Bike Fit/LBS/and Regrets

[CyborgQueen]

I had a nice LONG post, and I will put it up if anyone wants me to.


First - Does anyone have a 44cm bike that they're willing to sell?? Carbon of course is better, but Carbon/Alumium mix is good, Specialized Ruby or similar Geometry (racing style/Performance over fitness, which is more relaxed than I need) is a plus/


Secondly - have anyone here spent $1000+ or even $1500+ (i'm just pulling numbers out of my hat) on a bike from one LBS, and after several different fittings, and going to another LBS and being told that the bike is too big/too small and regret for buying that bike? What did you do to remedy problem? Did you wait a while before buying a new bike?

I will tell you my story (as it's a bit longish), if people are curious.

[Possegal]

I spent about $1000 on a bike at a store where my instinct was telling me that I wasn't getting the right attention from the kid selling it to me. I should have trusted that instinct and walked away, but I admit my bike was a real impulse purchase and had I walked away, not sure I would have gone back.

I rode it for one summer and then the next year took it to a local store that a lot of the local ladies here recommended. When the woman there did the fitting, the first thing she said was - I would never have put you on this size bike; I think you needed a size up from this.

But in the end, she made it work for me. Lots of tweaking and raising of things and changing out pieces. It works much better for me now. I bought another bike (more an 'asphalt' bike, I think they call it, than a road bike) and you can bet I bought it from her. When I'm ready to get another road bike, I'll go back to her first. I may find I like a brand she doesn't carry, but between this board, and the woman that owns the other store, I hope I'm better prepared than I was the last time.

Not sure that helps you at all, but I can relate about the wrong purchase part. At least my fitting was able to make it work for me in the long run.

[goldfinch]

I had a nice LONG post, and I will put it up if anyone wants me to.


First - Does anyone have a 44cm bike that they're willing to sell?? Carbon of course is better, but Carbon/Alumium mix is good, Specialized Ruby or similar Geometry (racing style/Performance over fitness, which is more relaxed than I need) is a plus/


Secondly - have anyone here spent $1000+ or even $1500+ (i'm just pulling numbers out of my hat) on a bike from one LBS, and after several different fittings, and going to another LBS and being told that the bike is too big/too small and regret for buying that bike? What did you do to remedy problem? Did you wait a while before buying a new bike?

I will tell you my story (as it's a bit longish), if people are curious.

Tell your story. I am bike shopping and want to hear the stories.

[Abarnes]

Sorry to hear your story, I hope that you have found a shop that listens to you and gets you on the right size.

It sounds like you know what size you need - so push those regretful/burned feelings aside and get what you want. That is to say, get what you deserve - a great fitting bike, fun and happiness.

That was the advice I gave to the 3-4 ladies I encountered over several years in a shop, who, like you, struggled with fit on a bike that was just too big. There was one lady who had bought the bike at another store, came to me for a fit (recommended by a mutual friend) but I had to tell her to take it back for the next size down.

If there are ladies that you know who recommend one shop or fitter over another, that would help too.

[jessmarimba]

I have been lucky, in that I bought both of my bikes used and have been beyond thrilled with how well they both fit (and one was bought on ebay, no chance to even look at it first!). However, a big disclaimer is that neither of mine is technically a road bike so I have a little more leeway.

I had the opposite experience at a Trek factory store, where they had the bike I wanted, only every frame in the next size down was sold out. Rather than push me to buy the frame that I probably would've ended up with anyway, they suggested I call around and try to test ride the smaller frame elsewhere first. They also have a return policy if you end up with the wrong sized bike (it's either 30 or 90 days) so they STILL could've pressured me, and they didn't.

I also remember when I bought my old Cannondale, they had a company policy to let you trade-in and trade-up frames - if you had your original receipt, etc, you could send in your frame for a discount on a new, better one. I imagine you could change sizes if necessary. I don't know if they still have that policy, or if whatever company your bike is from has a similar policy

[Velocivixen]

I am so sorry to hear of your disappointment. It would be nice if anyone could simply go to their LBS and trust what the ideally well informed and educated salesperson told us. However, in reality, this is frequently NOT the case. Ultimately it is up to us as consumers to do a little research first and not to blindly trust sales people. Don't get me wrong, as I am not trying to "blame the victim" and I do feel your pain. I did a ton of research and was measured, did more research, studied geometries and read fitting articles of all genres from Rivendell and Peter White to others, and still wonder if I had gone up a size.
Bottom line as consumers is to come armed with some information, ask a lot of questions, and if it doesn't feel right sleep on it before spending a dime.
Good luck on getting this remedied. I would like to hear your story.

[CyborgQueen]

Thanks for some of the insights, keep 'em coming.

