decision...to get a triple or compact double

I am ready to make the switch to a road bike and due to lack of funds I have to go with a cheaper one and upgrade components later if I need to. After riding the Trek 2.1 wsd bike in my first tri I have been looking hard. I did find out I can do layaway at several bike shops around town.

One of the lower end bike shops has a great sale going on right now and I went in to try out a few bikes yesterday. The one that fit the best has a Compact crankset, 50/39 and I am not really sure if I am ready to get rid of the "granny gear" yet.

I found a 2008 GTR Series Four within my price range. I tried several different Fuji sizes/types and nothing fit as well.....They are holding the GT for me until COB today. SO today is the day to either make a decision on this bike or find someting else.

Tina

One of my bikes has a triple and the other has a compact double. I've ridden both in the mountains without any trouble (other than the usual v e r y slow uphills that I do).

If you get the compact double and you feel that there just aren't enough gears for you, you could change the out the cassette for more options. The whole point about compact doubles is that you get the same or similar gear range as a triple.

I am not a technical expert at all - the numbers of the gears and stuff is quite mystifying to me.. but I started out on a roadbike triple and have just changed to a new bike with a compact. The compact pretty much covers the same range of gear ratios as the triple on my bike - but covers that range in 20 gears (it;s a 10 speed compact double) rather than 27 gears on my 9 speed triple.

Obviously seeing as the same total range is covered, it follows that there is less room for being in slightly the wrong gear as there was of course more 'overlap' and the gears were 'closer together' when I had 27 gears covering the same range, so it is taking some getting used to to make sure I am in exactly the right gear - the compact double is less forgiving like that.

That being said, I think I would personally go for the bike with the best 'fit' - the GT obviously stood out from the others in that regard - you can always change your rear cassette (cogs) pretty cheaply to effectively give you more of a granny gear if you find you need that - you can;t really do much about a not-so-good bike fit..

Ask the guys in the LBS what the rear cassette numbers are - try and met one that is 11-28 or 12-28 - the bigger the last number, the more 'granny' a gear you can select. A 12-25 with a compact double MIGHT be a little lacking at the granny end-- but the rear cassettes ARE cheap to swap out if the standard is something like 12-25 and you find you need a 11-28 or 12-28.

Like I said, I am not a technical expert, but it sounds like the GTR is waiting for you to go get her :-)

Also, with a compact you should be able to go down to a 34 in the small chainring.

This issue has been covered quite a bit here - do a search. In my opinion it comes down to whether you're comfortable pedaling in a wide range of cadences, or whether you prefer closer ratio gearing.

You may be able to get a very wide gear range with a compact, but you'll have large gaps between gears, that at a given speed might force you to pedal at (to pick random numbers) either 82 rpm or 95 with nothing in between. If you're okay with that, then a compact is fine. If you're really only comfortable pedaling in a range of 7-10 rpm, and you need a wider range of gears, then I'd recommend a triple.

I ride a 50/34 12-27 combo and I conquer major passes in the swiss alps. No problem. go for it.

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Originally Posted by alpinerabbit

I ride a 50/34 12-27 combo and I conquer major passes in the swiss alps. No problem. go for it.

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That doesn't mean it's right for her. People really are individuals. You're young and very fit.

I ride a compact double 46/33, with an 11 - 34 in the back. While I have the strength to stay in the 46 on a 5% grade, if I do, my knees start screaming at me after about a mile. I'm slightly older and very fit. :p I think my knees are few decades older than the rest of me.

Veronica

I have a triple & a compact double bike - and a lot of times I just like the compact double more because there's less gears to worry about and I really do a better job of spinning & getting into the right gear on the bike.

There's very seldom times when I'm wishing I had more gears, but I do have a spare set of wheels with a bigger cassette on the back for when I know I'm really going somewhere hilly (as in, I haven't really used it yet)

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Originally Posted by Veronica

That doesn't mean it's right for her. People really are individuals. You're young and very fit.

