Mace PepperGun, vs spray or gel...

[Miranda]

http://mace.com/index.php/product/index/id/5

I know that some of you on here carry mace pepper spray with you on rides. I have been thinking about getting some. On the Mace web site, they offer some different options. A dog version, protection spray, protection gel, and this PepperGun (shown in link above).

I have asthma and worry about the risk of cross contamination a bit more than the average user. Don't think it would mix well with the asthma. So, I was thinking the gel might be a better option. Then I saw this PepperGun in link above. I would think if you could aim better, and further, the risk of contaminating yourself would be less? Also, I want the spray for more than dog protection.


Thanks!

[Zen]

I think you've got a good idea there
Pricey but good

[TahoeDirtGirl]

Call me crazy but that thing looks too much like a gun! If you are using it for dogs I would go for the regular squirt one (talk to your postal carrier, they use it!). I am not sure I would want to have something on me that looks like a gun. But then again, if you are pulling it to squirt a human, then maybe that would be enough to scare them off?

I carry bear pepper spray. Not so much for bears, but for people. I figure if it's hefty enough for a bear, it'll work on dogs and people. Plus I have several bottles that I get per year for doing bear aversion training.

Make sure you look into you local carrying laws. In California, I could carry the bear spray with no problem, because we have black bears and mountain lions (I'm not sure it works on them but what else can you do?). Here in Mass, I found out I'm breaking the law by carrying it and I need a permit, even if I switched to the regular dog mace. The black bear and mountain lion plea won't work here

[Chicken Little]

I vote for the bear spray, too. Less likely to be a liability. And a double barrel shot gun is awkward on a road bike. Feasible on a mountain bike, but, awkward otherwise.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

If you want to be able to grab your pepper spray in a hurry, you have to strap it where it's easy to grab, you can't have it buckled inside your saddlebag, etc.
No way you could ride around with that GUN in plain view on your bike! People would be calling the police left and left. Not to mention kids trying to grab the 'toy gun' and shoot each other with it.
Yikes.

[Trek420]

When police arrive they might not inquire first if it's a toy. "Is this a toy? Or do we just shoot you?"

If used in self defense situation the perp might see your Peppergun, have a real gun ... and then it's down to who's fastest on the draw and the best shot. Self defense the situational stuff "if he does this I ... but if he does that I ... but if ..." never works. There's always someone faster, stronger, longer reach, more training, just gets a lucky punch ... than you.

There are some general principles that we all can learn but stuff that needs a Powerpoint flow chart of "this is stored there but if that happens then ...." not gonna work.

I don't carry weapons, have no plan to do so. Well ... there is one section of my commute, a bike/ped overpass I used to keep a small and I mean tiny pocket knife inside the back of my left glove.

One of the good things about the gas price increase is now ... that's no longer deserted there are other bike commuters on it. We even got it cleaned!!!

Trust your instincts and your gut, if a situation, place, person feels bad .... leave. I can understand if you ride, hike or work where there are bears etc. But even most bears will leave you alone if you make enough noise I think.

When it comes to people it's better to leave for no explicable reason than stay thinking "well I have ____ somewhere in my zippered jersey pocket"

Or take a self defense class. Here one goes on in my front yard

[alpinerabbit]

I don't carry weapons, have no plan to do so.
One of the good things about the gas price increase is now ... that's no longer deserted :

what she said. your weapon will be turned against you.

[boy in a kilt]

I guess it depends on what you plan to do with it. I liked the water practice cartridges. For some reason, dogs find being squirted with water distracting when they are in chase mode.

The problem with any chemical agent like this is it works both ways. If the source of your vexation is upwind from you, your weapons is useless at best and may save your attacker the effort of incapacitating you. I've been sprayed with various chemical agents (military training and a jerk ex-roomie) and I can say from experience that it hurts. You really don't want to do much but get that crap out of your mucous membranes.

Whipping that thing out, particularly in iffy light could lead to an escalation you aren't ready for.

And finally, you gotta train with that thing. Figure out where you are going to put it for quick, easy access. The only way to find the right place is practice. If you are facing a human attacker, it has to be fast enough that you have it out and sprayed in their eyes before they have time to close the distance and beat you senseless because that is what they will do if you pull a can of Mace out and don't use it in time.

