Does Glucosamine/Chondroitin sulfate actually work?

[beccaB]

I have been taking a Glucosamine/chondroitin sulfate msm supplement for years. I though I would wean myself off it, but I am having pain again. The doctors are skeptical about it actually working, what do y'all think?

[Crankin]

There's been several recent articles about this; in effect, it doesn't work.
Sorry, I can't remember where I read this, or the citation.

[OakLeaf]

Off the top of my head, I think the only studies that have been done on whether it rebuilds cartilage have concluded that it does rebuild knee cartilage. Studies on other joints have been equivocal or have concluded that it's ineffective.

ETA: here's a summary of one... http://cme.medscape.com/viewarticle/471971
here's another... http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11214126

Joint space and the condition of cartilage correlate poorly with pain, so it's no surprise that results have been mixed on whether glucosamine relieves pain. (The most recent article was in the NYT this week, but it focused on back pain, which has very little relation to cartilage in any case.) But I think that anything that protects your joints is good, whether or not it helps with pain.

I've tried other things (MSM, SAM-e) that have not worked for me, so I doubt it's a placebo effect. (FWIW, SAM-e also drove my blood pressure sky high, but my blood pressure is pretty sensitive to all kinds of things.)


Also, my dog had excellent results in her mobility and manifestations of pain from Adequan (which is an injectable similar to glucosamine), but little if any effect from oral glucosamine. I don't know why there's no injectable for humans, but I doubt the dog was getting a placebo effect (especially considering the shots were IM and not very comfortable for her).

[Eden]

I've also seen scientific evidence that it doesn't work - though I used to give it to my old arthritic cat and it did seem to help him. When he was getting it he would be able jump up onto the couch, when he wasn't he never did..... (and he certainly wasn't subject to the placebo effect... though I suppose I could have been on his behalf....)

[bmccasland]

My doc was of the position that it works for some people, try a bottle of 30-days worth, if you feel a difference, continue, if you don't, then stop and don't waste your money. Some people have said it takes 60-days. And just because it works for horses doesn't mean it'll work on humans.

[Zen]

I think it has finally been proven to be ineffective.

[firelady]

I had re-constructive knee surgery 10 years ago. I find that glucosamine does seem to help my knee. I definitely notice the difference when I don't use it. That is all the proof I need. I doesn't seem to do a thing for arthritis pain or shoulder pain but helps with the stiffness in my bad knee

[PamNY]

Here's one article I had bookmarked (it's from 2006). Not very encouraging.

ETA: Oops, I bookmarked page 2 for some reason. Start article here:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/23/he...ewanted=1&_r=1

I have used it with dogs and it did seem to work. As others pointed out, there's no placebo effect with dogs.

[Norse]

Can't speak for myself, but it has done and continues to do wonders on our dog. Shortly after we got her, at age 2, she was diagnosed with hip dysplasia. It was so bad she could hardly stand up. The vet suggested glucosomine with msm and within a few months, she was chasing frisbees again. She's 8 now, still gets her daily dose and is doing well. She had to have an xray about 6 months ago and the vet could not believe how well she walks/hikes/runs, or that she does it at all considering how bad her hip looked in the xray. It apparently helps her pain quite a lot.

[nscrbug]

I agree with firelady, in that I can definitely feel a difference in my knees when I don't take it. I used to have very creaky knees and since I started taking a glucosamine/chondroitin/MSM supplement some 8 years ago, my knees don't creak and crunch as much as they once did. I will continue to take it.

[Marionette]

I have read and heard lots of conflicting opinions. And i've had doctors who recommended it and others who didn't. My vet recommended it for my cat, but she won't eat it. This is typical of many supplements, and it's because they don't want to spend the money to do enough research on it, partly because the fda doesn't require it.

[KnottedYet]

The prevailing "wisdom" I hear is that if your regular diet is low in the stuff your body needs as raw materials for cartilage repair, the glucosamine chondroitin will help. If you already have adequate raw material in your diet, you may not notice a thing.

What DEFINITELY helps is USE. Use those joints. Study after study is showing that using the joints tells the cells at the weightbearing contact to become cartilage. Even if all you get is a thin layer of slick stuff (like in "bone on bone" knees) that may be enough to keep that joint functional. (you won't get the thick cushy cartilage of a teenager, but you wouldn't with a joint replacement, either. Those are "ceramic on ceramic" or what have you.)

Hence the stories we all know of spry elderly guys who are still running in their 80's and 90's. They aren't supermen and they don't have thick miraculous knee cartilage, the thing is that they never stopped so the body found ways to keep going.

I've got guys whose x-rays look terrible, yet they are running a mile or two every day,rain or shine, and they feel great! They are also mentally sharp.

Eat well, supplement if you feel it helps, and keep moving!

(side note: sometimes joints are truly a mess; painful and non-functional and causing misery. Those joints should be replaced. But if you are 70 years old, walking your dog 5 miles a day, and your knee just gets sore once in a while but doesn't even need a Tylenol, let alone a cane or walker.... please don't replace your knee just because your x-ray is bone-on-bone. Of course it is bone-on-bone! Don't go by the picture, go by the function!)

[Zen]

I have been taking a Glucosamine/chondroitin sulfate msm supplement for years. I though I would wean myself off it, but I am having pain again. The doctors are skeptical about it actually working, what do y'all think?

Every answer you get here is anecdotal. Do a search of reputable (ie, not studies done by drug companies) studies for information.

[arielmoon]

In my own personal trial, Hyluronic Acid was more effective than Glucosamine or MSM (Chondroitin comes from animal sources so no go for me) when I had knee problems but to be honest now that I am riding like crazy, I sometimes forget to take it and have not had the pain return.

And, although I was told I had a great deal of arthritis due to injury and surgeries, my acupuncture/massage guy was able to work on my quads and relieve "knee" pain. If your quads lock up it pulls on the knee, that is where you feel it. Something to think about too.

Right now I do my own massage by rolling on a hard foam roller to try and keep my quads loose and prevent knee pain.

[Rebecca19804]

And, although I was told I had a great deal of arthritis due to injury and surgeries, my acupuncture/massage guy was able to work on my quads and relieve "knee" pain. If your quads lock up it pulls on the knee, that is where you feel it. Something to think about too.

Yup, been that route.

My arthritis is due to mal-formation of the joint in several separate ways. This was diagnosed by x-ray and MRI when I was 11 - but the orthopaedist (in the USA) 'neglected' to mention to my parents 'oh and guess what, she'll get arthritis at a ridiculously young age because of this'. Xrays and MRI here in England last year showed exactly the same mal-formations... plus degenerative arthritis.

PT and stretching regime helped somewhat when I first began cycling a year ago. I was told it was especially important to stretch hamstrings & quads and the PT did a few other things each week to relieve pressure in the joint / on the back of the patella. However, the PT and the surgeon said cycling was the very best thing I could be doing and felt that, if I kept it up (which I have), cycling would accomplish far more in strengthening and supporting the entire knee joint than PT and/or acupuncture ever could.

But the improvement and relief I got from cycling (which was both marked and revelatory) peaked this spring and then declined. It's as if I passed through that stage of "getting stronger = less pain" and now I've arrived at "knee pain now preventing me from getting any stronger than this".

My mileage continues to go up each week... and I am wayyyyy fitter and stronger and smarter with gears/hills/etc.... which only tantalizes me with the dream of how much MORE cycling I could be doing... how much faster and stronger I could be... if not for the bl**dy knees.

Hence the surgical option coming back onto my radar.