I ride a compact double 46/33, with an 11 - 34 in the back. While I have the strength to stay in the 46 on a 5% grade, if I do, my knees start screaming at me after about a mile. I'm slightly older and very fit. :p I think my knees are few decades older than the rest of me.

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I hear you - But...

...there really is no big difference to a triple, IM(ns)HO, which I have also ridden. And I wasn't fit when I started cycling... and I wouldn't even try to climb in the big ring... ever....
(hope I don't offend anyone if I say she does live in Texas, and I live in the Alps ... ;) )

I'll say it another way:

On your current bike, do you ever find that you just can't find the right gear? You're either pedaling too fast or too slow? Then a triple is for you, because a compact will potentially give you that problem in almost every gear, where a triple will do it in only maybe one or two.

If not, you're probably fine with a compact.

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

I'll say it another way:

On your current bike, do you ever find that you just can't find the right gear? You're either pedaling too fast or too slow? Then a triple is for you, because a compact will potentially give you that problem in almost every gear, where a triple will do it in only maybe one or two.

If not, you're probably fine with a compact.

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I run a compact (50/34) with a 11-25 cassette in the back... and I can't say that I ever have a problem with feeling that I can't find the right gear. I don't have a problem with a 10 speed triple doing that at all either.

Now, I could see if I was running a compact double with an 11-37 or something on it that I'd have that issue with hunting for gears.

I run a 53/42/30 triple with an 8 speed mountain bike rear cassette on my surly and I quite often find that I can't find the right gear on that.

So that's your preference. And if the OP is the same way, then she should be fine with a compact. (But yes, obviously an 8-speed cassette will have wider gear spacing than a 10-speed of the same range, and that's as much a consideration as whether to have two or three up front.)

Myself, with my 50/39/30 x 11-25, I really really notice the absence of an 18-tooth cog on the cassette. The jump from 17 to 19 is just too large for me. If I went to a 50/34 x 11-34, I could have an even broader gear range, but I'd have jumps like that nearly every single gear. It would not work for MY knees or MY leg muscles.

At least with the 10-speed I have a 16; on my old 6-speed (52/42 x 12-21) it was awful having to jump from 15 to 17.

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

So that's your preference. And if the OP is the same way, then she should be fine with a compact. (But yes, obviously an 8-speed cassette will have wider gear spacing than a 10-speed of the same range, and that's as much a consideration as whether to have two or three up front.)

Myself, with my 50/39/30 x 11-25, I really really notice the absence of an 18-tooth cog on the cassette. The jump from 17 to 19 is just too large for me. If I went to a 50/34 x 11-34, I could have an even broader gear range, but I'd have jumps like that nearly every single gear. It would not work for MY knees or MY leg muscles.

At least with the 10-speed I have a 16; on my old 6-speed (52/42 x 12-21) it was awful having to jump from 15 to 17.

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It's my preference, but saying that she's going to have a problem hunting for a gear in almost every gear on a compact is not a true statement - it depends on what she's running on her rear cassette. Especially as we have no idea what the gears are on her current bike - I think she's got a hybrid from the tri thread she posted? So probably 3x8 in the back, so she is probably hunting for gears that work at times, but that's more related to an 8 speed in the back.

If you put an 12-23 rear cassette on your triple, you could get rid of not having an 18 tooth cog, and you probably wouldn't feel like you were hunting for a gear on a triple. A 12-23 would also probably fix a lot of that on a compact for you. Now that may not give you enough gears for hills, and it may not give her enough gears either. Not that I think you should get a compact at all, because you seem happy with your bike - but compact doubles are not as bad as you're making them out to be.

If you're having knee pain, you might want to look into your crank length if you haven't already - I switch my cranks to 165's which is much kinder on my knees.

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Originally Posted by Catriona

It's my preference, but saying that she's going to have a problem hunting for a gear in almost every gear on a compact is not a true statement - it depends on what she's running on her rear cassette. Especially as we have no idea what the gears are on her current bike - I think she's got a hybrid from the tri thread she posted? So probably 3x8 in the back, so she is probably hunting for gears that work at times, but that's more related to an 8 speed in the back.

