Yes, I wore padded shorts, but I always do. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitsune06
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Yes, I wore padded shorts, but I always do. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitsune06
Kitsune,
You might be crooked. I know I am! (Hey, no comments from the peanut gallery.) :p
Most people have a slight leg length discrepancy (a mm or two). Some of us have larger leg length discrepancies due to injury -- mine is about an inch in the femur. I compensate with shimming and cleat placement, but I still don't sit squarely in the saddle.
As far as the skirt goes, is your saddle level? I accidentally set the tilt angle incorrectly when I moved the saddle back, and I noticed my right leg brushing against the skirt. Now that the saddle is back to level, I don't have any issues with the skirt.
-- Melissa
Kitsune, do you have a B17S? If you're having probs with the skirt width, you might consider trying the B17. It's narrower but still pretty wide over the sit bones.
I know you measured your sit bones width and you believe the B17s might be better for better for you on account of that measurement, but if you get an opportunity, give the B17 a try.
If it's any help, I tried a B17S and I couldn't stand it, so I tried the B17 and that was fine for me. But I've never measured my sit bone width, I just went by trial and error (which was pretty painless on account of Wallbike's great return policy).
hth, - Jo.
Hmmm....
How would I test where my sit bones are 'sitting' on the brooks? Worse comes to worst, I can always take that hand-strengthening putty and put it in a sandwich baggie, spread out real thin, I guess. It feels like those are all in the right place, and my right leg feels no discomfort at all. I started with the saddle at mostly-level, the back raised just a hair from even... the only thing I've noticed to *really* affect the edge of the saddle (seemingly actually that rivet on the back left 'corner') brushing against my leg is turning the saddle to the left. I could still do that a little ways... I'm not too sure about using a narrower saddle, because my previous saddle had a much longer, slower progression from back to 'nose' and it put a lot of weight on my soft stuff, and felt like it was hitting just the inner edges of the sit bones. I'll keep fidgeting and trying things, and go from there. One curiosity: the saddle is positioned exactly where I had my previous one: as far back as possible. Do you think it would change much more than my knee-angle during the pedal stroke to attempt to move it forward?
I just replaced my B17 with a B67 - what a difference. I never really liked the B17 - it just didn't fit me right - unlike the my team pro s(I probably should have just gotten a B17s for road bike dimensions are apparently the same - I could not figure out what the difference was - except holes in top and copper rivets and difference in cost - oh well - I really like the team pros) Although the B67 seems a lot harder than the others. I have probably just forgotten how hard the others were at first.
FC - if your B67 starts making noise once the leather begins to soften, DON"T PANIC. (i did!) It's easy to fix.
::sigh::
I'm just waiting for my b67 to arrive. Maybe Tuesday!
So -- I have a question.
The saddle I have now feels like it needs to be farther back than it is, but it won't go any farther. Is that related to the saddle, or the post? (I'm wondering if the b67 will possibly extend a little farther back than the current seat, which is a Velo Plush.
I'm betting its an issue of you trying to find a comfortable spot on your existing saddle.
I kept shoving back on my Serfas Niva. But the B67 didn't need to go back nearly as far, and I have plenty of rail-room. And i don't keep trying to move my sit bones farther and farther back, cuz they're comfy where they are.
Wow, that makes me feel very hopeful!Quote:
Originally Posted by KnottedYet
(fingers crossed!)
Wow -- oh wow!
I didn't know some of them came in GREEN.
http://www.brooksengland.com/brooksengland.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by pooks
I have two Finesse saddles in British racing Green.
V.
GORGEOUS. Of course, the honey will look better on my bike. But still, if the b67 doesn't work and I have to try something different, I might ask if there's a green saddle that would work better. (I hope the b67 is perfect.)
It came!
I opened the box and saw the Brooks box inside and ran to get my camera to document this moment.
Couldn't find the camera, so never mind, I can't wait any longer.
Open the box.
See the saddle.
The beautiful honey b67 saddle.
Pick it up.
Heavy!
Feel it.
HARD.
Smell it.
Leather!!!
Only thing left to do is put it on the bike, but I don't have time right now -- already took too much time admiring the saddle and now posting this.
But.
She is here.
:-)
Pooks - don't be alarmed if it takes a few tries to get it adjusted up down fore and aft. I usually carry the right size allen wrench in my pocket or bike bag for the first week or so while I tweak the adjustments.(I have three brooks) after I get the adjustment right - I hope I never have to take the saddle off again.
