Bulging disc and sciatica

[badger]

Yikes, sorry to hear of your problems at such a young age!!

sorry to hijack, but Knot, would you say that McKenzie would help someone like me with a twist in C1 by 7 degrees? I get a slew of problems due to it, namely migraines, and things are made worse by the fact I have mild scoliosis that makes my right hip higher than my left. I've done PT before and nothing's really come of it so I've resorted to chiropractic, which has helped, but I'm afraid I'm dependent on adjustments and want to be a bit more proactive in helping myself rather than going to him when my headaches get bad. Lately I'm getting numbness down my hip/thigh as well...

There are a couple of McKenzie certified clinics near me. I don't want to waste their time or mine if it's something they're not specified to do. Thanks in advance!!

[KnottedYet]

Yikes, sorry to hear of your problems at such a young age!!

sorry to hijack, but Knot, would you say that McKenzie would help someone like me with a twist in C1 by 7 degrees? I get a slew of problems due to it, namely migraines, and things are made worse by the fact I have mild scoliosis that makes my right hip higher than my left. I've done PT before and nothing's really come of it so I've resorted to chiropractic, which has helped, but I'm afraid I'm dependent on adjustments and want to be a bit more proactive in helping myself rather than going to him when my headaches get bad. Lately I'm getting numbness down my hip/thigh as well...

There are a couple of McKenzie certified clinics near me. I don't want to waste their time or mine if it's something they're not specified to do. Thanks in advance!!

MDT is all about getting your own movements to correct your body. (doing your own chiropractic, as it were) The body has a wealth of corrective motions and is constantly correcting itself without you being aware of it. MDT gets you to do some focused repetitive concious movements to correct a particularly sticky bit. They are the same motions your body would normally use anyway, just with more oomph.

An MDT therapist will know within 3 visits if self-management is going to work or not, so don't fear you will waste anyone's time. (and yes, you can be taught to correct your own rotations)

[badger]

I made an appointment for tomorrow!

[nscrbug]

While I don't know if I could call myself "super-active", I do consider myself to be quite active...and my back is a mess, too. I don't have a herniation...I have a grade 2 spondylolisthesis at my L5/S1 level. In laymen's terms, my L5 vertebra has slipped forward and off of my S1 vertebra. The "grades" are used to distinguish the severity of the slippage...so at grade 2, I have a 50% or more slippage. I've had this condition for nearly all of my adult life. My lower back gets stiff and the pain is mostly chronic. The doctors I have seen all agree that surgery (a fusion and laminectomy) is the only solution...but offer no guarantees for being pain-free afterwards. I've had bouts of sciatica, too. My MRI showed severe bilateral foraminal stenosis, degenerative disc disease, degenerative facet joints, and a severe narrowing of disc space, and bilateral spondylolysis. I've been told not to run, but I still do...I'm slow and keep my distances to < 4 miles. I refuse to be told that I can't do something...just makes me want to do it, even more! I also swim, and workout at the gym doing cardio and strength training 5-6 days a week. In addition to my cycling, of course...which is roughly 200 miles a week (when the weather is good).

I can't really offer any suggestions, since I'm not exactly a "good" patient by going against doctor's orders. Exercising and staying active is what helps me deal with my chronic back pain. On the rare days that I don't do any exercise, my back feels 10x worse!!! I stretch a LOT, and also have an inversion table at home that I use daily. The inversion table was particularly helpful in curing my sciatica...but YMMV. I was told by a PT, that I should NOT do any type of back extension because it can cause my slippage to advance more. But you know what...I still do them, because if I don't...I feel "unbalanced"...like those muscles aren't getting worked if I skip it. I'm to the point now, where I know my pain pretty well and know what my limits are.

I hope you are able to remedy your back issues soon and get back to doing the activities you enjoy.

Linda

[DrBadger]

I am going to jump in here with a slightly different perspective. I understand, and fully support, trying to do the PT and non-surgical route if at all possible. Obviously, if you can get relief that way it is the best solution.

However, it doesn't always work, and the surgical options aren't as bad as some people would lead you to believe.

I had my first disc herniation (L4/L5) at the age of 22... slipped on an un-plowed road on my way to a physics final. That time I could sit, but not stand at all with out excruciating pain. Finally had the MRI in April, and the doc was amazed that I was still functioning and finishing my senior year in college. I had done PT for a while right after the pain started, but nothing helped. Finally, in May I had a microdiscectimy. There was immediate relief. 3 months later I was cleared to start doing things again (rollerblading, biking, etc.) I wasn't super active at the time, but became so in the years following. After my first back surgery I went backpacking, hiking, running, rollerblading, started biking (road, and now mountain as well), all without any problems at all. My back would get a little tight at times if I over did it, or my weight got up and my core strength decreased, but nothing too bad.

Then almost exactly 1 year ago I had a bike accident and re-herniated the same disc (L4/L5)... I was 30, so 8 1/2 years later. we tried PT and cortisone injections, and while the injections helped a little (made it so I could function and not be in tears all day, and I have a high pain threshold), surgery was once again in the cards. I had a revision micro-discectimy by a new surgeon (ortho this time), and again, immediate relief. The recovery from this surgery was a lot faster than the first, probably in part due to me being in better shape overall, but also I think from a really good surgeon. 2 months later I was cleared to start getting back to things again. I walked a 5 k 1.5 months after my surgery, ran my first one at 2.5 months, road all over southern Africa 4 months after surgery, and now, at 8 months have done a duathlon, and have a triathlon this weekend... 1 week shy of the 1 year mark for the accident.

