Specific Race Questions...

Countdown to race day is own, first race day that is.

I'd wanted to ask some of the more experienced racers a few related questions.

First off, I'm going to be riding unattached. Chalk it up to relocating at a bad time - meaning, I did so exactly as teams fill their spots. I was set to join a great team before my move, now in my new location, everybody's roster is full. Major bummer but there's nothing I can do about it :(

However I have done a lot of regular group rides with a variety of folks (practicing pacelines, climbing, sprints, attacks, etc), so I feel good about my pack skills. :cool:

Question: The feedback I get from people (mostly men actually) I have done group rides with is that in a typical Cat IV road race, everything/everyone gets chased down, at least initially. Is that generally true, that all attacks get chased & nobody gets to take a flyer? Obviously if the attacker is that much stronger than everyone else & then they can stay away I assume....

Question: In your typical group ride, people rotate & take turns up front. In a race while everything is still together in the main bunch, does everyone rotate & take turns up front or do you have a few riders who choose to stay up front and drive the pace of the bunch? I assume if only a handful of people stay up front & do all that work, that they do so for their own reasons such as to surge & try to break/drop the others or setup teammates. It makes sense to rotate & share the work in a breakaway but maybe not so much with the main bunch. The advice I've gotten which seems sound is to not be up front unless you have good reason to be. By the way, the local races are pretty small so we are talking a pack of maybe 15ish and as before, I'm unattached.

Lets see, what else: already have a racing license, plans to get the bike tuned at least 1 week before the race, crinkle my race number so it doesn't flap around like a kite in the wind, good warm-up on the trainer before the event.....

Finally, are there any other tips or suggestions? I've tried to read as many of the race related threads on here and there's some good stuff on there, but maybe there's additional feedback? I'm sure I've missed some things :o

I got nothing as I have never raced but I wanted to wish you luck! Let us know how it goes!

First, I have never heard of a place where all the teams are "full." Even so, you don't really need a team in a lower category race, because team coordination isn't really there a lot of the time anyway, for various reasons.

Question 1: Yes, most of the time, attacks in a cat 4 race will be chased down instantly. On rare occasions, people who know the attacker might say, oh, there's no way that'll stick. However, that doesn't matter unless the whole pack thinks the same thing. If anyone who is a threat thinks it's cool to chase, then you have to too (or the threat will get away and/or you'll get dropped).

Question 2: The main strategy of racing is to be at the front but not ON the front. This means, you want to be in front of any mayhem and crashes and big splits and surges, but you want to stay out of the wind. Yeah, some people like to drive the pace and to attack. They may do this to try to shell others, to break away, or to help teammates. The trick is being where the action is without wasting too much energy (in the back, you are wasting energy for other reasons).

While I am a fan of the race number crinkling, it's technically against the rules (and the officials can fine you). Instead, make sure the number has a sufficient number of pins in it and is pinned to be close against you when you're in the riding position. It still looks stiff enough but won't be that loud, flapping sail on your back. :p


You are reminding me that I have been slacking on cleaning my bike and putting on new tires (my first race is on Feb 13). That will have to be my snowy weekend activity.

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Originally Posted by arielmoon

I got nothing as I have never raced but I wanted to wish you luck! Let us know how it goes!

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That's kind of you, thanks for the encouragement. I wanted to spare people all the tedious details & all, but I'll post my results if anyone is curious :)

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

First, I have never heard of a place where all the teams are "full." Even so, you don't really need a team in a lower category race, because team coordination isn't really there a lot of the time anyway, for various reasons.

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Yeah it seems a bit counter intuitive, but I've gotten that response more than once. I can actually see some reasons why, for example, newer racers usually need mentoring. A team might only have so many members willing to do that, so that might be one reason why they limit members. Like you said though, team tactics at low level cat races are probably not so good. I hear many stories of teams chasing down breaks when one of their own team members is in said break :eek:

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

Question 1: Yes, most of the time, attacks in a cat 4 race will be chased down instantly. On rare occasions, people who know the attacker might say, oh, there's no way that'll stick. However, that doesn't matter unless the whole pack thinks the same thing. If anyone who is a threat thinks it's cool to chase, then you have to too (or the threat will get away and/or you'll get dropped).

