Realty check - body image

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Originally Posted by Lisa S.H.

No need to tell anyone to "screw off". I think Annie also understands this concept of being able to discuss varied opinions without personal attacks.

So? Why would anyone feel it's necessary to try to change their mind? :confused: One could say the very same thing about people who are passionately FOR BA's.

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Thanks, Lisa. I certainly hope I didn't sound like I was telling anyone here to "screw off!" Yikes! There are certainly people out there who I might say that to, but I can't think of one single person who's posted in this thread who would rate that. :confused: I just wanted to point out the difference of opinion and possibly get a discussion started. Seems to have worked. ;) :D

KSH, You are correct in that I'm comfortable enough in my decision to not be bothered by what others think. Or I wouldn't have said a word. I appreciate your speaking up in defense of my POV. Thanks!

I think we're lucky to have a forum of women who are able to discuss many controversial topics without too much acrimony or flaming and respect each others' opinions, whether or not we agree with them.

Annie

Did I ever tell you about the time I shot a skunk?

If I won the lotto, I would so seriously consider a BA and a nose job! I have a question though: can someone else (aka possible boyfriend) feel the difference between implants and nature by feel? :confused: :o

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Originally Posted by zencentury

Did I ever tell you about the time I shot a skunk?

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Noooo! Skunks are wonderful creatures :p

I have to say I am intrigued by this thread, skunks nonwithstanding. I was one of the "anti" people merely, I guess, due to my own feelings about how women shouldn't have to modify themselves due to society, etc.

What I'm impressed with are the people who are obviously in shape and are extraordinarily strong women who choose to do this. This is cool. I guess I've witnessed the non-athletic "Barbie" types who rely on surgery to do what they don't want to work for. I guess if it's something you want to do (instead of an attempt to make someone like you) it's a positive thing.

I have no desire to get it done but the ultra-painful sounding tummy tuck would be something I'd be interested in. Though I wonder if implants help in swimming? Are they bouyant? Might get me to thinking ..... :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by deedolce

If I won the lotto, I would so seriously consider a BA and a nose job! I have a question though: can someone else (aka possible boyfriend) feel the difference between implants and nature by feel? :confused: :o

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I can't exactly answer this question because I've never actually "squeezed" a real breast myself. But I would say that someone else would be able to notice the difference. I think it would depend on how much breast tissue you already have to insulate the implant. I would say that my saline implants are more firm than real breasts. They don't "ebb and flow" like real breasts. They don't bounce and jiggle like real breasts. I also have a one inch scar in the crease of each breast. (of course I have many other scars, one might not notice those) I think that they are still very nice and "squeezable." And they are better than no breasts at all. :rolleyes:

Now, silicon wasn't available when I got mine. They say that silicon has a much nicer feel.

Now I've asked Mr. if he could tell the difference and sweet man that he is, says he doesn't remember. ;) He likes them. However he was very clear to me that getting them was my decision and he loved me the way that I was.

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Originally Posted by teigyr

Though I wonder if implants help in swimming? Are they bouyant? Might get me to thinking ..... :rolleyes:

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They are no help at all! :(

Thanks, Silver. I think it's awesome that strong women, especially cycling women (!) are willing to talk about this...I've always been curious, and I've always thought about it - not willing to spend that kind of money yet, though. :p

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Originally Posted by teigyr

I have no desire to get it done but the ultra-painful sounding tummy tuck would be something I'd be interested in. Though I wonder if implants help in swimming? Are they bouyant? Might get me to thinking ..... :rolleyes:

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It's actually better to be flat chested if you swim. A lot better :(. I went from an A cup to a C cup over the course of a year in college, and well... the difference in water resistance is very noticeable. I don't exactly hate having grown boobs now, but it was really traumatic when it happened. Fortunately, going from an A to a C is still within the limits of what a racing suit can smoosh. And as long as there's no gaping at the neckline, there's no risk of swimming out of my suit. If it's one of those stupid low cut or "pretty" swimsuits tho, ugh!

It's definitely a YMMV thing tho. I'd not get breast reduction just to get back to being fast in the water. And I'm sure there are swimmers who wouldn't mind larger breasts. But I liked my body best as an A cup.

