Touring Bikes?? Can 2 people even own 7 bikes?

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07-31-2007, 05:30 PM
Skierchickie

Touring Bikes?? Can 2 people even own 7 bikes?

Hi everybody,

So, I've been thinking about a touring bike, so I can do some nice, fully-loaded touring. Which has always been one of those things I want to do someday (for about 20 years now). That is, if I can convince DH that we want to do this. I've been bitten by the "spend two weeks in Alaska on a touring bike next summer" bug. My friend is the culprit - she's done some major touring in the past, and planted the seed in my poor little brain. I started thinking that there are lots of touring opportunities in our immediate area, and even more within a short distance (NW WI, Northern MN, etc). My biggest problem is the dog that we are both so crazy about, we can't stand to leave her. Can you carry a 50lb dog in a handlebar basket?:p A very LIVELY 50lb dog?

So, if I do this (or we, as the case may be), I have to decide used (Ebay, most likely), or new (Trek 520 would be my most available choice). If I go the used route, what should I look for? More specifically, what brand, model, features? Do I make disc brakes a priority? I don't really want to spend a bundle, so depending on the moment, either used and a really really good deal, or the opposite end of my scale, the 520 (I think it lists for $1500, but I'm sure our LBS would be less). DH and I both have a tendency to end up spending more on our toys than we initially plan, so my original idea of used for $300 probably won't happen, but perhaps sanity will prevail this time.

Do touring bike sizes run similar to road bikes? Do I just go by standover height? Right now I have a 50cm Trek 5200 and a 15.5" Trek Fuel Ex9, both unisex (WSD does not fit me - I feel all cramped up). I am 5-6ish, with a long torso and short legs for my height. In my bare feet, I measure about 30" from the floor to my crotch.

Unfortunately, my shopping options are limited. My favorite LBS is a Trek dealer (hence the 2 current and 4 previous Treks, as well as DH's 3 current and 2 previous). The owner is a friend (well, we have been buying skis & bikes there for 20 years:rolleyes: ), and while we do have another LBS nearby, I'd feel like a traitor (I buy other stuff there, but haven't ever bought skis & bikes there). The Trek guy also has Kona, Gary Fisher, Lemond, & maybe something else. The other place has Giant and/or Specialized? Not sure. Otherwise, a few hundred miles to a real city with big shops. I'd rather buy used than a new one from elsewhere, anyway. I am fairly confident in saying that I doubt either local place has a touring bike in stock.

Any advice? Anybody have a primo, late model tourer, just gathering dust? Should I just not do it at all? Okay, I think I know you people well enough in this short time to know that NOBODY will tell me that!:D
07-31-2007, 06:56 PM
Zen

I can't give any advice on the bikes but there are lots of options for a pooch.
This is just one of many companies that make doggie trailers.

I harbor a fantasy of me and my (right now imaginary) dog riding and camping along the C& O Canal.
07-31-2007, 07:09 PM
KnottedYet

Between the two of us, my sweetie and I harbor slightly more than 6 bicycles...:D

I vote for Surly Long Haul Trucker. Your favorite LBS can order a "complete" from QBP, at a cost to you of about $985. No non-competition contracts with the manufacturer, as Surly *IS* QBP.

BikerHen just bought one, and Trek420 wants one. I think SurlyGrrl has one.

www.surlybikes.com
http://www.surlybikes.com/lht_comp.html

I have a Surly Cross Check, which I use with rear panniers. I'm very happy with it. It's not as steady/stable as a LHT, but it suits me. I don't like WSD either. I really like the way Surly bikes fit me.

If not Surly, my next vote would be Kona Sutra. (disc brakes, which might come in handy for the person pulling the dog trailer) www.konaworld.com http://www.konaworld.com/bikes/2k7/SUTRA/index.html The 2007 Sutras are on sale at my LBS right now for $1,100. (2008's are just around the corner)

Most touring bikes (in fact, all the touring bikes I've found) are steel. For a good reason! Steel is a lovely material. Rides like butter, wears like... well, steel!

If you are aiming at a long self-supported tour, you might want to seriously consider bar-end shifters like on the Surlies. (unless you have the tools and know-how to fix indexed brifters) The indexed rear Shimano bar-con on the Surly can be switched to friction, so if anything goes out of adjustment with your rear der, you can go friction and it becomes a moot point. The front is friction, which makes trimming the front der a breeze.
07-31-2007, 07:15 PM
Trek420

You can't have too many bikes....or shoes

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnottedYet

Between the two of us, my sweetie and I harbor slightly more than 6 bicycles...:D

Before she sold all but her 3 or 4 of her most loved bikes by my count Logdiva had 16 in her stable. Is this the TE record?