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Gotcha, ok. That's confirmation there of what I'd been told and suspected. I imagine in higher category races people get a much better feel of who is a threat and who isn't, not to mention having far better tactics.

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

Question 2: The main strategy of racing is to be at the front but not ON the front. This means, you want to be in front of any mayhem and crashes and big splits and surges, but you want to stay out of the wind. Yeah, some people like to drive the pace and to attack. They may do this to try to shell others, to break away, or to help teammates. The trick is being where the action is without wasting too much energy (in the back, you are wasting energy for other reasons).

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Good point! You are definitely right about wanting to be near the front but not necessarily pulling the pack along :-)

I notice that being in the back, when the folks at the front surge, there is a sort of yo-yo or accordion effect and it is always worse at the back. I'd bet that riding in the front 1/4 of the pack is probably easier in terms of physical effort/power than being at the back.

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

While I am a fan of the race number crinkling, it's technically against the rules (and the officials can fine you). Instead, make sure the number has a sufficient number of pins in it and is pinned to be close against you when you're in the riding position. It still looks stiff enough but won't be that loud, flapping sail on your back. :p

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style points are always important ;)

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

You are reminding me that I have been slacking on cleaning my bike and putting on new tires (my first race is on Feb 13). That will have to be my snowy weekend activity.

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Glad my question was semi-useful to ya....

Much appreciate the advice :D

While "teams" may be full (also sounds odd to me at the Cat 4 level), clubs should have room for you! If you can find a cycling club that has a presence at the races, associate yourself with them. They may also offer things like race clinics for new racers (our club does, for instance, and ANYONE can join the club and race with us).

Yes, all breaks will be chased down.

Repeat: don't be "on" the front, but being in the top 5 is a good place to be. In Cat 4 races (or higher, for that matter), once you are on the front doing the work, no one from another team is going to pull through to help you out - they want YOU to do all of the work (and yes, I unfortunately have learned this the hard way).

Enjoy and be safe. That means being predictable, and staying AWAY from the back of the pack. Will be fun to hear reports on how you are doing!

SheFly

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Originally Posted by SheFly

While "teams" may be full (also sounds odd to me at the Cat 4 level), clubs should have room for you! If you can find a cycling club that has a presence at the races, associate yourself with them. They may also offer things like race clinics for new racers (our club does, for instance, and ANYONE can join the club and race with us).

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Probably depends on your location. Up here in the PNW there are very few (like one) team that also has a purely recreational club component, at least that I know of. For the teams recruiting happens once a year in the fall and at that point the rosters close -some of it is about making sure riders are trained and safe, but a lot is also due to logistical things, like getting kits ordered. Most, well I should say all, of our teams are much smaller than yours, so having extra kits in many sizes available at any time of the year just isn't possible.

Every once in a while a rider comes along who is exceptional, one that we wouldn't want to slip away and they get invited on at in the middle of the season, but to my knowledge we've only made that exception once. At times we will recruit cross riders during the season - but that's kind of different, being much more of a solo sport, the numbers being small (generally only one or two) and it also means they will be with us for a winter training season before they represent us on the road.

I get the kit order thing, but it's not exactly mid-season right now. If a club is large, there is probably someone willing to sell you a jersey at least if you miss the order. That's really all a cat 4 needs.

On the plus side, at least most races don't charge unattached fees for the lowest categories.

