Please help me choose some new pedals

I need to buy some new clipless pedals ASAP. First, some background info - I am NOT new to clipless. Started out on SPD's, then quickly upgraded to Time RXS Carbon pedals (using Northwave Road shoes)...which I have been riding for the past 2 seasons, but have grown to dislike. I found a buyer for my Cervelo Soloist Carbon, and as part of the sale I negotiated the pedals into the deal, since I don't like them anyway. The buyer is picking up the bike this weekend. Until I find a new bike, I am riding my "first" road bike - a Trek 2100 WSD with the SPD's on it (using Specialized MTB shoes). I cannot ride distances longer than 40 or 50 miles because my feet start to hurt, due to a combination of the small contact surface of the SPD's and the MTB shoes feeling too constricting in the toe box. SO...I need to get those SPD pedals off my Trek ASAP, so that I can go back to wearing my beloved Northwave shoes that have a wider toe box and are way more comfy. My Northwaves are a 3-bolt pattern shoe, so I am currently looking at the following pedal systems -

Shimano Ultegra 6700
LOOK Keo Max 2 (Carbon)
Speedplay Zero Cro-moly or Stainless Steel

Eventually, I will move the new pedals to my future new bike. Another concern for me, is...at some point down the road, I would like to outfit the Trek (since I plan on keeping it as my winter/rain bike) with similar but cheaper pedals that use the same cleats...so that I can keep using my Northwave shoes for BOTH bikes. Which has me leaning towards either the Shimano's or LOOK's, since I'm pretty sure that the same cleat can be used across their entire line of pedals...but I'm not sure if that is the case with the Speedplays. I do like the idea of the Speedplays being double-sided...but since I'm coming from single-sided Time pedals, maybe it would be best for me to stick with something I'm already familiar with? I just don't know. Help me out, ladies! I'm looking for feedback (both positive and negative) on the 3 pedals I am considering. I would like to buy or order something by this weekend...my feet can't take another long ride on those SPD's.

Thanks!

Linda

fwiw, I think you get used to any pedal and if you've already used Time, you'd cope with the Shimano or Looks easily cos they 'present' for engagement anyway. The Shimano generally gives you a wider platform which I think has some benefit.

If looking at weight, consider both pedal and cleat cos the Speedplay cleats are so huge, although I think lighter than they were initially. I think they'd be awful to walk in, but ymmv. From memory, Shim/Look q factors are very similar. You could have a look at stack height as well if that's important to you.

I have Ultegra pedals and I like them. The only other road pedals I've ridden are Dura Ace though, so I can't compare them to Times for you. The Dura Ace pedals have a slightly stiffer release than the Ultegra (though they do loosen up with use). If you spin the Dura Ace pedals with your hand, they have noticeably less resistance than the Ultegras, but I don't notice this difference when riding (the Dura Aces are lighter as well, of course).

What is it that you dislike about the Time pedals?

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Originally Posted by VeloVT

I have Ultegra pedals and I like them. The only other road pedals I've ridden are Dura Ace though, so I can't compare them to Times for you. The Dura Ace pedals have a slightly stiffer release than the Ultegra (though they do loosen up with use). If you spin the Dura Ace pedals with your hand, they have noticeably less resistance than the Ultegras, but I don't notice this difference when riding (the Dura Aces are lighter as well, of course).

What is it that you dislike about the Time pedals?

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They are incredibly difficult to clip INTO. Clipping out is not a problem, but clipping in...UGHHH!!! Also, the cleats offer very little durability. The one thing I would look for in a single-sided pedal is how the pedal "hangs" before clipping in. I find that with the Time pedals (and I'm sure this is also an issue with Shimano and Look, as well), I have to constantly re-orientate the pedal so that it is "right side up". Do the Ultegra or DA pedals have a better "hang factor"? Or do you find that you still need to get the pedals "right side up" before clipping in?

