Custom Bike - 650 vs. 700 wheels

[Susan Otcenas]

I am working with Sweetpea Bicycles in the design stage of my first ever full custom bicycle. I'm soooooo excited. I've been through a multi-hour fit session with one of the best bicycle fitters in the country (Micheal Sylvester) as well as Natalie Ramsland, the owner of Sweetpea.

Based on my measurements, Natalie can build me a bike that fits with either 650c or 700c wheels.

There are pros and cons with each size wheel.

650 Pros
1) Bike design in more aesthetically pleasing (the small frame size looks in proportion with the smaller wheels
2) Lighter wheels and less rotational mass. Small wheels accelerate faster than large. Very nice wheel sets are available in 650 (many triathletes use 650s)
3) Fewer toe overlap issues

650 Cons
1) Fewer tire choices - both in width & color
2) Fewer fork choices - there is a carbon 650 fork, though
3) No stock 650 forks have fender clearance. Not a huge big deal, as I could use a race blade on front if necessary.
4) Spare tubes not as readily accessible - no relying on ride mates for an extra spare if you have an unlucky day.
5) Can achieve the same gearing as on a 700C bike, but need larger front chain rings to do it (ie bumping up to a 53x11 or 54x11 to get the same gear inches as a 52x12 with 700c wheels)

700 Pros
1) the world is your oyster on wheels, tires, forks, etc
2) every shop on the planet has replacement tires/tubes. Most of you r ride mates will have 700cs as well

700 cons
1) very small frame looks odd with larger wheels. Frame geometry has to change a fair bit to achieve the same position/fit
2) greater rotational mass on the larger wheels - accelerates more slowly
3) toe overlap


I'm sure there are other pros/cons... What are your thoughts?

Susan

[Becky]

Interesting dilemma. Can you please put this in perspective for me- how tall are you, and what sort of frame dimensions are you considering? Having ridden both 650s and 700s, I have some thoughts, but I'd like to tailor them to the situation.

Thanks!

[Biciclista]

well, let's dispense with the fork problem right off since you're getting a custom bike. Get the custom fork that your builder is so proud of and you'll do fine.

I went with the 700 wheels myself when faced with the same dilemma and honestly, i wish i had the 650's when i see how nice they look.
i have friends with 650's and have been told that they don't feel like they are working any harder than they did before.

however, my husband who has 700's was kind of strong in wishing that we had the same kinds of tires (which also eliminated the terry with it's odd front wheel)

Next time i'm getting a 650

[Crankin]

I've had both and honestly, for me, there has been no difference. I just bought a bunch of tubes and kept 3 in my bag at all times. I do think though, that you are right in the aesthetic thing. The bigger wheels look slightly off on a small frame.
I would go back to 650's if that was what the bike I wanted had.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

Yes, how tall are you?- in other words, just how small is this bike?

I'd also be interested in knowing whether it will be lugged or tig-welded- lugs can limit the range of fine tuning possibilities of the geometry/angles in the frame, so this would have a bearing on wheel size.

[DebW]

Will your frame be steel or ti or something else? Custom steel forks are nice and can provide fender clearance if that is an option from your builder.

I had a custom road/commute/touring bike built two year ago in steel. I'm 5'7" with a 32 inch inseam and went with 650. Actually, I let the builder pick the optimum wheel size (though he was on the fence until I told him my shoe size). I'd rather have perfect frame geometry than a compromise to fit a pre-determined wheel size. And the feel and handling of this bike makes it worth it. At the builder's suggestion, I have two wheelsets, 650c and 26". I run 650x23 tires on one wheelset and 26x1.3" (sometimes 26x1.5") tires on the other. That's one way to get a wide choice of tires. The brake pads have to be moved by 3-4 mm when I switch wheels. As it turns out, I love the feel and versatility of the 26x1.3" tires so much that I ride them most of the time. I run full fenders most of the time also.

[Becky]

DebW, what concessions would your builder have had to make with the frame geometry if 700c wheels had been used?

[TxDoc]

Hi Susan,
first of all let me throw in a little disclaimer: I am not an expert or a pro, so put whatever I say in perspective.
I would strongly recommend 700c. The advantages are enormous - one above all being the endless choice of wheels and tires for 700c. You can find the best wheelsets in this size, both clinchers and tubulars.
The perceived 'issues' with 700's on small frames are really not a deal in my opinion:
The slower acceleration is rarely an issue - as most pro racers can demonstrate, since they race 700's.
People that suggest 650's to avoid toe overlap make me wonder whether they plan to ride in a parking lot at 4mph. Toe overlap is basically never an issue in road riding because 1-we do not usually steer, and 2-we do not ride slowly enough to even encounter that problem. So that is sort of a myth the way I see it.
I would go with 700c wheels, and pick a wheelset you like.
Oh, and by the way - CONGRATS on your custom build!!!

[sbctwin]

I, as an owner of a Bella Lightspeed with 650c wheels, had little choice for my selection. At 4'10" when I looked for a new road bike, I wanted a bike that fit. I was tired of 'make do' with what was out there. Now, at 4'9.75" or less, I am happy with the 650c's on my bike. I sure wish I could ride a bike with 700c wheels, but I can't!! or do I say, I shouldn't ... I am happy with Bella, because it will be the last road bike I purchase, I hope/... My mom, bless her heart, had shrunk in inches to 4'6" before she died. My twin still holds out to be 4'11". I know, as I get older, I won't be as tall and at close enough to be 56, I want a bike that will last me until I can no longer ride and that probably means when I am dead because I hope to be riding in some fashion until then!!! I am in the market for a new commuter and it has become increasingly difficult to find something that will fit me until I am 65 and hope to retire...I may just save enough pennies for that custom bike

[Triskeliongirl]

I ride a 48cm cervelo RS w 650c wheels. Its the best handling bike I ever had, and there is no toe clip overlap. I have no problem getting tires (love the schwalbe stelvio 23c), and in a pinch you can use a folded over 700c tube. The aesthetics are great too (see pic attached). I posted the pic to make the point that everything on a bike needs to be proportional, so it makes sense that a small frame will have small wheels, shorter reach bars, etc.

If you want wider tires (terry makes a 28c) or do like Deb, and ask your builder to make it so you can swap out 650c and 26" wheelsets.

I think its crazy to build a small frame around 700c wheels unless you require neutral race support that only carries 700c.

Regarding the gearing, its true that the gearing will be lower for the same chain rings, but I found for me it made it easier to gear the bike a tad lower which is great for climbing. Mimi, there is no reason to believe you would work harder with smaller wheels as long as you choose an appropriately sized chain rings and casette.

So, while there are more choices in wheel and tire for 700c, there is no shortage of excellent wheels and tires in 650c, although you may have to mail order.

[Bluetree]

Wheelsets. Wheelsets. Wheelsets.

700c wheels allows me options and benefits that just aren't possible with 650's. I can borrow wheelsets from teammates to test them out, experiment with types/weights, and get great deals with members of the local community. I've experienced tubulars, deep rims, carbon, ultralights, bladed spokes, you name it -- and marvelled at how the different technologies transform how my bikes roll. Speaking for myself, I know I would be sorely disappointed if I didn't have those options. YMMV.

[sarahkonamojo]

Reading between the lines. You WANT the 650 bike. So maybe you should just get it. And see what the fuss is about.

Seems the only negative to the 700 is the toe overlap. And aesthetics, PLLLEASE, nothing beats a new ride. Besides you will be on it, not looking at it ride by.

sarah