LBS...wah....

[elk]

I took my bike in to get some help switching out my handlebars...(another thread)...I can't put any more spacers on, so I opted to get some neato nittos from Rivendell (Albatross)...swept back, upright posture bars. I want to sit more upright. And my cables aren't long enough. And I don't feel ready to do that job myself.

Anyway.....I called the closest BS...been around since the 30's and I've never seen any other customers in there, so I figured I could maybe get it back sooner. They are not as hip as other other LBS in PDX for sure. The guy who owns it is an old racer.

I called yesterday and talked to the mechanic ( he was pleasant). when I brought it in, the owner was a little gruff and was giving me a hard time about wanting it back ASAP...which I was NOT demanding about...I just said I would miss my bike...which I do.
"What do you think every one ahead of you wants?" he says.
"They want their bikes back ASAP of course," I says. "They miss them when they're gone."

I left it and can get it back at 3. But I am not happy....I'm hoping that the job they do is not necessarily proportionate to how nice they are....if they've been around since 1938...they have to do something right!!!

But I just feel dissed. I will not go back there. I could easily "have a talk" with him, but don't want to. I just want my bike to be ok....

[mimitabby]

everyone does NOT want their bike ASAP. I dropped off a bike right before i went out of the country for two weeks.
Some of us can't GET to the bike shop until the next weekend. what a loser!

[elk]

now I know why no one is ever in there! But how do they stay in buisness?

Anyone else in Portland know what I'm talking about?

[Running Mommy]

Ok, so here is my beef with the BS industry as a whole...

At Interbike I sat through a seminar on the state of the Industry- Independant retailers were the target audience. To say the trend is flat would be an understatement. Actually it's trending down.

In order to reverse the downward spiral the mindset has GOT to change.
The speaker had some great idea's, and was IMPLORING everyone in the room to change tactics and step up to the plate.
He spoke about how unfriendly bike shops can be, from an asthetic point of view, to the attitude of the staff.
He made a point of saying that the bike shops are targeting the wrong customer. They need to be targeting women, and the casual cyclist. As THEY are going to be the consumer who will keep you in business. He stated the % of spending decisions that are made by women. I think it was like 80%. Thats HUGE.
He also talked about how intimidating it can be for a casual or newbie cyclist to walk through the door and see all the metal, and fancy looking parts that they have no idea what they are looking at.
Merchandising needs to be softened up, Instead of looking like a dark machine shop it needs to be pleasing to the eye. Think about when you walk into a shop that is well merchandized. Your drawn to the racks to see what they have because the store is so nice. It's a subconsious thing I think, but it's true. If the store is pleasing to the eye you will spend more time browsing.
AND the staff (owners on down) need to learn some people skills at the very least. Snippy replies, sarcasm, and an elitist attitude are NOT skills that one needs to work in a bike shop. I just don't understand how bike shops have gotten away from giving good service?? It amazes me sometimes that they even stay in business with some of the things I've seen/heard!

Sure it's also important to be able to satisfy the hardcore dude. But they are more prone to already know exactly what they want when they walk through the door, AND they just want to know a few key things- can you get the part/bike/wheel/ etc, How much will it cost me, how long will it take.
Answer those key ?'s to their satisfaction and you have the sale.

Sooo as I step off my soap box, I am pledging that Estrella Mountain Cyclery will be a pleasing place to shop, have a good selection, and most importantly will treat EVERYONE who walks through the door with the utmost respect.
I demand that our shop be the friendliest bike shop in town!

[Duck on Wheels]

Ok, so here is my beef with the BS industry as a whole...

At Interbike I sat through a seminar on the state of the Industry- Independant retailers were the target audience. To say the trend is flat would be an understatement. Actually it's trending down.