I have Speedplay Light Actions, which are similar to the Zero but free float rather than adjustable. I came from the mid-range SPD-SL Shimano pedals and was quite happy with the Speedplays. They are no easier/harder to walk in than the Shimano cleats are, from my experience. It's a flat and fairly large platform on the shoe. I do find it easier to clip in in some ways (double sided pedals, only one place for them to go :p) but harder in others (the SPD-SL pedals were easy to mate but harder to snap on in the back). Clipping out is definitely hands down to the Speedplays, I find it easier to get out when I want to with less torque on my hips and knees (and I have not accidentally clipped out to date while climbing or anything). I switched on the recommendation of my LBS when I set up my triathlon bike. My hips and knees are much happier (though YMMV, of course).

IIRC, the Shimano pedals are weighted so that they fall in such a way that if you point your toes toward the ground, you can "pick up" the pedal with your cleat, and it'll rotate back that way pretty well. Been a while, though.

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Originally Posted by colby

I have Speedplay Light Actions, which are similar to the Zero but free float rather than adjustable. I came from the mid-range SPD-SL Shimano pedals and was quite happy with the Speedplays. They are no easier/harder to walk in than the Shimano cleats are, from my experience. It's a flat and fairly large platform on the shoe. I do find it easier to clip in in some ways (double sided pedals, only one place for them to go :p) but harder in others (the SPD-SL pedals were easy to mate but harder to snap on in the back). Clipping out is definitely hands down to the Speedplays, I find it easier to get out when I want to with less torque on my hips and knees (and I have not accidentally clipped out to date while climbing or anything). I switched on the recommendation of my LBS when I set up my triathlon bike. My hips and knees are much happier (though YMMV, of course).

IIRC, the Shimano pedals are weighted so that they fall in such a way that if you point your toes toward the ground, you can "pick up" the pedal with your cleat, and it'll rotate back that way pretty well. Been a while, though.

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Yes, my DH uses the Light Action pedals and he loves them, too. However, I don't need (nor want) 15 degrees of non-adjustable float...hence my reason for looking at the Zero. I've never had any problems clipping out on my Time pedals...only with clipping in...and it's not even so much a factor of "picking up" the pedal, but rather the amount of push down force that is needed to engage the cleat in to the pedal...it's ridiculous.

Do you find that your Speedplay cleats require more maintenance? I've heard that you need to lube them on a fairly regular basis (weekly). Compared to the SPD-SL's, would you say the platform on the Speedplay is larger or roughly the same? Ideally, I would like the largest, widest platform I can find because I do have some nagging foot issues.

Linda - the Shimano pedals will have the same re-orientation issue, they generally hang wrong side up.

My +1 and I recently got Speedplay pedals to replace our Shimanos - his were Ultegra, mine were 105s. He got the zeros that you are considering while I got the easy entry ones and we love them. He's ordered a second set for his commuter bike because he didn't experience any knee pain from his first two rides with the new pedals.

The cleats are much bigger as ozrider said, but we also got 'cafe cleat covers' that are easy to carry and slip on and it's a breeze to walk in them. Even without the covers they are not harder to walk in than my Shimanos.

But the best thing is that you don't have to re-orient your pedal - the double sided entry is woth its weight in gold.

The only drawback is that you wouldn't be able to get a cheaper pedal for your winter bike - it would need to be the same one. And I think they are always sold with cleats - but then you'd have a spare pair of cleats.

I recently got a set of Speedplay Zeros. Love them.

The only issue is that I tend to have a hard time clipping into them when I initially start a ride (first foot, my right). It's like I can't put enough weight on them to clip in or something. No problems once I already have one clipped in and I'm moving.

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Originally Posted by nscrbug

Yes, my DH uses the Light Action pedals and he loves them, too. However, I don't need (nor want) 15 degrees of non-adjustable float...hence my reason for looking at the Zero. I've never had any problems clipping out on my Time pedals...only with clipping in...and it's not even so much a factor of "picking up" the pedal, but rather the amount of push down force that is needed to engage the cleat in to the pedal...it's ridiculous.

Do you find that your Speedplay cleats require more maintenance? I've heard that you need to lube them on a fairly regular basis (weekly). Compared to the SPD-SL's, would you say the platform on the Speedplay is larger or roughly the same? Ideally, I would like the largest, widest platform I can find because I do have some nagging foot issues.