I had no idea about WSD bike fit and such...it was more of an impulse quick buy as the LBS was having a huge sale, and I got $400 off the bike. I have Jamis Ventura Elite in 48cm. Full Ultegra components, and Alu/Carbon mix. If I've gotten Cannondale/Specialized/Trek/Giant with the SAME components and frame material, I would have to spend nearly $800 to $1000 more. Hence why I went with Jamis...plus I like the simplicity of the design...unlike Trek bikes where you see "Trek" stickers everywhere...that drives me batty, but the DuoTrap is very cool.

I was "sized up" when I first shopped around, and was told that this bike is perfect. I trusted him because he was recommended. I wished I went to ALL of the shops, but I only went to three of them. One of them had Specialized, but didn't have any in stock in my size and weren't too helpful. The other shop had a HUGE shop...sells Cannondale/Trek, but too out of my price range, and the guy that I spoke with wasn't too helpful either. Too bad because I met the owner, and he's super nice...I didn't know.

BUT...as time gone on...this was two years ago, so I HIGHLY doubt that Jamis can do anything about it or the LBS that I bought it from...so I'm SOL. I would LOVE to buy a frame from Jamis. Everyone oohs and ahhs over my bike because there's a slew of Cannondale/Specialized/Treks in this town....I met like 3 people so far that has a Jamis in the past two years. I would LOVE it even more if Jamis can just take my old frame and give me a new one with a lower cost. I can just transfer over my components as they're still in a great shape. Jamis - where are you?! :-P I *should* have been recommended the Femme version.

I had my handlebars replaced to a narrower one - didn't have to happen if I bought a WSD bike. The brifters are on the large side. It's okay and tolerable when I shift. I have gotten used to it, but looking at everyone else's they shift so easily, while my wrist has much more movement on the left. Di2 anyone?? :P The WSD Specialized Ruby (the only reason why I'm bring this up is because that's what my current fitter showed me to compare to mine), has Egro handlebars, and the shifters are closer to the drops. Much easier for people with small hands like mine. I can't brake in the drops currently...can't reach 'em, even with shims.

The main issue was the headtop tube length. It is too long. The stem is as short as my fitter can do it. Everywhere I ride...there's hills....1% to 5% grades. I struggle so hard on 'em and sometimes I feel like I'm not getting any better than I did last year. So a better Seat Tube angle will help that (my 74 degree vs 76 degree on Jamis Xenith Comp) as well as smaller crank arm.

My fitter has set up my bike currently enough that I can get comfortable, but he feels that I would be way more comfortable and powerful in a more smaller performance built bike over a relaxed/fitness geometry. So while I have my bike to be for fitted, I have pangs of regrets and wanting to buy a new bike, especially after hearing how he can pretty much promise me that I'll be much more comfortable and better climbing in the long run.

I don't even know if I can sell my current bike...it's very rare that I see anyone selling a Jamis...besides, although my fiance ain't too happy about my feelings of regret, he doesn't want me to buy it "used" or off eBay...I'm drooling over one 2010 44cm Jamis Xenith on ebay that's under $900...the components can be replaced, the frame size cannot....that's the KEY (a shout to Goldfinch). You can remove EVERYTHING from your bike, replace everything, but you cannot change frame size. If you want to buy a carbon bike...go for it...if there's Tigra or Sora parts on 'em, who cares...save up your buckaroos, and get Ultegra or Dura-Ace or SRAM or even Campnologo components down the road.

Hope that kind of clarify my story up a little bit....

[Koronin]

At this point (a year later) we are sure we bought the wrong bike for my husband. I love my road bike, but my husband just cannot get comfortable on his and we've done all kinds of changes to it and he still has issues with it. His is a Cannondale CAAD 8 in a 48cm. He was fitted to it, but just is not comfortable. The local LBS is a Trek and Cannondale dealer and they really push Cannondale. They also don't get why I have no interest in a WSD bike. We were in Raleigh over the weekend and stopped at Preformance (on way home from Bristol). Anyway were looking at the road bikes there and my husband is now 100% convinced that we bought him the absolute wrong road bike, as well as possibly the wrong size (too big). I keep thinking and have suggested he take mine out and adjust it to fit him and see what he thinks of it and if he's more comfortable on it. He doesn't want to do that because it's set for me. Um, we can't put it back to those settings. He's also much more of a mountain bike person.

[Miranda]

Just skimmed this thread, but yes I've had an $1K+ ill fitting bike that was sold to me by the LBS. I pretty much hate the LBS around here with my experiences. It was a 54cm, two frame sizes two big for me, hind-sight knowledge. My bike sizes now are carbon roadie 49cm, xc bici 48cm, and mtb 16". Orbea does make a 44cm women's frame road bike, fwiw. Good Luck.