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Originally Posted by deedolce

If I won the lotto, I would so seriously consider a BA and a nose job! I have a question though: can someone else (aka possible boyfriend) feel the difference between implants and nature by feel? :confused: :o

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I certainly could... it was very odd. They looked real, but they felt very unusual. (this was a friend of mine who later got them taken out)

I used to work in a clinic where we did rehab on the "failed" cosmetic surgeries from the plastic surgeons in the building. Believe me, you want to research your surgeon, and then do everything they tell you! If someone gets a tummy tuck and is supposed to walk hunched over a low walker for 2 months to let it heal right, dang it they'd better do exactly that!! (cuz otherwise things can go very wrong)

Zen,
You better behave yerself, Missy! :cool:
Don't make me mention butter.

:eek: :eek:
;)


Knot,
That's scary stuff!! :eek:
(((hoping Kit doesn't start posting bloody eyeball pix again....)))

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Originally Posted by amymisk

... get a fitting and try out as many ...

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I thought this thread was about breasts?

:D Karen in Boise

What about a fanny lift? You know, having it high and tight? Zen, are you listening to me? :p :rolleyes: :D

OMG- I hate that abbreviation but OMG you gotta see this :eek:

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Originally Posted by zencentury

OMG- I hate that abbreviation but OMG you gotta see this :eek:

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(keeping my mouth shut) :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :( :( :(

Holy moly!! I thought the girlie parts trimming was bad enough! :eek: :eek: :eek:

Heh. I looked that up and as I was scrolling through the slides, one of our managers (a friend of mine from way back when) walked behind me. His comment was "where do you FIND these things?"

I wanted to blame zen :D Instead, I took the fall for her.

I always did wonder how women sat in those bustle dresses. Never imagined that they were retractable! Cool! Thanks, Zen.

Too bad there's not a magic pill for me to gain a few inches in my legs. <sigh> Oh, well... my bike wouldn't fit than.;) Never mind! :p :D

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Originally Posted by Lisa S.H.

An interesting viewpoint. You make it sound as though women who are not in favor of breast augmentation operations are full of hatred towards women who are. Stating one's own opinion that differs from another's is not "abuse", it's just a basic right of expression.
What *is* accurate is that each woman has their OWN opinions on the subject, and when groups of them talk about the subject in an open discussion forum, then one can expect to hear various opinions, both pro and con. Discussions involve a back and forth exchange of ideas and opinions. If one doesn't want to hear any opposing views, then one shouldn't be reading a discussion about it. As far as I've seen, the women in this discussion were pretty much just stating their own viewpoints, not attacking anyone here.
No need to tell anyone to "screw off". I think Annie also understands this concept of being able to discuss varied opinions without personal attacks.

So? Why would anyone feel it's necessary to try to change their mind? :confused: One could say the very same thing about people who are passionately FOR BA's.

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Lisa, I probably didn't word my response just right.

I would say that there are probably 3 types out there (applies to men as well as women really):
1) Boob jobs are fine in their book. They have no issue getting one themselves (or their SO) and are fine with them.
2) Boob jobs are fine in their book, but they wouldn't want one for themselves or their SO.
3) Boob jobs are NEVER OK in their book. No matter if a women needed them (some women do have tubular breasts, etc. Getting a boob job is a huge mental lift for them. Or what about breast cancer survivors?)... and they will stand on the top of the "mountain" to let women with boob jobs how horrible they are for getting one and how agains boob jobs they are.

I'm all for listening to opposing views. I don't think anyone in this thread has been rude or judgemental. Not at all.

But in reference to the lady that posted... you do run into the ones who are judgemental and you have to be prepared to face that if you tell people.

I know I was cornered in a ladies restroom at a club for about 45 minutes by a lady who had to tell me how horrible getting a boob job was. I was very polite and listened to her point of view and recognized why she didn't agree with it and respected her opinion. Trust me, I was more than kind to this lady. But that's a prime example of what you sometimes have to face.

