Ultergra/DuraAce vs LookKeos

[Miranda]

I have been pedal and saddle shopping this season, and am hopefully closer to getting what I want. Old threads helped some, but looking for some more info.

OK... I "thought" I had my pedal decision down to Look Keos. Last lbs I was in the rep brought out some Shimano Ultergras and the Dura Ace. He said, "you want a wide platform, lady... these are the motherload of wide platforms...". My first reaction was, "wow... looks like huge support...".

One thing I'm not sure if this is a pro or a con... is the clip in space. The rep said since the pedal has a wide opening, it gives you more error room to find to your pedal. I read in old threads that some Look Keo users said that the Keo was "always where they wanted it to be"... vs the other having to look down to guide in?

I ride a ds mtb pedal now, Shimano M505. I thought I wanted ds SpeedPlays but just didn't like some things about then when I tried them in the trainer at another lbs: 1) didn't feel much more supportive than my M505s (not $200 worth to ME anyways), and 2) didn't like the stomp straight down to clip in.

I know I will be giving up the convenience of ds pedals with a Dura Ace, or Look... but my main aim is support... no more numb foot, etc.

I'm hoping this purchase will "get it right" with no buyer's remorse of lingering issues. Thx for any thoughts.

HISTORICAL INFO BTW: through this process, I did upgrade Diadora mtb shoes, to road SIDI Zetas... and my cleat position was moved some...

[Miranda]

Well, I'm going to respond back into my own thread with what I've tried if someone looks for this in a search...

I have not ridden any of the pedals on the road yet (trying to work on saddle issues as change # 1, before doing pedals next), but tried them at the shop.

The Dura Ace is lighter than the Ultegra of course, but while the Ultegra looks slimmer, the tech said they are both the same width. The new generation Ultegras are slightly wider. When the tech mounted the cleat to my shoes, it slightly hung off the edge. My friend said it could have been the placement... but just saying it was a wide connection.

When I clipped in... it was indeed an easy target to hit. And, omg... what a rock solid connection of stability. Now, of course I'm riding ds mtb pedals now that are spds... so, huge leap granted. However, even with the lowest tension setting, it was hard for me to get out. I do have pretty weak ankle tissue, fwiw. I really loved it otherwise.

I tried a Look Keo elsewhere on another day. The cleat there did not hang off (slightly narrower contact). It was still an ok opening target to hit. Felt ok to pretty solid connection (but not like the Ultegras). On the clipping out on the lowest tension... pretty darn easy. Less tension than the Ultegras. More tension than the super loose mtb pedals.

For sake of getting out easier, I think I'm going with the Look Keo Classics. If the Ultegras were just a bit easier to get out of, hands down, I would buy them for the contact. I've crashed before due to not getting out. That is no fun at all. That's the word atm.

[VeloVT]

Hi Miranda,
I haven't tried Look road pedals but I have Ultegra pedals and my bf has Dura Ace pedals. We tend to switch bikes for a ride or two when we change things up to get the other persons take on it (we're almost exactly the same size), so I've ridden his pedals a fair amount. Besides the weight, I would say the Dura Ace pedals have better bearings -- they spin much easier. I notice this when I spin the pedal with my hand; of course, I'm not actually aware of it when I pedal.

There are two comments I would make about these pedals.

1. The pedals "loosen up" with use. They really do -- my bf got his pedals after I'd had mine a year or two and was quite used to clipping out with them. I noticed his new Dura Ace pedals were considerably "crisper" than my pedals (though I didn't have trouble clipping out of them). Over time, his pedals have gotten easier.

2. You get used to the force they take. When I first got my Ultegra pedals (which were my first experience with clipless pedals), I thought there was something wrong with my cleats or pedals or something . I just couldn't get out. Of course, there was nothing wrong with the pedals, it was a head thing and a kinetic memory thing. After a few months they were magically MUCH easier .

Also, I don't have to look down to clip in (although I'm sure I do sometimes ). But they hang in an easily-accessible position.

I *love* how solid these pedals are. After having eggbeaters on my commute bike for two years, I'm switching to a different pedal that I hope will be more like my road pedals -- I much prefer that solid, locked-in feeling to the floaty feeling my eggbeaters have.

Good luck with whichever pedals you get!

[ilima]

I had the Ultegras for a while, because I was getting hot spots with Speedplays and wanted to try something different. I did like the wide platform, but ultimately decided they were too hard to unclip from.

I tried them a few months and felt like I was doing damage to my already screwed up knees and then went back to the Speedplays, which are effortless to clip in and out of.

[Miranda]

Hi Miranda,
I haven't tried Look road pedals but I have Ultegra pedals and my bf has Dura Ace pedals. We tend to switch bikes for a ride or two when we change things up to get the other persons take on it (we're almost exactly the same size), so I've ridden his pedals a fair amount. Besides the weight, I would say the Dura Ace pedals have better bearings -- they spin much easier. I notice this when I spin the pedal with my hand; of course, I'm not actually aware of it when I pedal.

There are two comments I would make about these pedals.

1. The pedals "loosen up" with use. They really do -- my bf got his pedals after I'd had mine a year or two and was quite used to clipping out with them. I noticed his new Dura Ace pedals were considerably "crisper" than my pedals (though I didn't have trouble clipping out of them). Over time, his pedals have gotten easier.

2. You get used to the force they take. When I first got my Ultegra pedals
(which were my first experience with clipless pedals), I thought there was something wrong with my cleats or pedals or something . I just couldn't get out. Of course, there was nothing wrong with the pedals, it was a head thing and a kinetic memory thing. After a few months they were magically MUCH easier .