If you put an 12-23 rear cassette on your triple, you could get rid of not having an 18 tooth cog, and you probably wouldn't feel like you were hunting for a gear on a triple. A 12-23 would also probably fix a lot of that on a compact for you. Now that may not give you enough gears for hills, and it may not give her enough gears either. Not that I think you should get a compact at all, because you seem happy with your bike - but compact doubles are not as bad as you're making them out to be.

If you're having knee pain, you might want to look into your crank length if you haven't already - I switch my cranks to 165's which is much kinder on my knees.

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You are correct I have a cannondale F400 Hybrid. It has a triple in the front (mt bike kind from what i have been told) and a road bike cog but dont know about the #'s. I do have 27 gears. I really rarely go into the small chain ring at this point.

One of the people I road the 38 miles with last sunday suggested either
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...=38454&eid=117

http://www.trekbikes.com/women/wsd_p...es/road/12wsd/

I am not sure I can go that high...at this point.

Tina

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Originally Posted by txred9876

You are correct I have a cannondale F400 Hybrid. It has a triple in the front (mt bike kind from what i have been told) and a road bike cog but dont know about the #'s. I do have 27 gears. I really rarely go into the small chain ring at this point.

One of the people I road the 38 miles with last sunday suggested either
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...=38454&eid=117

http://www.trekbikes.com/women/wsd_p...es/road/12wsd/
I am not sure I can go that high...at this point.

Tina

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whoa. Definitely not the one with Sora. That's too crappy a groupset.

Have you thought of buying used?

I too own a triple and a double. I have run out of gears on the double once or twice, but that's due to my own fitness issues and I would have run out of gears on the triple as well (MAYBE I have one or two that are effectively a bit lower). As I get more fit the double becomes less of an issue (and keep in mind I live in the Rockies, so when I run out of gears it's been on fairly steep grade).

What's more of an issue (and one of the reasons I bought a new bike) is the 8 speed rear on the old bike. It's really limiting, and not particularly fun or cheap to upgrade to a 10speed at a later date. I notice the limitations of the triple/8 speed setup far far more often than I run into my physical limitations with the double/10 speed.

IMO, with your tri goals, you are better off with a double and a 9 or 10 speed cassette than a triple with an 8 speed cassette. You can make the double cover nearly the range of the triple (If I wanted I could get a smaller "granny" or a different rear cassette). If you find a triple with a 9 or 10 speed rear then I think it becomes more of a personal preference thing, but I personally wouldn't be afraid of a double based on not being able to get a low enough gear though.

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Originally Posted by alpinerabbit

whoa. Definitely not the one with Sora. That's too crappy a groupset.

Have you thought of buying used?

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Yes but have not found anything. Even before I road in the tri I was leaning toward a road bike and been keeping my eye out for something. I just do not know enough about bikes to buy used without taking someone wiht me. Thats hard sometimes....

Sooo, I'm reading all responses today, triple this, double that, and just when I thought I was ready to purchase a road bike, NOW, I have even more to consider.......:eek:

Okay, I finally looked up this bike:
http://www.cycle-world.co.uk/product...id=m1b0s6p6847

I don't know what price the bike shop is, but I think I'd recommend you avoid an 8 speed sora double.

If you end up upgrading the components on that... you're talking about a new set of shifters, a new cassette and possibly derailleurs... The price of which is going to be a lot.

I don't think I'd recommend you get less than a 9 speed double, and preferably a 10 speed... at least 105 level.

And I'd definitely look into used.

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Originally Posted by alpinerabbit

I hear you - But...