I should maybe clarify, in cat 4 races, it's not always that teams won't work together (or will chase each other down, though I have seen this happen several times). A lot of the time, fitness levels and individual strengths are all over the board on a cat 4 squad. So, say you're a good sprinter. What are the odds that, as a cat 4, you will have a good leadout on your team, even if you could convince that person that you deserve to be led out? It works out. You can find some allies in the field that have a similar style to yours, and you can work together sometimes. Particularly when the fields are so small...there's a bit more sharing the load going on.

I guess its just a different culture up here. You never see a team racer with just a jersey unless they are having issues with the chamois in their team shorts. On my team, we will certainly make an exception for someone dealing with saddle sores, but we do require at minimum that all team members buy 1 jersey and 1 pair of shorts and that they wear them to race in.

Recruiting is pretty organized. All of the teams that aren't invitation only recruit in September, close their rosters in October or even earlier and get kit orders in by Nov/early Dec, so that we have them for the first races at the end of February.

We have smallish teams, but a lot of them. I can think of about 10-12 that are co-ed, ours is all women, and there are 6 or 7 more at least that are all men. They range in size from 10 or so people to probably 100 or more for the biggest co-ed teams. Our cat 4 fields these days are big - 50 rider max fields have been filling up at many races. We even have a separate women's 3's field in a lot of races these days too because we have enough racers to merit it.

Oops, forget to mention I moved & am no longer in Nor-Cal. So yeah, far less options here in the way of teams, etc. None for example have any clinics at all which is a darn shame because a bunch of the Nor-Cal teams have them regularly.

SheFly - yes ma'am :-) I promise to be close to, but not at the front. I've learned that the amount of energy you waste/spend being in the wind is astonishing! I'll post my results and it won't be too long since race day is < 30 days now.

Eden - all great points & from what I've read of some of your posts on this subject, you have been (or are still that is...) involved in organizing events so I know you speak from plenty of experience :-)

Aicabsolut - field sizes here are very small, at least compared to big metro areas & cycling hotspots. Here, there will be a distinct cat IV with their own placings, but they aren't picked separately. So everyone, IV's & P-1-2-3 & masters all get sent out together - and even then you might only have 20 total on the better days. My guess here is that it magnifies the fitness/skill variations when you have such small fields.

Thanks for all the information here. It is very exciting to finally get involved in races and compete with a great group of women. :)

Yeah, but just because a team might tell racers to wear the full kit doesn't mean you have to under USAC rules. Around here, clubs are ecstatic about getting new female racers.

Eden - shows the regional differences in racing. In fact, sounds like I am living in the TOTALLY WRONG PART OF THE COUNTRY for women's racing!

In the Northeast, we are like aicabsolut - ecstatic to get new racers, and I am always recruiting...

Glad that you get the message about ON vs. AT the front of the race :D. Of course, that's easy for you to say NOW. Let me know how that plays out :D

SheFly

If there is a pre-race meeting, do listen carefully. Some people got into trouble because they didn't show up in the staging area before going into the start area. Instead, they showed up directly on the start line (and that was a MAJOR NO NO at one race)...

At TT, some people/team got into big trouble for setting up one of those 10x10 canopy and was warming up underneath... to riding up and down the course for warm up. :rolleyes:

Enjoy your race and I'll just smile and watch all the racers suffer. :p I'm too old for this stuff anyway.

have fun...

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Originally Posted by SheFly

Eden - shows the regional differences in racing. In fact, sounds like I am living in the TOTALLY WRONG PART OF THE COUNTRY for women's racing!

In the Northeast, we are like aicabsolut - ecstatic to get new racers, and I am always recruiting...

SheFly

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I've never raced elsewhere (just up here in Washington and down in Oregon), but I have got the idea that we have a very large and very active women's field up here in the PNW (my team is all women, we have about 80 this year, most are active road racers, three quarters are cat 4s). It is an interesting experience to be in a field of 80+..... our 1,2,3 field at the Walla Walla stage race had that many last year. Thankfully this year we will have an entirely separate 3's - though it may not be too much smaller..... On the first day of registration there were already 30 or 40 women signed up.

