Wheel Advice (again!)

Based on your some earlier advice on wheels, I've decided to have some custom wheels made for me. I'm probably going to use Mavic Open Pro Rims, Chris King hubs, and DT Revolution spokes. My question to you concerns what weight of spokes and, particularly the spoke count and lacing pattern to use? The people I've talked to recommend 28 hole wheels front and back with 2 cross spoke lacing patterns with 14/17 DT Revolution spokes and brass nipples. My use for these wheels will be all-around for training & events. I weigh between 140-145#. Any advice on the # of spokes front vs back and spokes? Thanks so much for your help.....:)

I just went through the same torture. What to get, then how to get it setup. I guess you would know best how you ride and the locations you ride most. Aggressive masher riding over very poor roads? Maybe 28/28 (or even 32 rear), 2x front, 3x rear. More like me, a finesse spinner? I went 24/28, 2x 2x with Sapim race spokes, White Industries hubs and Velocity Aerohead rims, (trying to go light without being silly-light). These are tough choices, I kept building wheelsets in my head for a month (no kidding). And you know, everybody has an opinion all their own. I looked at EA-90 slx Eastons, but the low spoke count worried me. I think my custom build beats it on weight and I feel better about the spoke count. I weigh 148 and dropping to 120 (and yes I was almost 170lbs before taking up cycling again around 5 months ago.)

I almost bought the CK hubs, because they are awesome, but that angry bee noise made me change my mind. Also needs a $pecial tool to rebuild it and no that dollar sign is not a typo. Then I looked at DT Swiss hubs, but settled on WI hubs because they are made in the USA like CK and are very light and strong. When the bearings wear out or I win the lottery, I will replace with ceramics myself.

My current set revolves around old Mavic Reflex clincher rims (pre open-pro), DT spokes and Dura Ace hubs, 32/32 3x 3x. Bullet proof but on the heavy side. If you lean to the bullet proof over weight, 28/28 2x 2x is a good compromise that should last. With quality rims and spokes like Mavic/DT, you could drop the front to 24. Also, some would go radial up front, but I think that puts a lot of extra stress on the hub and on the wheel overall for really nothing more than looks. It's wise to go 2x IMO.

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Originally Posted by mauisher

Based on your some earlier advice on wheels, I've decided to have some custom wheels made for me. I'm probably going to use Mavic Open Pro Rims, Chris King hubs, and DT Revolution spokes. My question to you concerns what weight of spokes and, particularly the spoke count and lacing pattern to use? The people I've talked to recommend 28 hole wheels front and back with 2 cross spoke lacing patterns with 14/17 DT Revolution spokes and brass nipples. My use for these wheels will be all-around for training & events. I weigh between 140-145#. Any advice on the # of spokes front vs back and spokes? Thanks so much for your help.....:)

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I'd recommend 32 rear/28 front, though you'll probably be fine with 28/28. I'd go with the 32 spoke rear for the cross-country trip because of all the pounding you'll put these through on diverse roads in diverse conditions day after day. You can do 2x for 28 spoke wheels, 3x for 32 spoke. But if you do a 28 spoke rear, see if your builder will do 3x on the drive side, 2x on the other. I laced up one like this at UBI.

Thanks for the reply and info Tzvia! I wasn't aware of the special tool and cost to maintain the CK hubs, so that's some new info to consider. Also, I'm not too crazy about the 'angry bee' noise of the CK hubs. Do you know of any problems with the Swiss DT hubs? (the other brand I'm considering)

I'll probably go for 28 holes and 2X lacing for front and back since I already have a lightweight Easton (Velomax) wheelset with the low spoke count you mentioned.

Thanks so much! :)

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Originally Posted by DebW

I'd recommend 32 rear/28 front, though you'll probably be fine with 28/28. I'd go with the 32 spoke rear for the cross-country trip because of all the pounding you'll put these through on diverse roads in diverse conditions day after day. You can do 2x for 28 spoke wheels, 3x for 32 spoke. But if you do a 28 spoke rear, see if your builder will do 3x on the drive side, 2x on the other. I laced up one like this at UBI.

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Thanks, Deb. That idea of 3x on drive side and 2x on other of a 28 spoke rear would be a compromise between the two builds.

What's most important to you with respect to your hubs? Cost? Weight? Sound? Durability? Serviceability?

The DT Swiss hubs generally get good reviews and are lighter than the CKs. CKs are a great choice for MTB wheels but IMO there are cheaper and/or lighter choices for road. If you want quiet hubs that are easily serviced, I'd give some thought to Ultegras.

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Originally Posted by indysteel

What's most important to you with respect to your hubs? Cost? Weight? Sound? Durability? Serviceability?

The DT Swiss hubs generally get good reviews and are lighter than the CKs. CKs are a great choice for MTB wheels but IMO there are cheaper and/or lighter choices for road. If you want quiet hubs that are easily serviced, I'd give some thought to Ultegras.

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The most important factors to me are weight and durability. Thanks!

I've got Ultegra hubs on my touring/commuting wheels. They are a good choice for serviceable bearings. I've had mine 2 seasons and have overhauled them 3 times now. I repacked after each of 2 week-long off-road tours because I felt some minor grittiness, but it was mostly in the dust caps and not in the bearings themselves, as the sealing mechanism is pretty good. Still, if you plan to ride cross-country through all kinds of weather and not service your hubs mid-trip, then sealed bearings might be a better choice. I was impressed with a DT hub we disassembled at UBI. On the other hand, Ultegra hubs are easily serviced by any shop in the country, and replacement freehubs would not be hard to find.