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showt...ghlight=stable

I test rode the Surly, I ::heart icon:: Surly but need to wait till the house remodel is done.
07-31-2007, 07:36 PM
KnottedYet

EastHill might be pretty close to Logdiva's record.
07-31-2007, 09:33 PM
VeloVT

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnottedYet

If you are aiming at a long self-supported tour, you might want to seriously consider bar-end shifters like on the Surlies. (unless you have the tools and know-how to fix indexed brifters) The indexed rear Shimano bar-con on the Surly can be switched to friction, so if anything goes out of adjustment with your rear der, you can go friction and it becomes a moot point. The front is friction, which makes trimming the front der a breeze.

The Trek touring bike has bar-end shifters that switch from index to friction, too. I thought that was pretty neat. I looked at this bike briefly (never tested it -- and I THINK it was the 520, but I'm not absolutely sure -- in any case they probably only make one touring bike, right?) while looking for a commute bike. It's pretty (that year's model was all black and very handsome), looks comfy and relaxed, and has touring stuff (eyelets, etc). It was heavier than I wanted, for my purposes, but that might not be such an issue if you're doing loaded touring anyway. I think it's around 25-27 lbs, not insanely heavy, but the bike I ended up with was around 20/21.
08-01-2007, 04:59 AM
Trek420

Quote:

Originally Posted by liza

....they probably only make one touring bike, right?) while looking for a commute bike. It's pretty (that year's model was all black and very handsome), looks comfy and relaxed, and has touring stuff (eyelets, etc). It was heavier than I wanted, for my purposes, but that might not be such an issue if you're doing loaded touring anyway. I think it's around 25-27 lbs, not insanely heavy, but the bike I ended up with was around 20/21.

Trek only makes one touring bike? They make one of everything, I'm shocked they don't make a unicycle (maybe they do?) ;)

No problem, there are lots and lots (and lots) of other builders to choose from :D

Check out V's Riv, beautiful, comfortable and light enough to do doubles on.

www.tandemhearts.com/wordpress/legolas/
08-01-2007, 05:47 AM
Pedal Wench

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnottedYet

Between the two of us, my sweetie and I harbor slightly more than 6 bicycles...:D

I think me and mine have 13 in our stable...
08-01-2007, 05:51 AM
Trek420

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedal Wench

I think me and mine have 13 in our stable...

But how many shoes? :p
08-01-2007, 06:19 AM
Pedal Wench

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trek420

But how many shoes? :p

Oh my god - I have almost as many shoes as I have bikes! 7 pairs!!! Two pairs of mtb, 3 Sidis (all different sizes for different sock layers), 1 Pearl Izumi what were on sale and haven't ever been worn and a pair of PINK Adidas road shoes. :eek:
08-01-2007, 06:26 AM
BleeckerSt_Girl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trek420

Trek only makes one touring bike? They make one of everything, I'm shocked they don't make a unicycle (maybe they do?) ;)
No problem, there are lots and lots (and lots) of other builders to choose from :D
Check out V's Riv, beautiful, comfortable and light enough to do doubles on.
www.tandemhearts.com/wordpress/legolas/

The Rivendell Legolas (their cyclocross bike, which is what V. has) would cost two to four thousand dollars for a complete, depending on components and add-ons, etc. If you could get one. They've stopped making them for now.
Any other Rivendell would do well for touring- but their Atlantis model is specifically designed for heavy loaded touring. Again, a whole bike would likely run over $2,500. Seems out of the price range described.

A touring bike should have all the braze-ons necessary to attach front and back racks, panniers, and additional water bottle cages. If you plan to ride under dim light conditions you will need both headlights lights and rear lights, not just blinkies.
Most touring bikes I see in use do not have disc brakes. (I thought disc brakes were a mountain bike thing?) They do have a wide range of gearing to handle steep ascents.
You will not want to carry loads in backpacks- you'll want to have everything loaded on the bikes.

