So confused!

[Slowspoke]

I have a Bianchi Eros Donna. Love that girl! I rode her across Michigan two summers ago. I had full support so I only carried what I needed for the day. She was great on nice roads but those ultra skinny tires and geometry were not the best for a tour. I also am not "one with the hills"! I think I needed more granny. I also cannot put fenders on her. There simply is not enough fork clearance.

Now I am looking at a touring bike. I want steel and comfort! I want maximum granny gears! All of those bikes seem soo heavy! I really don't plan to do much with panniers. If I went totally self supported I think I would go with a trailer. What I want is something that will handle the terrible roads of michigan, mostly commuting and errands with some light touring thrown in. I am looking at all the usual suspects: Salsa Casseroll, Surly LHT, Novara Randonee, Specialized Tricross, Kona Sutra and a Raliegh (forget the name). The only one I have found to try so far was the Novara.
Are these overkill for what I want to do?
Would a performance hybred be enough?
What's with bar end shifters on touring bikes?

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

You need to tell us what kind of distances you are hoping/planning to ride for your tours. If you are not packing much for panniers, etc, does that mean you'll be staying in motels or B&B's?

Large range granny gears, fenders, any racks, steel frame, sturdier tires, extra water....all these things will add some weight.
The good news is that if your touring bike winds up being 25-30 lbs (without panniers), your granny gears will help you climb the hills anyway despite extra weight. You will also develop stronger legs to get that bike moving. Most people who like touring are not too concerned with high speed, and pedaling a 30 lb bike on flat terrain is not that much more effort than pedaling a 20 lb bike on flat terrain.

Hybrids are good, tend to be comfy with semi-upright position for long rides...but they often come with straight bars which can be a strain on hands and wrists on long rides (40+ miles). Drop bars allow many varied hand positions- and believe me, after a few hours riding you really are grateful to be able to vary your hand/wrist positions.

[OakLeaf]

I'm having the same problem choosing a commuter (aka sub-55 miles RT, heavy loaded "tourer").

I need 165mm cranks and a sub-50 cm effective top tube on a sub-50 cm frame.
I need a frame that will accommodate a rear rack (steel preferred, but I'd take aluminum).
I really really want R700 brifters, a triple and a 10 speed cassette.
I really really DON'T want bar end shifters or anything other than drop bars.

That doesn't seem like much, does it? It's all available on ordinary run-of-the-mill road bikes... except for those pesky carbon rear triangles, which is a deal killer as far as mounting a rack.

It's not a problem if I spend $4000+ building up a bike on my own. It's not a problem if I buy a $2000 mass-produced complete bike and spend $500-700 retrofitting bars, brifters, rear wheel and derailleur, and/or cranks.

Where does that leave someone who really doesn't want to spend $2500+ on a second/third/fourth bike (depending on which ones you count ), the one that's supposed to be "practical?"

[Slowspoke]

I would be touring light. I can't really see loading more that 30 lbs. My last couple tours were in the 50 miles per day range. I agree that I don't want flat bars. I MUST change my hand position often. My Bianchi is fitted with a rack and I can carry what I need but the geometry is just not right for touring. I also found a Trek 520 that I am going to test out tonight after work.
Sadly, adding another bike is space prohibitive. I will be giving up my Gary Fisher Marlin. Oh, here is thought. Could I fit that bike with handlebars better for touring? Fenders? Hmmm more research. It has a rack, good grannies but 26 inch wheels.

[Zen]

You left out Jamis and the Terry Valkyrie

[uforgot]

I would be touring light. I can't really see loading more that 30 lbs. My last couple tours were in the 50 miles per day range. I agree that I don't want flat bars. I MUST change my hand position often. My Bianchi is fitted with a rack and I can carry what I need but the geometry is just not right for touring. I also found a Trek 520 that I am going to test out tonight after work.
Sadly, adding another bike is space prohibitive. I will be giving up my Gary Fisher Marlin. Oh, here is thought. Could I fit that bike with handlebars better for touring? Fenders? Hmmm more research. It has a rack, good grannies but 26 inch wheels.

Doesn't the Marlin have front suspension also? You definitely do NOT want that. Added weight that is useless on the road. I have a Surly Cross Check and love it. Steel, comfortable and fairly economical. I know a few others that have the Trek 520 and they love it too.

[Slowspoke]

Yes, it has a front shock, but I can lock it out. I could also swap out the fork. So if I get a new fork, new tires, new handlebars, fenders and probably a new seat cuz I love the brooks on my roadie...I am talking about $400. Now, for about $1200 I can just pick up an entry level touring bike. That is a pretty big difference.

I am still calling around to find some bikes to try out. I called one place and he tried to talk me out of a touring bike. He goes, "they are heavy and everyone is going with hybreds nowdays. You won't like that road type handlebar. Besides, they are expensive"!!! LMBO I was asking about an $1100 bike,not a custom seven!!!

[shootingstar]

You need to tell us what kind of distances you are hoping/planning to ride for your tours. If you are not packing much for panniers, etc, does that mean you'll be staying in motels or B&B's?

Large range granny gears, fenders, any racks, steel frame, sturdier tires, extra water....all these things will add some weight.