It hasn't been that long though. Probably less than 10 years ago there weren't enough women to separate any of the fields. It used to be 1-4's all in the same races. Throw people in the deep end and they sort out quite quickly. The ones who stayed with it tended to be the strongest, and are often the women who still are winning today. Now there is almost always a separate 4's field, so it is easier to stick with it longer. It's a good thing. It means more participation. The people who are really strong can move up and those who need to develop don't end up dropped, alone and discouraged at every race. It's also meant our 3's field has had an opportunity to grow, which in turn will grow our 2's.

80 women racers in just one club? WOW :D That's really impressive! There aren't many more licensed women in the whole state of PA! But the SE PA region also compromises the MD and NJ riders, so we have a few more. But still, 30 is a good field, and I've been in races as small as 3...and they were opens. Crits are easier to get two races in, usually a 1/2/3 and a 4 or 3/4. What few road races we have for women are usually an open, but we can usually get 4's broken out. We are working on it, but it's an uphill battle! And this is an area ripe of racing!

My team does close it's roster in October. I'm not sure if other teams in this area do that. But even so, we're all tight. If an unattached girl shows up and is friendly, she'll be welcomed! It could work to your advantage, you'll have the chance to meet women that you gel with and that will be the team you join. That's the one good thing about womens racing vs. men. There's no proving ground. If you are enthusiastic, and want to race your bike, you'll be welcomed to the ranks!

A funny, hah hah moment. The 3rd ever crit I was going to do there were just two of us pre-reg. Me, and a former PRO. It was canceled, much to my chagrin. The way I saw it, she could have lapped me three times, but I'd still podium 2nd to a champion!

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Originally Posted by AllezGirl

A funny, hah hah moment. The 3rd ever crit I was going to do there were just two of us pre-reg. Me, and a former PRO. It was canceled, much to my chagrin. The way I saw it, she could have lapped me three times, but I'd still podium 2nd to a champion!

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Funny but sad. :(

Stunning to hear some of these comments. I mean it is great that the sport is now attracting so many women. Excellent for the long term prospects & viability.

Still, considering the biggest field sizes I will see this year are ~20 - and that's when they combine the all the women across all cat's - hearing of 40, 50+ is incredible!

Glad it is thriving, at least elsewhere :-)

Nothing new on race day!

^^I'm assuming that bit of triathlon logic would apply here as well. Don't eat anything you've never eaten, don't wear anything you haven't worn riding(might be hard if a group hands you a whole kit that day, maybe take that with a grain of salt), don't put brand new tires on your bike the night before, don't eat a new kind of gel or bar or breakfast, don't drink an new kind of drink, all that.

Good luck! Have fun!

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Originally Posted by BalaRoja

Stunning to hear some of these comments. I mean it is great that the sport is now attracting so many women. Excellent for the long term prospects & viability.

Still, considering the biggest field sizes I will see this year are ~20 - and that's when they combine the all the women across all cat's - hearing of 40, 50+ is incredible!

Glad it is thriving, at least elsewhere :-)

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Its a bit of a drive, but if you ever get the opportunity you should wander up north for a race or two. The smaller Oregon races probably won't have quite as large fields, but the stage races often do (my favorite is Elkhorn, Baker City Oregon, in June - there are always some California gals there). If you want to plan for next year and go for our most popular race you could try for Walla Walla - the cat 4 field is capped at 50 and it filled up within several hours of registration opening this year! - there's even 25 women wait listed. (there are also 39 3's and 20 1-2's registered so far as well, and I'm sure there will be more eventually, but people aren't in such a rush to register because higher cat fields are allowed to be larger [70 riders] and there still are fewer of us, so they don't fill up so quickly)