Thanks! I only rode it about a mile (HOUSE was about to come on!) but it WAS slippery and I WAS sliding forward if I wasn't careful. I assume that means the nose needs to be raised, even though it doesn't look like it?
Also, I'm sitting way on the very back of the saddle, same as the other one. I can't figure out if that's the typical place or if I'm sitting way back behind where people typically sit. But it feels okay when I do that (as long as I don't slide forward).
I put some proofhide on it last night and then polished it. It still feels slick to me. I wonder if I didn't use enough.
Anyway, I'll be riding today! And I need to figure out how to adjust it -- that's a new one for me!
It will feel slick for awhile even after proofhinding -for me I either get used to it or it gets better-don't know which - it takes a couple or so weeks.
I'm FURIOUS. This is the most perfect morning for a ride since I started riding -- it's 64 degrees outside! I'm getting ready to go and --
I have a flat. Damn, I knew that. Or rather, I knew that before I rode last night, it was almost flat. I hadn't ridden in days because of rain so I pumped it up and hoped for the best. This morning? Flat again.
I guess this is the morning I get to learn to patch it or change it. But if it heats up before I get this thing fixed I'll be VERY sad. Dang.
Okay, phone rang and it's a call reminding me I have a doc's appt this morning. So I've rearranged my mental plans. I'm going to take my bike with me, and after the appt. go to the LBS and buy a tube and have them show me how to put it on. (I have tubes already, but it seems the right thing to do, to at least buy a tube from them, right?)
Then I'll ride. Whatever the temp. And surely it won't be in the 90s already!
But it sure does chap me to miss out on riding when it's 64!
If you feel you are sliding forward, tilt the nose up a bit more- just a TINY BIT at a time! You'll know if you tilted the nose TOO far up when your girly bits get too much pressure on a several mile ride. When I tried tipping the nose down a bit, I felt I was constantly sliding forward onto my hands- highly annoying! As soon as I tipped the nose up- problem gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by pooks
Expect some sit bone soreness for at least the first week as your butt adjusts to the hard new leather and the new seat shape- my soreness went away after that. Our bodies need to adjust to new things.
Take plenty of Proofhide on your finger and rub it in everywhere you can on the UNDERSIDE of the saddle too. You don't need to do that more than once, I would think.
But proofhiding the top (and edges!) should be done several times. Rub plenty of it into the surface with your fingers, let dry 15 minutes, buff off. A Q-tip will cleanup any stuff that gets in the top holes. I've Proofhided mine twice now in 2 weeks, about to do a third time. (I rode on it for several weeks first without putting anything on it just to check it out) I've ridden for about 5 weeks total on it, and I just noticed for the first time yesterday two subtle indents forming where my sit bones go- wheee! :p
I rode on it 40 miles on Monday and only got a little soreness (along with the entire rest of my body, considering my previous longest ride ever was 23 miles!)
My DH put neatsfoot oil on his new honey colored Brooks, and the color turned to a rich brown instead of honey. Still looks nice, but it's now a lovely brown saddle. I put only Proofhide on mine, and the honey color has only deepened slightly, but did not turn dark. So if you want to keep the honey toned effectas much as possible, I suggest using ONLY Proofhide.
I would think sitting far back on the seat is a good thing as long as it doesn't cause problems...
My Brooks is a year old and I have yet to put anything on it, because we had a series of used Brooks saddles in this house that were completely ruined by being over "conditioned." I never had the sliding issue -- the B-67 is pebbled, isn't it? But I also never ride mine with bike shorts on, and I think street clothes may be less slippy than Lycra.
I agree with Lisa, turn up the nose a tiny bit.
and proofhide.. should be less slick after that.
and yes, it is pebbly, but if you are wearing really
slick clothing, you will feel like it is slippery.
the slipperiness really does wear off after a few rides.
Nice thing about it being slippery at first is that you immediately know if your seat isn't level!
Well, I didn't make it to the bike shop, and am now home. I get to decide now whether to figure out how to change/patch a tire on my own or wait for the hubster.
And I have a tube question. I guess I'll poke around and look for the right place to ask that one....
I am a little behind, but better late then never. Congratulations on your new Brooks saddle. Enjoy. :)
I finally got my flat fixed and got on my bike yesterday for 7 miles. Feels pretty good -- I still find myself with my sitbones almost hanging off the back edge of the seat, as that is most comfortable..
After the ride I ended up raising the seat higher and pushing it back farther. I'm beginning to think I'm trying to turn my hybrid into a road bike. I'll see how it feels today.