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I had the same experience with the push-down "snap" in the SPD-SLs, too.

I haven't had any maintenance problems with mine - I suppose they might benefit from a good lube, but I can get in and out of them with no problems and I can't remember the last time I did treat them. :o

I think the platform on the Speedplays is a little bigger, all things considered. It's basically a nice rectangle on the bottom of my foot with the circle-shaped cleat in the middle. It feels more "even" pressure-wise, distributed across the bottom of my foot. I can probably snap a couple of pictures of my cleated shoes if it would help - I still have the SPD-SL cleats on my Sidi shoes which I don't wear because they are too narrow for long distance rides.

+1 on the Speedplay Zeros. There are different metals with different prices - so the Cro-Molys are significantly cheaper than the titanium, but they all use the same cleats, so you can keep your shoes for all your Zeros. The Zeros don't have the clogging issues that the Speedplay X's were reputed for having. I like that you can be unclipped but still very able to securely pedal, which is nice in traffic or in a mass-start at a ride. They do take a bit of breaking in for the first week or so - they take just an extra 'umph' to engage them. But after that, they're a breeze.

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Originally Posted by loopybunny

I recently got a set of Speedplay Zeros. Love them.

The only issue is that I tend to have a hard time clipping into them when I initially start a ride (first foot, my right). It's like I can't put enough weight on them to clip in or something. No problems once I already have one clipped in and I'm moving.

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I went to Speedplay Light Actions last year and I have the same problem only it's with my second foot and then once I'm clipped in, I don't always feel it. I have to pull up on my shoe to be sure. The other complaint I have with them is that you have to be careful walking in any dirt (ie using a cornfield as for a pee break). Since the cleat is actually attached to your shoe, any soft surface you walk on will collect in the cleat and then you either can't clip in or get unclipped. They make covers for the cleats and you have to be sure to carry these with you if you need to do any walking. Other than that, I've been happy with these but have thought about switching because of these factors.

Love my Speedplay Zeros! I switched for the double-sided engagement. I really like that I can adjust out some of the excess float on the inboard side while keeping more outboard float.

Like others have said, the first few rides on new cleats can be tough to clip in. But they get significantly better after that, IME.

I lube the cleat springs maybe once every few weeks. A little Triflow or similar after a ride does the trick, and it only takes a couple of drops.

I have speedplay lightactions that I love. I've had them on my bike for a year and the only maintenance that I have done is to check the screws on my cleats to make sure they aren't loose.

I have read that some lighterweight girls have more trouble clipping into zeros than other speedplay varieties.

I have Speedplay X2s. I needed the float for my wonky knee. I had Northwave shoes that worked just fine with them.

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Originally Posted by nscrbug

I cannot ride distances longer than 40 or 50 miles because my feet start to hurt, due to a combination of the small contact surface of the SPD's and the MTB shoes feeling too constricting in the toe box.

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Linda, I'm wondering if you needed a larger size shoe. That alone may have resolved your pain issue.

Specialized shoes are known for a generous toe box and for me personally I've not had any foot pain issues unless I wear a size smaller. I wear one size larger in cycling shoes (43) than regular shoes.

I pair my mtb shoes with Speedplay Frogs. Prior to switching to mtb shoes I used the Speedplay Zeros with road shoes and had no issues with hot spots or foot pain. Some fitters recommend going with a larger pedal (Look Keos) for larger shoe sizes to reduce hot spots for that reason. I like using the Frogs because they are the easiest to clip in and out of. They are designed for mtb'ers but many roadies use them.

Look pedals are designed to hang so that you can slide your foot right into them, toe first. There's a learning curve with any new retention system, but the only time you need to take action to orient the pedal is when you miss on the first try and send it spinning. :o Once you get used to them, that doesn't happen often.

I like Look for the range of adjustment of cleat position and the large platform. They also offer three different levels of float (0°, 4.5° or 9°) by choosing different cleats.

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Originally Posted by sundial

Linda, I'm wondering if you needed a larger size shoe. That alone may have resolved your pain issue.

