Yet another gearing question

[kelownagirl]

So I'm still struggling with whole issue of climbing hills on my road bike compared to my mountain bike and have read all the gearing threads - thanks so much for the info btw... Loved the Sheldon Brown site where you punch in your info and it gives you lots of stuff back. Anyway..... I am wondering where cadence comes into the whole thing. I generally ride at a cadence of about 90rpm. It feels comfortable to me and comes naturally. When I am on the really hard hills - you know, the ones where people say, "don't worry about your speed, just drop into your granny gear and spin up" - I find I can't get much about 50 rpm even in my lowest gear. I'm struggling along at about 8-9 km/h and pushing my legs as hard as I can. If the hill is really long, my legs are aching so bad by the time I get up to the top, that it takes me a fair while to recover.

So the gearing question is - should I consider switching over to a rear cassette with a ring that would allow me to spin at 80-90 rpm up those hard hills? Using Sheldon's site, I see that the 11-34 would probably allow me to do that.

Any thoughts? Thanks in advance..

barb

[Veronica]

I train with a HRM monitor that shows cadence. I have the HRM set to beep when I go above a certain HR. Then I focus on keeping my cadence at 90 RPMs as I go up the hill. I try to stay in as high a gear as I can, keeping the cadence at 90, w/o getting the HR too high. When I start beeping, I drop a gear, if I still have a long way to go. If I'm close to the top, I'll push through the beeping.

V.

[RoadRaven]

I'm like V... relatively low cadence (compared to my cadence on a flat) in a low gear... I only have to cogs at the front (52 and 39) so my lowest gear is 52-27

Try not to push yourself "as hard as you can"...

Rather, settle into a rythym/pace you know you can maintain for most or all of the hill - the aim on a training ride is to get to the top of the hill feeling not too exhausted or sore... and remember not to stop at the top, keep your legs rotating as you go down the other side as this helps the muscles to recover. If you have to stop somewhere, stop on the way down or at the bottom - but never at the top.

Good luck - remember - your own rythym and stick with it

[kelownagirl]

Thanks ladies! I guess for me, the problem is, my HR is up there almost right away. I have to push hard to maintain even 50 rpm in my easiest gear, and even then I'm only going 8-9 km/h. I could probably slow down to about 6 km/h before I fall off my bike, but it doesn't make a whole lot of difference to how hard I'm working (re: HR and leg muscles and of course breathing). My HRM starts beeping at me fairly soon as I start up the hills, and I'm in way better shape now than I was 5 months ago. I have no choice than to push thru the beeping or I'd never get up the hill at all... I guess that's why I'm wondering if I should see if I can get an even easier gear on my bike. Or maybe I should just keep on riding and get stronger...

I must say though, the 1000 km of road biking I've done this summer has done wonders for my climbing on my MTBike.

Edit: my front is 30-42-52 and my back is 12-26

Thanks again,
barb

[Kano]

Barb -- no hints, no tips, cuz I've got NO clue about gears! All I've got for you is a "you're not alone!" and to go with that, an "I'm so glad I'm not alone too!" We were out practicing today -- in this weather! If you have a peek at the attached picture -- sunny, high clouds, 70-some degrees, sounds and looks ideal, doesn't it? Sadly, it LOOKS like plains, but there should be mountains in the background! Tater and I are surrounded by wildfires! the air stinks!

Anyhow, hills were not fun today! We had a good strong head wind today as we headed south and east to the hills (yay! come tired time, we'll have a tail wind! HAH! it shifted! we enjoyed SOME tail winds, but then, by tired time, we had head winds again!) The false flats got me today, and then we got to the real hill. Poor Earl, he offered to go back toward home (I think he was hoping) several times before we tackled the big one, said, it's okay -- those "roadies on their fancy bikes" turned down toward town instead of riding up this one, but I kept telling him that he could go back, but _I_ was going up that hill.

I think I stopped to let my legs and breath catch up to me five times today. DH came back once and asked how I was doing, which was probably a bad idea -- messed with my ego when he came down to ride back up ahead of me a second time, you know? When we got to the top, and my speed started building again, suddenly I was raring to go, and there was DH, "don't you want to stop?" I can't decide if it's in my body or my head that makes hills such a challenge: last weekend, I did far more hill climbing with no stopping and no maddeningly low speeds (which is what I think bugs me MOST about hills!), so I've got no sort of consistency even to whine about!

One of these days, maybe I'll get me one of those road bikes like you have, and start climbing hills like, like, like, maybe six miles per hour! And, one of these days, maybe I'll have lost another 30-50 pounds, and then I'll REALLY go up the hills!

That reminds me, I've got a mighty serious post-ride hungry going on....

Karen in Boise

[SadieKate]

There are a lot of articles on how to decide what cadence you should use for hills. Each person is different. This article was a in recent RoadBikerRider newsletter. Here's the start:

7. Try This on Your Next Ride o^o o^o o^o o^o o^o o^o

Take Testa's Test to find your best climbing style and cadence.

