Cycling "knock knees"??

[KnottedYet]

I've been riding for about 20 years - have a hitch (what I call it in my right leg) where my right leg (knee) dips towards the top tube. It gets worse when I'm tired. I've always attributed it to the fact that I have crushed vertebrae in my lower back and compensate for that.

So far, no knee pain - so I'm not sure about the theory that this is going to cause trouble in all people.

Yep, I agree.

I should've added that my right knee tracking in is a biomechanical thing--not that the left one is way out, but it's straighter--and while I've got a host of issues with my right side, the knee is definitely not one of them.

If your joints are happy and you aren't generating medial/lateral stress, life is good. Like I said, I've seen some pretty wild knees and some pretty interesting compensations, but if they are tracking straight (femur relative to tibia) we don't try to change anything in the clinic.

Legitimate biomechanical compensations are exactly that, and shouldn't be changed.

However, if someone doesn't already have something they are correcting for, and they find their knee is wobbling due to a weakness or a force imbalance; they need to be aware of the stress they are putting through the structure.

I have seen plenty of sucessful knee replacements, but keeping your own knee healthy is usually a pretty good idea.

[RoadRaven]

Like its already been said - "knock knees" is desirable.

In my experience, many new cyclists tend to ride with their knees out - and so do many older cyclists.

That was certainly me, with one knee pointing more out than the other.

Getting my knees both pointing forward alleviated knee discomfort.

Getting my knees in the habit of pointing in to the frame has "disappeared" my knee pain and of course in a race situation, you become more aero.

Having knees pointed out, or even straight ahead creates a "bucket" which "catches" wind and slows you...

The most important thing is your comfort though... find the best way for you to ride and stick with it.

[velogirl]

Actually, I would say that neither knock-knees nor bow-legs are desirable, but they're very common with inexperienced riders (or more experienced riders who've never been taught how to pedal correctly).

Typically women are more knock-kneed; men are more bowlegged. The condition has to do with hip flexibility. Neither is an efficient way to ride because you see wasted motion in the pedal stroke. It takes time to correct the flexibility differences and track in a straight plane. While we don't want to "force" the pedal stroke (which causes stress on the ankles, knees, and hipe), we want to correct this within an acceptable range of motion for each individual.

[RoadRaven]

Sorry Velo... what I meant when I chimed in on the "knock knees", I was not referring to true 'diagnosed' knock knees...

I just meant that when you cycle, if you are aiming for aero position, you try and "aim" your knees inwards to reduce the bucket effect - in the same way aero bars reduce the bucket created on the tops or drops.

You are very right, Velo, you still want comfort for the rider and position should not compromise comfort.

[SouthernBelle]

Would properly positioned cleats, assuming your are riding clipless, help alleviate some of this?

[aicabsolut]

If the knee issue is stemming from the foot being allowed to toe-in or out due to bad cleat alignment, then yeah, it would help.

If the problem is in the way the foot is making contact with the pedal (a varus or valgus abnormality), then moving the clips won't make much difference. In that case, you'd need a forefoot wedge to help align the leg. From what I've read, it's those kind of issues that can generate knee pain under load. Wedges and arch support can also help people whose tibia curve slightly (usually outward from the ankle--like my right side).

Then there are issues with the hips and pelvis: flexibility, muscle imbalances, alignment etc.

[Melstar]

Ok ok.. so from what i gather after reading everyones posts, is that knees inwards to bike frame isn't necessarily a bad thing in fact its good for racing... as long as the knee tracks a uniform path during its course of pedaling? Right? Wrong? No?

To knotted_yet: My knee doesn't wobble erratically through the pedal motion. The knee does however angle inwards for segments during a ride where i'll pedal with that form for some distance.

Perhaps weak muscles? I'm not exactly very strong so i'm not sure. hmm

Okie.. thanks for the feedback tho.