Dangers of Vegetarianism?

[kaian]

I was a vegetarian for several years and went back to eating chicken about a year ago. I was having soft tissue problems - I had tendinitis in 4 different parts of my body within a 3 year period all from "overuse" even though I really was not over-training. My chiropractor suggested I try eating some meat to see if it made a difference. I don't like red meat and I am allergic to fish, so I just eat chicken maybe 2-3 times a week at most and do whey protein shakes as well. I have not had any problems since I started eating meat. I have also noticed that my performance on the bike has improved, which I didn't expect.

So...while I think vegetarianism is the ideal (I don't really enjoy eating meat), I don't think it was working for me. A lot of veg products you can buy at the store are processed and that's something to think about too. Too much processed food is not good either. So...if you can prepare healthy meals and your body responds well, I say go for it. I think it's different for everyone. It certainly can't hurt to try. I tried for 6 years and ultimately I think there was something I wasn't getting that I needed.

It's hard though. I do think about the animals and some days it's hard for me to eat the chicken. I have to eat pre-cooked (can't see it in its raw form) chicken. But, I am feeling better and it has kept me out of physical therapy!

[deena]

I have been a vegetarian for more than ten years. No meat, chicken, or fish. I do eat eggs and dairy, but as I have become a better eater, have reduced that too.

Concentrate on whole grains, fruits, and veggies. The key is variety. I don't look at the nutritional value of each meal, but of the day as a whole. If I am eating lunch out with co-workers I may wind up with a cheese sandwich - just make up the difference at dinner. I also took to grazing (on HEALTHY foods) rather than eating big meals.

There's a great book - Vegetarian Sports Nutrition by D. Enette Larson-Meyer, who is a cyclist. She covers foods as well as meeting the hydration needs. Great resource.

[lizbids]

Divingbiker--
Didnt' mean to sound rude about the 40lb-comment remark (I had a friend in college who a vegan but actually smoked, drank, wore leather and ate a lot of junk). I just hate hypocrites, and he was just so smug about his non-meat-eating.

and as for genetics, yeah totally hear you on that. In my family, people are just generally heavy no matter what...though a few of them have tremendous appetites. Then you meet ultra-thin people who are big eaters--go figure!

[divingbiker]

Divingbiker--
Didnt' mean to sound rude about the 40lb-comment remark (I had a friend in college who a vegan but actually smoked, drank, wore leather and ate a lot of junk). I just hate hypocrites, and he was just so smug about his non-meat-eating.

No offense taken. I know there are a lot of holier-than-thou vegans out there. My approach is to bring in cakes, cookies, and delicious dishes to potlucks, and show people that vegan food can be tasty. What they do with that info is their business.

[solveig]

Good to hear from all the other vegetarians and vegans out there. I've been vegan for 5 years, vegetarian for 5 before that, and generally really like how it makes me feel.

I've read some pro-vegan books that basically tell you not to worry about protein consumption, calcium intake, and B12 intake. I tried that strategy for quite a few years, and then - to make a long story short - I realized that I do have to pay attention to those things. Maybe it wasn't such a big deal when I wasn't riding and placing those extra demands on my body, but now that I am I need to make sure I'm eating my 50+ grams of protein every day, getting calcium from food & supplements, and taking my B12 supplement.

I've also learned that it's convenient for those wanting to lose weight to use veganism as way to avoid calorie-dense food. Which is totally valid, as long as you're being rational rather than obsessive about it. Veganism can be a really meaningful expression of ethical relationship among living beings, when it's done mindfully and humbly. When it's done in a knee-jerk way, it can be just another "food rule" that doesn't bring clarity at all.

Did that make any sense?

[margo49]

I have been a vego (lacto- ovo) for 28 years. I started because I wanted to be less aggressive. It has worked.
(Whatever you-all might be thinking from some of my posts this is a much more tranquil and calm version of margo49 )

I think the main things you have to look out for are iron and B12. As a woman you have to look out for iron anyway. The B12 - I take a sub-lingual supplement every so often. I had a bad time with it when I had my Terrible Tractor Accident (the symptom to look out for is that the bottom (palms as it were) of your feet hurt). Probly coz the System was under so much strain anyway.

I have also had breast cancer.
My answer to (pathetic) critics who say "Look at all those healthy things you ate and did; Where did it get you?" is this:
If I hadn't had that healthy background I would have been in much worse shape (physically and mentally); and for longer.

Eat a wide variety of foods and make sure your plate is colourful

Btw, if it makes you unhappy it is not the diet for you. People are different - an oft-forgotten obvious fact.

[lizbids]

I think the main things you have to look out for are iron and B12. As a woman you have to look out for iron anyway.
I have also had breast cancer.
My answer to (pathetic) critics who say "Look at all those healthy things you ate and did; Where did it get you?" is this:
If I hadn't had that healthy background I would have been in much worse shape (physically and mentally); and for longer. Eat a wide variety of foods and make sure your plate is colourful Btw, if it makes you unhappy it is not the diet for you. People are different - an oft-forgotten obvious fact.