In order to reverse the downward spiral the mindset has GOT to change.
The speaker had some great idea's, and was IMPLORING everyone in the room to change tactics and step up to the plate.
He spoke about how unfriendly bike shops can be, from an asthetic point of view, to the attitude of the staff.
He made a point of saying that the bike shops are targeting the wrong customer. They need to be targeting women, and the casual cyclist. As THEY are going to be the consumer who will keep you in business. He stated the % of spending decisions that are made by women. I think it was like 80%. Thats HUGE.
He also talked about how intimidating it can be for a casual or newbie cyclist to walk through the door and see all the metal, and fancy looking parts that they have no idea what they are looking at.
Merchandising needs to be softened up, Instead of looking like a dark machine shop it needs to be pleasing to the eye. Think about when you walk into a shop that is well merchandized. Your drawn to the racks to see what they have because the store is so nice. It's a subconsious thing I think, but it's true. If the store is pleasing to the eye you will spend more time browsing.
AND the staff (owners on down) need to learn some people skills at the very least. Snippy replies, sarcasm, and an elitist attitude are NOT skills that one needs to work in a bike shop. I just don't understand how bike shops have gotten away from giving good service?? It amazes me sometimes that they even stay in business with some of the things I've seen/heard!

Sure it's also important to be able to satisfy the hardcore dude. But they are more prone to already know exactly what they want when they walk through the door, AND they just want to know a few key things- can you get the part/bike/wheel/ etc, How much will it cost me, how long will it take.
Answer those key ?'s to their satisfaction and you have the sale.

Sooo as I step off my soap box, I am pledging that Estrella Mountain Cyclery will be a pleasing place to shop, have a good selection, and most importantly will treat EVERYONE who walks through the door with the utmost respect.
I demand that our shop be the friendliest bike shop in town!

Dang! Now we all have to move to Arizona???

[SalsaMTB]

Ok, so here is my beef with the BS industry as a whole...

At Interbike I sat through a seminar on the state of the Industry- Independant retailers were the target audience. To say the trend is flat would be an understatement. Actually it's trending down.

In order to reverse the downward spiral the mindset has GOT to change.
The speaker had some great idea's, and was IMPLORING everyone in the room to change tactics and step up to the plate.
He spoke about how unfriendly bike shops can be, from an asthetic point of view, to the attitude of the staff.
He made a point of saying that the bike shops are targeting the wrong customer. They need to be targeting women, and the casual cyclist. As THEY are going to be the consumer who will keep you in business. He stated the % of spending decisions that are made by women. I think it was like 80%. Thats HUGE.
He also talked about how intimidating it can be for a casual or newbie cyclist to walk through the door and see all the metal, and fancy looking parts that they have no idea what they are looking at.
Merchandising needs to be softened up, Instead of looking like a dark machine shop it needs to be pleasing to the eye. Think about when you walk into a shop that is well merchandized. Your drawn to the racks to see what they have because the store is so nice. It's a subconsious thing I think, but it's true. If the store is pleasing to the eye you will spend more time browsing.
AND the staff (owners on down) need to learn some people skills at the very least. Snippy replies, sarcasm, and an elitist attitude are NOT skills that one needs to work in a bike shop. I just don't understand how bike shops have gotten away from giving good service?? It amazes me sometimes that they even stay in business with some of the things I've seen/heard!

Sure it's also important to be able to satisfy the hardcore dude. But they are more prone to already know exactly what they want when they walk through the door, AND they just want to know a few key things- can you get the part/bike/wheel/ etc, How much will it cost me, how long will it take.
Answer those key ?'s to their satisfaction and you have the sale.

Sooo as I step off my soap box, I am pledging that Estrella Mountain Cyclery will be a pleasing place to shop, have a good selection, and most importantly will treat EVERYONE who walks through the door with the utmost respect.
I demand that our shop be the friendliest bike shop in town!

Hey, Dh and I attended the same seminar! We just opened our shop 1.5 years ago and the seminar was definitely interesting. It helped to confirm we were doing some things right (focusing on the customer, tons of group rides, active in the community etc) but also helped us to see the trends and help us generate new ideas for the store.