I would never expect to change someone's mind. If you are against it, that's the way it is. I guess I would just expect for someone to respect my decision for my life and stop judging me for my decisions. But, sometimes, that's not the case. Not in this thread, but generally speaking.

So trust me... I'm not upset or hurt and I don't think anyone here has been mean. I was just pointing out that sometimes you do have to "face" those people who will make judgements and tell you how horrible you are for making your choices.

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Originally Posted by teigyr

I have to say I am intrigued by this thread, skunks nonwithstanding. I was one of the "anti" people merely, I guess, due to my own feelings about how women shouldn't have to modify themselves due to society, etc.

What I'm impressed with are the people who are obviously in shape and are extraordinarily strong women who choose to do this. This is cool. I guess I've witnessed the non-athletic "Barbie" types who rely on surgery to do what they don't want to work for. I guess if it's something you want to do (instead of an attempt to make someone like you) it's a positive thing.

I have no desire to get it done but the ultra-painful sounding tummy tuck would be something I'd be interested in. Though I wonder if implants help in swimming? Are they bouyant? Might get me to thinking ..... :rolleyes:

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Well, I think with everything... why women get boob jobs can vary.

Yes I think there are the ones out there who do it to "get men" or they are just all about relying on their looks to get by in life.

I would encourage you to view some before and after pictures though... as you will see that there are women out there with deformed breasts. One size is an A cup the other a D cup... tubular breasts, etc. I am sure these women get a BA so they can feel comfortable undressing in front of their partner.

I can't say my choice was based on something that dramatic.... I just like boobs and I didn't have any. I went from a perky B to a saggy A when I lost some body fat through diet and exercise. After that I wasn't happy with the size or shape. And I'm a women who is all hips/thighs/butt. I had this thin torso, no boobs but a lot of booty. I just wanted to even it all out.

Honestly, most people who have met me in person, and who I tell later about my BA... are shocked I have one. I don't stand out... mine are very natural looking and fit my body size. I don't flaunt my chest... I don't use it to get anything. I dress in respectable clothing and I make sure to cover up at work.

I'm a very strong and confident woman who got it done for... me. I didn't do it for anyone else.

As for swimming... eh... no help there.

[QUOTE=KSH;250607]
But in reference to the lady that posted... you do run into the ones who are judgemental and you have to be prepared to face that if you tell people.

I know I was cornered in a ladies restroom at a club for about 45 minutes by a lady who had to tell me how horrible getting a boob job was. I was very polite and listened to her point of view and recognized why she didn't agree with it and respected her opinion. Trust me, I was more than kind to this lady. But that's a prime example of what you sometimes have to face.



I find people who force their opinions on others much more obnoxious than women with big boobs real or fake. :D

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Originally Posted by KSH

I know I was cornered in a ladies restroom at a club for about 45 minutes by a lady who had to tell me how horrible getting a boob job was. I was very polite and listened to her point of view and recognized why she didn't agree with it and respected her opinion. Trust me, I was more than kind to this lady. But that's a prime example of what you sometimes have to face.

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Yikes, you probably should have just excused yourself after 5 minutes! :eek: :rolleyes:

But hey, I hear what you are saying. :)

I think there are more than the 3 types you mention though. I know I don't fit neatly into any of the 3 "types".

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Originally Posted by stacie

I find people who force their opinions on others much more obnoxious than women with big boobs real or fake. :D

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I agree. What's more, I also think that women who force their boobs on others can be just as obnoxious as women with big mouths and opinions real or fake.

(just kidding!!)

KSH, thank you for sharing that.

I guess we're all guilty of having proconceived notions sometimes and it's always the obnoxious people who are out there talking about what they had done. (Think Pamela Anderson) I've long been against people "beautifying" themselves to fit into some role but then again I know that's pretty hypocritical because we all do things that make us feel good. What gets to me about surgeries, especially for those who do them for someone else instead of themselves, is it's risky. I've known men who insist their womenfolk do these things (really, I have and it's horrible!) and it appalls me. Then again we should have the freedom to do what we want with our bodies.

