Saddle height and fear

So, I'm out looking at new bikes, because I've committed to riding in a long charity ride. I am looking especially at a Jamis Aurora (2009, about $780 with my discount). But as it turns out, I have some issues. Some mental issues.

I've ridden bikes for years, but probably have never ridden a bike that actually fit me correctly. I've also never ridden with drop bars and those fancy shifters. So I have a lot to learn. And, when I went out on my test ride with the saddle height at the correct height for me and my leg length, I was completely intimidated. I had a real problem stopping and starting, and felt like I was going to fall off the bike.

I have a plan -- it's to go ahead and buy the bike, and adjust the seat down a inch or an inch and a half, so I can get my feet to the ground. That way I can get used the bike, and the shifting ... and then I can gradually raise the seat back up to right height as I gain confidence.

So, my question is ... is this plan crazy? Is it inherently flawed? :confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ln_ib

So, my question is ... is this plan crazy? Is it inherently flawed? :confused:

---

Nope! Lots of folks have done the exact same thing.
Just make sure you don't buy a bike that is too small, and be sure to explain to the salesperson exactly what you are planning to do. They can help you choose the right size bike and then drop the saddle down a smidge before you leave.

The other thing you might consider is raising the bars. Again, your shop can be a big help.

I think it's fine... honestly that 'intimidated' feeling is 95% of why I did NOT buy a road bike when I was shopping late last spring... I just wasn't comfortable mentally, and I didn't feel like the handling on those bikes (compared to a flat bar or hybrid) inspired much confidence in myself. I hadn't really ridden a bike of my own in a long time.. and definitely not one that fit me very well.

So based no what I liked when I was trying out bikes, I bought a hybrid.. but it didn't take me too long before I was wishing I had gone with a road bike... so I don't think it will take you long to get comfortable on it.

Sounds like a fine plan to me and a superb choice of bicycle ;)

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/b...DSCN2171-2.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ln_ib

I've also never ridden with drop bars and those fancy shifters. So I have a lot to learn. And, when I went out on my test ride with the saddle height at the correct height for me and my leg length, I was completely intimidated. I had a real problem stopping and starting, and felt like I was going to fall off the bike.

---

Remember the bulk of your time will be on the hoods or on the bar. You might be in the drops briefly on a descent or if you need to sprint. So drop bars are not that different, narrower I suppose then what you're used to.

You could also consider a flat bar road bike. But the Jamis is an excellent choice.

Make sure the shop knows what kind and length of ride is your goal. :D

The feeling is perfectly normal; however, I would caution against lowering it too much or getting used to it lower and just leaving it.

If you don't raise it to something resembling close to "proper" height before the event, you will be miserable on a "long" ride and you run the risk of doing severe damage to your knees.

Also don't be surprised or discouraged if you feel like you are putting in a lot of effort and going nowhere or you are getting aches and pains from riding. That happens to everyone, but riding a bike that is not adjusted correctly for riding will likely make it even worse.


Honestly, I'd put the bike into a mid-range gear and get used to starting and stopping with the seat in the "correct" position on relatively level ground, THEN get used to shifting (ie: I'd personally do it "backwards" of what you are considering).

A hint that may help with this: Most no-one can comfortably put a foot down while still seated in the saddle on a road bike (I can touch a toe NOW, but by this point I'm darn comfortable leaning my bike over while I'm still on it). When you are about to stop get off the saddle (move forward and down), put your weight on one foot with the pedal in the 6 o'clock position, and step off the bike with the other foot (pedal at the 12 o'clock position). If the bike fits, you likely won't have to lean it or anything and this will become second nature with some practice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ln_ib

I have a plan -- it's to go ahead and buy the bike, and adjust the seat down a inch or an inch and a half, so I can get my feet to the ground. That way I can get used the bike, and the shifting ... and then I can gradually raise the seat back up to right height as I gain confidence.

So, my question is ... is this plan crazy? Is it inherently flawed? :confused:

---

That's exactly what I did and it worked just fine. I live in Manhattan and no way was I starting out in traffic with the seat where it should be. Hope you get a great bike and enjoy it!

Pam

If you have access to a trainer, another thing that might help, is put the bike on the trainer and practice shifting until it becomes easy. This way you have some "muscle" memory when you are actually on the road.

Your plan with the saddle is also a good one. This is similar to what I do, as a cycling instructor, with students who are new to a specific bike and want to get used to something new for them.

But it is also a good point, that as you increase your miles, you do want to raise your saddle, as you will be uncomfortable and your knees will suffer.

Best of luck!

Thanks for the thoughtful and sound advice. Also key: another LBS employee came over and said it looked like the seat was actually adjusted too high for me. She brought it down, and I made sure she erred toward the low side, of course. Now I'm feeling much more comfortable in the saddle.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2696/...7c95dd9948.jpg

:D

That is a BEEEEEOOOOOTIFUL bike! Congratulations! :D

They did class it up since I bought mine, but I got such a deal I can't complain. And I kind of like my root beer color too.

