Saddle Sores - Sorry maybe TMI

[cmac77354]

Thanks for all the replies. This past weekend I didn't have the problem. I really lubed up with Chamois But'r and it seemed to work.

[seeker]

Hi. I'm new here. I know a couple of your members from another site. They're always recommending that I come join you over here. I've lurked but never really needed to post anything. But I am now desperate for help and I've come to you.

I started biking in January and am training for a triathlon. My first sprint is in July. I have had saddle issues from the get-go. I've changed saddles. I've gone over this and over this with my LBS. They have been very supportive. We put my bike on the store trainer and tried several saddles. They sold me my bike and I was properly fitted.

So here's my problem and it is way tmi. I've tried to describe this to both the LBS and my coach but no one seems to appreciate my problem. When I sit on the saddle it splits my labia apart and all the pressure rubs right on my clitoris. I wear Peal Izumi bike shorts and I've also worn Sugoi tri shorts. I rode 30 miles today and it almost looks like I have 2 blisters on the lower part of my clitoris. I am constantly having to shift my weight to the back of the seat. When my saddle was completely level it was even worse. My coach tilted it slightly back and it took some of the pressure off and it was manageable. But my rides are getting longer and it has become unendurable. I currently have this saddle on my bike. I don't know whether I need a wider seat or a more narrow seat. The LBS thought maybe I need a men's seat. I'm 5'4" and weigh 125. I have no hips to speak of. I am starting to get a butt since I've been riding. The LBS told me I have more of a male body type than female and thought since I was narrow through the hips that maybe I should try a male saddle. But I think that will just make the labia splitting worse. I asked the LBS on Saturday if they could tilt my saddle back a little more. But they insisted it needed to go forward. But when I'm riding every ounce of pressure is on my clit. My coach coaches several women who use a Terry Butterfly seat. I asked him if I should try that seat. He's looked at my seat and feels it is a good seat.

Sex has obviously become an issue. Not only do I have the clitoral problems but my entire pubic area is bruised. It's been this way for 4 months.
Right now I'm riding between 60-90 minutes of trainer drills on Tuesday. 45 minutes of either trainer or road on Wednesday. Then 2 hours on Sat or Sun.
My time on the bike is only going to get longer. I have not been able to get any men to understand what my issue is. I've told them the exact same thing I've told you but they just don't get it.

So I've come to you in hopes of two things. One, you will understand where my pain is and two, maybe have a few suggestions.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

[koala]

Wow, that sounds really awful. A couple of things jump out. One is your shorts. Tri shorts tend to have a really thin chamois, and PI's tend to have a really stiff chamois. My guess is neither one is helping in your situation, but they can make matters worse. Second thing is that you sound like you're pretty active on your saddle when you ride, you move around a fair amount. So you end up rubbing the front area more, and irritating it more, a vicious cycle. I would suggest less is more up front for you. Your cut-out looks small. There is better out there. Check out the Selle SMP line for h-u-g-e cut-outs. If there's nothing there at all, it can't irritate. Also, Selle San Marco makes something called an Aero Saddle. It has a big cut-out in a diamond shape that might just give your bruised parts clearance. Be sure it is the Aero, and not some other models that use the "arrowhead" cut-out as there is a difference in the front end.

I don't think you gain anything by going to the Butterfly. It is a soft saddle, and if you push on the cut-out you'll see it has a tendency to fold in under pressure & pinch in front. You'd probably be better off with something firmer that has as big a hole as possible but will still keep its shape if you shift around on it.

[mimitabby]

Hi. I'm new here. I know a couple of your members from another site. They're always recommending that I come join you over here. I've lurked but never really needed to post anything. But I am now desperate for help and I've come to you.

I started biking in January and am training for a triathlon. My first sprint is in July. I have had saddle issues from the get-go. I've changed saddles. I've gone over this and over this with my LBS. They have been very supportive. We put my bike on the store trainer and tried several saddles. They sold me my bike and I was properly fitted.

So here's my problem and it is way tmi. I've tried to describe this to both the LBS and my coach but no one seems to appreciate my problem. When I sit on the saddle it splits my labia apart and all the pressure rubs right on my clitoris. I wear Peal Izumi bike shorts and I've also worn Sugoi tri shorts. I rode 30 miles today and it almost looks like I have 2 blisters on the lower part of my clitoris. I am constantly having to shift my weight to the back of the seat. When my saddle was completely level it was even worse. My coach tilted it slightly back and it took some of the pressure off and it was manageable. But my rides are getting longer and it has become unendurable. I currently have this saddle on my bike. I don't know whether I need a wider seat or a more narrow seat. The LBS thought maybe I need a men's seat. I'm 5'4" and weigh 125. I have no hips to speak of. I am starting to get a butt since I've been riding. The LBS told me I have more of a male body type than female and thought since I was narrow through the hips that maybe I should try a male saddle. But I think that will just make the labia splitting worse. I asked the LBS on Saturday if they could tilt my saddle back a little more. But they insisted it needed to go forward. But when I'm riding every ounce of pressure is on my clit. My coach coaches several women who use a Terry Butterfly seat. I asked him if I should try that seat. He's looked at my seat and feels it is a good seat.