The last bit of your practice should be getting the hell out of there as quickly as possible. If the person recovers quickly, they are going to be pi**ed off at you.

[Trek420]

Not be a downer but what he says

I liked the water practice cartridges.

Oh goody, they have practice cartridges, I wondered about that.

Get them in bulk because you'll need to practice. By practice I mean from sitting, from standing, from the ground, gloves on, gloves off, assailant is on the right side, left side of you, in front of you, behind, backlit, in the dark, in motion on the bike, taller assailant, multiple opponents, they are armed, unarmed ... every possible variation and combination thereof.

Be creative, have fun You'll need to do this 2-3 times a week to have it ingrained in muscle memory.

I hope to never use martial arts training. For one there is the utter embarasment and humiliation of a Nidan looking like Americas Funniest Home Videos.

The right response just has to be in muscle memory.

I've been sprayed with various chemical agents (military training and a jerk ex-roomie) and I can say from experience that it hurts. You really don't want to do much but get that crap out of your mucous membranes.

I don't train to be the biggest baddest mo'fo' on the block (ignore the hysterical laughter in the background), It's the love of the art, thrill of learning a new skill and every once in a while getting it right and because I hate hate hate to stretch ... but I'll do this

Aikido is not meant as self defense. But may work best if needed because is it's not about pain.

I tell new students when they ask
"Do I have this pin right? He's not tapping out?"
"Can he get up?"
looks down at struggling thrashing partner "no"
"Then it's right"

What do you do to the drugged crazy person who is not feeling any pain? And they have to be crazy to attack you, right?

I used to train with a guy who was/is (we've lost track of each other) an orderly at Highland Hospital in Oakland. They'd call him in when they had the violent patient who fell asleep on a steam radiator He was a gentle giant of a man. He'd just put the patient in a pin and it's just engineering; down, pinned.

Then the Dr's would do their work with a shot or drugs.

So, now that you can accurately shoot left handed backwards standing on one leg ... and he's still coming atcha or not reacting. What now? Because he's amped up and event with the gunk in his eyes one can do quite a bit of damage.

What's the back up plan?

It has to be fast enough that you have it out and sprayed in their eyes before they have time to close the distance and beat you senseless because that is what they will do if you pull a can of Mace out and don't use it in time.

Things happen very fast. I'm just sayin'.

Even a double amputee can reach you faster than you thought. Don't ask

Are you prepared to shoot first and explain later? You'll need to work on timing. All those variations? Now practice when he's running at you, walking towards you, standing ...

None of this is meant to be discouraging.

We have the right to ride where we want and when we want.

Especially as women, I have the right to say "I'm going to ride _____ alone, I want to ride now, at 3 am" whether there are lions and tigers and bears or whoever I have the right to feel safe ... anywhere anytime.

And I should not have to spend a lifetime doing martial arts or a fortune on weapons to do so.

I've been training since about '80, do I feel good about my timing, technique and reactions in any situation? Mmmmmmmaybe, maybe not.

I have no desire to find out. I just wanna train.

That's why I do everything possible to avoid the situation in the first place.

The last bit of your practice should be getting the hell out of there as quickly as possible. If the person recovers quickly, they are going to be pi**ed off at you.

Arthritic from the neck down I can't run. So I'd just have to stay put and throw 'em or avoid the situation in the first place.

That does not mean staying inside, not going anywhere alone. That means trusting my gut, a touch of common sense and avoiding conflict. If I do everything I can and still get in a situation that is unavoidable then well....

But I think I can speak for anyone who trains that I hope to never find out.

[tulip]

I'm with Trek and Alpinerabbit. A weapon can be used against you, and can become a crutch. Self-defense classes give you lots of options for all kinds of situations, and emphasize avoiding such situations.

[Trek420]

Not sure I'd call it a crutch but if you mean thinking "I have a weapon, I'm ready for anything" then yes, a dangerous crutch.

To get where I am, feeling somewhat prepared takes decades of training, taking classes, staying after class, starting early. I don't want to be discouraging but it's a lifelong commitment and goal. Every once in a while I get it right. I love that.

Here L stays after class to show the proper way to send M at right flying ;-) The gal on the left is soon going up for black belt.

Your local police can recommend a self defense class and instructor. One to several days at most should give you options, experience.

Then go out and ride and let's hope none of us ever need it.