...there really is no big difference to a triple, IM(ns)HO, which I have also ridden. And I wasn't fit when I started cycling... and I wouldn't even try to climb in the big ring... ever....
(hope I don't offend anyone if I say she does live in Texas, and I live in the Alps ... ;) )

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Hills are different everywhere. The hills in Colorado are long, but rarely over 7% grade. In the North Georgia mountains, we get 9-10% grades, even sustained 13%. I had no problem climbing the Rockies on a double with a big (13-29) cassette, but for Georgia, prefer a compact. With a 13-29, I get the same gearing as a triple.

+1 on avoiding Sora - i think that is more important than whether it;s a triple or double-- try and find something with at least Tiagra shifters to allow you to upgrade components later on, imho, if you can find something.

batsheva

My only problem with the compact was missing the higher end gear. I was finding that I was gearing out on downhill sections. This was a big issue with me especially when trying to hang with the boys in group rides since I don't have near the weight they do to fly down those hills. Just something to consider. I currently have a triple with a 52/39/30 and it suits me perfectly for both flat and hilly rides (I am over forty and do not have young knees). I would take both for a really long test ride with varied terrain if possible before you make your decision. I think what it comes down to is what will work best for your riding style. Oh, and +1 on getting 105 or better components!

One simple way a lbs owner put it to me was, "...with a compact, you loose the highest gear on a standard double, and the lowest gear on a triple...".

My old ride, that I learned the hard way was way too big for me had a triple. 50/39/30+12-27cassette. My new ride has a compact 50/34+12-25cassette.

With the old bike, I only used the smallest front ring once for the triple. This last w/e I took my new roadie girl out to that "one hill" that forced me to use it. I kept her in the big ring, changed up the back some, and just powered straight up... slow, but I did it:).

Having a bike that actually fits you well, is huge for one thing. Hope you can work out one that's the best that way for you.

One thing I had read about on here, that turned out to be a lovely surprise for me as well with the compact... having my knees closer together, vs w/the triple.

At first, it's sorta strange. My knee pain also went away. I feel much more powerful and efficient in my pedal stroke with my legs being closer together.

Based upon that, I'm thinking no more triples for me. If I switched, it would be to a standard 53/39 double.

Good Luck shopping!

Well.... I didn't put anything on layaway today. I rented a trek 2.1 52cm (they didn't have the 54cm WSD). This one has two front chain rings instead of 3. (not sure of the 3's).

I didn't like the reach or the width of the handlebars. Oh and the seat was HORRIBLE!

I plan to make a ride in the morning with a group. I will put on a memory foam seat or I won't make it 20 miles tomorrow!

I think I am going to hold off and look for either a used WSD bike or buy a new one when I get my bonus in either august or sept.

Thanks for all the advise.

Tina

Triples tend to have more shifting trouble than a double or compact double.

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Originally Posted by Jiffer

Triples tend to have more shifting trouble than a double or compact double.

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I don't think that's universally true, but it seems to be so in the lower range of the spectrum. I've got an Ultegra triple and I've had no issues worth mentioning over the last 4 years. But I think it would be different with Tiagra, and as other posters mentioned I would definitely avoid Sora... Sad but true.

My Ultegra triple shifts beautifully and I have probably 4,000+ miles on it with very little adjustments. DH was so impressed with how well mine shifted that he just put a Dura Ace crankset on his bike and can't believe the difference in shifting. So, unless you have a lower end triple components, I wouldn't worry about trouble shifting.

Sora isn't great but I rode 6,000 miles on mine before switching to 105. That is awful isn't necessarily true. With proper maintenance mine served me VERY well but I wanted a carbon frame. I am finding the same is true of my 105 gruppo, with maintenance it runs like a dream. The only thing I have a problem with is the 105 front deraileaur is a bit finicky but I take it to my shop and the usually trim it in for free if nothing else is needed. This is only once every 2-3 months not weekly. I regularly lube my chain with a good quality lube and my bike runs well.

If you are going to the hill country or even Dripping springs you might want the triple but for MOST of Austin I find with a little TITS (time in the saddle) you will probably be okay with the compact. I am a weak climber but I rarely use my granny gear whihc if you go compact I think you only lose that. I do ride a triple with a 12-28 back cassette but am thinking of switching to compact because I just don't use the smallest gear and I want to upgrade my bike to complete Ultegra one day.