I do think that the seminar would be most beneficial for the type of shop that OP attended. I recall before we opened our shop, we visited many of the locals together and I told them I was shopping for a bike. I think only 1 shop actually talked to me, not my dh. It was a HUGE eye opened for my dh. Hopefully other shops will be able to take something away from the seminar.

For the OP, just because the guy was a bit grumpy doesn't mean the quality of work will be poor. There's no excuse for him talking unprofessionally to you, but hopefully (for your sake) it's the quality of the service, not the personality that keeps the shop running!

[Sheesh]

The reason we continue to frequent our shop of choice, versus any of the other shops in town, is because of the service we receive from the moment walk in the door. We've waited for what seemed like forever before even being acknowledged in empty shops, and then just walked out the door because nobody even looked up. The minute we walked into our now-favorite store, the owner looked up, acknowledged us and asked if he could help us find anything. The rest of the people in the shop are not nearly as helpful, but the owner tries to get them to be that way.

When I went in with my husband to talk to the owner about getting a cross bike, he called me behind the counter to show me some catalogs and some stuff on his computer. He talked directly to me, asking me what I wanted, and pretty much ignored my husband. It was great!

For these reasons, I will continue to give my hard-earned money to this guy, rather than any other shop.

And, from an outsider's perspective, I think every bike shop needs a coffee stand included (or a bar). It gives the guys some other way of spending their money, and an excuse to hang out and chat. If you're going to hang out and chat anyway, you may as well give me some money for a cup of coffee or a beer.

[Zen]

And, from an outsider's perspective, I think every bike shop needs a coffee stand included (or a bar). It gives the guys some other way of spending their money, and an excuse to hang out and chat.

Or an excuse to hang out and check out the guys

[Kalidurga]

I've read some similar articles, including one in the latest RBR netletter. Makes me very glad I found my two LBS's, even if they aren't really local (15-20 miles away). There are a lot of shops to choose from, five alone in the town where my favorite shops are located, and it was definitely the demeanor of the owner/managers that made me want to come back initially. I go to both of these shops because the guys there just plain enjoy talking about bikes, with anyone. When there's nothing I need but I'm in the area, I'll go in, ask a question about something, shoot the breeze for a bit about where we've each ridden lately, then walk out without buying anything, and they still greet me with a smile the next time I walk in the door! That is what makes me a loyal customer, and why I'll spend all of my bike $$'s at those two shops, rather than at closer locations or on-line.

Good to see that the industry is recognizing this.

[elk]

He was a lot nicer when I back to get my bike. Chatty and sweet. I also learned that after over 40years, he had sold the shop and it would change hands in a year.

He reversed my brakes...so my front brake is at my right hand and my shifter is now on the left...and they're kind of upside down...

This pissed me off; he told me it was alot better NOT to cross the wires and The shifting would be easier and I would get used to it.....Meantime, he was trying to get my old bar off my rack and was kind of flailing around in a way that made me just want my bike back and to get out of there.

OK...so the guy is European and I'm thinkning maybe it's a European thing and I did some internet research; found actually lots of sound support for this reversal...Including my current hero, King Retro Sheldon Brown...So ok, I'll try it.

But my brake levers are upside down!! An aesthetic concern.
I'll live with it for awhile and if it bugs me, I'll change it. I won't go back there though...

I have another question that I'll post seperately...

[Running Mommy]

"And, from an outsider's perspective, I think every bike shop needs a coffee stand included (or a bar). "

HA! Funny you should mention that! We are going to have a lounge area in the shop complete with a couch, couple of chairs, and a flat screen. When I was at Interbike I spoke with a lady from Kinetic coffee. Good stuff- AND they do private label.
We plan to have weekend morning rides from the shop, and then have coffee and some baked goods for the end of the ride. I LOVE to bake, so I figure it'll be a good excuse for me to bake up some muffins, scones, or nanner bread. I make a mean chocolate almond biscotti too... Mmmmmmnnnn...
But I digress.
So my thought is that if the coffee is a hit, I'll get some done private label and sell it.
Ahhh yes ladies, I have plans. Yes I do.. Now I just need to get them in ACTION! OY!!!