Sex has obviously become an issue. Not only do I have the clitoral problems but my entire pubic area is bruised. It's been this way for 4 months.
Right now I'm riding between 60-90 minutes of trainer drills on Tuesday. 45 minutes of either trainer or road on Wednesday. Then 2 hours on Sat or Sun.
My time on the bike is only going to get longer. I have not been able to get any men to understand what my issue is. I've told them the exact same thing I've told you but they just don't get it.

So I've come to you in hopes of two things. One, you will understand where my pain is and two, maybe have a few suggestions.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

Seeker, i'd say you 're not set up right on the bike. If you were, you would have all your weight on your sit bones, not the front of your crotch.

I can't even imagine how you can ride that way for 5 minutes!

how about a photo of you on your bike from the side?

and here's a dumb suggestion; can't you position yourself so all your delicate parts are right over to the side a bit
so that the saddle nose isn't ON them?

And what kind of saddle is it?

[emily_in_nc]

I don't know whether I need a wider seat or a more narrow seat. The LBS thought maybe I need a men's seat. I'm 5'4" and weigh 125. I have no hips to speak of. I am starting to get a butt since I've been riding. The LBS told me I have more of a male body type than female and thought since I was narrow through the hips that maybe I should try a male saddle.

I feel your pain, though I have a problem with a persistent saddle sore in the area in the crease of my inner thigh. Anything down there that hurts badly is not right or normal. I once rode over 3000 miles a year without significant saddle issues.

I've just discovered that despite having small hips (34"), weighing 102-103, and wearing a size 2 petite, I actually don't have the "narrow sit bones" that I thought I had! My saddle sore started a YEAR AGO on a narrow saddle. I changed to a different narrow saddle. It never went away even when I didn't ride for three months in a row. I went to a dermatologist and got a cortisone injection right in the sore, which took all the pain away; however, after my second ride this spring, it came right back, angry and swollen as ever!

So yesterday I finally sat on my yoga mat in underwear and was finally able to see the problem -- my sit bones are actually wider than I thought. Maybe average for a female (about 130mm c-to-c), but a lot wider than I realized. If you go to a Specialized dealer, they can sit you on the "Butt-o-meter" (memory foam seat) so you can find out the same thing.

Based on my measurements, I now realize my narrow saddles are too narrow for me; as a result, my sit bones are hanging off the sloping sides and putting way too much pressure on the inside of the bones and soft tissue in the crease of my thigh.

So...while I don't think you can know (yet) what width saddle you need, it sounds like you need a much better cutout for your lady bits! The saddle I'm taking off my mountain bike has an amazing diamond-shape cutout, so comfy, never a bit of genital discomfort, but the saddle width is relatively narrow (140mm). If you figure out your sit bone width and want to try it, I'm going to be putting it up for sale here over the weekend (w/pictures, etc.). It's a Selle San Marco Atola Gelaround like this. I'm not posting here to sell it, though, just to make a couple of points:

1. Don't assume because you're thin and/or have narrow hips that you have narrow, male-width sitbones.

2. With the clitoral issues you're having, it sounds like you need a much better cutout. Your clitoris should not even be touching the saddle if it is painful. I personally get very raw if I ride a saddle without a cutout for anything longer than short rides, and skinny, stiff cutouts are just as bad as no cutout at all. The diamond-shape cutout of the Atola is perfect for me in that area (just wish the saddle were wider in the rear!)

Good luck!
Emily

[OakLeaf]

It definitely sounds like you need a different saddle! The one you're riding is pretty narrow, and typically if someone's putting her weight on her genitalia rather than on her sit bones, it's because her saddle's too narrow.

Here's what I did: I sat on a piece of paper on my Pilates mat to make a butt print. (Sit on a low step-stool, or on a hard chair with your feet on a stool, to approximate a riding position.) While the indentations were fresh, I circled them so I'd have a permanent record of where my sitbones are. Then you can take that print and lay it over any saddle and see whether it's wide enough to support you.

Then there's pear shaped vs. T-shaped saddles, and the shape of the cut-out to consider. Just like trying on clothes, there's no substitute for trying on saddles. Many LBS's and many saddle makers will let you return a saddle that doesn't work for you.

I have to say this: your coach may be very good at teaching you to get stronger and faster, but he obviously knows nothing about saddles if he thinks he can look at one and say "it's a good seat" and therefore it ought to work for you. If he hasn't measured your sitbones, the Q-angle of your femurs, and the dimensions of your soft tissues he has no idea what saddles might work for you and what ones wouldn't.