I've been VERY happy with the Dura-Ace hubs on my current wheelset. They are lighter than Ultegras. Also, being cup/cone bearings (loose balls), it is easy to service and easy to adjust bearing tightness. Everywhere I went online to check out the possibilities (and get weights), I kept toying with Dura Ace again but they were the heaviest of the hubs I was considering. DT is a fine hub, and easier to service, if you are looking to do it yourself, than CK. I agree with what others here have said, 28/28 and find out about getting 3x driveside. After all, these are custom wheels, the builder should be able to do that. You could also do aluminum spoke nipples (but brass for the drive side rear). If the roads are less than nice, and saddle hours long, it's nice to know the wheels can take it.

So many choices, no wonder it took me a month to get it sorted out. Good luck!

Yeah I'd go with Shimano hubs personally, but DT would be my second choice.

I'd do 28/28, 14/15 double butted (you could do 14/17 on the front). I'd prefer radial lacing on the front. 2x on back, or a mix of radial and 2x. there's nothing wrong with 3x, but i might rather use that for 32 spoke.

BTW, the DT white hubs and rims are hawt.

i've been playing with custom builds on excel a lot lately..

I'd think twice about DuraAce hubs for these wheels unless you can get the 9-speed version. The 10-speed version (last I checked) has an aluminum freehub and takes only DuraAce cassettes (expensive and hard to find). I've got the 9-speed version (from 2006?) with Ti freehub for one of my wheelsets, and that is compatible with all standard Shimano cassettes including 10-speeds. DuraAce hubs aren't recommended for consistent use on a loaded touring bike - they are light enough to lose durability.

You might want to play around on Excel Sports' website to compare the weight and price of various builds. Certainly, from a weight standpoint, the DT Swiss hubs are the lightest choice (they're a bit lighter than CKs and a lot lighter than Ultegras). Ultegras are also a fraction of the cost of both.

There's a pretty intense debate as to whether loose bearings are easier to service than sealed cartridge bearings, and I won't even begin to weigh in on that one. That debate aside, I think just about everyone agrees, however, that Shimano hubs are very durable and easy to service. I just had an experience at my local bike shop--which is otherwise a good shop--that makes me doubt whether they really understand sealed cartridge bearings. They don't build wheels at the shop and are disadvantaged in that way. Whatever you get, I would suggest reading up on how to service and adjust them before embarking on your trip. And bring some extra spokes as was previously suggested.

Frankly, if it were me, I'd go with an Open Pro/Ultegra build; 28 2x front, 28 3x driveside, 2x nondriveside rear. But I say that because weight on a cross country trip would not be my biggest concern. If weight remains your bigger "want", then I'd go with the DT Swiss or (although you haven't mentioned them), White Industries.

Just checked Dura Ace compatibility at Sheldon Brown (great site, sad he is no longer with us). The 7800 used an aluminum freehub and had taller splines and took the Dura Ace AND Ultrega cassette. The 7850 went to using TI and has regular splines and takes the typical hyperglide style cassetttes, not just Dura Ace. So if you decide to go Dura Ace, get the 7850 hub to leave your cassette choice open. Mine is a 9spd and has been rolling fine for years and now has the Ultrega 10 speed cassette on it. Good solid hubs.

But I would still do DT over it (weight) and did choose WI over it.

Thanks, everyone, for your advice. This is what I'm thinking for a wheel: mavic open pro rims, DT revolution spokes, brass nipples, and DT Swiss hubs.
The front hub would be 28 holes by 2X lacing and the rear 28 holes with 3X drive side and 2X on the non-drive side.

It seems as if the DT hubs may offer the best in terms of weight and servicability. Since my local wheel building is limited, I'm thinking of buying the wheels at Exel Sports. Does anyone have any experience with them?

Thanks so much!!!:D

I haven't gotten wheels built by them yet, but their customer service seems pretty good. My BF got a SRAM chain from them that broke in >100 mi. He had to send it back to Excel for an inspection before they would give him a straight answer about warranty, but they did wind up replacing it for free.

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Originally Posted by mauisher

Thanks, everyone, for your advice. This is what I'm thinking for a wheel: mavic open pro rims, DT revolution spokes, brass nipples, and DT Swiss hubs.
The front hub would be 28 holes by 2X lacing and the rear 28 holes with 3X drive side and 2X on the non-drive side.

It seems as if the DT hubs may offer the best in terms of weight and servicability. Since my local wheel building is limited, I'm thinking of buying the wheels at Exel Sports. Does anyone have any experience with them?

Thanks so much!!!:D

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I have no personal experience with Excel, but I'm partial to giving business to small operations/wheelbuilders. There are a number of builders that have been recommended on TE. You might do a search and see what comes up. The builder I used is doing business a bit differently now and only builds certain predetermined wheels-0--so I can't recommend him. My BF recently had two sets of wheels built buy Ron Ruff at White Mountain Wheels. He was happy with his experience but has yet to mount them.

http://www.whitemountainwheels.com/contact.html

Also, even though you've decided what you want and what you've decided is a sound choice, I think it would still be to your benefit to talk to a builder and get their input.

Good luck! Be sure to post pics of your wheels once you get them.