So I reveal the secrets here.
What it has meant financially to be --car-free. :rolleyes::) Let the discussion roll...'cause I managed to get numbers from Canadian Automobile Association on costs of owning & driving a car.
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So I reveal the secrets here.
What it has meant financially to be --car-free. :rolleyes::) Let the discussion roll...'cause I managed to get numbers from Canadian Automobile Association on costs of owning & driving a car.
What a great post! I'll be car-free for 2 years this August, and I'm really feeling the "need" to have a car again. I currently only have a 2 mile commute to work (that I'm biking!) but have applied for a new job (fingers crossed) that's 15 mi one way and not bikeable. It's an hour commute, one-way, by bus, and if I get the job I'll seriously consider moving closer to the job but it's in the 'burbs, and I'm a city girl - I love my urban jungle.
Thus the dilemma of having/not having a car. Your post has given me renewed inspiration. Thanks for all the great incentives :)
Being totally car-free works well in an urban environment, especially if it's got the infrastructure for walking, cycling and public transportation. Cleveland had two of those things down, at least...It was nice not having a car--no paying for parking or digging my car out of snow drifts. We only bought what we could carry from the grocery store, and we got plenty of exercise too. If we needed something that was outside of walking distance, we took the bus. Yes, when we needed to do certain things--like taking the bikes to the LBS--it was really inconvenient, but we got along without it.
Next year, I'll be out in the 'burbs of a different city. I'm pretty sure I'll need a car, as everything's so spread out, and there's nowhere to lock a bike off-campus. I'm not looking forward to being tied to the car, even though it's pretty fuel-efficient. Gas, insurance, two lots of parking...I'd rather have the money for other things, like tuition.
Car ownership is $$ I tend to amortize things I own. My computer, 10 years and running at over $1000 -> $100/yr.
Well with cars, cost of ownership per mile driven is around 52cents per mile. This is a composite number generated back in 2007 by AAA. Edmonds pegged it at 42 cents per mile in 2009.
Soo think next time you hop in a car. how much is that the trip costing you! :eek:
And some cars it can be as much as $3-$5 per mile or more.
Car insurance in NYC was astronomical back in the '80s $3000/yr. so I moved to NJ in '82 car insurance came down slightly but not much. Then in California, I still pay over $1200/yr on my Prius. No accident, no ticket, non-smoker, discount cause my home owners is with them... Haven't changed my insurance to Oregon yet so not sure what its going to cost.
Buy a cheap reliable car. keep it until it falls apart then buy a new car. Leasing doesn't make sense. Buy it in cash if you can. And be very gentle with your car so it lasts longer!!!
I wish I could be car free!
Great post! I have been living car free for 14 years now (or since I moved into my first own flat). My point of view was really changed by this lifestyle regarding a lot of things.
In the suburb I grew up it was so "normal" to use a car for every little trip outside your house. To an extend that there are no sidewalks to walk anywhere - nobody does this anyway! All small grocery shops there died in the early eighties, and new shopping-malls are next to big streets with little possibility to go there by foot or by bike. Even if you wanted to go for a walk, it was safer to drive somewhere where you could actually walk safe.
I never questioned this as a child. I think my parents still don't see my point when I criticize that those suburbs are built for cars and not for people.
Now that I have lived in the city and car-free for so long, I really notice how much more fun and how much easier and more convenient it is if you can walk or go by bike. I was amazed that the "big city" is actually more pedestrian and bike friendly than those suburbs.
I get really mad if I see those places where you can not by any means go without a car. Towns where you could hardly leave your house without a car. Or those huge, huge parking spaces with no place to walk and not even a little space to lock up you bike. What are they thinking?
It's true that you can save a lot of money going by bike. Also, you can save a lot of time - while others sit somewhere in the traffic jam.
There are also downsides. Some things are hardly doable without a car. It can be difficult to transport large things. With public transport, small distances can become very very time consuming - I am not seeing my family as much as I would like because the 30-min trip to my parents takes me about 2 1/2 hours by train and bus. Train tickets for longer distances are really expensive. I haven't been skiing or hiking a lot lately, because I always have to find someone who is willing to accompany me who owns a car.
I think a lot of those things could be overcome, if there would be a larger lobby for people without cars - but as of today it's still very unusual not to own a car.
You know, cycling saves me money, but in a different way. Before DH and I started cycling as our main recreational activity, we mostly "went shopping" for fun. Sure, we went out to dinner and to cultural things, but now going to a mall seems as foreign to me as just about anything. This is what our friends do, when we are out riding all weekend.
At one time we envisioned moving into the city or a near in suburb that is more city like. We chose not to because where we live is ideal for riding... recreational or fitness riding. I would not find it fun to ride, even in the suburb I grew up in, which is about 6 miles from Boston. DH commutes a couple of days a week for 8 months out of the year, 34 miles round trip. While my life style is not extremely car centric compared to everyone else I know, I can't see myself riding to get groceries in the snow and ice. I would walk and do it, though, and in a few years, we plan to move to the center of town, where this will be possible.