Max Testa, M.D., is a former pro team physician who now directs a sports medicine clinic in Davis, California, owned by Eric Heiden of speedskating and cycling fame.

According to Testa, the key to discovering your most-efficient cadence is to pay attention to what happens when you're about to blow on a climb.

"What fails when you're trying to keep up on a climb?" he asks. "Do you shift to a lower gear and spin fast because if you go to a bigger gear and grind your legs die? In that case, you need strength. But if, when you use a smaller gear and spin, your breathing goes out of control, you need more cardiovascular conditioning."

Try Testa's Test when you're doing hill repeats:

The test is at: http://www.roadbikerider.com/255e.htm

[Kano]

SadieKate -- this intrigues me! I can hardly wait to play with it!

Now to figure out this hill repeats thing. Off I go to the search engines....

Karen in Boise

[emily_in_nc]

Thanks ladies! I guess for me, the problem is, my HR is up there almost right away. I have to push hard to maintain even 50 rpm in my easiest gear, and even then I'm only going 8-9 km/h. I could probably slow down to about 6 km/h before I fall off my bike, but it doesn't make a whole lot of difference to how hard I'm working (re: HR and leg muscles and of course breathing). My HRM starts beeping at me fairly soon as I start up the hills, and I'm in way better shape now than I was 5 months ago. I have no choice than to push thru the beeping or I'd never get up the hill at all... I guess that's why I'm wondering if I should see if I can get an even easier gear on my bike. Or maybe I should just keep on riding and get stronger.
Edit: my front is 30-42-52 and my back is 12-26

Barb - if you ride in big hills, which it sounds like, that's not very low gearing, especially if you have 700c wheels on your bike. However, to change to a different cogset, you may be looking at a rear derailleur change as well. You could go ot a 12-27 in back if one more gear would make the difference. That was the gearing I had on my Terry Isis, and I could get up most hills in my easiest gear, but I do know the very slow feeling and being about to die in that situation! On my Bike Friday, I have a 11-32 or 11-34 (I can never remember) in back, and can get up most hills in my middle front ring, which is nice. With the smaller wheels, though, that also makes the gearing lower than it would be on a big-wheeled bike.

If I were you, I'd probably change to a 12-27 in back, which is just a simple cassette change, and then just train like crazy, unless you plan to tour with a load and really want mountain gearing on your bike.

Good luck!
Emily

[kelownagirl]

There are a lot of articles on how to decide what cadence you should use for hills. Each person is different. This article was a in recent RoadBikerRider newsletter. Here's the start:

7. Try This on Your Next Ride o^o o^o o^o o^o o^o o^o

Take Testa's Test to find your best climbing style and cadence.

Max Testa, M.D., is a former pro team physician who now directs a sports medicine clinic in Davis, California, owned by Eric Heiden of speedskating and cycling fame.

According to Testa, the key to discovering your most-efficient cadence is to pay attention to what happens when you're about to blow on a climb.

"What fails when you're trying to keep up on a climb?" he asks. "Do you shift to a lower gear and spin fast because if you go to a bigger gear and grind your legs die? In that case, you need strength. But if, when you use a smaller gear and spin, your breathing goes out of control, you need more cardiovascular conditioning."

Try Testa's Test when you're doing hill repeats:

The test is at: http://www.roadbikerider.com/255e.htm

Interesting, SadieKate, thanks! I think I am a spinner for sure - a spinner with exercise-induced asthma, so I can relate to the out-of-breath thing too. As long as I use my puffer now though, I am much more comfortable spinning than mashing. I know this is definitely true when I'm dong hills on the mountain bike. I can spin without getting too tired, even up steep slimbs. I have only been riding for 5 months so I still have a long way to go as far as leg strength is concerned but already I have noticed a huge difference since the beginning of April. Is riding 100-150 km a week enough or should I be doing strength exercises as well? I usually just do weights for arms, back etc.. Guess doing more hill repeats would be good too eh?


Emily - thanks for the suggestion. I think I will talk to the boys at the LBS. I do think I'd like to be able to spin up a little more - I don't even care what speed I'm doing.


Kano - LOL on your description. I can totally relate - glad to know I'm not alone! I LOVE my road bike but must admit I was disappointed that it didn't actually help me improve on the steep hills. It's much faster on the flats and the gradual climbs, but when I hit the steeper stuff, I am dying. No more spinning up. I must say I do like the fact that MTBiking is much easier now that I've been riding the road bike so much..

[7rider]

Just the phrase "hill repeats" makes me feel queasy!!
Yuck.
But I'm definitely a masher. When I run out of juice on the hills, I click up a gear and stand and slog it out. It's never pretty, and I keep thinking...boy, I hate the StairMaster at the gym....what the heck am I doing????