Also, I don't have to look down to clip in (although I'm sure I do sometimes ). But they hang in an easily-accessible position.

I *love* how solid these pedals are. After having eggbeaters on my commute bike for two years, I'm switching to a different pedal that I hope will be more like my road pedals -- I much prefer that solid, locked-in feeling to the floaty feeling my eggbeaters have.

Good luck with whichever pedals you get!

Thx for the input.

I'd say my mtb pedals now w/the multi-release spd cleat feel like eggbeaters. I'm thinking about those on my mtb for the 4-sided entry in hopes it might improve my mtb some if I can in and out faster on the trail when I want to put down a foot on an obstacle. Of course my very skilled mtb guy pal tells me that if I would just keep my feet on the pedals and keep going I wouldn't have these issues.

One of the shop guys was willing to let me demo his DuraAce on his extra bike loaned out to a buddy. I thought later, they wouldn't be he same as they were broke in by a big hard mashing guy. But, maybe I just need to get him to sell me his used broke in less tension pedals and I'll have the best of both worlds. In my pedal fantasy-land anyways.

[Miranda]

I had the Ultegras for a while, because I was getting hot spots with Speedplays and wanted to try something different. I did like the wide platform, but ultimately decided they were too hard to unclip from.

I tried them a few months and felt like I was doing damage to my already screwed up knees and then went back to the Speedplays, which are effortless to clip in and out of.

Yeah... I have some ankle and knee tissue injuries too. My ankle I used to try and clip out in at the shop set up actually ached after I left. I was SO bummed because I fell in love with that rock solid connection.

I did try some SpeedPlays at a different shop that carried them. The zeros were too hard for me. Again, recommended by a big hard mashing guy pal. The LightActions worked pretty well. But, stomping down on the pedal, vs toe in just felt so weird. I know we get used to change over time. At the time, I just didn't go "omg! these SpeedPlays feel $200 more supportive worth than what I have now, sign me up". So, I left without them.

One thing that makes a huge difference I think in feeling like my spds have that floating feeling is the cleat. I had single release once by accident, and that was solid, and I fell over because I spaced out at a busy intersection that I couldn't put my foot any direction to get out (like multi-release). The multi-release gives the float feeling I think.

That was truly a learning experience with the eggbeaters to what I have now. The multi-release aspect is built in the pedal, not the cleat from what I could see. The tech set my "release angle", besides tension. I thought... "a-haaa... it's built in the pedal, not the cleat".

[aicabsolut]

Here are my thoughts on these two.

First, the platform and method of using them are pretty comparable, as you've noticed. Both will be a big improvement over your MTB pedals in that respect.

The float is different. Shimano cleats are either yellow (6 or 6.5* of float) or red (0). Keo cleats are red (9*), grey (4.5*), or black (0). The red Keos were too much for me. I really like the grey. I was thinking of switching to Shimano, but I'm concerned 6.5 will feel too loose still.

The reason I have thought about switching: cleat wear. Keo cleats wear out much faster than Shimano cleats. The wear points on the Shimano cleats also don't really impact how the cleat sits in the pedal as much. Say you wear down the yellow toe point. It should still feel the same in the pedal. If I wear down the front of a Keo cleat from stopping and starting, eventually my knee starts to hurt and I need to replace them, even if they are not too thin to really risk breakage etc. As Keo cleats wear, they get harder to clip in. It helps to file off the rough edges a bit. The new grip cleats do wear a bit better b/c you wear down extra rubber bits. However, they require a bit more accuracy and force to clip in over the older style cleats. None of my friends with SPD-SL cleats complain about them at all. Everyone with Look pedals complain about cleat wear. The good news is that the cleats are cheap. I've also broken a brand new Keo cleat and had friends break their cleats at inopportune moments, which can be pretty bad.

So.. that's something you might want to consider as well.

[Miranda]

Here are my thoughts on these two.

First, the platform and method of using them are pretty comparable, as you've noticed. Both will be a big improvement over your MTB pedals in that respect.

The float is different. Shimano cleats are either yellow (6 or 6.5* of float) or red (0). Keo cleats are red (9*), grey (4.5*), or black (0). The red Keos were too much for me. I really like the grey. I was thinking of switching to Shimano, but I'm concerned 6.5 will feel too loose still.

The reason I have thought about switching: cleat wear. Keo cleats wear out much faster than Shimano cleats. The wear points on the Shimano cleats also don't really impact how the cleat sits in the pedal as much. Say you wear down the yellow toe point. It should still feel the same in the pedal. If I wear down the front of a Keo cleat from stopping and starting, eventually my knee starts to hurt and I need to replace them, even if they are not too thin to really risk breakage etc. As Keo cleats wear, they get harder to clip in. It helps to file off the rough edges a bit. The new grip cleats do wear a bit better b/c you wear down extra rubber bits. However, they require a bit more accuracy and force to clip in over the older style cleats. None of my friends with SPD-SL cleats complain about them at all. Everyone with Look pedals complain about cleat wear. The good news is that the cleats are cheap. I've also broken a brand new Keo cleat and had friends break their cleats at inopportune moments, which can be pretty bad.

So.. that's something you might want to consider as well.

Thank you for taking the time to type out those specifics ! I have not went back after the pedals yet, so this is still good decision making information. Sorting out new shoes potentially atm, and figure I will just wait on pedals to have the tech put on the pedals, new cleat on the new shoe, etc. at the same trip. I had read about cleat wear, but never what the effect of that was. The float is a good point too. Appreciate the feedback.