European Cities Allowing Bikes to Run Red Lights

http://transportationnation.org/2012...un-red-lights/

While running a red light on a bike in the U.S. could cost you upwards of hundreds of dollars, several European cities have amended laws this month to permit the practice, mostly for safety reasons.

In Paris, where bike share began and cycling is rampant, the municipal government decreed it legal for cyclists to flat out run red lights, according to The Telegraph. Several reasons were cited. According to officials and public documents about the law, the goal is to reduce bike backups clogging intersections. Cyclists are slower with less control as they accelerate from a stop, making them more likely to swerve or fall into a car lane.

Likewise, a crowded gaggle of them waiting for a green light means they will pack closer up against cars in more dangerous proximity once everyone starts moving at different speeds. Plus, drivers of cars densely packed together waiting for a light may have lower visibility of a cyclist up ahead in a lane over. In all, when there are too many cyclists waiting at a red it becomes a danger.

more at link: http://transportationnation.org/2012...un-red-lights/

That seemed crazy to me at first, but the article states:

"Cyclists who grill red lights, as the previously-ticketable act is known in French, will have to yield to any oncoming traffic and, of course, pedestrians. They also must make room for entering traffic turning. Any accidents occurring while they are crossing will be deemed their fault."

OK, all in all that makes pretty good sense. It's up to the cyclist to make the judgement that it's clear to proceed.

With all the repaving work going on in my area, many red light sensors for bikes no longer work. I'd appreciate having the law on my side when I run those red lights (when it's safe to go, of course).

They refer to it here as the Idaho stop. Treat a red light like a stop sign. treat a stop sign light a yield sign.

It makes perfect sense to me, and the explanation is the one I've been giving for years. Two-wheeled vehicles are a greater danger to EVERYONE when we come to a complete stop.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jobob

With all the repaving work going on in my area, many red light sensors for bikes no longer work.

---

By law you can call those in, and SFO might even be more responsive about it than some cities. :rolleyes: Even in my small towns, more and more of the sensors are going optical or at least being set so I can easily trigger them with the alloy wheels of my carbon roadie.

Still, they've apparently re-set one of them in the other direction recently. I'd heard other cyclists complaining about it, and yesterday I had even had to run it on my moto.

Just one more reason to move to Paris...as if I needed another reason!

I ride treating most red lights like stop signs depending on how busy the intersection is. If it is a busy roadway I ride with the same rules as a car. If the road is not busy usually one lane of traffic in both directions I treat the red light like a stop sign for the reason stated, I am slower to accelerate then a car. I feel like I am doing them a favor by giving myself a head start. If the light changes right after I go I try to slow a bit and move more to the right to give the few cars (in most cases) a chance to pass me so I am not holding them up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sarahkonamojo

They refer to it here as the Idaho stop. Treat a red light like a stop sign. treat a stop sign light a yield sign.

---

Yes, In Idaho it is legal to stop and then proceed on through a red light if it is safe to do so. You are supposed to stop prior to moving forward. For stop signs we can slow and make sure the path is clear prior to advancing but for stop lights we are to stop.

As the rest of you, if it is a busy intersection I take my lane and wait my turn with the traffic rather than attempting to move through a red light. The intersection right by my house has 5 roads that intersect at the light so there is no way I will run the light (unless there are zero cars)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sky King

As the rest of you, if it is a busy intersection I take my lane and wait my turn with the traffic rather than attempting to move through a red light. The intersection right by my house has 5 roads that intersect at the light so there is no way I will run the light (unless there are zero cars)

---

Same. My road traffic is way too heavy (over 1 million people in the county and most of them drive). Whatever red light, I take my place in line and wait. I don't move up to the intersection.