But Elk- Back to your lbs dude. You know, I'm not sure I would have reversed ANYTHING without first speaking with the owner. I would have given you a call, explained what I was thinking, and then had YOU make the call. I mean it's YOUR bike..... Hmmmm.... Yeah, he may have oodles of experience and all, but that's not a decision I would have made... Maybe that's just me??

[elk]

no...RMommy...you would've been doing the right thing.... I was miffed.
You're gonna have a GREAT shop!!!

[Sheesh]

Running Mommy - I'm moving to AZ and making your shop my new favorite LBS! I'll sit and drink coffee and browse the women's clothing selection while the hubby talks components with the mechanics. I think that would be heaven for both of us.

Elk - I wouldn't hesitate to take my bike back and wait while they returned your brake levers to the way you had them. It's YOUR bike, and you can have them whatever way YOU want them. Don't let that guy push you around.

[elk]

sheesh....you're right and I wouldn't hesitate to have them change them, but I don't want to go back....I'd rather be out a few bucks and have someone I like and trust do it.
Meantime...I'll try it out...

[onimity]

Hey Elk,

Yea, the reversed brakes is def. a european thing (or an american thing...) but when I've ridden internationally companies that I've rented bikes from have *always* made sure that the bike matches my expectations, not their preference. The reason for this is that instinct is a powerful thing and if you apply the wrong amount of pressure thinking you have the opposite brake, that can be bad, and you are more likely to do this when you are not thinking about this, i.e., when a car pulls in front of you, or you *really* need to stop. True, you'll probably get used to it over time, but it sets you up to have incorrect instincts on any other bike you are going to ride in the US... don't know about you, but I have a few...

Personally I like a bit of a surly attitude every once in a while, these people end up being some of my favorites if you can dish it back, but it's probably no wonder the shop is empty. Those sorts are fun to have a beer and chat with sometimes, but less so to do business with.

I had a great experience at my LBS today. I went in for a fitting on the bike I am taking to Patagonia. I've been tweaking a few things and wanted to make sure the fit was good, though it felt good to me. The LBS guy tweaked a few more things, and when he'd say, you could do A, or not, we'd discuss and he'd say, "so we're in agreement then, that there's probably nothing to be gained from..." awesome. He told me in great detail about everything he looked at. Of course they didn't charge me for the fit, and when I asked about winter gloves after, and had decided on the ones I wanted, he said "I think we have some of those marked 35% off in the back" ?!? way cool! I also got my new tires, they had just come in, and he had a) remembered that I'd ordered them and b) noticed that the guys in back were processing an incoming shipment containing them. I love that familiarity, like small town businesses that used to be so much more frequent. I love that attention to detail. I love that every person in both of their stores is the same way. Except the owner, he's kind of a jerk. But he has a good staff...

Best, they asked if I'd need any help installing the tires (they always offer to install anything you buy there, but he knows I like to be self-sufficient). Not a chance! I said. When he was ringing up my tires a guy came up to pay for them fixing his flat. He had already wheeled the bike out to the car. The LBS guy said: what kind of bike was it? Flat guy says: Uh, that red one I just had up here. LBS guy smiles. I said: It looked like a 2007 Kona Lana'i? Flat guy says: Yea! That's it! LBS guy just smiles.

Honestly, I think that their attitude toward women is the way it is because there are so many women here that ride, and ride seriously. That, and the attitude of bike shops here tends to almost be more one of advocacy than of retail. They want people to ride. They want people to be able to maintain their own bikes. They want people to love their bikes. It really shows, and I love giving them my business for that reason.

On a similar note, though, while I prefer giving my LBS business over shopping online, I also love giving business to team estrogen, for the great selection of woman-specific products, for the helpful articles and for the tremendous community. This is my favorite virtual LBS, to be sure.

And great idea about the LBS bar. Mine has free water & sports drinks, and the counter serves as a bar more-or-less, but I think it's a great idea.

Anne