Is that the stock saddle?

Classy!

That is the stock saddle. My first assessment is that it will need to be replaced, but LBS is telling me to be a little bit patient. Patient?!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hirakukibou

If you have access to a trainer, another thing that might help, is put the bike on the trainer and practice shifting until it becomes easy. This way you have some "muscle" memory when you are actually on the road.

Your plan with the saddle is also a good one. This is similar to what I do, as a cycling instructor, with students who are new to a specific bike and want to get used to something new for them.

But it is also a good point, that as you increase your miles, you do want to raise your saddle, as you will be uncomfortable and your knees will suffer.

Best of luck!

---

This is better to do than lowering the saddle - practice mounting and dismounting on a trainer, and raise the bars instead. On the trainer, your rear tire will be higher than on the road, so as you get used to the trainer, once you get out on the road it will almost feel "too" upright.

I also felt intimidated about a drop handle bar road bike (and now that's my third bike in a year). You probably saved yourself a couple of upgrades. I may be one of the few people who can actually put a toe down with the bike tilted to get on and off. I put the toe down, then slide forward to get off. When I get back on, I put the right foot in the half toe clip, start peddling, and then get the left foot in the half toe clip. It took a few weeks to get that second toe clip on, but you can ride with it upside down until you get to a safe spot. Club members assure me that I will eventually want to go clipless, but I don't want to fall down while I'm learning that skill since I had ACL surgery a few years ago. Being able to touch the ground with my toe took all the stress out of riding a road bike. However, I raised the saddle up 1/4" a few weeks ago. I think you made the right choice and the bike looks beautiful!

I think we did a survey way back when about how many people kept the stock saddle on their bike, i think it was like 20% of us kept that stock saddle...
You shouldn't be in constant pain. it's one thing to get sore after riding for an unaccustomed long period, but to get on there and be OUWCH that's not right...
feel free to visit our saddles threads...

Thanks, Biciclista, and I am already visiting the saddle threads ... and, I have to admit, thinking about how nice a Brooks saddle would look on that bike.

Wow, that is REALLY pretty.

This thread made me realize that I have no idea the order of things when I come to a stop. The only thing I know for sure is that I unclip my left foot well before the stop because I do that very consciously. I'll have to pay attention next ride.

I asked my DH which foot he unclips when he comes to a stop, because I thought it was unusual for me to unclip my left foot when I am right handed. He said he had no idea. How can you not know that?!?

I actually noticed, because I'm really paying attention now, that when I stop I step off first with my left foot, although I'm not clipped in, and I'm right handed. But I'm sure I wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't been paying attention to every little thing I'm doing.

You're not weird, RitaMarie. Although I started out unclipping right, somehow, I switched to the left. Now, I can't even get on my bike from the right side... after 9 years. I really don't know the order I do stuff either. I unclip a little before a stop and I *think* I lean a tiny bit left and forward. Next thing I know, my foot is on the ground. It all happens in like a second.
I have tried unclipping on the right side. While I had no issue actually taking my cleat out of the pedal, I felt like I would fall if I tried to actually put my foot down. I know you are supposed to feel comfortable doing both, but I never bothered to try again. Interestingly, I can unclip and stop on both sides on my mountain bike, mostly because I always am on the alert to stopping due to obstacles (I generally suck at mountain biking).

Congrats on the new bike! I advise against lowering the sadle though, as that can lead to knee pain. Instead, as others have suggested, practice shifting in a trainer. Also, put some cheap flat pedals on so you can first get used to the bike, and then put clip in pedals on later. I find speedplay frogs are the easiest to learn to use.

I am right handed.. I mount from the left and unclip the left foot first at a stop. My DH is left handed and he mounts from the right and puts his right foot down first (he doesn't ride clipless). I think it looks weird which is why I noticed, but I didn't say anything :)

I think to some degree it's just what you grew up doing and what feels more comfortable.

Huh... how about that. I figured that mounting from the left and putting my left foot down came from my horse riding experience where it's proper to mount from the left side of the horse. I always heard that the reason you mount a horse from the left was because soldiers holstered their swords on the left. Maybe it's just more natural for a right handed person to mount from the left. Probably some Pilates person could tell us why.

I'm right handed and I've always mounted from the left and put my left foot down at stops. I always figured it was because by doing that my stronger/more coordinated side of my body is doing the bulk of the work--holding the handlebar at the far side, swinging the leg, getting the bike started from a dead stop, etc.

Why a racing bike and not a hybrid? I just wonder... if you don't have much experience I would stay away from racingbikes all together... but that's just my humble opinion.

It'll make you feel a lot safer on the road.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by papaver

Why a racing bike and not a hybrid? I just wonder... if you don't have much experience I would stay away from racingbikes all together... but that's just my humble opinion.

It'll make you feel a lot safer on the road.

---

I actually wanted something for touring, rather than racing. I'm not racy, but I do want to go a long way. I'm riding a 545 mile ride in June, and am getting prepped for it now. It's not a ride I feel like I want to make on a hybrid.

