'm sure her own feelings were much more complicated...

So generally I think it's safe to assume that how women dress, eat, sit, look, act, etc. is not just about their own "choice"... The same probably applies for men, as all men who have been found to be "too feminine" know...

[RoadRaven]

My two cents...

Interesting thread and interesting discussion

Re what the Koran says... well, one way of reading/interpreting passages of the Koran tells us that men cannot be trusted to behave themselves around women, that women should cover themselves in order to stay safe... men have no self control and the sight of womens skin can drive them past the edge of sanity. This interpretation has been verified for me by two Muslim males - however, they are only two of the thousands and thousands who follow this books teachings.

Regarding the Japanese man chastising the Japanese woman... well, Japan is actually highly prudish about sexuality in public (despite western perceptions of there fetishes with school girl uniforms etc).
My understanding is that Japanese law will not allow any displays of sexual intimacy in public unless they are between married couples. Hence, the only sexual scenes in movies with real people are between married couples. Hence the high popularity of manga and anime where the girls and women are cartoons and therefore ok to be involved in sexual acts with caricature males, or aliens/weird non-human creatures.

I am happy to be critiqued on this... this is only my perspective from what I have heard and seen and read on a very limited scale and from a western viewpoint and understanding.