Transitioning From Sitting to Standing When Climbing Hills

Wonder if anyone could give me some advice. When I am climbing a hill and get to the point where I would like to get off my seat, I find that as I am getting off the seat, my quads feel very fatigued and there is a lot of stress on my knees. So much so, that I wind up staying on the seat hoping for the best. I know I will need to be able to get out of the seat in order to conquer longer steeper hills.
Is there anything in the way of training or technique that I should be doing to get better at this? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Rosanna

I rarely stand to climb. I have found that I do better sitting up and spinning in a granny gear. sitting up straight allows me to breath deeply and relax my shoulders. Slow but steady is my practice, besides I never met a hill I couldn't walk.

I wrote this in another thread:

When I returned to cycling over 2 decades ago, I often cycled behind my partner to learn how he dealt with new routes, signalling, etc. and that's when I watched-learned how he could climb-spin up long hill and mountain grades without standing/rising from his saddle. He does this also with full weighted bike panniers and a loaded bike trailer also. He is a experienced and long distance endurance cyclist....I believe he has racked up 130,000 km. over the last 25 years and he doesn't rise from his saddle. Yes, he has iron legs.

Yet, I am certain he is incorrectly/negatively judged by younger/same age guys flying up the mountain grades on their carbon bikes in their team kits. (My partner has never cycled in a team kit. He never will. Just ordinary lycra, jersey and high-vi apparel. That's all.)

If you want to compete-race then for certain you may want to learn how to cycle rising up from your saddle.

But already I'm with my guy..who cycled mountain ranges in British Columbia and Rocky Mountains with loaded bike panniers....he has never risen from his saddle. He just grinds up long 10-15 km. grades 7-14% up. When I think of him for times he's not around, this how I sometimes have the image, him just doggedly spinning and spinning up that long, steep grade ahead of him, not rising from his saddle. It is more inspiring than you could ever believe...especially when he is pulling weight of panniers.

Don't be too hard on yourself if you don't become super good. There are good (male) endurance cyclists who don't rise from their saddles and they tackle mountain ranges in 100-130 km. day long rides.

Just enjoy the hill climbing no matter what riding style. It's like life...

When you stand you’re shifting all your weight onto your legs and knees. That might be part of what you're feeling in your already tired quads and knees during a long climb when you come off the saddle. That bodyweight is also what can give you a little more power on the pedals though. Standing also brings into play more upper body muscles, which can use more of your energy and can also increase HR and more cardio/breathing stress if your strength to weight ratio isn’t optimal for out of the saddle climbing. That optimal ratio is rarer than many might think.

I ride long steep climbs (11-17% sections) on my weekend rides for my strength and endurance training. I’ll get out of the saddle to stretch or on a really difficult climb to make changes in my muscle groups for a few minutes and/or for the added power.

For a smooth transition I’ll move my hands to the hoods, shift to lower my cadence while standing as my right foot begins its downward stroke. I’ve learned by watching the movement of my stem I can quickly get a fluid rocking movement and know the rhythm that allows my leg to make a direct push on the pedal making the best use of my weight while keeping a smooth stroke. Keeping my chest open for breathing efficiency, upper body relaxed, back straight, not leaning forward enough to put weight on the front wheel but enough to put my weight over the axis of the crank rotation and having the tip my saddle just barely brushing my thigh gives me a body position that works well for me. It can take some practice to adapt to the position for both motor learning and upper muscle development reasons. Like most things more practice is good.

All this said staying seated and pedaling at a high cadence is probably a more efficient use of most people’s energy while climbing....and that shouldn't be looked at as worse than being able to ride out of saddle :)

It sounds like you're staying in a squat rather than standing completely up. When you stand to climb, you'll be extending your knees almost fully, really standing up except for whatever bend in your hips you need to reach the handlebars. Commit yourself to the motion, it's really just like getting up out of a chair initially, and then, as others have said, like riding an elliptical machine once you're standing.

The conventional wisdom is that standing takes more cardiovascular energy. But sitting and spinning takes more leg muscle, and sometimes we run out of leg muscle before we run out of cardio capacity. It's good to be able to climb a hill either way, and to be able to switch back and forth on long climbs.

Well, my experience is that of the OP's. I stand to stretch for a few seconds on long rides, or to just move around, but never while climbing. Just the act of standing hurts like hell, and I spin up anything. I may be going slowly, but I can climb steep grades. When I am riding behind DH, I always know when he will stand. If I stand, all that happens is my speed goes down as he accelerates. It just hurts all over, so I stopped trying. I approach it in a similar way as Marni described.

When standing, I'll only do it for 10-15 seconds, rarely more than 30s. I find it's best for super short steep pitches that you might need a little extra OOMPH to get over, of just to stretch the legs a little bit in a longer climb (in which case I'll shift one or two gears to give it more resistance just for that little bit).

