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  1. #1
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    OMG USADA Lance etc

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    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/24/sp...pagewanted=all


    Lance may be stripped of all TdF titles.
    Each day is a gift, that's why it is called the present.

  2. #2
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  3. #3
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    Mar 2007
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    sometimes, I wonder about USADA. I don't like them!

    Jurisdiction issues are really big sticking point for me. There is UCI, so why does USADA think it has the authority to tell other sports organization on what to do.

    I also am not sure about how clean Lance is but if he managed to not get caught after so many suprise visits by the vampires and all, I have to give him more than reasonable doubt.

  4. #4
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    I think it's going to hurt the Tour more than Lance himself. This proves nothing - his fans will stick around and his enemies will hate him anyway. But revoking 10 titles since 96 is going to kill all respect for the results of the TdF.

    "I never met a donut I didn't like" - Dave Wiens

  5. #5
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    So who wins? I think every second placer has also been implicated in doping scandals.

    What a mess.
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  6. #6
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    I think that basically, folks who thought he was clean will still think he was clean and those who doubted will continue to doubt... and it's not as if people are going to forget those seven titles no matter what the "official" guys say. I think it's a smart move on Lance's part -- time to move on!

  7. #7
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    Dec 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by jessmarimba View Post
    I think it's going to hurt the Tour more than Lance himself. This proves nothing - his fans will stick around and his enemies will hate him anyway. But revoking 10 titles since 96 is going to kill all respect for the results of the TdF.
    I agree, it solves nothing but makes things a mess. We know he won tours when others clearly were doping. So IF he doped, wasn't it a level playing field. I want to believe he did not dope. And even if he did, could you really dope for that long and still be that good? Wouldn't it eventually mess you up one way or another? Or get so that you can't really keep "out performing"?

    I'm sure this will eventually be a controversial thread.

    K
    katluvr

  8. #8
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    Whether or not one always was a Lance or fan or not, this clearly confuses and tarnishes the Tour /other big competitive international cycling races.

    We know someone who competed in Europe when he lived there for a few years..... doping was common among the racers. This was awhile back. Did he dope? Yes.
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  9. #9
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    I don't agree that him dropping the fight against them, admits guilt. I also don't agree that they should be allowed to ban him for life when he has never been convicted.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by smilingcat View Post
    I also am not sure about how clean Lance is but if he managed to not get caught after so many suprise visits by the vampires and all, I have to give him more than reasonable doubt.
    I'm not sure. If he's using EPO, wouldn't he just need it for the races? So a surprise visit, mid year, would turn up zero, right?

    I completely understand him wanted to end it. But also consider that the investigation was going to make a completely different turn and many of his teammates were prepared to testify against him. For a man of Armstrong's ego, this could be devastating. I've found Armstrong quite fascinating and have read a lot about him. He is driven and fanatical about protecting his reputation. He has used his clout to get his way when he was criticized, e.g., the Lemond/Armstrong feud that resulted in Lemond apologizing publically - and in return Lance would not withdraw his support of Trek bicycles.

    Not long ago, a U.S. district judge in Austin threw out Armstrong's lawsuit against the USADA because it was basically 80 pages of propoganda designed to influence the public opinion on his case. You'd think that Armstrong with his legal team would know better.

    Did he do it? I tend to think yes. Armstrong would talk about his exceptional VO2max, but when tested it was found to be about the same for most professional cyclists. Why would Armstrong, given his zeal for managing his publicity, associate with Ferrari? Why is LA Confidential only published in French? Why are there no teammates coming forward to profess his innocence? Armstrong has the means and motive to dope and cover it up. Ferrari was accused of combining testosterone & olive oil because it makes testosterone undetectable. Armstrong was found to have paid Ferrari almost a half a million dollars in 2006 but supposedly their relationship ended in 2002.

    Still, it does taint the sport very badly.
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  11. #11
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    Jun 2006
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    I have always believed he was doping, but so were most others. So to me that makes it a level playing field. This doesn't take away from the amazing wins in my eyes.
    By the way, I don't like Lance, but I think it is too late to me doing this!
    pedal pusher

  12. #12
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    Ugh, I forgot - Johan still has an arbitration hearing coming up. Still a chance for messy, dirty legal proceedings.

    "I never met a donut I didn't like" - Dave Wiens

  13. #13
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    I'm not a particular fan of Lance. I'm also not surprised that he stopped fighting over it--the whole process has got to be wearing. I think he was doping, but then, so was everyone else. It just seems like a matter of trying to make an example of him.
    At least I don't leave slime trails.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhodie View Post
    So who wins? I think every second placer has also been implicated in doping scandals.

    What a mess.
    That's exactly what I was thinking.
    Each day is a gift, that's why it is called the present.

  15. #15
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    Jun 2006
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    Here are the second place finishers:

    1999 Alex Zulle, 2000 Jan Ullrich, 2001 Jan Ullrich, 2002 Joseba Belocki, 2003 Jan Ullrich, 2004 Andreas Kloden, 2005 Ivan Basso.

    Ullrich and Basso were both suspended for doping, but I don't know about the other guys. It will be interesting to see how this affects the outcome.

    But I'll never think that Lance didn't win.
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