One thing of note -- the very helpful guy at the LBS did his best to convince me that the Brooks wasn't going to be as good as one of their serfas or other softer saddles. A definite bias against Brooks, at least at that store!
oh yes, of course, I've seen that too. They want to sell the inventory they have in their stores!Quote:
Originally Posted by pooks
It sounds like you are doing all the right things. keep us posted!
Pooks, remember it is normal for some sitbone soreness the first week or two on the Brooks. Keep Proofhiding and riding, and it will form to your personal shape slowly. My sitbone soreness went away after a week of getting used to the Brooks. Now I'm comfy as can be, even after a 40 mile ride the other day.
My finesse just arrived. She is the prettiest thing I have ever seen. Better shaped than I expected, wide in the back but narrow in the nose, just like I need. But I notice she is higher in the back than front, so when I level her, do I put my level all the way across the top from front to back, or just across the nose?
Level it all the way across the saddle. When it is horizontal, that is a good place to start. I actually had to tip my saddle up 1/2" in the end.
Well, I still haven't figured out my postion with her yet. I started level across the entire top, and felt too much pressure on my girly bits, so leveled just the nose half, which makes the whole saddle tilt down. It felt a tad better (but still pressure on my girly bits) but to test my stablity if I take my hands off the bars I slide foward (they are slippery suckers aren't they). I'd like to see how moving it further back feels, my butt seems to want to scoot further back, but the rails are relatively short. My carbon seatpost is pretty laid back, but I do have an aluminum one that is even more laid back I could try with. The distance from the back of the saddle to the bars is definitely shorter with the brooks than my butterfly. My KOPS looks OK, but it doesn't mean that I am sitting on the saddle correctly so the set back could still be wrong. I am also doing all this on my trainer cuz its raining outside, and getting late. At this point I am going to take a break and pick DH up at the airport. ANy ideas what to try next when I get back. What's weird is while it is hard it doesn't bother my sit bones at all (at least just sitting on it on the trainer) but it does bother my soft tissues, which is a bad sign I think PLEASE HELP!! I SO WANT THIS TO WORK!!!!!!!!!! SHE IS SO BEAUTIFUL, and her shape looks like she should work.
Dumb question: How do I raise the nose?
You can't tell much from just a few minutes in one position or another. You really have to ride for a couple of hours between adjustments. And EXPECT to be sore the first few days. When I first tilted my nose up, my girly bits felt sort of squashed. After a few hours they were fine and have stayed fine. Odd but true. Having the nose tipped down was much more unpleasant, feeling I was sliding off forward onto my hands.
Set the saddle in the middle of the brackets, forward/back wise. Tilt the saddle somewhere between nose-up/squashed girly bits, and nose-down/sliding forward feeling. Then ride for a day or two and make more tiny adjustments. There IS no magic position to make a hard new Brooks will feel wonderful for the first week. Unless you are just weird and lucky.
In fact, the first few rides will leave your sit bones sore. They will adapt and feel better after a few more rides. Just have faith that every 2 or 3 rides will feel a little more comfortable, and by a month (with weekly HideProofing) it will start to feel like riding on nothing much at all, like sitting in a nice carved Winsor chair, you don't think about it when it doesn't hurt!
Plastic, gel, and foam saddles stay the same as when you buy them. But leather slowly changes shape and forms to you like a good pair of fine leather shoes, or a favorite belt. So you can't tell what it will feel like as it shapes to you. This just won't happen in a couple of hours on a trainer.
The allan wrench nut in the back of the bracket that holds the saddle on the post. Loosen it with a correct size wrench. This enables you to change TWO settings: the tipping up and down of the nose, and the sliding forward and back of the saddle. (It does not make the saddle taller or lower on the seat post.)Quote:
Originally Posted by pooks
Yep -- and I don't have to ride for two hours that way to know it!Quote:
Originally Posted by Lisa S.H.
Thanks!
Pooks, this webpage might help visualize adjusting saddles:
http://bikes.jump-gate.com/maintenan...ntenance.shtml
Well I kept it on the carbon seatpost and made it level again. I noticed that when I put it as far back as it will go, the distance from the front of the saddle to the bars is the same as on my butterfly, but the back is closer since the saddle is shorter. My KOPs looks good, so the plan was to try this out this morning, but its raining and our group ride was cancelled. I also applied profride overnite. I am worried if I feel pressure on the nose just sitting in the trainer, this is gonna hurt riding, but it seems you guys want me to just try it like this on a ride. Bill Laine enclosed a note with the saddle (very nice personal touch) in which he said if it felt too hard to loosen the tension 1/2 a turn for the first 100-200 miles and then tension it back up. I also read somewhere to not mess with the tension. What do you guys think I should do for my first real ride? Can I learn anything on the trainer, or do I just need to see how I feel on a real ride (i.e. should I see how the more laid back seatpost feels). Maybe pressure will not be as bad as the chafing I got from my butterfly. If the weather clears I'll try a short ride this afternoon.