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Originally Posted by Eden

Its a bit of a drive, but if you ever get the opportunity you should wander up north for a race or two. The smaller Oregon races probably won't have quite as large fields, but the stage races often do (my favorite is Elkhorn, Baker City Oregon, in June - there are always some California gals there). If you want to plan for next year and go for our most popular race you could try for Walla Walla - the cat 4 field is capped at 50 and it filled up within several hours of registration opening this year! - there's even 25 women wait listed. (there are also 39 3's and 20 1-2's registered so far as well, and I'm sure there will be more eventually, but people aren't in such a rush to register because higher cat fields are allowed to be larger [70 riders] and there still are fewer of us, so they don't fill up so quickly)

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That would be fun :-)

I've heard a lot about some races in Oregon and it is obvious you have the numbers to make for interesting fields. I mean wait lists? That's what I call thriving!

Personally I'd rather compete in a field of 40 women than in the 10 or so I will be riding with. There's such a broad range of fitness at the entry level & especially when you only have a dozen or so people.

I'm not living in Northern Cal anymore though so lots of travel would be involved. Moving away has made me realize just how great and well organized women's cycling was there as compared to other places. Things get done so, so differently here - or more accurately, they don't get done! I've had to temper down my expectations....way down.

Two other things just came to mind....

Eden, is there a velodrome in Oregon? I love track riding :)

Tangentgirl's post about sticking with your nutrition routine makes sense but it made me ponder something. Do most/all road races have feed zones? The flyer doesn't mention any so I'm assuming I ought my own food/fuel. I haven't ever used gels, using 'real food' instead, so perhaps I ought to start experimenting with them now.

Most cat 4 races do not have feed zones. No feeding in crits and circuit races except pro-1, if that, I think. Road races may have a feed zone but only for races over x number of laps (which a cat 4 women only field may not do). If you do get a feed zone, it will be spelled out on the flyer as for location and which laps it is open. Unless you have a feeder there with you, then you'll need to figure out a way to get through it on your own anyway. Gels and chews are a pretty easy way to get quickly absorbed sugars into you in a small amount of jersey space. You can also put a spare bottle in your jersey. Discards (bottles only, not trash) can be made in a feed zone if there is one regardless of whether you take up a feed. Just go back and try to find your bottle later if no one is there with you.

Yeah - no feeds for 4's, generally the races aren't long enough, though sometimes if you do a combined field race and all the cats are doing the same course the 4's have the same access to feeds *BUT* unless you actually have someone in the feed zone specifically for you all you usually get is water and that is if there is a neutral feed at all....

Indeed Oregon does have a velodrome - Alpenrose and it is in Portland. There are also plans to build a new one. Seattle and Vancouver (Canada) also have velodromes. Vancouver's (Burnaby)is and indoor track and has racing year round. Seattle's (Marymoor) is a very long track. It was refurbished in the 90's to host the Goodwill games.

A few things popped into mind...

1 - From my conversations with other rides, when unattached and participating in events - you have to wear a plain jersey (no artwork, no lettering, no words, no manufacturer names, etc). Is this generally true? Now please bear in mind that I wasn't thinking of showing up in a Team Tibco kit, :cool: , but it seems like you can't wear anything that even says Castelli or Team Estrogen or Primal or that has any kind of drawings or art, etc.

2 - Speaking of unattached, I've been told to expect a surcharge on my registration fee for every race. Has anyone actually experienced this? Ostensibly it is to encourage riders to participate in clubs. Personally though it seems a bit wrongheaded, as there are no clubs locally that I really want to be a part of - in NorCal sure, but not here. Yet you have to pay extra for not wanting to join clubs that aren't a good match for you anyway? :confused:

3 - What kind of tires do you all race with? For training - indoors/outdoors - I use what I like to think of as a 'tank' tire :D Kind of a heavy, thick thread, never flats it seems, and definitely has horrendous rolling resistance. I've thought of using some Michelin Pro 2/3 tires but am worried about flatting. I'm thinking there's a sort of tradeoff that you make: less rolling resistance but more likelihood of flats . Do you all race with the fastest tires and puncture resistance be darned? :-)

4 - If the field is small and they start the women 3/4's at the same time as the men 4 & 5's - is it bad form to try and draft the guys to get some extra speed if you can manage it? Basically they are going to run women 3/4's on the road race course at the exact same time as the male 4/5's. I'm sure the guys will be flying but if you can hang on to their draft.....well, is it OK?