So, what I am trying to say, is that, yes, if possible avoid surgery. But, if you can't control the pain, surgery can be an amazing thing. And at least from the herniated disc perspective, once it is healed you can get back to all the things you did before. The only thing I was told to not do until 6 months after surgery is downhill ski.... but that isn't much of a problem here in Texas :-)

Good luck, I know how horrible this can be! Once you get the pain under control (even a little bit) try getting back in the pool... that felt really good for me since it took a lot of the pressure off my disc.

Ellen

[Ered_Lithui]

Hmm. If I had a Wii, I'd take you up on that, Jess.

Thanks for your input, Linda and Ellen. I'm not vehemently opposed to surgery, but it's expensive and I was given a 75% probability of success. The PT I saw yesterday thinks there's a good chance I can fix things without surgery, so we're going to give it a month to see if there's any progress.

Leila

[Ered_Lithui]

Well, 2 1/2 weeks into PT with no overall improvement in the leg. Sometimes (usually mornings) the pain seems lessened, but often (generally afternoons on) it's worse. The back pain does seem better overall, which is in keeping with what the neurosurgeon and PT both expected, so I think the exercises are helping in that regard at least.

Now that I'm looking more seriously at surgery, the naturopath/alignment experts in my acquaintance are telling me vociferously that I'm far too young for surgery, should look at fixing my posture, should walk more and avoid sitting; PT is only one non-surgical option; have I tried [X]?; and so on. There are days when I function more or less normally and think, "this isn't bad enough to merit surgery." And then I realize that I still can't ride or play tennis or hop off a low garden wall, and getting out of bed means grabbing a wall in anticipation of a surge of pain -- and I'm overwhelmed by the ridiculousness of the limitations. I come close to tears trying to justify the surgical option when people suggest yet another alternative. Maybe there is more I should do -- walk in the pool, take ibuprofen religiously, get acupuncture. But at what point is it enough?

Well, that update devolved into a whine-fest. Sorry. :/ Thanks for being so understanding earlier.

[yellow]

I was "too young" too (mid 40s).

You'll know if and when it's time. For me it was a question of continuing to be miserable (after having done everything I could to avoid surgery) or having the opportunity to be able to sleep, move, and sit again with less pain.

I'm a better partner, friend, and employee now. I might get shot down for this, but surgery really wasn't all that bad. PITA, yes, but given the result I'd do it again.

[cyanemi]

I did have surgery five years ago. I did not have a choice and a good surgeon will not do surgery unless there is no alternative. I can bike, swim, lift weights, hike, kayak. I really have problems running though. Once I do, back pain starts again. I am not discouraged because I am so thrilled to be able to do everything else and not have any pain

[Ered_Lithui]

It's good to hear your stories, itself and cyanemi! Thanks.

I have most of my mobility back now, and life is a matter of "mustn't do [x]" (where x = bend over, walk fast, reach high, ...) rather than "[x] is physically impossible." I don't need to remind myself, since anything forbidden causes immediate pain, but sometimes it's tempting to squat and reach down to the floor and pick up my glasses rather than wait until someone in the house has a free moment. My leg's quite a bit better and I'm no longer afraid of unpredictable jolts of pain sending me to the floor.

Best of all is being able to roll over in bed without feeling like I'm about to die.

I went to watch a cyclocross race today -- my first big outing. I'd really hoped to race this year, but watching was still enjoyable. Being out in fresh air is such a welcome change from a stuffy bedroom.

[jessmarimba]

I'd been wondering how you were doing. Glad to read your follow-up!

[itself]

After back surgery you make smarter choices. One of mine was to give up those things that caused any pain at all. Running was one of them. I feel so blessed to be able to hike, bike and kayak and lift weights, I don't miss running at all.

Glad to hear you are making progress!!!

[jdubble]

I went to watch a cyclocross race today -- my first big outing. I'd really hoped to race this year, but watching was still enjoyable. Being out in fresh air is such a welcome change from a stuffy bedroom.

i'm amazed you made it out to even watch a cross race so soon after back surgery! and in the rain we had yesterday! you go!

hope you feel better and better and are back on a bike before you know it.

[daisylubob]

Ered, how is your recovery going? I have been following this page since you made the thread. Back in winter '10 I put up a similar thread. Just yesterday, I set up an appointment w/ a neurosurgeon. I have gone through 4 rounds of PT (including Mckenzie) w/ water therapy, ultrasound w/ electrical stimulation, massage, traction, more core exercises, walking w/ a harness. I have tried oral Naprosyn, topical Naprosyn, 2 cortisone injections. Still no relief. In fact this past weekend, I woke up and my left leg was totally asleep from top of thigh to toes The pain ranges from being in my low back, to the left side in my hip, down the outside of the left leg to the calf and foot. There is also left sided weakness with some numbness. And this past weekend the pain was so relentless I ended up taking Vicodin, which I hate doing as it makes me feel all loopy, not to mention the constipation factor DRs, PTs, chiropractors all keep telling me it can heal in time, but I have not really seen any sort of improvements as far as 'long-term'. Heck 1 pain-free day would be awesome at this point. Hence the desparation of seeing a surgeon who may have to cut. Which I am totally scared about.

[klesko]

My L5 disk bulged for months in 2006. It does not bulge any more as long as I stretch every day and do yoga. When it starts hurting I exercise more. I can start out a bike ride in pain and have trouble lifting and un clipping my left leg and finish feeling great. When my disk bulged I walked and it would hurt really bad for half a mile and then I could walk briskly. The key to my recovery was physical therapy and the realization that exercise is the fix and rest is bad. I have a lot of spinal degeneration too. Hang in there and stick with the physical therapy. My leg still has a numb spot and feels weird sometimes now, but does not hurt and I ride 100 miles a week.