Don't change anything until after you ride it a bit.
Don't even loosen the tension to soften the leather until after you've ridden outside. (I never did loosen my tension)
Pressure from the nose while riding will most likely be from the angle of the seat, not from the tension of the leather. But you need to go on a decent length ride outside to really feel what the seat is doing. My first couple rides with my B67 I took a wrench with me so i could adjust the obvious fore-aft/tilt/height things I felt right away. The slipperiness of the saddle the first couple weeks really did help me to figure out when the seat was level.
Once I got the seat right, I drew marks on the rails and seat post. The lowest point of the saddle skirt lines up beautifully with my seat tube. When I took the saddle off to oil the nose shackle it was pretty easy to put it back just the way I had it. Had to fuss with tilt a little because my seat-post has a personality of it's own. If I have it tilted even a tiny bit to high or too low I can feel it right away.
It's a lot like breaking in a brand new pair of Levi 501's. You fuss around a lot at first but soon it feels like it was made just for you.
My B67 felt great from day one. It was such a relief to have a seat that actually supported my entire sit bones that I truly didn't feel that the leather was too hard!
Yeah, I agree, mine felt fine from day one, as well. I've never adjusted it or done anything to do it at all. My first ride on it was about 10-15 miles, and I actually forgot I was riding a new saddle. I didn't even have sore sit bones at the end of that. My 'girly bits' (using that term makes me feel like I'm 12) don't come into any contact with the seat at all, though, and I have the seat completely level, not tilted.
I have never conditioned it, either, because it never sits in the rain, and at just about a year old it has the butt dimples and is by far the most comfortable saddle I've ever ridden. I'm a little shy of trying a Brooks on one of my road bikes, for some reason, but the B67 is the most painless saddle I own. I wish all my saddles felt like that.
:) All I can say is WOW, you guys were right. I just put it back to completely level using a leveler across the top, and made the KOP measurements the same as with my old saddle. In the trainer I still felt pressure on the nose, pressure mind you, not pain, but decided to follow your advice and take her out since it had stopped raining. The plan was to see if I could make it to the gym, only 8 miles away. At first I didn't even take a water bottle, thinking I'll be back inside for an adjustment in no time. She felt like a dream on the road, much better than my butterfly. I liked that I could tell my weight was being supported by my sitbones and not soft tissues. The shape suits me better than the butterfly, wide in back with a sharp transition to a narrow nose, and not too deep either (the finesse). I had no sit bone discomfort at all, and while I still felt some pressure on my soft tissues under the nose, I felt pressure, not pain or abrasions like with the butterfly. I think its just the feeling of support under me, which I am not used to since I have ridden with a cut-out for so long, more of a squishing sensation as Lisa put it, which I think will go away as the leather comforms to my body down there. OK, the ride was only 8 miles, but I was so excited I had to come to my office and write this email, before doing my workout and ride home (I came in to use the gym at work). THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR ADVICE AND HELP THROUGHOUT MY SADDLE CRISIS!!!!!!!!! As I was riding, all I could think about is that there is no way I am getting on that butterfly on my commuter. Now I just have to decide when to order the next one. I should probably wait until I do a longer ride, and I have to decide if I should move her to Athena (my commuter) for the week, or throw a rack on Isis (my go fast bike) for the work week and keep it all as is she feels so perfect. I am inclined to do the latter.:)
Well, I get home from the gym, no problems. Again, still pressure but not pain on the soft tissues hitting the nose (and no after ride pain). I took 2 pictures which I am going to try and post. In one see you can see her on the entire bike, and the other is a close up. The only 2 positions I tried was completely level (as in pix) by placing a carpenters level across the entire top of the saddle, and the other was placing the level on the nose. When I leveled it on the nose I was sliding off, so that wasn't good, but do you guys think I should try tilting her down just a tad for my next ride, or leaving her alone until she adjusts to my body? The other thiing I love about her is that I can slide around more easily, back when hunkered down in the drops, instead of meeting resistnance from the gel in the butterfly. I never sent pix before. I put them as attachments so I hope this worked. If not, tell me what to do!