[seeker]

Thanks ladies. I see your point about the cutout, however I am putting all my pressure on the nose of the seat, not over the cutout. That is why I thought tilting the seat back would help. When I had the seat level, my bits were right at the tip of the seat. We tilted it back slightly and now my bits are almost to the cutout but not quite. I wanted the LBS to tilt it back some more and they wouldn't do it. They don't think that will solve my problem. But they don't have a clitoris either. And yes I do move around a lot because I'm trying to shift my weight to the back of the seat.

I have tried shifting things around but I can't seem to keep my labia from separating. I know I'm not seated properly but I'm not sure what to do. I can't sit on a folding chair or a wooden bench without sitting on a pillow. If I sit directly on the hard chair, I'm sitting right on my sit bones. I don't have much padding there. I actually keep a pillow in my car because I can't handle the church pew. So I know if I were sitting on the saddle properly, I'd probably feel it in my sit bones. But I don't. It's all up front.

I'll see if I can get a picture but that might be a problem. DH is not supportive of my biking. And I'm not sure he can even operate the camera. I'll have to work on him.

If you have any more suggestions, please give them to me. As I mentioned in my first post, my tri coach has seen me on the bike. He thought I was seated properly. He didn't understand my discomfort and I was finally able to talk him into tipping my seat back. The LBS have seen me on my seat numerous times and they also feel I'm seated correctly so I don't know what the heck to do. I was hoping a simple saddle change would fix the problem.

emily, I may get in front of the mirror and see if I can measure the distance from sit bone to sit bone.

Thanks.

[seeker]

I just read your post Oakleaf. I will get these measurements. Thanks.

[OakLeaf]

Just to clarify, do measure your sitbones. The other things make a difference but aren't easily measured, any more than they are before you try on a pair of jeans.

[sundial]

Yes, by all means have your sitbones measured. Check and see if your bike shop has a butt-o-meter to measure your sit bones.

[OakLeaf]

Read Knott's comments on sitbone measurement here.

[aicabsolut]

Hard bumps sounds to me like the typical saddle sore cysts. That you're also chafing on the sit bones and you feel like things are being pinched indicates that these shorts do not fit you, that the material is irritating, and the seams are probably getting in the wrong places.

If they feel at all loose in the chamois, they do not fit right. Go with a smaller size.

You may need to see a dermatologist about the cysts. In the meantime, I find that a combination of hydrocortisone cream and neosporin post-ride helps a lot, and keep using the chamois cream when you ride (in different shorts). My derm gave me a prescription for antibiotics to take the next time I have a saddle sore developing. She says it should clear up before it gets all huge and gross. We'll see if that works. Some people have had luck getting theirs injected with cortisone. Severe ones may require surgical removal.

I also say be careful of shaving there if you're getting any chafing.

[VeloVT]

I ride a saddle without a cutout. I had many more problems with chafing, bruising, pinching, pressure WITH a cutout than I have since I started riding saddles without cutouts (I've had good luck with a few different Fizik saddles). We are all different, and I know many if not most people swear by cutouts, but they aren't right for everyone... Just something to consider, you shouldn't necessarily take it for granted that you will be most comfortable on a women's saddle or a saddle with a cutout.

Good luck!!! Sounds like your saddle is no fun right now!

[Kano]

Recently, I went into my LBS, convinced I needed to try a narrower saddle with a different shaped cut out.

Bike Guy John came out of the service department, and asked how he could help. So, I explained my situation. He asked if I'd bought the bike along. Nope, I hadn't -- I can put a saddle on my bike, didn't figure there was any need.

I want to see you on the bike before I'll sell you a saddle, he said. "I think it's a reach issue." I thanked him and said I'd be back in a couple of days with the bike.

I have the same saddle and I'm much happier on it now. I have a shorter stem that's been angled up a bit more, and my saddle is farther back, down a bit lower, and angled a bit differently. No charge for the hour of his time or the parts.

Except that I bought some socks, and dragged DH in to figure out his wheel problem the other day.

We may still change the saddle, after I put more miles on it with this set up, but it's MUCH better than it was!

Maybe someone else needs to look at you on your bike, along with the possibility of a different saddle?

Karen in Boise

[aicabsolut]

My bike came with a saddle that was too narrow for my sit bones, so I wound up putting more pressure in the wrong area. This led to bruising and soreness on the pubis, but not chafing or pinching in the crease of the leg or on the sitbones.

I then switched to a wider saddle. Things were better, but then I started getting chafing in the hot months.

I finally switched to a harder, thinner racing saddle (still with a cutout), and a lot of the chafing and pinching went away, because I now have the maximum stability under my stibones. Now the only problems I have are definitely correlated to the shorts--seams, looseness in the chamois area over time, or the fabric covering the chamois. I can only do so much about that, because I go with what the team gets. I just try to get the snuggest fit that I can and lube up.

FWIW, I ride with the saddle pretty nose-down for a girl. My crit racing position is even lower than where I may put it for long rides in the fall, to make it even more nose-down and comfortable when I'm in the drops. I don't think I'll have to move this saddle any, though, because it's gotten very broken in and molded to me, unlike the others.