Loner Manners?

[Brandy]

Oakleaf, I know there is no drafting advantage to following closely on a climb but there sure is a mental boost and the companionship of shared misery.

Generally, people don't stand in pacelines. Do it at the back.

And if you're climbing closely with someone and need to stand, just call it out beforehand. It's a good idea to be climbing spaced a little bit apart so that the kickback of standing won't cause contact but you can still be close enough to gossip.

Or drop the "f-bomb" repeatedly. On the Eastern Sierra Double last year I was riding with a girl and her fiancee and he actually dropped us because our language got so colorful on one particular climb.

[maillotpois]

It's a good idea to be climbing spaced a little bit apart so that the kickback of standing won't cause contact but you can still be close enough to gossip.

I think this is fine, just as long as you are not talking about me.

[MM_QFC!]

...but you can still be close enough to gossip.

or whine together!

[SadieKate]

Even if the paces in climbing are not the same (which they were not on that particular ride), it is a great challenge for the lead rider to keep a pace the other can comfortably follow. You have to really be aware of the other rider's pace, how they show weakness and tiredness.

I use this as one of my indicators for conditioning and bike handling skills. When I can pace a slower rider up a hill, I know my own fitness and skills are doing well.

In other words, I don't HAVE to find my own pace to survive the hill.

[SadieKate]

I think this is fine, just as long as you are not talking about me.

Oh, well, then . . . . . . . .

Is it okay as long as we don't use Brandy's f-bomb?

[maillotpois]

You've met me, right? The f-bomb would be required...

[Crankin]

This is to answer Grog's question. My rides are social because while some of us are close together, others are riding side by side IF we are on a rural country road, and others are passing and/or moving back to talk to friends.
We also stop and regroup. AMC requires there is a sweep. That is usually me when I lead with my husband, so let's say at the top of a climb, the group will wait until I show up behind the slowest person. We don't drop anyone. MOST of the time all of the riders are within a speed range, but last year, on all of our rides, we had at least one "outlier." It was torture for me, mostly because each of these persons misrepresented their skills when I screened them. Now I am so fricken to the point when I screen riders, they truly understand if it's the ride for them. Every single time the person has been a woman, who lives near the city, who is not used to the smallest rollers and hills. So they say they can ride 25 or 35 miles, but they lie about their average and the hill thing. These rides are not that fast to begin with, and there are "easier" group rides in the club, so there is no reason to lie.
We stopped leading the show and go rides, because there are too many unknowns. After 3 years, I know most of the people who sign up for our rides and the new ones usually are nice people who have found the type of ride they want.
The other club I ride with is part of a more traditional bike club. However, it's a group for "older" riders who can ride during the week. I hooked up with them in the summer when one of them came on one of my rides, that I lead alone on a 95 degree day, when my husband was in the hospital. Of course, there are a lot of younger people, 30's-40's who come, too. These groups tend to be huge and some are very squirrelly. I stay up front and that avoids the issue. Many of these people are great athletes, have run the Boston Marathon many times and ride long distances. They are just older and slower now.

[Eden]

Silly me, here I thought that riding single file was pacelining without the intent of drafting.

I'll have to agree with you here - riding in a line with other people is pacelining no matter how fast you are going and not knowing how to do it is dangerous no matter how fast you are going... in fact falls at slow speeds are probably more likely to result in broken bones than really fast ones, which result in more road rash....

Even if you are a loner if you EVER plan to do an organized ride you will more than likely end up in some sort of informal paceline, so better to know how to do it than end up in over your head.

[Crankin]

Well, the only time I went down on a group ride was when the leader slowed without signaling. My husband was behind him, thinking this guy knew how to paceline. After he hit, he knew he was going down, and swung wide so I wouldn't hit him. Of course, my eyes followed him, and I went down, along with the 2 behind me. We were going around 20, which may not be fast for some, but for this group it was. I wasn't hurt, but I was shook up, my helmet scraped, and I had a headache for a week. We left the group and rode to the emergency room after my husband's elbow swelled like crazy (it was just from the medication he takes).
Not my best ride and I will never go on a ride with that leader again. He's very nice, but doesn't know how to lead.

[jobob]

When I can pace a slower rider up a hill, I know my own fitness and skills are doing well.

I'll remember that next time we ride up a hill together and you're hanging back with me.

[jobob]

Sorry V, cute girls on stunning steel steeds simply cannot BE "creepy".

Sure I can!

[jobob]

Well, the only time I went down on a group ride was when the leader slowed without signaling.

Sounds a lot like the Ride Leader from Hell that snapdragen and I had a few years ago, when we participated in a series of training rides put on by a local club to to prepare us for the Cinderella ride.

Luckily no one suffered any bodily harm on account of said ride leader's boneheaded maneuvers, but I considered strangling her on more than one occasion.

[SadieKate]

I'll remember that next time we ride up a hill together and you're hanging back with me.

And just how will you be able to tell if I'm hanging back or hanging on?

Something tells me you can put the hurt on me right now. I've got a lot of puppy cuddling to do.

Not to mention it snowed again last night and still hasn't melted in the shadows.

[Geonz]

We also have social rides that have absolutely nothing resembling a paceline. There is, simply, more room between riders. Many of the riders are really glad that there is a chance to go for a ride and not have to have an extra skill set (and there's the occasional person who's been in a crash and is gun-shy... ). Sometimes there are 30 or 40 of us ... but it doesn't take long to become subgroups and we *do* talk about & encourage & dare I say enforce not being a traffic hazard with creative clumping.

Just a word in defense of outliers... many people overestimate their averages because they sort of interpret it to mean "the speed you spend most of your time going." Most faster riders (and it sounds like your club's easiest rides are pretty fast) use the actual average that the speedo gives... which means (at least around here, where we generally have to go a bit in traffic to get out to the ountry) that most of the time we're riding significantly faster than the "average." It's a constant communication challenge. (I can also sympathize with hoping that the easiest club ride would actually be in the range of a relative beginner.)

[OakLeaf]

many people overestimate their averages because they sort of interpret it to mean "the speed you spend most of your time going."

Actually in the two clubs I belong to, the "ride average speed" is expressly defined the way you're talking about. So, say a flat B ride will "average" 17-20 mph, because that's how fast we're going most of the time, even though at the end of the ride, with warm-up, stop signs, turnaround, etc., our computers will read a true average more in the 15 mph range.