I find a lot of TE people are role models. I don't see any of you as going around flashing your boobs (unless there's good reason ;) ) and scheming about your next surgery. Yeah, I've seen surgery addicts also. All/most of you are in incredible shape and take care of yourselves.

It is sad that the procedure is stereotyped in such a negative way but I think it's usually because we only hear/see negativity.

Go here for the new Dove, Campaign for Real Beauty, film entitled "Onslaught":

http://www.campaignforrealbeauty.com/home.asp

What do you think?

That video was interesting, michelem. Thanks for posting the link.
I feel that way- like the media is the ones who make us think we need to be thin to be pretty or perfect.
Then again, I know how I feel when I'm thinner (better about myself in general). Don't know if that's from all the hype that's put it in my brain or not. When I was 25 lbs thinner I thought I looked good, but even then I still saw all my flaws and wished I was just a little flatter here or thinner there. That alone tells me I'd probably not be happy at any weight (no matter how tiny I got, I'd still find flaws), and that I just need to learn to be happy and love myself where I'm at now.

That video is AWESOME!!!!! sooooo cool! everyone should see that!

Hmmmm....this is a very thought provoking thread. and good discussion.

beware of random musings with no particular point in mind.

I, being a thin, fit athletic person, who has had plastic surgery, have had to really do some soul searching about my choices. I'm very comfortable with the choices that I've made. I won't get my feelings hurt, but I will not be silent when plastic surgery or "thinness" gets stereotyped and negatively addressed. I do try to present a more positve side...an alternate view.

I'm very thin boned, thin framed. my natural body type is thin. When I eat healthy food and exercise my body weight falls to a "thin" weight. If I eat junk food I gain weight. I actually am not a sweet eater and because I eat healthy I really notice my performance suffer when I eat junk food.

I worked hard to become fit and was very happy with the way that I looked except my breasts. Which as I explained before, I wasn't just flat chested, my chest looked deformed.

sideline to say that when I told my mom that I was getting the BA, she said, I always wondered why your breasts never developed. :rolleyes:

So, now, I'm very happy with my body image. I work very hard to become more muscular and stronger and faster. I love how clothes fit. I love being able to go into a store and buy a bra that fits. I used to hate shopping for clothes because of how poorly things fit.

But I recognize that my body type is more the type that perpetuates this pressure on young girls to be thin. I don't want to be a negative role model, it's my desire to be a role model for girls to be active and fit. However, this is my body type, (ectomorph) I'm working as hard as I can to be the most fit that I can with my body type.

as you know I have a 17 year old daughter. she is built more like Mr. she puts on muscle and weight more easiely than me. She's curvier. She's a nice A cup. She is beautiful and proportional! She turns heads. When I got my BA, I asked her what she thought, and she said she understood. She said that she understood that I would want to have breasts that were nice looking. I feel that she has a very good self image. She works out and is active and doesn't worry too much about what she eats.

This part is hard to explain......it's the point at which I finally decided to have the BA. I was always one that said I was happy with them, didn't want plastic surgery....put a lot of energy into saying that I was happy with the way I looked. Well, I was running at a Race for the Cure. All these beautiful women that had had breast Cancer. What a terrible illness! (I do not want in any way to detract from what a horrible thing that breast cancer is) They all had beautiful breasts! I understand that some were prothesis. and that not every woman chooses reconstrutive surgery, but a good majority do. Much of BA development comes from breast cancer reconstructive surgery. I was wearing a running top and completely flat. So here, I've been telling myself that having breasts aren't important....and these women you have faced death are celebrating and although I know they were celebrating life mostly, they were celebrating breasts. When they lost their breasts to surgery they mourned the loss of them. Why, because breasts mean something to a woman. It can't really be defined.

ha, enough for now.

That film about sums it up.
But I'm afraid it's bigger than all of us.
The weak will succumb.

Silver, I'm really touched by your post, and it's given me more to think about.

My sister, who I am not very close to, is a breast cancer survivor who has had a masectomy. I am very proud of her. Her attitude is awesome, she rose above a terrible disease and she's a nice person. She did not have BA surgery. She told me that she'd had all her kids and was finished using them anyway....I realized then that she was not defined by her breasts. She defines herself in other ways, which is perfect for her and her family.