Is it okay that I don't move up to the intersection or am putting myself in danger? I feel moving up to the front causes a backup in traffic and I'd rather not aggravate drivers who are already upset about all the traffic they have to deal with (though they are also creating it! :rolleyes:).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rubysoho

Is it okay that I don't move up to the intersection or am putting myself in danger? I feel moving up to the front causes a backup in traffic and I'd rather not aggravate drivers who are already upset about all the traffic they have to deal with (though they are also creating it! :rolleyes:).

---

Make sure to position yourself so that oncoming, left-turning traffic can see you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by soprano

Make sure to position yourself so that oncoming, left-turning traffic can see you.

---

Genuine question: How is it different than when I am riding through an intersection though? In case it matters, our lights are timed so left turn either has their own light that turns red before straight moving traffic goes or they are required to yield to oncoming traffic.

I make sure I wear my high viz windbreaker and have lights on the front, back and my tires. They are either going to see me or they have to be blind. I am much more worried about merging traffic from other roads when they are coming across my lane or vehicles wanting to get to the right turn lane since most decide to speed up to cross ahead of me while another waits to take the lane behind me and the two come close to colliding. I'm worried one of the drivers will forget where I am in order to protect their car from hitting the other. (Saw this yesterday except they the car behind just braked to prevent getting hit.)

If you are in the lane behind anything bigger than a compact car, oncoming drivers who are waiting to turn left can't see you. They will assume that the lane is clear and start to turn as the car in front of you goes past them.

I've come close to being hit several times this way. These days I either go around waiting cars so I can wait at the front of the intersection, where I am most visible to everyone in the intersection, or I wait in the leftmost part of the lane so oncoming drivers can see me. It doesn't matter how bright my clothing is or how good my lights are if there is an SUV between me and turning traffic.

When I am driving, good defensive driving practice dictates that I wait and verify that there is nothing hiding behind oncoming cars before I turn. Now, wouldn't it be just peachy if everyone did this? The problem is that they don't.

Thank you for pointing out that situation to me. One more thing to be aware of on the road.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rubysoho

Same. My road traffic is way too heavy (over 1 million people in the county and most of them drive). Whatever red light, I take my place in line and wait. I don't move up to the intersection.

Is it okay that I don't move up to the intersection or am putting myself in danger? I feel moving up to the front causes a backup in traffic and I'd rather not aggravate drivers who are already upset about all the traffic they have to deal with (though they are also creating it! :rolleyes:).

---

I hear you. When there are more than two cars waiting at the light I move up to the front but I will preface that by saying I am also looking at who has their right turn signal on - busy intersections are tough for sure. My daughter was knocked off her bike by a suv turning right in downtown portland I always try to be either in front of or behind anyone with a turn signal. I always assume the driver has not seen me and bike defensively.

be safe!

It totally depends on the intersection, I think. How many lanes (both in the street you're on and in the cross street), how wide a bike lane/shoulder, does the road change in any way on the other side of the intersection, how heavy is traffic, what's the speed limit, what are local drivers' habits. I don't think whether to filter through traffic is one of those questions that has a blanket answer. It certainly doesn't for me.

Problem with passing all the stopped cars to move to the front is that everyone who managed to get around you safely...now has to do it again...and again at the next light. Seems to me the fewer cars coming up behind be the better. At least I can see what's happening ahead.
I always wait in my spot in line.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seajay

Problem with passing all the stopped cars to move to the front is that everyone who managed to get around you safely...now has to do it again...and again at the next light. Seems to me the fewer cars coming up behind be the better. At least I can see what's happening ahead.
I always wait in my spot in line.

---

This reflects my own thoughts/opinion regarding the situation. But the point about being visible to those turning left from the oncoming traffic lane is valid too. However I think I will still wait my turn in line and try to increase my own awareness of oncoming cars turning left.

Back on topic, I can't imagine running a red light. Paris is a busy city so I can't imagine their intersections are any less busy than mine. I'll slow down and roll through a stop sign at most. A red light? No way.

I also refuse to hop over to the crosswalk like I see a lot of cyclists do when they don't want to wait for a red light.