I don't think we should judge too much on this issue. I have an 8 year old BMW that gets average gas mileage. I only have 68K miles on my car because I did commute for a few years and I plan my errands so I am not driving around all of the time. I love my car, I maintain it, and it has that nice all wheel drive that gets me up the 15% grade driveway when it is all ice. Some of the "down" side things to not owning a car, as Susan mentioned would be extremely negative to me and stressful. I try to be responsible, and I don't doubt being car free saves money. But, it's a huge commitment that I am not willing to make.
Man, I would love to be car free... I just can't imagine being a backyard homesteader without the ability to haul things. Needless to say, my boyfriend and I have 1 car that we share and it works pretty well when the weather is warm and the roads aren't crappy. I work in a very expensive suburb of St. Louis that's 12 miles from home and there are a couple of issues. #1 Living closer costs more and more with each mile. #2 The suburbs are blahhhh #3 I love St. Louis City!
I am considering getting rid of my mountain bike because it irks me so very much that I have to drive an hour or so to MTB anywhere. Seriously... driving... to bike somewhere!? I know people do it, but I was definitely spoiled when I lived in Lake Placid across from the Olympic cross country ski/mtb trails.
I recognize the cost of the car in gas and insurance. I don't have a car payment on my 8 year old car though (hurrah!). But we probably spend about $180/mo keeping it up between the two of us.
Today I'm picking up 12 2" x 10" boards for a garden project at school and I'm glad I have my car.
It's highly noticeable --places that don't have a sidewalk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Susan
In this city, the 2 main groups for outdoor hiking/snowshoeing and another place associated with the university, always arrange for carpooling at an city transit train stop. It's really great the cost sometimes includes the shared car ride in a nice van, plus an experienced guide..which the in winter is highly recommended in the Rockies. We are 150 kms. south of the Rockies.
Cities of Vancouver and Toronto have car-share, car-cops. I have a friend (a transportation analyst for the province there) who has used one for past decade. For stuff like building supplies, whatever. She only needs a car for afew hrs. every few months.
She has her own home solo. Near the subway. She bikes alot. Takes public transit. She is like me...sees family once a year in another province, travels out of province for other types of vacations.
She is looking buying into a 2nd place with a sister of hers.
When I get a car ride, I appreciate it if it's a long distance over 50 kms. I don't have children so it is easier for me to live this lifestyle.
If you are in a situation where you only need a car one day a month or even two days a month, it may be cheaper to forgo car ownership and rent a car for those one or two day out of a month. You would need to pick up the insurance from the rental... but this would be a lot cheaper than owning a car.
If the rental is $80/day or even $100/day this is only $160 to $200 for the two days you need. Car ownership is still more expensive.
example:
assume you buy a new car at $20,000. You own the car for 10 years. At the end of 10 years, you sell the car at $4000. Then your monthly depreciation rate is around $134/mo.
And if you own a car then there is the maintenance, the insurance... So for the luxury of owning a car for the two days you really need, its going to cost you more than renting a car. or even hiring a taxi.
Taxi is cheaper than even renting a car for the one or two days...
This is true... many people in the city here use Zip Car.
I just took a job where I have to drive to my clients' homes or schools to see them. It will all be in a specific geographic area, not too far from where I live. I will have to go to the corporate office once a week (24 miles). I am not thrilled about this aspect of the job, but it's a very good entry level clinician position and it gives me the flexibility to plan my day. I get reimbursed for mileage at a decent rate and the rest I will write off on my taxes. While I had dreams of working at the clinic 5 miles from my house, it didn't happen, but once I get my license to practice (2 yrs.) I will be able to cut my hours and find something closer to home. Since I need this job to get the hours for my license, I am going to have to get used to putting gas in my car, because right now, I only do that once every 10 days to 2 weeks.
I did wonder how it would look if I rode up to my clients' homes on my bike, but I have a feeling my bosses would not like that (although they are very wellness oriented).
I lived in European capitals for 15 years and got rid of my car after the first few. It was more of a burden than a positive contribution to my quality of life. My bike certainly amortised itself... and not even against the potential ownership of a car, but simply against public transport, which is good but expensive in London. The last years, I subscribed to a car share club scheme that let me take out a small car whenever I needed one for a very reasonable price and rented one if I needed one for a few days at a time, or for a trip outside the country. Easy.