5 - Have any of you tried wearing a skinsuit? I've got a TT as part of the stage race and the only tops I've got are the common, club-cut jersey's. A skinsuit should cut down on drag a bit and save you a little bit of time. If you've got one or worn one, can you suggest a good place to get one? I find plenty of 'tri' suits online but not many skinsuits.

Whew...

1. Generally race organizers are pretty lenient with beginners. Even if you showed up in a Tibco jersey they'd probably just warn you and let you ride (you'd just look like a total chopper ;) ). I never see the girls do it, though I see the cat 5 boys do it all the time. At a stage race they might be a bit more stringent - especially if Tibco actually shows up.... Though technically the rules say plain jerseys only, if your jersey has a logo for the manufacturer on it or a picture no one will care - especially if its not a current team. [funny aside story..... once at a local race I saw a dude in a full on Health Net pro kit - I though to myself who's the poseur and how'd he get past registration - turned out it actually was Tyler Farrar]

2. Though they are allowed, I've never seen anyone actually do the unattached surcharge. I think this is allowed because teams pay USACycling a fee each year - that pays for stuff like the insurance that is provided to the race organizers and the riders. (did you know that at any USACycling sponsored race if you crash there is supplemental insurance that will pay the bills your own doesn't ? This is why you want the official to know and to take a report if you crash and are hurt). I don't know if the organizers get charged extra for unattached riders or not, but around here at least no one bothers with the extra $5 - I think they feel it would discourage participation and be a bookkeeping hassle.

3. Get race tires and don't worry about flats. You'll want the faster tires and there will be a wheel car. At small races, especially if there is a small field it might be "wheels in, wheels out" - which means that you need to provide your own wheels and you'll only get a change if you've provided one. At a stage race I've never seen anything but neutral support (which means you get a wheel no matter what) - though sometimes they do have a lottery and if you get picked you have to put wheels in or find someone who will put them in for you. If you have anything less usual (like 650 wheels or Campy gearing) you really should put in your own wheels - otherwise it will be highly unlikely there will be anything for you in the wheel car. In the event you get a flat and for any reason cannot get a change someone will bring you in - so you need not worry about being stranded anywhere.

4. If you are starting in the same field as the boys, they are fair game.... unless all the girls make a gentlewoman's agreement before hand then its game on.

5. I wouldn't worry too much about a skin suit for your first race. TT bars are the #1 thing to have - if you don't have clip on's or haven't practiced with them go for that first. #2 TT helmet. A cheap, well free, thing to do is leave your gloves off..... saves more time than having an aero wheelset..... You can get a skin suit with no labeling - I've seen them on the Northwave web site (yeah the guys who make shoes) and Tri items would be OK as long as they have sleeves - you can't go sleeveless at a road race. Of course any of these things are only going to save seconds, if that - maybe only 10ths..., on a short course and in the 4's at TTs strength tends to decide things more than any kind of aero equipment. It's no use worrying about shaving 10ths or 100ths of a second when you are behind or ahead by minutes....

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Originally Posted by Eden

Whew...