[KnottedYet]

CQ-
Surly, Salsa, and Soma sell lots of bare frames. A Surly Pacer frame might be the performance level you want, but it sounds like you aren't interested in steel.

Have you contacted Jamis about buying a bare frame?

[nscrbug]

I was sort of in the same boat as you, CyborgQueen. Got sized up at a Trek dealer and was told 54cm 2100 WSD (paid $1400) would be perfect fit for me (I am 5'6", short torso, longer legs). Felt a bit stretched out on the bike from day 1. The guy there never really did a complete fit, hence the reason I could never really get comfortable. I found another shop that did offer "pro" fits for a hefty price tag of $200. Reluctantly, I brought my Trek in for a pro fit and was told that the frame was too large and there wasn't much he could do. He said he could tweak it only so much. So I ended up buying a 51cm Cervelo ($3200) from that shop. The bike was awesome, but it was way too aggressive of a geometry for my bad back. I rode it for a year and sold it. Now I have a 51cm Cannondale Synapse Carbon Fem 3 ($3000), but I continue to have fit issues with this bike too (primarily hand issues). I absolutely HATE the Ultegra components on it (I know this goes against most people's opinions of Ultegra) because the front shifting is SO incredibly stiff...similar to what you were saying about your left shifter and your wrist having to move so far to shift it. It has an extremely long throw. I am lusting for electronic shifting (either the DA Di2 or the new Ultegra Di2 coming out in Sept.). As you can see, this has been a rather expensive experiment in trying to find the right bike. Anyway...didn't mean to hijack your thread...just wanted to chime in to say that you are not alone and I truly hope that you (and I) eventually get THE perfect fitting bike.

Linda

[CyborgQueen]

Not at all Linda! Reading stories like these really made my feelings more valid.

I've heard a lot of information about Steel and how good they are etc. I've never tried them...I'm not against them at all. A few people that I know has steel bike, and would never buy carbon. I'm not really against any material actually, I just want to be COMFORTABLE! If it's steel, then so be it! :-) Although, if it's seriously heavy, then that would make a difference because it's not flat here, so that'll be a lot of weight for me to carry for climbing.

[Kubla]

Thanks for some of the insights, keep 'em coming.

I don't even know if I can sell my current bike...it's very rare that I see anyone selling a Jamis...besides, although my fiance ain't too happy about my feelings of regret, he doesn't want me to buy it "used" or off eBay...I'm drooling over one 2010 44cm Jamis Xenith on ebay that's under $900...the components can be replaced, the frame size cannot....that's the KEY (a shout to Goldfinch). You can remove EVERYTHING from your bike, replace everything, but you cannot change frame size. If you want to buy a carbon bike...go for it...if there's Tigra or Sora parts on 'em, who cares...save up your buckaroos, and get Ultegra or Dura-Ace or SRAM or even Campnologo components down the road.

Hope that kind of clarify my story up a little bit....

CyborgQueen, you shouldn't have much trouble selling your Jamis. I have a Coda Sport and an Aurora (both steel frames) and love these bikes. While they aren't as widely-known as some of the other brands, they definitely have their following.

[indysteel]

Thanks for some of the insights, keep 'em coming.

I had no idea about WSD bike fit and such...it was more of an impulse quick buy as the LBS was having a huge sale, and I got $400 off the bike. I have Jamis Ventura Elite in 48cm. Full Ultegra components, and Alu/Carbon mix. If I've gotten Cannondale/Specialized/Trek/Giant with the SAME components and frame material, I would have to spend nearly $800 to $1000 more. Hence why I went with Jamis...plus I like the simplicity of the design...unlike Trek bikes where you see "Trek" stickers everywhere...that drives me batty, but the DuoTrap is very cool.

I was "sized up" when I first shopped around, and was told that this bike is perfect. I trusted him because he was recommended. I wished I went to ALL of the shops, but I only went to three of them. One of them had Specialized, but didn't have any in stock in my size and weren't too helpful. The other shop had a HUGE shop...sells Cannondale/Trek, but too out of my price range, and the guy that I spoke with wasn't too helpful either. Too bad because I met the owner, and he's super nice...I didn't know.

BUT...as time gone on...this was two years ago, so I HIGHLY doubt that Jamis can do anything about it or the LBS that I bought it from...so I'm SOL. I would LOVE to buy a frame from Jamis. Everyone oohs and ahhs over my bike because there's a slew of Cannondale/Specialized/Treks in this town....I met like 3 people so far that has a Jamis in the past two years. I would LOVE it even more if Jamis can just take my old frame and give me a new one with a lower cost. I can just transfer over my components as they're still in a great shape. Jamis - where are you?! :-P I *should* have been recommended the Femme version.