Specialized shoes are known for a generous toe box and for me personally I've not had any foot pain issues unless I wear a size smaller. I wear one size larger in cycling shoes (43) than regular shoes.

I pair my mtb shoes with Speedplay Frogs. Prior to switching to mtb shoes I used the Speedplay Zeros with road shoes and had no issues with hot spots or foot pain. Some fitters recommend going with a larger pedal (Look Keos) for larger shoe sizes to reduce hot spots for that reason. I like using the Frogs because they are the easiest to clip in and out of. They are designed for mtb'ers but many roadies use them.

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My Specialized MTB shoes are a men's size 42...I originally bought them to use for spinning classes. But when I got my first road bike, I got SPD's on it so I didn't have to buy new shoes. The MTB shoes work fine for spin class and rides of 40 miles or less...anything over that, and I start to get some toe pain on my right foot. I do not have this issue with my Northwave shoes (also a size 42, but in women's) since Northwave's are known for their wide toe box. At this point, I don't plan on buying another pair of MTB shoes, since I will only wear them for spinning classes 2x a week...so I'll make due with the ones I have.

After reading all the posts here, I think I'm going to go ahead and order the Speedplay Zeros. Thanks everyone...you've all been most helpful!!!

Linda

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

Look pedals are designed to hang so that you can slide your foot right into them, toe first. There's a learning curve with any new retention system, but the only time you need to take action to orient the pedal is when you miss on the first try and send it spinning. :o Once you get used to them, that doesn't happen often.

I like Look for the range of adjustment of cleat position and the large platform. They also offer three different levels of float (0°, 4.5° or 9°) by choosing different cleats.

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A note on Looks. I have them and like them ok....HOWEVER, the cleats don't do well if you plan on walking. While the goal is, of course, to RIDE in your bike shoes, sometimes walking is unavoidable...I finished Sea Otter only to find that I had to WALK my bike a mile back to the car through a vendors venue, over a few bridges, and up a gravel drive (cycling not possible). After this little hike, my cleats were shot and would not clip in properly. As I had a race the following weekend, I stopped to get new ones and the LBS told me that it was a problem in the hilly area where we were...some people walk hills, and that the Look cleats, in particular, did not hold up well. I guess I had managed to avoid walking in them up to that point. I went ahead and replaced them...I am a pretty good climber and have yet (knock on wood) had to hoof it up a hill, so I know now to keep them covered for any pre or post ride hiking. BUT, it might be worth a note for anyone who lives somewhere where there are stretches of unrideable road, or if you know you have to walk up some hills.
Just my .02.
BTW, my DH, a CAT 2 rider, switched from Speedplays to the Looks. The new retention system was irritating him after the switch, and he was busy messing with his pedal when he did a slow speed coast across the road and into a ditch, propelling himself, the bike, our camera, and his new helmet into the lawn on the opposite side. Careful with those new pedals!

egg beaters - simple, medium/high float, lots of different style choices.

Based on your reasons for disliking Time, I'd go with Shimano SPD-SL over Looks. Look cleats tend to wear faster, and when they start to get worn, clipping in gets tricky. Also, the newer grip style Look cleats (while have much longer life) require a little extra accuracy for clipping in over the non-grip ones.

The platform and hang of the Shimano and the KEO Max pedals are comparable. Older style KEOs have slightly smaller platform, but I haven't had any problems comparable to a tiny contact area like regular SPDs.

Also, Look pedals tend to wear out faster than Shimano, at least the composite ones. I'm not sure about the carbon ones, but the rear retention piece (under spring pressure) will get worn with KEOs to the point where clipping in is again a problem. I'm not sure how much of the wear on the rest of my composite pedal body contributed to this. In any event, I had to start really pushing HARD on the pedal to get it to engage. I guess my first set lasted about 2 or 2.5 years. I haven't heard of this problem with Shimano users. I have with other KEO Sprint (composite) users. Since it seems to be the rear springy plastic part, I'd guess that it would also wear out on the carbon pedals.

I don't have good knowledge of Speedplay.

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Originally Posted by TsPoet

egg beaters - simple, medium/high float, lots of different style choices.

