Another group ride ettiquette thread

[Tuckervill]

I went to the "beginner's group ride" for the first time at an LBS 2 weeks ago. The man who leads it does it as a volunteer for the store. He's a GREAT guy--older gentleman with a lot of patience with this hill slug. I took my son with me last week and the ride leader was really encouraging to him. There are a lot of regulars (about 30, he said) but of course they don't all come on the same day. None of the regulars are "beginners' anymore, it has become obvious to me. (One of the most consistent regulars did RAGBRAI.)

The route is a popular one for cyclists because there are not a lot of hills or traffic. (hard to find around here) The ride starts at 10 am, but the another group of A and B riders leaves the store at 8:00 am. Sometimes some of these better riders come out to ride with the beginner's group for the first few miles, because there is serious traffic for those miles, and I guess they just think it's safer or something, or it fits their schedule better or something. I wish they'd just go on, though.

Unfortunately, those experienced riders get out at the front at the beginning and go faster than I can go for 25 miles. This means all of the other newbies are trying to keep up. The first week, we did a 16 mph for the first 3 miles, until the group split in two: The fast people and the slow people (in this case me and one other woman). Max, the leader, stayed back with us. He's a really good shepherd and keeps up with everyone in the back and if you're way at the back he'll stay with you. (Bless his heart.) Max has said to me several times that "we lose more people that way" meaning when the fast people leave the slow people behind, the slow people get discouraged and don't come back.

The second week, the same thing happened, only this time I had my son with us. He was capable of keeping up, but when he saw that he and I and Max were slower than the rest, he got discouraged. I can get discouraged but I work on my mental state more than my son can. I ride my ride and slug up hills and coast downhill and can usually catch up. I think my son is a strong rider, but the heat got to him that day--I made him stop before the last huge hill because I didn't think he could climb back up. But he said it was about the discouragement of the group leaving us more than the heat.

So I'm torn--should I expect the people who are doing the whole ride (not the speedies who are hitching a ride with us--I wish they'd just leave before us and go) to stop and wait if we get too far apart? (They don't, unless they're still within shouting distance and Max can get them to.) Should I just not care that Max is holding up for us?

It feels like if not for me, Max would be up there with the group. That's irrational because I know he volunteered for this, but it still makes me feel bad. I think the regulars who are no longer newbies should hold back, too, for a beginner's ride. What do you think?

Karen

[limewave]

I go back and forth on this. I used to be one of the people that pushed the pace at our weekly Women's Ride (a relaxed group ride). But now that I take DD with me in the Burley, I'm one of the riders who are made to feel like we're holding everyone up. I get a lot of complaints from the less speedy women about the other women who are constantly increasing the pace.

Here's my feeling: It's a relaxed, beginner ride (period). The pace should be comfortable, maybe just a little challenging, for all the cyclists who show up. If there is a wide range of ability and there are enough people, then, perhaps, the groups should split in two before the start.

[ehirsch83]

I think you need to ask the ride leader if this specific ride has a no drop policy. I fit does, then they should wait up for you, if it does not have a no drop policy, then unfortunately the majority will win.

[Fredwina]

One of the things we do we have set Regroup points. i.e. the folks that know the way ride there and wait for everybody. the ride leader(s) stay back with the new folks. If the folks want to go faster -that's fine. I'm still working with some of ride leaders on the "stay behind: concept, though It's not a "race", no matter how much people want to make it.

[indysteel]

I think you need to ask the ride leader if this specific ride has a no drop policy. If it does, then they should wait up for you, if it does not have a no drop policy, then unfortunately the majority will win.

I think that's great advice. Our local club training rides do not have a no drop policy. There are ride leaders, but they do not take responsibility for staying back with the slowest of the group. The course is marked and they have maps if you need one. Otherwise, you're on your own. The group doesn't typically slow down to regroup although when it first started up again this season, the ride leaders would often hang back and sweep the stragglers up (like me). We now typically have discernible A and B groups, but even they have people who fall off somewhere along the way.

My point in sharing that is that if your ride leader didn't want to wait for people, there are ways to structure and lead the ride such that he wouldn't have to hang back. So, if your ride has a no drop policy, then take advantage of it; that's what it's there for. As a beginning ride, I would expect it to have such a policy. If you're uncomfortable with repeatedly holding Max back, try to memorize the route or map it yourself and tell him that it's okay to leave you. My guess is that Max likes the fact that you keep coming back; it means he's likely doing something right. Frankly, it sounds to be like the faster, experienced cyclists are the ones who are creating the issue, not you and/or your son. They really should be encouraged to just start a few minutes earlier if they're not really part of the ride.

[li10up]

Since I lead a beginner's ride I can tell you how I approach it. I started to lead the ride because the other rides were too fast for me. I now can ride with the moderate group but still lead the beginner/easy paced ride. We have a wide range of riders that show up for this ride. Some are very strong riders that want to socialize but still get in a good ride and some people who are truly beginners who can only go 10 mph. If we have a true beginner we usually split into two groups and the faster group goes on at it's pace. If we decide to stay together as a group the stronger riders are encouraged to go ahead at their pace but are to wait at the next turn or else turn around, come back to the group and then go on again. That way the group can stay together and everyone can ride at their own pace. Most of the time there are a few of us who will do another loop after the ride gets back to the start point. That way the faster riders don't mind going slow the first 20 miles because they know that they can go faster the 2nd 20 if they want.

I'd suggest that the beginner group not even try to stay with the fast group if you all start at one time. That would probably encourage them to just go on at their pace. If Max would ask his riders not to pass him until the group splits up that might help.

I can't imagine that a beginner ride would be a drop ride...kind of defeats the purpose of a beginner ride. I think the group should make every effort to stay together unless there is someone who is obviously much slower than the rest of the group.

[Geonz]

I will sometimes tell the group to "remember where they came from" and how it can be prety discouraging to come to a "beginner level ride" and not be able to keep up. I try to activate the "shepherd" in at least a few of 'em. When I go to a beginner level ride, I ride my big fat bike and go slow even if I'm not the leader. I was always the last one in sports... and in my very first bike club tehre was a whole group of guys who woudl go slow for you so I'm giving it back, and I tell people that, too.
It's an ongoing thing, though. I also tell the new folks that one of the problems is that you get strong pretty fast and you don't realize it! So if they'll keep coming back, they'll be with those people in no time...