The good news is that if your touring bike winds up being 25-30 lbs (without panniers), your granny gears will help you climb the hills anyway despite extra weight. You will also develop stronger legs to get that bike moving. Most people who like touring are not too concerned with high speed, and pedaling a 30 lb bike on flat terrain is not that much more effort than pedaling a 20 lb bike on flat terrain.

Well, true that not dragging around camping gear, lightens the load abit for a credit card bike touring ride. But, I couldn't help giggle ironically here...when a bike touring trip, has near the beginning or in the middle of it, a work-related conference it does mean more baggage. Has it ever occurred to anyone that the weight of clothing for someone who is 5'1" is lighter than clothing for one at 5' 10"? Presumably the lot taller person is stronger, but not always. There's just more fabric required to cover a taller person, ergo more weight.

I agree that one shouldn't over-rate the speed of a touring bike trip that is loaded with panniers, but it is nice somehow to have a bike that has some lighter weight (but not necessarily always the lightest materials) components to still go over hills, different terrain...which isn't always beautiful smooth pavement, etc.

Have fun Oak, in the bike/component shopping. We wanna see photos of the final baby!

[tpb]

How about a Bianchi Volpe? I have one that I use for commuting and light touring - and I love it. I don't have fenders so I don't know how that would work.

I have made a couple of upgrades (rear derailleur, seat) as well as adding a rear rack, lights, etc.

Enjoy.
TB

[tpb]

I forgot to mention. On the way to finding my Volpe, I rode the Specialized Tricross. For me at least, it just was NOT comfortable. Also, if I remember right, it's not steel...

-TB

[ginny]

I tried the bianchi volpe and while I also have an eros donna as my road bike, I didn't like that bike as much. I ended up with a LHT for my daily commute, grocery shopper and touring bike. It is heavy - particularly as compared with a sassy little road bike. Also, to be honest, I'm not particularly stoke on how I 'sit' the bike. I feel much more stretched out on it than my road bike... in retrospect, I maybe should have saved up for a custom bike... have you thought of that? Lunas are really nice, as are um... those ones named after elves... rivendell... does Seven make touring bikes? Don't get me wrong, I like my surly and plan to ride it to death... then maybe I'll get a custom bike. If I had saved for the custom bike, I wouldn't have been able to commute by bike this winter / summer, and I wouldn't have my new job (got it probably because I ride my bike every day).

[rosetwig]

Curious to find out what folks think about converting your Gary Fisher Marlin into a touring bike. I'm also attempting to buy a touring bike, and being rather short, it's a little tricky. (The smallest Surly Long Haul Trucker is really the only one where I have any standover room.) And I have a Marlin also, though it doesn't have front suspension. What might converting it entail? Or would it even be worth it?

[HGuthertz]

I have two suggestions:

Look for an early 1980s Trek and have the entire bike retrofitted with Ultegra, brifters, etc.- whatever you want. Look for a frame with Reynolds 531 steel.

The frames were beautifully made and are really great for sport touring - carrying 20-25 pounds. They are sturdy bikes - real classics. This route should cost around $1,500 - buying the old bike just for the frame and then the retrofit.

Another route is to buy a Terry Isis Sport - very light steel with carbon fork. The bike has eyelets for a rear rack.

I have gotten into a mid-life bike collecting phase and actually have done both options, and have done 50 plus mile segments on each of them. They are both comfy in their own way. I chose the bar end shifters for the Trek, because I like the option of switching to friction shifting on a tour - uncomplicated.

I test rode the Surly LHT, and also thought too heavy - and without the charm of the old Treks.- but maybe that's my age showing. Also go with down bars - you can use a taller stem-Nitto- to raise the bars to a more upright position.

Hope this helps.

[OakLeaf]

HG, as someone who's got an old custom steel frame collecting dust in the basement...

is it really that simple?

Early 1980s will be 5-speed. Can you spread the drop-outs enough to accommodate 9-speed, which I think is still available in Ultegra? Would it be better to go to 10-speed, bearing in mind that a cassette won't last forever and 9-speed may not be available forever; and if so, can the drop-outs be spread that far?

And for you, as well as Margo and Deb if they're listening: does spreading the drop-outs weaken the rear triangle or cause chain alignment issues?

Bearing in mind that you'd have to replace at least the rear hub, can it really be done that cheaply? Or are you talking about parts only, and building the bike herself, just going to a framebuilder for the cold-setting? Little things like chain, cables and handlebar tape add up...



ETA: and what about the front derailleur? If it's a clamp-on, will a modern front derailleur clamp fit narrow Reynolds 531 tubing? My old frame has a front derailleur braze-on - so am I right that that limits what gearing I can put up front?

[HGuthertz]

I brought the bike to Yellow Jersey in Madison for a package deal.- they specialize in this sort of thing.

They took everything off, spread the frame, and returned a "new" old bike - complete with Ultegra 9-speed cassette, new FD, new wheels, etc. They finished the job quickly - brought the bike in on Friday - picked up on Monday.

They can quote you a package price, and you can ship the bike.- I drove in as it wasn't that far.

I am very happy with the result.