I also realized then and am reminded now - I am not her. I am partly defined by my breasts, as can be seen in my original post. I know now that if I were ever in that situation, if I went through what she did, I would opt for surgery. I am proud of my curviness, generally happy with my body (always aware of imperfections and room for improvement as most of us are), and would want to rebuild myself after going through the grief and the healing....

Thank you, Silver. Thank you, all of you ladies, for such a great discussion!

Hugs and butterflies,
~T~

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Originally Posted by LBTC

Thank you, Silver. Thank you, all of you ladies, for such a great discussion!

Hugs and butterflies,
~T~

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Ditto!

Annie

So, back to where I started on this thread....not that the rest of the discussion hasn't been great....but this new strange sizing to consider.

Sure, I'd love to buy an inexpensive bra, but it absolutely must fit. So, now that I know the size I'm supposed to be, before I start randomly trying on anything that looks okay, I'm going to try to find the right size...34D.

All I can say is Good f*****ing luck.

Thousands of bras at Walmart. Not a single 34D. D's start at 38, with the odd 36 in there. 34's don't get past C.

Yes, I'll try another store next chance I get, and I'll let you know if I have any success. I may be destined to only buy expensive bras. I hope not.

Will the hoped for weight loss help to reduce the cup size? Hard to say. Perhaps. But I'm not going to lose weight fast, so I'll need at least one more bra, including a sports bra, in the meantime. Wish me luck!

Hugs & butterflies,
~T~

I have a few tidbits to share.

First LBTC - I feel your pain, a 36/38 A ain't easy to find either.

Second - I am lucky enough to have very nicely shaped breasts, however they are smaller than average. I also have spectacular abs. BFs in the past have always commented on how nice my breasts are, I on the other hand always wanted to hear how nice my abs are. I earned those abs, they weren't a simple developemental happen-stance. My breasts are a fluke.

Thirdly - I have opted not to have children in part because of what it does to our bodies. Sure, I haven't had PS but in many ways I'm more vain than many. Who am I to say if it's right or wrong to have PS. That would be pretty hipocritical of me.

Lastly - I have very close friend who just had a mastectomy due to breast cancer. She's 36 years old. She's currently going through consultations for her reconstructive surgery. I asked her what size she was going to get (you do get to choose and they do the other one to match), she said "I told DH if he lost 20 lbs I'd get a C, otherwise he's getting a B same as before." She cracks me up, I love her and I hope she wins her battle.

This thread has been really interesting, and not least, it's made me rethink some of my own values. I think the only point important to me when it comes to body image issues is "how it looks is less important than how it WORKS".

That's not to say that vanity is stupid, or pointless, or completely shallow, but I do believe that it's important to have a sense of perspective. We're all vain in some way or another, some of us more than others. Some of us on behalf of our bikes... And we change with time, and with different circumstances. I remember when I was a teenager, and swore I'd NEVER dye my hair (like my mother), I'd rather just go grey gracefully. Well FOOF to that ;) I dye my hair all the time. But I like to think I can just stop, and still feel fine about myself.

Whoever said that "it's only the obnoxious ones you notice" - very true. You don't notice the discreet, natural-looking BAs. I see skinny little teenage girls wearing watermelons, and I feel sad for their flatter chested classmates. My bust size is increasingly "invisible". (Funny thing is, quite a few supermodels hardly seem to have breasts either, it seems to go quite naturally with their skinny frames.) I used to go to an aerobic class that was half full with teenage girls obsessed with making their butts look good. I just thought, well, great, they're getting a cardio workout at the same time, and that might be really important for their health at some point.

I'm not really getting anywhere here. But it's been a education reading all the stories here, and I thank you all for it. I know everybody here is primarily concerned with keeping their bodies fit and in good working order and I can't imagine a better ideal for women. How vain we want to be on the outside is a personal choice, and I for one am going to be a bit more careful about passing judgement too fast.

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Originally Posted by LBTC

Will the hoped for weight loss help to reduce the cup size? Hard to say. Perhaps. But I'm not going to lose weight fast, so I'll need at least one more bra, including a sports bra, in the meantime. Wish me luck!

