Strength of humanity in crisis...

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Originally Posted by PamNY

I keep thinking of the people who are working on the nuclear facility. They are very brave.

That was interesting, Shootingstar, thanks.

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It isn't a matte of bravery or not. The workers who are the walking dead know that they will die soon maybe a month, two... maybe a year from now...

They may have volunteered.

They may have been asked. If you were asked to do this job, you can not turn it down from cultural standpoint. To refuse, implies you are selfish and self centered and not thinking for the good of all. Your honor is tarnished and so is your family.

My heart goes out to the walking dead. They are doing this to save their loved ones, their neighbor, their way of life. If I lived in Japan and if my expertise was in nuclear power, I would seriously consider volunteering. I don't have kids, Only family I have is my elderly mother, my sister and her three children and I'm already in my 50's. I've had a good life. This is the strength of the Japanese culture.

smilingcat

.... :eek:

Oh my. That very clearly highlights the difference in culture. That is very impressive, but to me also quite disturbing.

I pray that they succeed in their efforts. I hope they feel it was worth the sacrifice. I hope they know that a whole world is watching, and waiting for better news.

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Originally Posted by lph

.... :eek:

Oh my. That very clearly highlights the difference in culture. That is very impressive, but to me also quite disturbing.

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I agree. Interesting the change this casts on the dialogue...the very attribute we were applauding becomes disturbing when viewed in the extreme...

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Originally Posted by lph

Oh my. That very clearly highlights the difference in culture. That is very impressive, but to me also quite disturbing.

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I don't know. Remember how many people did the same thing at Chernobyl. And (granted that the risks were different and to some extent unknown) at the World Trade Center site.

Did you read the Johann Hari piece I linked to?

The volunteers are amazing, commendable, there's no adjective too extreme for what they're doing. But I don't know that they're uniquely Japanese.

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

I don't know. Remember how many people did the same thing at Chernobyl. And (granted that the risks were different and to some extent unknown) at the World Trade Center site.

Did you read the Johann Hari piece I linked to?

The volunteers are amazing, commendable, there's no adjective too extreme for what they're doing. But I don't know that they're uniquely Japanese.

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Not yet, I'll read it later. I was thinking not of volunteering as such, but of the mindset that not accepting would mean dishonour of you and your family. I won't elaborate, I know far too little about it.

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Originally Posted by smilingcat

It isn't a matte of bravery or not. The workers who are the walking dead know that they will die soon maybe a month, two... maybe a year from now...

They may have volunteered.

They may have been asked. If you were asked to do this job, you can not turn it down from cultural standpoint. To refuse, implies you are selfish and self centered and not thinking for the good of all. Your honor is tarnished and so is your family.

My heart goes out to the walking dead. They are doing this to save their loved ones, their neighbor, their way of life. If I lived in Japan and if my expertise was in nuclear power, I would seriously consider volunteering. I don't have kids, Only family I have is my elderly mother, my sister and her three children and I'm already in my 50's. I've had a good life. This is the strength of the Japanese culture.

smilingcat

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I think this attitude of what some, (stress some) Japanese might do to volunteer for something deadly as self-sacrifice, is something to me personally, what distinguishes "traditional" Chinese cultural thinking from Japanese. I mean there is a Japanese word for this.

It's very sad, smiling cat.

I'm sorry, after losing 2 family members to suicide for completely different reasons, this form of self-sacrifice is not something I agree. The mothers in their anguished grief for the kamikaze son-pilots who died in WWII... by willingly gunning and running their planes into enemy planes or into the ground at instant death.

I guess it's no different from serving in war willingly. Though the difference is that the latter is always the possiblity you will kill /maim civilians not the "enemy" army/navy member on the other side. Dousing a nuclear blown out plant, you're not intentionally hurting anyone,...just yourself....

It's very hard for me to understand how some can do this. I know it's cultural and thus, I won't comment more, because, of course, I am not Japanese. I wouldn't do anything where I was knowingly putting myself in this position. Yes, it's selfish in the eyes of a different viewpoint and I totally understand that.
This was the main argument I had with my son when he joined the military. Why would you do something that intentionally put yourself in harm's way, when you don't have to? Of course, now that he's married, I think he is starting to see this from a different viewpoint.

Interesting account of a man who recalls his experience with the Three Mile Island meltdown.

I really think the thread title is appropriate, that this is about the strength of humanity in crisis, not about the strength of Japanese people distinct from other cultures. From yesterday's LA Times:

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examples of heroism are common in such situations, said Dr. Fred Mettler, a University of New Mexico radiologist and advisor to the U.N. on radiation safety.

At one point during the Chernobyl disaster, he said, workers were conferring about how much water was in one reactor pool. No one knew the answer and their instruments couldn't tell them, he said. "An Armenian engineer slipped out and came back in 30 minutes. He said, 'There's 3 feet of water,' " Mettler said. "He did that on his own."

The engineer died soon after of acute radiation poisoning.

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And the American man at TMI that NbyNW linked to, who is lucky to have survived - apparently health intact - but couldn't have known that going in.

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Originally Posted by OakLeaf

I don't know. Remember how many people did the same thing at Chernobyl. And (granted that the risks were different and to some extent unknown) at the World Trade Center site.

Did you read the Johann Hari piece I linked to?

The volunteers are amazing, commendable, there's no adjective too extreme for what they're doing. But I don't know that they're uniquely Japanese.

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Oakleaf, I agree. Given what we've seen in other dangerous situations, I don't find it surprising that there are brave people in this one. And that takes nothing away from their bravery.

Anyone who works at a nuclear facility must have some awareness that things could go wrong.

Interesting article from Slate. Elaborates on the legal system discussed in this thread.

According to this article, an organized crime syndicate has donated 40 tons of humanitarian aid and is patrolling to maintain safety. Reminds me of stories I've heard about Brooklyn neighborhoods where the Mafia guys' mothers live.

yeah, the notion of shame is worse than death, so you'll hear of a lot of suicides by CEOs and presidents of companies that have come under fire. I wouldn't be surprised if those in charge of the nuclear plant ends up "saving face" by killing themselves :(

I understand the bravery of someone trying to save a drowning person or person in burning a building..because one is physically grasping hold of hopefully a still live person out of danger..

This is quite different.

I just can't, folks....Earlier this month, I was talking to my 25 yr. old niece..the one who lost her mother, my sister. Though she was happy to talk briefly to me, I sensed she was ready to cry again.


It is more courageous to stay ALIVE for your children. Always think of this.

It is an understatement to say that it is unfortunate that these workers are sacrificing their health and potentially their lives to contain the radiation and get the situation under control.

But it is also very likely that if they were all to walk away from the situation, that the damage to human life and to the environment will be far greater than any of us want to think about.

There are many ethical questions whirling around this with no easy answers.

Maybe one analogy for this is an ensnared animal who chews off its own leg to save its life. Maybe like that "127 Hours" guy cut off part of his arm in order to survive.

Is it even possible to advocate that no one try to do anything about these damaged reactors, because it might be dangerous to a few individuals? The reactors will not fix themselves on their own.

Everything has a price. What is going on is beyond sad, beyond tragic. I for one am very grateful that efforts are continuing to try to contain the fallout. I don't know how, but I'm sure we'll find ways to honor the work and sacrifice of these brave, strong people.

What NbyNW said. I'm not even a parent, but I've felt overwhelming guilt over the death of one of my dogs. Flashbacks, crying jags, months into years. If I had a child who got cancer because of radiation exposure, and I thought there was something I might have been able to do to prevent it, as well as cancers to thousands or tens of thousands of other children, at the cost of my own life ... I can't even imagine the guilt and shame.