I had my handlebars replaced to a narrower one - didn't have to happen if I bought a WSD bike. The brifters are on the large side. It's okay and tolerable when I shift. I have gotten used to it, but looking at everyone else's they shift so easily, while my wrist has much more movement on the left. Di2 anyone?? :P The WSD Specialized Ruby (the only reason why I'm bring this up is because that's what my current fitter showed me to compare to mine), has Egro handlebars, and the shifters are closer to the drops. Much easier for people with small hands like mine. I can't brake in the drops currently...can't reach 'em, even with shims.

The main issue was the headtop tube length. It is too long. The stem is as short as my fitter can do it. Everywhere I ride...there's hills....1% to 5% grades. I struggle so hard on 'em and sometimes I feel like I'm not getting any better than I did last year. So a better Seat Tube angle will help that (my 74 degree vs 76 degree on Jamis Xenith Comp) as well as smaller crank arm.

My fitter has set up my bike currently enough that I can get comfortable, but he feels that I would be way more comfortable and powerful in a more smaller performance built bike over a relaxed/fitness geometry. So while I have my bike to be for fitted, I have pangs of regrets and wanting to buy a new bike, especially after hearing how he can pretty much promise me that I'll be much more comfortable and better climbing in the long run.

I don't even know if I can sell my current bike...it's very rare that I see anyone selling a Jamis...besides, although my fiance ain't too happy about my feelings of regret, he doesn't want me to buy it "used" or off eBay...I'm drooling over one 2010 44cm Jamis Xenith on ebay that's under $900...the components can be replaced, the frame size cannot....that's the KEY (a shout to Goldfinch). You can remove EVERYTHING from your bike, replace everything, but you cannot change frame size. If you want to buy a carbon bike...go for it...if there's Tigra or Sora parts on 'em, who cares...save up your buckaroos, and get Ultegra or Dura-Ace or SRAM or even Campnologo components down the road.

Hope that kind of clarify my story up a little bit....

Short of buying a new bike, I'd offer the following suggestions with respect to your current bike. First off, bars and brifters can be swamped out for something that works better for your hands/shoulders. Plus, brifters can often be adjusted to narrow the reach. Yes, these changes may cost some money, but you might talk to the shop where you bought the bike to see if they might give you a bit off any new items. Tell them what problems you're having with the current set up.

As for your seat tube angle, do you happen to know how much set back your current seat post has? You can make a STA effectively steeper by using a seat post with no set back. Is your saddle pushed all the way forward currently? How tall are you, what is your inseam and would you say your femurs are long or short relative to your inseam?

In looking at the Ventura's geometry, I wouldn't say that bike is all that relaxed. IMO, it's geometry isn't radically different from a lot of bikes on the market. Without knowing more, I'm inclined to be a bit skeptical of what the second shop is telling you. I'm not suggesting that you're imagining your fit issue, but some of the buzz words that your shops is using with you makes me wonder about their assessment.

[CyborgQueen]

Seajay - that's the problem in my perspective. NONE of the shops had 48cm or smaller. So I cannot "test" ride them. The shop where I had my yesterday's fit, had the 44cm. I'll ask him if I can test ride it.

IndySteel - you brought up some valid points. I'll ask my current fitter about the seatpost, and see if a zero setback seatpost will work better.

I'm 5' with 26" inseam (to floor). I would say my femur is about half way. I did measure it, and the knee pretty much is halfway, so it's neither short or long.

I'm slightly inclined to go to the shop where i bought my bike from. I had little issues with them for a while. They have told me a few times to just bring in my bike to get the fork cut down, and it'll take less than an hour. Well, when I brought it in, they said I should have made an appointment. It'll take a week. I asked them if I bring it after the triathlon, they said the same thing, "it'll take a week". Instead, I had a bike builder friend (he does it on the side...for his bikes), to cut it, and it took less than 30 minutes.

Then I asked them about a paint issue, and they just kind of shrugged it off and said, "That happens. Nothing you can do about it. Put clear mailing tape over it to prevent it from getting worse." Really?!

Lastly - when I was saddle shopping, I said, can I test it for a short while, and they said, I'll still have to pay the 15% restocking fee, even if I only used it for one hour. I asked them if I could just feel it on another bike and just ride on the trainer they had inhouse - "uhh, we're too busy". I just wanted to put my butt on the saddle and feel it for about 15 minutes before dropping $$$! There's like 3 customers!

So...I'm not to keen on going back to that shop ever. Kind of odd because some people LOVE that shop, while other people don't, and some people don't like the shop that I frequent at and others love it. I have a feeling that if I go back to that shop, they'll just give me the "you bought the bike. Nothing we can do about it" attitude.