1. Generally race organizers are pretty lenient with beginners. Even if you showed up in a Tibco jersey they'd probably just warn you and let you ride (you'd just look like a total chopper ;) ). ........ [funny aside story..... once at a local race I saw a dude in a full on Health Net pro kit - I though to myself who's the poseur and how'd he get past registration - turned out it actually was Tyler Farrar]

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LOL! :D:D:D That's a great story about Tyler. And yeah, I guess the boys do like their pro kits a bit more. I've seen many a Team Astana/Disco/USPS/KOM/Maillot Jaune jersey on group rides :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Eden

2. Though they are allowed, I've never seen anyone actually do the unattached surcharge. I think this is allowed because teams pay USACycling a fee each year - that pays for stuff like the insurance that is provided to the race organizers and the riders. (did you know that at any USACycling sponsored race if you crash there is supplemental insurance that will pay the bills your own doesn't ? This is why you want the official to know and to take a report if you crash and are hurt). I don't know if the organizers get charged extra for unattached riders or not, but around here at least no one bothers with the extra $5 - I think they feel it would discourage participation and be a bookkeeping hassle.

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I appreciate the details. It makes more sense now and gives me a better idea of why they 'would' (even if they don't obviously) charge a bit more. I'll think better of cycling promoters nationwide because of this tidbit :-)

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Originally Posted by Eden

3. Get race tires and don't worry about flats. You'll want the faster tires and there will be a wheel car. At small races, especially if there is a small field it might be "wheels in, wheels out" - which means that you need to provide your own wheels and you'll only get a change if you've provided one. At a stage race I've never seen anything but neutral support (which means you get a wheel no matter what) - though sometimes they do have a lottery and if you get picked you have to put wheels in or find someone who will put them in for you. If you have anything less usual (like 650 wheels or Campy gearing) you really should put in your own wheels - otherwise it will be highly unlikely there will be anything for you in the wheel car. In the event you get a flat and for any reason cannot get a change someone will bring you in - so you need not worry about being stranded anywhere.

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Woah, I had no idea. I'm glad you mentioned that. This is going to be a smaller event I think - certainly compared to the likes of races you've talked about close in the washington. So it sounds like I ought to bring an extra wheel or two (one with & without a cassette). I'll see if I can confirm with the promoter and/or contact person for the event.

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Originally Posted by Eden

4. If you are starting in the same field as the boys, they are fair game.... unless all the girls make a gentlewoman's agreement before hand then its game on.

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Ok, ok, that's interesting. I pretty much do group rides exclusively with men (there aren't any women's rides here whatsoever, so what choice do I have?) and find I can hang on pretty well if I can just stay near the front and draft in close. Nothing like going 23mph while doing 150 watts behind some 6'3" windbreaker!

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Originally Posted by Eden

5. I wouldn't worry too much about a skin suit for your first race. TT bars are the #1 thing to have - if you don't have clip on's or haven't practiced with them go for that first. #2 TT helmet. A cheap, well free, thing to do is leave your gloves off..... saves more time than having an aero wheelset..... You can get a skin suit with no labeling - I've seen them on the Northwave web site (yeah the guys who make shoes) and Tri items would be OK as long as they have sleeves - you can't go sleeveless at a road race. Of course any of these things are only going to save seconds, if that - maybe only 10ths..., on a short course and in the 4's at TTs strength tends to decide things more than any kind of aero equipment. It's no use worrying about shaving 10ths or 100ths of a second when you are behind or ahead by minutes....

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I've got clip-ons and have been practicing on them several times per week. It truly does take time getting used to the position and you notice different muscle groups seem to get fatigued. I'll keep my eyes open for an affordable TT helmet as you suggested. Worst case, I may just put one of those helmet covers for cold weather that I got from TE, over my regular road helmet.

Thanks so much for all the tips Eden. Much appreciate it all :):)

Thanks

For your kit, you can always order something like this "unattached" kit: http://unattachedrider.com/skinny.htm :) Just having anything "race cut" will help you avoid that bib number sail situation you are worried about.

While you're a cat 4, the race promoters will not charge you an unattached fee. Same with men's cat 5. Maybe they can, but I've always seen an exception for these categories. Although the fee encourages club participation, I guess they want to create more of an incentive for new racers to show up.