Thanks, I think I feel the same way: I'm not doing this because some Hollywood jerk convinced me...this really is something I have been considering for a long time but thought I could never give up meat. I do love the taste, but as stated before, I can't bring myself to eat it anymore.

Oh and any book that claims you don't need to pay attention to iron and B12 and stuff...I am surprised at that. As women we need to really keep our nutrients in mind. Actually, men do too. We all do! I'm still trying to figure out which foods have high volumes of this and that.
As for B12, I noticed that my soymilk contains 50% per 8oz serving. Is there anyone out there who don't use pill-supplements? I'm sure some protein shakes out there will help, too?

And, I'll also be honest: Any day I bike for 2 hours, I need those carbs more than anything. After I get off the bike is when I try to get protein and vegetables and stuff. Works for me pretty well so far.

[purplegolden]

Hi

I've been what my friends call "a fish and chip-o-crit" for over 10 years. I switched because I work in agriculture and I couldn't bring myself to eat sheep (we did trials on them - mulesing if you have heard of it), seen chooks stuck in small, small cages, little calves (they seemed to have an OK life) and piglets. After that, I couldn't eat them. Moral decision on my part. What I can't kill, I won't eat. Though, probably would have a hard time killing a fish! But not everyone is the same...

I've always exercised and have been cycling for the last 5. No health problems (so far). I often forget to take multivitamins including iron tablets. Just make sure you vary your diet and have regular check-ups (which you should anyway).

[Jolt]

I'd say the biggest concern is B12, since that only comes from animal products (which can be milk or eggs, doesn't have to be meat). Iron may be an issue too but it can be obtained from plant foods if you know which ones have more and eat them with something that has lots of vitamin C. My take on it is that the natural human diet is omnivorous but should contain a lot more plant than animal products; most of us here in America eat too much meat and that's not healthy especially given modern farming practices. I seldom eat red meat anymore, mostly poultry and fish, and those not even every day. Ditto to those who said to stay away from excessive amounts of processed foods--those are unhealthy whether vegetarian or not!

[Zen]

When I was a student of anatomy our textbook had photos of cadavers to show various muscles. That pretty much put me off meat. I find that the vanilla soy milk has too high a sugar content. You may want to do a search with the terms complete and incomplete proteins and complimentary proteins.
and check out http://www.mypyramid.gov/mypyramid/index.aspx

[smilingcat]

Cookbooks for reference:

Any of Moosewood cookbooks. Great recipe.
Laurel's Kitchen Have nutrional information and how to mix grains, beans corn and other vegetable protein to make it worthwhile. After six or so month of veggie diet, your nose will become sensitive to the smell of meat in a grocery store. And you'll be able to pinpoint where the meat section is just from the smell.

I like veggie burger from Trader Joe. You can't tell its veggie burger... yum...

smilingcat

[beetle]

Another omnivore here. I don't have the time or inclination to become vego BUT think those that do it well should have a very healthy body and be giving themselves a great chance against many diseases.

Just wanted to add that if you are exercising a lot make sure you are getting enough protein as plant sources are not as efficiently processed as animal sources (which could include milk, eggs and cheese if you choose to eat them).

Also be careful falling back on multivitamins to replace the things not in your diet. This link shows an interview discussing recent findings about some antioxidant supplements (inc beta-carotene, Vit A and Vit E) and links to increased risk of mortality. http://www.abc.net.au/rn/healthreport/stories/2007/1861068.htm
. This guy is talking about Danish research but it supports recent American findings. I've not read this particular interview transcript but read a summary of the American findings just the other day. It seems that until now little research had been done into potential negative effects of taking supplements and really its just been assumed (with the help of multivit producers no doubt) that they are beneficial. My personal view - there is no substitute for real food - if you can't get all the vits and minerals you need from real food (with certain exceptions) then perhaps your diet needs to be rethought vegetarian or otherwise.

[lizbids]

Ok, so basically B12 is really only something you can obtain from animals, and all of us have B12 in our systems to begin with, correct? So are supplements like Centrum the only way to go to ensure you get the vitamin? Other foods have B12 added (cereals, soy milk, etc)?

[Thorn]

Several people here replied with sub-lingual B-12. I'm fuzzy here, but, when I did the research eons back, it seemed to me that the B-12 in swallow-whole tablet form is not absorbed easily and is almost certainly just peed back out.

The sub-lingual losenge form, on the other hand, is like a trickle-charge. It goes in slowly and your body will absorb more of it.

Of course, the diet side effect of the losenge form is that you won't be eating while taking your B-12 and the cherry flavor (the kind I used) hangs around for a while afterwards, so munchies are out of the question.

[lizbids]

I'm intrigued...can someone tell me more about the B12 lozenge?