The tips for how to get there are good above. I'd only add that I have to consciously think to keep my butt back a little bit, almost touching the nose of the saddle. Also, to help save my quads, I just use my legs to get my feet into position, straighten the knee, and then just use my bodyweight to push down on the pedal rather than muscles. Then focus to the other side and stand again. It takes some practice to get the timing right.

Good luck!

-- gnat!

Make sure you're not too far forward over the handlebars. You want your hips to be about 10-12" in front of the seat post for balance. Pull up on the handlebar on the side that you're pushing your leg down on. (The other arm is just relaxed.)
You can find out why pulling up on the handlebar works by putting a bathroom scale in front of a dresser. First, lean forward and press one leg down hard on the scale. Make a note of how many pounds register. Then, slightly pull out one of the drawers just above knee height and pull up on it from the bottom while pressing the same-side leg down on the scale. You'll notice a huge increase in how much pressure you can apply.
And, of course, don't forget to use your hamstring muscles to pull the pedal around and over the back side of the pedal stroke. Think of your leg circling around the hip joint like the Road Runner in those old cartoons.

Don't stand up. Or at the very most, only if you are on a really long one and you need to stretch. Standing is less efficient. I just have standard double with 11-28 in the back and I live in the burbs of SLC. I sit and grind. I am never sure of the point of standing when the climbs are all so long. Long steep climbs just need endurance and practise, not gymnastics. I don't think though, that I am getting much bigger grades than 16% (fleeting). I would stand rather than fall, but that would be it. Because I don't have a granny or a compact, I probably mash a bit more than is desirable but I really like to climb, which is a requirement in the Wasatch. I am old and not racing though.

Yup, Oak had it. Commit, and get up, all the way. Once you're up, straighten your knees and stand. Well, don't straighten them all the time :-), but do aim for straightening your knee completely from time to time, if not on every pedal stroke.

I stand a lot, sometimes because my legs start screaming on a hill if I don't, sometimes just to catch a better glimpse of the next intersection, sometimes to get a bit of extra oomph to get out of an intersection fast and not have to discuss right-of-way with a driver who looks clueless. It doesn't have anything to do with racing or better or worse, it's just a handy but not absolutely necessary skill which some people like to use more than others.

If I had to think about all of those things (stand straight, 10 inches this way, pull up, opposite arm and leg), it would kill my enjoyment. Maybe I'm weird, but I can't think like that and ride at the same time.
Do what feels best.

Well if I still had to think about all the things I thought about when learning to ride a bike - or drive a car - I wouldn't be doing either of them either! :D

99 percent of the time I am the granny gear hill climber but upon occasion I do stand, especially on long rides. What I don't see mentioned here is to realize when you stand you are probably going to want to gear down first. Trying playing with different (slightly harder gears) as you stand and see if that helps. If I stand in to easy of a gear I totally fell it in my quads.

You mean gear up. :) More often than not, I'll shift up *two* gears to stand.


And just to beat my usual drum, I wonder also if crankarm length might be an issue for the OP. I can stand on my commuter with its 175mm crankarms, but I'm bouncing WAY up and down, rocking my hips a lot, and bending my knees WAY too much at the top of the stroke *and* locking them out at the bottom if I'm not careful. If I didn't already have plenty of experience with road bikes, I'm not sure if I would be able to.

I'm also not sure that I would switch to shorter cranks if standing were the only problem I was having with them, but my knees won't tolerate longer than 165 at all.

Also, one caution about "keeping your butt back" - with the understanding that we have indeed given you way too much to think about :p - just be careful not to hook your chamois on the nose of your saddle.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

You mean gear up. :) More often than not, I'll shift up *two* gears to stand.

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need more coffee!!!!

This thread has given me a lot to think about. I can stand and pedal on my hybrid but have big trouble making it any thing but a brief grab on my road bike (with its drop bars). Sometimes its just nice to change your position but it does seem that you can get some power out of standing up--not that I've been able to realize it.

I agree that there is a lot to think about here. I'm swimming and the coach asks us often to think about incorporating a new way of doing things in swimming. At first it always feels awkward and counterproductive but (because I have faith in the coach) I push through and it makes things better.

But I think breaking the effort down into a first things first approach helps too. Here's what I'm thinking. First things first might include: Hands on the hood or top bars not the drop bars. Question here is do you put them so that they wrap around towards your gear levers or just front and center on the bars?

Finding the appropriate gear that gives you a bit more resistance but not too much also seems important.

Committing to stand and using the counter pressure on the handle bars seems like it is pretty important, too.

Would those of you who do it recommend a different order of focus.