Now it's unhelpful to be too ideological about it. Now that I live in Alaska, I have my own car, and it's a big one (for me -- a small 4WD SUV). I balk at some of the cost, the low fuel efficiency (compared to what I'm used to), but living 25 miles outside Fairbanks, in a place that gets really difficult road conditions several times a year, this is appropriate right now. It's of course a choice to live that far out. Fairbanks itself is, for an American city, surprisingly cyclable. There's an acceptable network of bike path and a lot of intrepid cyclists, the university has a bike lending scheme (and offers excellent bike maintenance classes, which I'm currently taking) etc. But the temperature falls below -20°F/-30°C every winter for stretches of time, so only the most intrepid will cycle then. So I do see somewhat less serious cycling-for-transport (to the stores, with a child trailer...) than I would in a similar-sized place in Germany, even though it has its fans. Instead, it's easy to find organised club rides at non-racer level.
Great post-- thanks, shootingstar!
May was the first month ever where I racked up more mileage on my bikes than my car. And most of those bike miles were transportation, pure and simple. I wish I could see a way to getting rid of the car entirely, but at least once a week I'm going someplace I can't get to by bike, or carrying a load my bike won't handle. Like taking my elderly dog to his vet appointment--even if I had a suitable trailer, I doubt he'd cooperate...
But all y'all who can make it work car-free, way to go!
From Shootingstar's Blog:Holy guacamole.Quote:
Bought my own home—mortgage-free.
When I got tired of having to say "I'd have gone on the bike, but I had to bring..." I got an Xtracycle.
Little over a year later, my car was my brother's taxicab and my garage is full of bikes now.
Not many would call this place urban -- even better, it's a University town (wth a few hospitals), with a very good bus system.
Great to get reimbursed Crankin. Guess your have to earn your stripes first before adding abit of your own style later.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crankin
Cycling to client meetings. Guess it depends who the client was, how close and if you could cycle in semi business streetwear. Wouldn't most counsellors be advocating some daily exercise for their clients...as part of road to better mental health? You could provoke more envy among your clients than you realize. Only a tiny portion of the whole solution of course.
Very interesting about Fairbanks, AK.Quote:
Chryss: Now it's unhelpful to be too ideological about it. Now that I live in Alaska, I have my own car, and it's a big one (for me -- a small 4WD SUV). I balk at some of the cost, the low fuel efficiency (compared to what I'm used to), but living 25 miles outside Fairbanks, in a place that gets really difficult road conditions several times a year, this is appropriate right now. It's of course a choice to live that far out. Fairbanks itself is, for an American city, surprisingly cyclable. There's an acceptable network of bike path and a lot of intrepid cyclists, the university has a bike lending scheme (and offers excellent bike maintenance classes, which I'm currently taking) etc. But the temperature falls below -20°F/-30°C every winter for stretches of time, so only the most intrepid will cycle then. So I do see somewhat less serious cycling-for-transport (to the stores, with a child trailer...) than I would in a similar-sized place in Germany, even though it has its fans. Instead, it's easy to find organised club rides at non-racer level.
Like you I don't cycle in winter time,...it has dropped to -25 to 30 degrees C for several days this past winter in Calgary. I haven't and don't plan to invest in studded bike tires to try it out. The cycling infrastructure isn't set up to protect a person totally for an entire ride. So I walk through a series of interconnected indoor pedestrian walkways ...it's helpful for really cold days. You will find more people from Alberta (and probably other prairie provinces where it's dry, cold winters and higher wind across flatter land) to have worked in the Arctic, because they already lived for awhile in much colder winters than other southern parts of Canada.
Personally I think it's too bad our city's light rapid transit train system is aboveground/at grade not underground to protect riders from waiting in chilly winter temperatures. I mean it can get very COLD. Not like what I experenced at all when I lived in Toronto.
If at least the article makes a person consider whether or not to get rid of a 2nd or 3rd car in the family at the right time in life...
So far, we will rent a van for 2nd time this year, for 1 day probably to buy some furniture.
That's all.
Last time was to move my modest belongings a few months ago. For 1 day too.
We were unable to go "car-free", but we did go "car-light" when we went from two cars to one, plus two scooters (and multiple bikes of course!). Car free isn't really an option for us (although I would love it), but even just dropping down to one car saved us a lot in insurance, property taxes, gas, etc. It certainly helped that we don't have children or pets, though!
I wasn't sure how one car would work out for us in the winter, but it was fine and now it's been three years. As long as my job situation doesn't change, we will never have two cars again.
It was abit strange that when I started to earn a full-time salary with an established "career", my parents were wondering when I would buy a car.
When already they knew I wasn't good at driving, didn't like it, etc.
It was the status thing.
Reminds me of the Singaporean stereotypical aspirational "5Cs": cash, car, credit card, condo, country club.Quote:
Originally Posted by shootingstar
Wasn't aware of the 5C's.Quote:
Originally Posted by pll
For certain, I don't come from country club family stock. Thank goodness for cycling. That's the yuppie 5Cs? :D To appease those who still want the Audi or BMW parked in their garage.