Fully loaded self-supported touring means tent, sleeping bags, sleeping pads if wanted, food, cooking gear if you want to do that, water, several tubes, clothes&toiletries, rain gear... The bike will need to be somewhat sturdy and will likely need to weigh about 25 lbs to handle medium heavy loads. Steel bikes are good for loaded touring.
Unless you are only touring in really flat areas, I myself can't see hauling 40 lbs worth of gear on a 25 lb bike and a dog/trailer combo of 70 lbs as well. This doesn't include your own weight. Well, I guess it could be done on flat routes. But then you wouldn't need disc brakes anyway. ;)
Another consideration- will it be hot? If so, the dog would be pretty uncomfortable under the sun in a hot cramped trailer for hours at a time, bumping over the roads. Do think about whether the dog would actually enjoy the trip as much as you would enjoy having the dog along. :o

I humbly suggest you think of ways to make your first-time tour enjoyable and not an ordeal, so that your partner will want to do more! ;) The second time around you will have a much better idea of what you'll want to bring and leave behind.
Why not try just an overnight lightly loaded tour with a tent etc on some bikes you already have to see how you like it before jumping in to buy new bikes? It's going to be fairly expensive for all the gear and bikes too.

Just some thoughts....
08-01-2007, 07:22 AM
SadieKate

I believe Rivendell specifically stated that the Legolas was not intended for loading touring, but they make other frames that are.
08-01-2007, 07:35 AM
mimitabby

I think an important thing to consider is after you use up the fingers on one hand it is polite to stop counting how many bikes you have.
08-01-2007, 07:37 AM
Blueberry

Take a look at crazyguyonabike.com - there are some journals from folks who have traveled with dogs (though I don't think any are quite that large). It's also a great place to get information about different touring bikes, and what works for different people.

I have 2 touring bikes - a Bike Friday Crusoe and a Trek 520. ISTR that my 520 was not much over $1000, and I bought it at the end of the year. I've not done loaded touring on either (though it is in the plan for the future). I love both bikes. What kind of bikes do you have now? Is there a possibility one would do for short tours to try it out? Since you're touring with your DH, one of you could be lightly loaded and pull the pup in a trailer, and the other could carry most of the load. There really isn't that much more gear for 2 people than 1. You could pull gear in a trailer or use panniers. It's a matter of preference.

Good luck, and let us know how your decision process goes - as you said, we're great enablers:)

ETA - Make sure you think about how to get you, your pup and your gear to AK - 50lbs would have to fly cargo, which would worry me...
08-01-2007, 08:03 AM
Pedal Wench

Quote:

Originally Posted by mimitabby

I think an important thing to consider is after you use up the fingers on one hand it is polite to stop counting how many bikes you have.

I thought it was when I have to start using toes...:D
08-01-2007, 08:13 AM
Torrilin

My partner and I have been talking about doing some touring. Mostly "ride to local state park and camp" sorts of things. Crazyguyonabike is very helpful. Lots of equipment lists, reviews, "what would I do differently" articles. Tour diaries can also help. Most people there feel disc brakes on a tourer are a bad idea, for a laundry list of structural and engineering reasons. The short version is "they break. a lot."

We want to start small, because it will be easier on the budget *and* on us. Plus, then we can start doing lots of short trips on weekends and get out more. And short trips means we can combine biking and hiking. He likes bikes, but thinks camping and hiking are more fun. I like hiking and camping fine, but like bikes a bit more. Compromise! (well that and we both think more excuses for fire and peach cobbler are win/win propositions)

Since you already *have* lots of bikes, take a look and see if you've got one that will take a rack. Add a trailer for your dog, pick a date and go for a minivacation. A 20-50 mile jaunt with an overnight in a motel or at a local state park should help shake some of the kinks out of your gear. Next time, go a bit further, and fix anything that didn't go so well. If you discover you need a touring bike, the Trek one gets good reviews. But for testing the waters you probably don't need it :). Trailer and panniers first.
08-01-2007, 09:47 AM
Trek420

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedal Wench

I thought it was when I have to start using toes...:D

Does that mean only men can have more bikes than fingers and toes? ;) :p :D
08-01-2007, 12:15 PM
nicole309

Try...

Check out what the Keweenaw Adventure Company in Copper Harbor and see what they will be selling at the end of the season. I used to work there, so I know the bikes are well taken care of and can be a really good deal.
Hey, does that crazy shoe guy still work at Cross Country Sports? I remember many time wanting to buy stuff from them, but never being able to get the conversation to go beyond my used tennis shoes and always walking out frustrated. It was funny in a way I suppose.
08-01-2007, 12:41 PM
Pedal Wench

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trek420

Does that mean only men can have more bikes than fingers and toes? ;) :p :D

Got two more counting devices you've missed!:D
08-01-2007, 02:36 PM
Aggie_Ama

We were discussing why everyone doesn't understand that we aren't financially ready to start a family.... I pointed out they would never understand why one of the costs we have discussed is bikes to pull a Burley trailer and those little tot helmets. We are at 4 bikes right now, but I am itching to expand the fleet (and not with a baby hauler). :D

Sorry for the threadjack....
08-01-2007, 02:50 PM
Trek420

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aggie_Ama

.... I pointed out they would never understand why one of the costs we have discussed is bikes to pull a Burley trailer and those little tot helmets. We are at 4 bikes right now, but I am itching to expand the fleet (and not with a baby hauler). :D

Sorry for the threadjack....