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Sorry...I can't do eggbeaters because the contact platform is too small for my needs.

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Originally Posted by kenyonchris

A note on Looks. I have them and like them ok....HOWEVER, the cleats don't do well if you plan on walking. While the goal is, of course, to RIDE in your bike shoes, sometimes walking is unavoidable...I finished Sea Otter only to find that I had to WALK my bike a mile back to the car through a vendors venue, over a few bridges, and up a gravel drive (cycling not possible). After this little hike, my cleats were shot and would not clip in properly. As I had a race the following weekend, I stopped to get new ones and the LBS told me that it was a problem in the hilly area where we were...some people walk hills, and that the Look cleats, in particular, did not hold up well. I guess I had managed to avoid walking in them up to that point. I went ahead and replaced them...I am a pretty good climber and have yet (knock on wood) had to hoof it up a hill, so I know now to keep them covered for any pre or post ride hiking. BUT, it might be worth a note for anyone who lives somewhere where there are stretches of unrideable road, or if you know you have to walk up some hills.
Just my .02.
BTW, my DH, a CAT 2 rider, switched from Speedplays to the Looks. The new retention system was irritating him after the switch, and he was busy messing with his pedal when he did a slow speed coast across the road and into a ditch, propelling himself, the bike, our camera, and his new helmet into the lawn on the opposite side. Careful with those new pedals!

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Hmm...good info on the Looks..thanks! When you stated that the "new retention system was irritating" your DH...was that on the Speedplays or the Looks? I can't tell if that statement was in reference to BEFORE he switched to the LOOKS, or after. :D

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

Based on your reasons for disliking Time, I'd go with Shimano SPD-SL over Looks. Look cleats tend to wear faster, and when they start to get worn, clipping in gets tricky. Also, the newer grip style Look cleats (while have much longer life) require a little extra accuracy for clipping in over the non-grip ones.

The platform and hang of the Shimano and the KEO Max pedals are comparable. Older style KEOs have slightly smaller platform, but I haven't had any problems comparable to a tiny contact area like regular SPDs.

Also, Look pedals tend to wear out faster than Shimano, at least the composite ones. I'm not sure about the carbon ones, but the rear retention piece (under spring pressure) will get worn with KEOs to the point where clipping in is again a problem. I'm not sure how much of the wear on the rest of my composite pedal body contributed to this. In any event, I had to start really pushing HARD on the pedal to get it to engage. I guess my first set lasted about 2 or 2.5 years. I haven't heard of this problem with Shimano users. I have with other KEO Sprint (composite) users. Since it seems to be the rear springy plastic part, I'd guess that it would also wear out on the carbon pedals.

I don't have good knowledge of Speedplay.

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Yes, this seems to be the general consensus. Now I'm torn again...:confused: I thought I wanted the Speedplays, but I keep looking at those Shimano Ultegra 6700's...AND...Nashbar has them on sale for $99 PLUS an additional 20% off today only! That would bring them down to $79...almost too good of a deal to pass up.

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Originally Posted by nscrbug

Hmm...good info on the Looks..thanks! When you stated that the "new retention system was irritating" your DH...was that on the Speedplays or the Looks? I can't tell if that statement was in reference to BEFORE he switched to the LOOKS, or after. :D

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It was on the Looks. He has Speedplays on his TT bike, his cross bike, and his Madone. He changed to the Looks on the Madone...I kind of think he is going to change back to the Speedplays. I am probably going to change to Speedplay as well, as I am riding now in a new city that has a gazillion lights. I want to be able to clip in on either side.

I have Shimano SPDs on my MTB and love them for THAT. I wouldn't put them on my road bike, tho.

BTW, BOTH of us had problems with the Look cleats.

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Originally Posted by macski

Linda - the Shimano pedals will have the same re-orientation issue, they generally hang wrong side up.

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I may be misunderstanding this comment/the issue generally, but I don't agree. I do not have to flip over my Ultegra pedals to clip in, or otherwise fuss with positioning -- I just step in. They hang so that the front "loop" is pointing up, at an angle nearly perpendicular to the ground, so you can easily toe in as it comes around.