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Good luck :).

If you can remember the pattern you gained weight in, that offers a clue as to how the weight will come off. It's *not* a hard and fast rule, but often women who gain weight in the chest area tend to lose it from there too.

I know I've seen 34D bras available. Just not at Walmart/Target. If you've got an old fashioned department store around, check their underwear department. There's usually a sale rack tucked somewhere in a corner, with all the discounted bras stuffed on it. If you're a 34 or 36B, you won't find anything there most of the time. If you're an A cup, a C cup, under a 34 band size or over a 36 band size, go digging. There will be lots of odd colors, but you'll find cheap bras :). Victoria's Secret end of season sale is still going on too (tho it's about due to be over). Again, lots of weird colors, but for much less money.

Sadly, neither of those options work if you're much above a D cup :(.

LBTC, did you try Target? I've seen lots of 34D's there. I've even seen them on the sale rack. :) I wear a 34 B or 34C depending on the style. and so I notice the 34's.

Another good place is JCPenny's.

I searched victoria's secret clearance for 34D and came up with 3 in the link below. Personally I highly recommend the body by victoria full coverage bra and its available in your size in black and tan for $24.99. It doesn't get much better than that for good quaility. My VS bras last years when properly taken care of (don't put in dryer).

http://www2.victoriassecret.com/Sale...ypes=B&x=4&y=9

I've avoided this thread until now but I thought my experience might be helpful to some.

I hit full on puberty at 10, before I was 11 I was wearing a 36C bra. I went though high school with giant breasts (40D), they encumbered me and made playing sports (my sanctuary) painful, made me the focus of ridicule, and made me the focus of endless sexual advances from boys AND grown men. By the time I was 20 I was wearing 44DD and by the time they finally finished growing I was a 44E.

I spent years as a lifeguard, police officer, firefighter/medic, all the while dealing with breasts so large they impacted my breathing, hurt my back and neck, and made doing my job significantly more challenging than it should have been. At age 39 my parents gave me the best gift I ever received, they offered to pay for a breast reduction. I went from 44E to a B cup and could finally breathe again! My life improved immeasurably, I was no longer defined by my breasts, males looked me in the eye for the first time in my life, and I could ride and play sports without pain. The scarring on my chest is unbelievable, I looks like someone took a weed whacker to my chest, the scars are thick and ropey and sometimes uncomfortable. But I truly don't care.

Weirdest thing...the reactions I get for some women, so many wish they could have it done BUT their boyfriends or husbands wouldn't like it. Men respond by saying it's a tragedy and NO woman should have a reduction.

I would do it again in a heartbeat.

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Originally Posted by LBTC

Thousands of bras at Walmart. Not a single 34D. D's start at 38, with the odd 36 in there. 34's don't get past C.

Yes, I'll try another store next chance I get, and I'll let you know if I have any success. I may be destined to only buy expensive bras. I hope not.

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LBTC, listen to Knott, she is very wise :) She recommended Title 9 for me, I just checked and they have 34D :D

One example

http://www.titlenine.com/shopping/pr...ProductID=2164

Trek-The secret to inner peace is a great bra-420

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Originally Posted by Torrilin

If you can remember the pattern you gained weight in, that offers a clue as to how the weight will come off. It's *not* a hard and fast rule, but often women who gain weight in the chest area tend to lose it from there too.

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Weight gain was very hard to track due to the severe bloating that came with my illness over the last 15 months.... Walking has already improved the shape and size of my butt, the improvements in my health have reduced the huge belly I was sporting.... I don't remember when exactly my bras started fitting poorly in all of that, I was a little distracted. :rolleyes:

I think I lose it there last, but I'm not sure.

H&B
~T~

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Originally Posted by silver

LBTC, did you try Target? I've seen lots of 34D's there. I've even seen them on the sale rack. :) I wear a 34 B or 34C depending on the style. and so I notice the 34's.

Another good place is JCPenny's.

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There is no Target or JCPenney's in my town. In fact, I'm not sure they are even in Canada!

H&B
~T~