Not to mention the adorable childrens jerseys. Do they make baby Sidis? Kids could get expensive :p
08-01-2007, 05:10 PM
Skierchickie

Thanks everybody - great info! I need more!

Wow - so much good stuff!

I really like the dog trailer idea, although we would have to think about the heat, comfort, etc. She'd rather run than anything, so we'd have to have routes where we could find dirt roads with no traffic once in a while, so she could run a little - maybe we could get her used to running on the leash, alongside, for short, safe stretches - she just wants to bolt full speed for a while, though - no fun on a leash for at least a mile or two. I freak whenever we're close to a road with her, so DH is dubious about my ability to let go.:rolleyes: He's right, of course. Another strike against the whole touring idea, in his mind (and I am a mind reader, after all).

I did look at the Rivendell site, and while they sound just wonderful, they all seem pretty far out of my $$$ target range. It/they would spend most of their lives in the garage, which seems unfair for something so nice.:( Good thing I've never seen one in person!

I looked at the Kona online, and was pretty interested, but read some reviews that concerned me. Mainly, a couple of people said that the front wheel would hit their foot when they turned. Not sure what model year - maybe that isn't an issue anymore. I do have huge clown feet for my height (well, maybe not that bad).

I had read the reviews here about the Surly - sounds too perfect! Never had seen a price, and assumed it would be too much, and assumed I'd have to drive 500 miles to find one. I had no idea my Trek dealer could get one! And it looks like the price is right. Thanks for the info, Knot! I do wish I could see/ride one.

Most of the reviews I've seen so far were for the Trek 520 (and I had the price confused with the Kona - MSRP is $1240, not $1500), and it seems to be very popular. As with anything, there are a few people who had a problem and flamed it (much like the Kona).

Just too many choices, and none of them available to ride! I suppose at this point the two front-runners would be the Surly and the Trek, with the Kona in there close behind (interesting about the issues with disc brakes - I thought they'd be a must for rainy conditions, mountains, etc.). How about the Jamis Aurora? Seems like a popular one - is it sturdy enough/good enough components?

By the way, when I said seven bikes, I did mean that if we both bought a touring bike, we'd have seven. I just have two, myself. Hardly seems like enough, after reading some of your posts! Neither of us has one suitable for loading/touring for practice. We each have a 5200 (road/racing), a mountain bike (mine is fully suspended and his is a soft-tail, so not quite the ticket for heavy loads), and he has a TT bike (no way!:eek: ). Anyhoo, we both love biking, hiking, nature, camping.... While I've never bike toured, we did do a 7-day backpacking trip in Alaska (and how is that pertinent, you may ask? I dunno.). I'm pretty confident that I'd like it (although car camping is not my favorite, and I figure we wouldn't be able to get too far off the beaten path, like if we were hiking).

And, finally, DH just isn't sounding interested. Not to the point of refusing, but I think he's getting sick of me harping about it. I said maybe just I could get a bike and try it, and my friend could probably be persuaded to go with me, occasionally. However, honestly, I can't see myself going touring and camping alone, so I reeeaallly want him to jump on board. I'm alternating between being excited and feeling all dejected. I'm all about instant gratification, too, so I want to find a bike, order it, and start riding it. Then, after a week or so, it would probably be hanging in the garage, pushed aside for all the other, easier to utilize toys.

Thanks, guys! Next issue: sizing! I'm totally lost.
08-01-2007, 05:47 PM
Skierchickie

Hi Nicole,

Ah yes - the shoes! Nope - Matt got his degree in elementary education, and has been teaching on a tiny little Island off Alaska for a couple of years. My DH did see him recently, out riding - he comes back here in the summers, but I haven't seen him in the shop. The shoe thing was pretty odd - I always refused to give him any, and eventually he gave up on me. DH would sometimes produce a pair, which just kept it going.