I like my Michelin Pro3s. I kind of liked the old Pro2s better, because they were less susceptible to cuts, but they dry rotted faster. The handling is great. They are awesome in wet conditions. I use them all the time. I used to be able to buy them 1/2 price through the Team Michelin deal for collegiate racers, but that program is discontinued. One advantage to being on a club that is sponsored by a shop is that they have a "shop night" where you can stock up on things like good tires at a low price.

Another commonly used clincher that is good for training and racing are the Conti GP4000s.

now I'm really confused. :confused:

is it Crit or TT you are racing? I thought it was a crit... Then all of sudden, talk of skin suit, TT helmet...

I assume it is still a crit, drafting guys, wheel in/wheel out...

Have fun at the race!! It's about having fun right??

The skinsuit question was related to a stage race that included a TT stage.

Please forgive me if this isn't true across the board, but here, even if you start at the same time as another field, you are NOT ALLOWED to work together, and can be DQ'd for it. So, if it is a men's 4/5 field, and someone from the women's 3/4 group can catch, they wouldn't be allowed to work together.

SheFly

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Originally Posted by smilingcat

now I'm really confused. :confused:

is it Crit or TT you are racing? I thought it was a crit... Then all of sudden, talk of skin suit, TT helmet...

I assume it is still a crit, drafting guys, wheel in/wheel out...

Have fun at the race!! It's about having fun right??

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Would love to do a crit but don't think I'm ready for flying around 90 deg. corners at 25mph!

This will be a TT + RR.

Yeap, having fun is the goal. Not embarrassing myself would be a close 2nd though...:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SheFly

Please forgive me if this isn't true across the board, but here, even if you start at the same time as another field, you are NOT ALLOWED to work together, and can be DQ'd for it. So, if it is a men's 4/5 field, and someone from the women's 3/4 group can catch, they wouldn't be allowed to work together.

SheFly

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Egads, I better find out how that all works here. thanks for pointing this out...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SheFly

Please forgive me if this isn't true across the board, but here, even if you start at the same time as another field, you are NOT ALLOWED to work together, and can be DQ'd for it. So, if it is a men's 4/5 field, and someone from the women's 3/4 group can catch, they wouldn't be allowed to work together.

SheFly

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We may be talking semantics? I don't mean being on the course at the same time - that happens all the time (we usually have 3 to 4 fields running at a time on road race courses - with starts staggered by 5 -15 min) and no you can't work with other people out on the course if you catch or are caught by them, but if you actually start together - at the same time with the same lead/follow cars and officials then you are considered to be one field and they can' tell you to not work together. The organizer is obligated to provide enough support for each different field that they start - they're not allowed to tell any group to fall behind the cars intentionally...

Of course mixing the men and women doesn't happen much out here. Very occasionally they'll start the 1,2 women with the masters A,B men to give us 3's our own field. Generally the woman have an agreement to let the boys alone to race their race, so they let the guys start a break before they start to play themselves. What ends up happening though is as soon as the women start up, the boys who missed the break jump on them with the hopes they'll get pulled back up..... They drag the pack along and it begins to be very hard for the women to run a tactical race.

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Originally Posted by Eden

We may be talking semantics? I don't mean being on the course at the same time - that happens all the time (we usually have 3 to 4 fields running at a time on road race courses - with starts staggered by 5 -15 min) and no you can't work with other people out on the course if you catch or are caught by them, but if you actually start together - at the same time with the same lead/follow cars and officials then you are considered to be one field and they can' tell you to not work together. The organizer is obligated to provide enough support for each different field that they start - they're not allowed to tell any group to fall behind the cars intentionally...
.

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This is correct. I raced on Sunday with 3 different fields (2 collegiate, 1 USAC), and we were all 1 field, rolling out at the same time (not staggered). If the field that started 5 min behind us had caught us, then the 2 groups could not work together.

Things also can get complicated in crits where there are lapped riders.