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Originally Posted by Grog

I don't think that's universally true, but it seems to be so in the lower range of the spectrum. I've got an Ultegra triple and I've had no issues worth mentioning over the last 4 years. But I think it would be different with Tiagra, and as other posters mentioned I would definitely avoid Sora... Sad but true.

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+1

If triples truly had more problems, why would mtb come with triples? A sport that involves infinitely more shifting, and more precision, than road biking would weed triples out pretty fast if that were the case.

Mountain bike derailleurs have a lot stronger springs than road bikes... I've also seen a lot of mountain bikes with a bash guard for the big chain ring, so they're not really triples. I don't go into my big chain ring usually mountain biking, just stay in the middle or the granny.

For avoiding sora - I'm more saying avoid 8 speed with a double, I've never tried sora or tiagra. I can't see not wanting to upgrade that soon.

I haven't noticed any difference in the shifting abilities of my bikes that are ultegra or full 105, also haven't had any difficulties with the front derailleur needing trimmed regularly on the 105. I have one bike that's a 105 level triple & 2 bikes that are ultegra doubles.

I'm happy with my campagnola compact veloce. It's smooth and it works the best for me. The steepest hill i've ever done was 19% and I didn't run out of gears...

I would never give up my triple. I don't think I could get up the 12-20% grades without it. I use it!
I have had 2 bikes with an Ultegra triple. Never had any problems shifting. I did have issues shifting my first road bike into the big or little ring, with 105 (on a Cannondale R700).

The only problems I've had with my 105 triple FD relate to the clamp rotating on the frame. (Yes, it was the clamp, not the L screw.) It's a bizarre occurrence, I don't know anyone else it's happened to, and no one seems to believe that it happened to me but it did.

When the derailleur is positioned correctly, I have no trouble whatever.

Well I did my 20 miles today on the trek 52cm (non WSD). SInce I am a newer rider I did have some SLOW hills but I did make them all. My legs screamed much more then on my cannondale. I am not sure if it is due to the two rings instead of 3 or what.

I think until I am a much stronger rider and lose more weight I want the ability to drop down into the triple. One thing I have noticed here in austin lots of our roads are flat then a straight up hill! I do not know the grade but some are steep (for this new rider).


Aggie ama ....said "Sora isn't great but I rode 6,000 miles on mine before switching to 105."

If I can get that many miles out of Sora then thats fine with me! I am going to work on getting one of the Trek demo bikes. They sell them every July.

Tina

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Originally Posted by txred9876

Aggie ama ....said "Sora isn't great but I rode 6,000 miles on mine before switching to 105."

If I can get that many miles out of Sora then thats fine with me! I am going to work on getting one of the Trek demo bikes. They sell them every July.

Tina

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To expand on my comment, after you ride something higher you will notice that Sora or Tiagra isn't as clean shifting. BUT money is an issue (it seems) and I found Sora can be reliable if you keep up with maintenance. I like that my first bike was a Sora success story, she did 2 MS150's, a couple centuries and served me very well.

Oh and several of the LBS and REI do low cost or free basic maintenance classes. Look into one to learn how to lube the drive train, etc.

Probably coming in late here but I went from a triple to a compact double a year ago and wasn't disappointed. I was very hesitant to change at first because we have a lot of hills, but the double was fine. I had been riding my triple for 2 years before I switched. (All ultrega on both bikes)

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

The only problems I've had with my 105 triple FD relate to the clamp rotating on the frame. (Yes, it was the clamp, not the L screw.) It's a bizarre occurrence, I don't know anyone else it's happened to, and no one seems to believe that it happened to me but it did.

When the derailleur is positioned correctly, I have no trouble whatever.

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I've had that happen on my surly... I'm not sure how it happened, but I did crash it once, and rode over a parallel grate with it another time.