It's official; I suck at climbing

**Cassandra_Cain** · 10-31-2006, 01:00 PM

I've read the trainingbible and am familiar with the Friel's (joe & dirk) methods. I definitely have issues with some of the things they suggest....both the idea of having riders put huge amounts of LSD training as a way of gaining fitness and this issue with weight training. The latter is the subject here, not the former so I won't get into that.

Also cadence is one component of power, but hardly the end all be all. There is no best cadence, and you'll notice riders doing TT's will use a high cadence to make their best power, while on climbs it typically lower, and in crits it is entirely different too. Training at 50, 80, or 100 is, in of and by itself - key phrase - not going to make you any fitter, though it can improve your leg speed or economy if those are issues.

Forces exerted in endurance cycling are very low - I didn't arbitrarily decide that or make it up, it is simple physics. I can give many examples of this via any of a number of my power files on long mountain climbs - and you can tell me if the forces were high.

If people want to lift weights, great, there's much in favor of the activity but IMO, it will not make you faster on a bike, except on a track!

Ok on to other topics, have fun with those hills!

**alforfun** · 10-31-2006, 02:47 PM

All I know is, I do lift weights. I can run up four flights of stairs at work without breathing hard. However....it is NOT FUN going up hills, but I think you get better mostly just by biking. At least thats the way it appears to me. So....hopefully Ill get more biking in before the big freeze sets in.

**Dogmama** · 10-31-2006, 05:55 PM

C-Cain - Lance lifted weights when he wasn't racing. Big weights. Since I started doing serious weight training, my climbing has improved remarkably. I was always pleased with my ability to climb, but now I can blast up hills.

I found the following articles that support weight training and cycling performance. This is from the Journal of Applied Physiology:

http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/conten...ract/65/5/2285

The conclusion is:"These data do not demonstrate any negative performance effects of adding heavy-resistance training to ongoing endurance-training regimens. They indicate that certain types of endurance performance, particularly those requiring fast-twitch fiber recruitment, can be improved by strength-training supplementation."

This was in pub med:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Citation

The conclusion is: "These findings indicate that strength training improves cycle endurance performance independently of changes in VO2max. This improved performance appears to be related to increases in LT and leg strength." (LT= lactate threshold). So, apparently they found that strength training does increase lactate threshold.

I think you'll find that competitive cyclists do strength training in the off season. The theory of specificity is important, but augmenting training with other modalities is the rule rather than the exception. Case in point: Lance increased his ability to cycle in thin mountain air by sleeping in a special tent that reduced the amount of oxygen he received. The theory of specificity would require him to endlessly blast up mountain hills.

I can sit in the drops longer because I do bench presses & tricep exercises. I can climb longer because I do squats which strength my glutes and lower back. When my muscles don't quit, I can work on my lung capacity. And I become a better cyclist, and a LOT better at climbing hills. And, I wasn't a bad hill climber to start with (she says modestly!)

**Kathi** · 10-31-2006, 07:07 PM

I'm piping in here mainly because I know the type of hills you are talking about. I used to live in Cincinnati and have done many miles in the Southwestern Ohio, Kentucky and hilly parts of Indiana.

Many of the hills you will encounter are "rollers" which means they are short downhills with short uphills. It's tempting to coast down those hills but don't. Keep your pace by spinning down them. This will give you enough momentum to make it up the other side. Like Eclectic said, when you start to lose momentum start shifting your big chainring. You may spin a little and think you are in the wrong ring but your speed will catch up. Then start to shift the rear cassette.

Hill climbing takes practice and timing the shifting. If you have a heart rate monitor use it and learn what your hill climbing heart rate should be and use it to pace yourself.

Yes, I agree that hill climbing is strength and endurance. I recently did Bicycle Ride Across Tennessee and Cycle North Carolina. Neither ride was particularly hard hill wise but I'm recovering from ACL surgery this past Feb and didn't get to build my endurance for the hills. I made it through the 80+ days of Brat, (with a meltdown at 60 miles everyday) but on the first day of CNC the hills were much harder and I began walking more and more of them. After 44 miles I gave up and sagged in. I was devastated! The only other time I sagged in on a tour was this year on Candisc and that was due to 20+ mph winds.

From that experience I learned that I didn't have the endurance and power I had before my injury. It was a very hard pill to swallow because I'm a fairly good climber and came to terms with hills many years ago. But I felt like I'm a beginner again and having to start all over. My only consolation was that I was 7+ months from a pretty tough knee surgery and I still need time to build my endurance.

Don't get discouraged with hills, they will become easier as you get more experienced. Just remember that they are more techinque than anything. I look back at the hills I walked many years ago on the Horsey Hundred in Georgetown Ky and wonder why I had to walk them.

You have lots of opportunities to do some great organized hilly rides in Oh, Ky. and Ind. The cycle clubs in Cincy, Louisville, Lexington have some great rides. The Dayton, Oh cycle clubs have some good rides too with fewer hills.

A used to be good hill climber.

**Cassandra_Cain** · 10-31-2006, 08:14 PM

I guess you wish to continue this discussion, so be it.