Using Paypal For Internet Sales?

[Aggie_Ama]

I have used Paypal to buy somethings and taken it from several TE members when we have sold things with no issue. I have a wheelset on sale on Craigslist right now, the rear wheel has a very specific size hub making it a hard item to sell. Tonight I got a request to take Paypal and ship to Kansas. The email looks very legit. The address is a residence in the city, the guy gave a full name which does come up with some involvement in activities, he gave a home and work number. The only thing he asked was I include shipping in the cost, which seems no less the fair than someone locally who asked if I would knock $50 off immediately.

If the paypal clears to go in my bank account before I ship, what other concerns are there? I haven't put much thought into it because here on TE everyone has been relatively active posters or at least enough I knew they were for real. I did however buy a toilet paper holder from a guy in Georgia I found on Craigslist.

[TxDoc]

You know, I was wondering exactly the same thing today. I'm having a similar issue, someone who saw a wheelset I have for sale on craigslist, and asked if I would ship. He plans to pay with Paypal using a credit card and asked if that would be ok with me. WHich of course I have no idea!
Paypal seems safe, once the payment is made - but I too would like to hear what the TE collective wisdom says...

[Irulan]

Paypal takes a percentage of the charges back as a fee from you the seller. I think it's 3.5 or 4 %. Don't ship until the payment clears paypal, that would just be stupid. It should only take a few days if they use a card, longer if they use an e-check.

[Aggie_Ama]

TXDOC- Other question, how does one ship a set? I have a great relationship with the LBS, do they likely have boxes? Do you know how much it costs since it would be an awkward shape?

Irulan- Once it clears they can't rescind it can they? I mean if you can prove it was shipped and signed? I was worried they could just cancel the payment by protesting with their card.

[surgtech1956]

I buy off EBay all the time and use Paypal. I believe it's a safe way to buy online. More and more websites are also using Paypal.

[Catrin]

Paypal is a safe way to deal with online purchases. They collect from the person then release the money to your account. This can take anything from a few hours to a few days depending on which verification process the buyer has gone through. Of course both eBay and PayPal take a small percentage but it is safe.

[TxDoc]

TXDOC- Other question, how does one ship a set? I have a great relationship with the LBS, do they likely have boxes? Do you know how much it costs since it would be an awkward shape?

I have shipped my wheels before, to travel, and ground shipping has always been around 40-something dollars, depending on zipcode, for the dual box. I think the single box that holds two wheels costs a bit less to ship. The only carrier I use is FedEx, so I do not know if others may be cheaper.

Yes I always get boxes at the bike shop, normally they throw them away, but they do know that a few of us ship their bikes and stuff when we travel, so they got into the habit of keeping the boxes for a few days before the discard them.

[laura*]

If the paypal clears to go in my bank account before I ship, what other concerns are there?

Whether the payment clears into PayPal or all the way into a bank account won't matter. In the event of a dispute, PayPal can come after you for the money. They'll first make your account balance negative, and then send it out to a debt collector.

Sellers on eBay as essentially at the mercy of their hopefully honest buyers. I don't know if things have gotten as bad for non-eBay transactions.

PayPal has a Seller Protection Policy that's supposed to protect sellers. However, it seems that certain types of financial fraud aren't covered.

[Catrin]

Laura makes a good point, though as often as I've used it I've never been subjected to a dispute but that does not mean it never happens.

More and more websites, and even services, are using PayPal these days. I can even make payments to my doctor's office online via PayPal if I like.

Obviously the more ubiquitous it becomes the more attractive a target it makes for scan artists and hackers... At one time it was simply the "payment" arm of eBay unless I am mistaken, but over the years it has become far more than that.

[TxDoc]

Whether the payment clears into PayPal or all the way into a bank account won't matter. In the event of a dispute, PayPal can come after you for the money. They'll first make your account balance negative, and then send it out to a debt collector.

Sellers on eBay as essentially at the mercy of their hopefully honest buyers. I don't know if things have gotten as bad for non-eBay transactions.

PayPal has a Seller Protection Policy that's supposed to protect sellers. However, it seems that certain types of financial fraud aren't covered.

So, then what countermeasures can we take to not be scammed by somebody off Paypal. I mean, are you saying that if they send the money, we ship the item - and then then start a dispute and do not return the item... then what, are we going to lose both the wheels and the cash and there's nothing that can be done?

[sarahkonamojo]

I have done many paypal transactions, but very few craigslist transactions. Document what you are doing with photos and receipts. I would also verify that you have the fellows employer's number/name. That will keep most people honest. Sure people can cause all sorts of issues, but if he wants the wheels, he won't.
S

[Biciclista]

normally scammers will be sending you a check for the wrong amount (maybe hundreds of dollars more than you are asking) and then they'll ask you to send some of it back "we'll split it" if you're selling something that is hard to find at the price you are asking, it's likely that you have a legit buyer. But i'd get lots of information from them just to feel safer.

[Grits]

I sold a wheelset on CraigsList and accepted PayPal. I waited until the funds had cleared and then shipped.

I priced USPS and Fed Ex. Fed Ex was considerably cheaper. I went by my LBS and got an old wheelset box from them.

[Irulan]

So, then what countermeasures can we take to not be scammed by somebody off Paypal. I mean, are you saying that if they send the money, we ship the item - and then then start a dispute and do not return the item... then what, are we going to lose both the wheels and the cash and there's nothing that can be done?

I've been using PayPal to collect payments for 10+ years, and frankly I don't seen this happening. If you are a seller, you don't get the money until payment has been verified either by a valid credit card, or a check that clears. If there is a dispute involving the finances, your PayPal account should have all the records of the payment clearing and who received it, when and by what method.

I had a situation last year where for some reason PayPal was denying a customer of mine services, saying they hadn't paid me. I was able to pull up the full transaction history, including the date he used his debit card, the date the transaction cleared and was paid to me, online. I then gave that info to my guy to clear his account.

My brother in law lives in Mexico and we did have problems recieving a payment from him for family stuff. They have several extra levels of security required for money coming from Mexico as so much fraud is generated there.

If you sell someone a crappy wheelset and they aren't happy with it when they get it, well that's a different kind of problem. Let's assume you keep records well, photo documentation of what you are selling and so on.

Some people keep a separate bank account just for PayPal transactions, the theory being if it's going to be hacked its completely apart from your regular finances. So if you set it up that way, and keep $5 in it only, you won't lose much if they did put a hold on your account while a dispute was being settled.

[Aggie_Ama]

I am surprised how expensive it is to ship wheels! They are only 2,000 grams. It is coming to right around $50, I guess it is the size of the box. Can't decide if I want to take that much of a hit. The wheels have an abnormal sized hub, so I might just want to take the money and go on. I am not big on just keeping "back up" parts of this nature. Yes you can taco a wheel but it isn't something that happens often even in rocky Texas.