There is one bike that is really great for long distances. But dead expensive.

http://www.idworx-bikes.de/nl/bikes/trekkingbikes.php

It's the rolls royce of the trekking bikes. I've had one for a weekend. You ride just as fast as on a racingbike, but the comfort is of a much higher standard.

but like I said, very expensive.

A very good second best: http://www.koga.com/us/ and less expensive.

A friend of mine has a koga and he cycled from belgium to the south of India (and that is a looooooooooooooooooong way). He did this while having cancer. Unfortunately he died at the beginning of this year... but he was happy.

This is about MY fear of a tall seat-post. When I first started looking into cycling, my instructor put me on a flat-foot bike that had a step-through frame. What I purchased, however, was a Trek 7.6 which is a flat-bar road bike/fitness bike (depending on who you are talking to). I followed advice at the time to just lower the seat a little until I became comfortable riding and then to re-raise it.

I had a fitting today, and the fitting specialist raised my seat 4 inches :eek: :eek: Ok, so I am long-legged and I know I have this mental thing about starting with my butt on the saddle...gotta get over that for my 50-year old knees sake...but I can't even touch my toes to the ground!

I LOVE my bike, she is great - and this is really the only problem I've had so far - how to deal with starting up properly without being seated. Is this a common problem?

Methinks that they did me no favors getting me started on a flat-foot frame :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ritamarie

Huh... how about that. I figured that mounting from the left and putting my left foot down came from my horse riding experience where it's proper to mount from the left side of the horse. I always heard that the reason you mount a horse from the left was because soldiers holstered their swords on the left. Maybe it's just more natural for a right handed person to mount from the left. Probably some Pilates person could tell us why.

---

I keep my left foot and left hand on the bike, because I'm left-handed and left-footed and my dominant side stays in charge of the bike. Guess I trust the bike more than I trust the ground... :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Catrin

I had a fitting today, and the fitting specialist raised my seat 4 inches :eek: :eek: Ok, so I am long-legged and I know I have this mental thing about starting with my butt on the saddle...gotta get over that for my 50-year old knees sake...but I can't even touch my toes to the ground!

I LOVE my bike, she is great - and this is really the only problem I've had so far - how to deal with starting up properly without being seated. Is this a common problem?

Methinks that they did me no favors getting me started on a flat-foot frame :(

---

I'm long legged, but I can touch my toes to the ground. I don't "ankle" when I pedal, so I much prefer a saddle height that keeps my ankle neutral at the bottom of the pedal stroke. Different strokes for different folks.

However, I always start up OFF the saddle.

Pick a foot (any foot) and stick it on a pedal. When you have a gut feeling for which foot you like to put on the pedal, go outside. Practice standing on that pedal, and scooting around using the other foot to push you (not on the saddle yet, just scooting). Once you feel very comfortable scooting, practice lifting your butt onto the saddle mid-scoot using that pedal as a step.

It's a beautiful thing!

Starting on a flat-foot frame is just fine! That's the way we all learn as kids. Don't worry.

(fitter concern note: I never change a person's saddle height by a full 4 inches all at once. Can you start with 2 inches, then in a week or two go to 3 inches, then a week or two after that go to 4 inches?)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KnottedYet

Pick a foot (any foot) and stick it on a pedal. When you have a gut feeling for which foot you like to put on the pedal, go outside. Practice standing on that pedal, and scooting around using the other foot to push you (not on the saddle yet, just scooting). Once you feel very comfortable scooting, practice lifting your butt onto the saddle mid-scoot using that pedal as a step.


(fitter concern note: I never change a person's saddle height by a full 4 inches all at once. Can you start with 2 inches, then in a week or two go to 3 inches, then a week or two after that go to 4 inches?)

---

Thanks - and he used the same analogy of a ladder. With the full 4 inches, my feet do not hit the ground at all - I have pretty much decided to back it off to only 2 inches higher than what I had, get comfy with that, add an inch and then go the rest of the way as you have suggested.

I already know which foot I like to use to start with - right for starting and left for stopping :) I like the idea of scooting around, as you have described, and will work with that this afternoon. I meet with my instructor tomorrow, weather permitting, and I don't want to really go all the way back to the beginning if I can avoid it :)

I have that exact model Aurora the 09' - got it off of eBay for less than $600. :D I like the stock saddle alright and I want to get a Brooks for it - eventually. However, my main concern is the Ritchey seat post with a slight set-back and no micro-adjust capability. Since "seat-angle" is supposed to be critical on a Brooks (I have a Brooks on my 520 - but it has a micro-adjust seatpost) I'm thinking I'd have to replace the seat post and the saddle --- just to ensure that I can get the Brooks fit just right.

Since the saddle will do for now. I'm keeping it until I have fewer expenses:o (house, bills, medical) and just dreaming of upgrades. As far as saddle height goes, I like to ride in a touring position - with the seat in a less aggressive posture than on standard road bikes.

I too never adjust a seat post more than a tiny bit at a time - and then readjust - 4 inches in one go - seems jarring.