DebW "Sure glad they are a thing of the past. But if you've got an old Motobecane Mixte from around 1970, it probably has them."

yep, ah, so that's why my LBS has them sorta off to the side on the bike. Have to talk with them about semi-affordable replacement. But the Mixte is a keeper I think, she's gonna fit me and be the "urban assualt bike".

Planlover "It enrages me that you are having funding difficulties in atmospheric science. That is only one of the most critical fields right now, with global warming"

Oh, that's never OT here. Anytime the weather is too bad to ride I blame Dubya for not signing the Kyoto treaty. But one thing that heartens me is this saying

"Everytime I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the human race." H. G. Wells

Makes a good footer dontcha think?