The shop has really changed - still really relaxed and laid back, but, dare I say, far more efficient than before? My favorite thing is stopping in and yakkin' with the owner. I've been buying all my toys there since 1984 (geeze, I'm old!), in spite of the occasional frustration. They've opened a second shop, too, in Houghton. A couple of the guys who worked there in college have stayed on, and run the new place.
08-01-2007, 06:11 PM
anakiwa

It sounds like a touring bike would be a great addition to your stable :)

I own a 1991 Trek 520. It went across the country (fully loaded with me on it) in the summer of 1991. I think it's a great bike- I can't comment on the current componentry (I'm sure it's changed) but the bike I have has held up remarkably well over the years (it's needed the obvious things- tune ups, new tires, chain etc but is in great shape despite several years of near complete neglect).

I still ride this bike regularly (in fact I rode it this morning). Nowadays it's used more as a commuter and for riding on dirt roads (it's got a lot more speed and climbs so much better than my mountain mike, but it's still a lot more stable on the dirt than my road bike would be).

As far as fit goes- for me the touring bike is a little different from my road bike. A few years ago I had a road bike fitting done and discovered that most of the non-WSD bikes have top tubes that are too long for me. I changed the stem and seat-post on the Trek to shorten the reach and it's quite comfy now. Even though the distance between the seat and the handlebars is still farther than my road bike numbers, it still seems to work (I think the fact that the handlebars are not as low means that I can get away with the fact that they're a little further forward). So I don't really know much about how you're supposed to fit a touring bike- but for me handlebars a little higher and further forward than on my road bike seems to work. (I'm pretty sure Trek doesn't make the 520 in WSD sizes- if you have WSD type proportions you'll probably want to consider a different stem and seatpost to shorten the reach if you decide on this bike).

I know what you mean about getting an idea in your head and then not wanting to let it go- I probably drive people crazy when I get on a new idea.

Good luck!
08-02-2007, 01:54 PM
Torrilin

We-ell... The *other* good thing about a touring bike is it makes a great commuter bike. And a great utility bike. So if your husband doesn't want to go on tours with you, a touring bike for you could still be a good addition. Getting groceries by bike is fun :). So is commuting. The extra stability would probably make it a good "walk the dog by bike" platform too. There are some tools out there for walking dogs with a bike.

Note that some cyclocross bikes can work as touring bikes (mostly the steel ones). The geometry isn't as good for heavy loads, but the two styles of bike seem quite similar.

Can't really tell you much about fit on 'em. I've got gorilla arms, a long torso and short legs, so standard bikes fit me fine.
08-02-2007, 10:56 PM
RoadRaven

There are 6 of us in this house...

My partner - 4
Son #1 - 4
Son #2 - 3
Son #3 - 2
Son #4 - 1
Me - 2

+ 3 mountain bikes and 3 sundry bikes for general use...

My daughter also has 1 bike, but she has moved away

(break down includes: 4 Cervelo, 3 EMC2, 6 Giant, 2 Scorpio, 3 Avanti, 1 Raleigh - the others are genericly branded bikes)

So... my answer to your question... if two people can have seven bikes??? It seems rather limiting to me... I would say... AT LEAST... :p
08-04-2007, 11:52 AM
Skierchickie

Curses, Foiled Again! Thwarted at the moat....grrrrr

Well, I called the lbs to get prices on the Trek 520, Surly LHT, & Kona Sutra. In his research Mr Lbs found that both the Trek and the Surly are sold out in my size for the year. I'm still not as keen on the Kona, although it is still in the running. So I will probably end up waiting until next year (my instant gratification addiction has been denied!:( ).

On the bright side, my lbs has a price of $999 for the Trek (MSRP=$1239, per the Trek website), the Kona would be ~$1200 (MSRP $1499), and the Surly "much less", per the owner (didn't get the actual amount, as he was looking at the availability at the time, and there was nothing close to my size).

My next step is to go and look at the 21" Trek that he has there, which will likely be just a smidge too tall for me - my 50cm road bike's top tube is 29.5" from the floor, with very little extra clearance, and the 21" 520 claims to be 30.1". Wish I weren't so deformed (okay - true story - in college, one day I was sitting next to a rather tall male acquaintance. At the end of class, we both stood up, and he literally exclaimed "You look like a normal person, sitting down! But you're short!"). I should be able to ride it, anyway, to see if I love it. Wish I could do the same with the Surly, as I am intrigued by it. I realize that I could possibly find what I want this year, if I look elsewhere, but this guy has been great to us, and his prices have been great, for many years, so if I buy something he can get, I'd like to remain the loyal customer.

Alas, I must away! My in-laws are sitting downstairs, unattended, and we were gone most of the day, at our favorite Tri.