The weight loss 'wall' - keep banging my head :-/

SadieKate - That is interesting information from your friend. When I spin I frequently attain 200 watts for long periods of time. I intentionally push myself hard to get in a workout. I am only guessing, but I think I'm extremely fit for cycling. Other sports not as much. Seems my body is very efficient at cycling because I have ridden a lot. Even when I don't ride as much as I like, I do hard spins like the one I mention or I am commuting while towing things. I had a lung capacity test done in school and I have the lung capacity of an adult male. I realize I'm sitting outside the norms which I guess is why I got nervous to see my calorie count and HR in the first place.

My HR monitor has the chest strap and in the past has been very accurate but since I have been exercising 'hard' at high HRs where people say they aren't as accurate? Well who knows, maybe it is wrong for that. I am happy to discover that I can run again. Apparently the ripped tendon in my foot finally healed, so now I am going to do more of my no so efficient sport: running.

I'm not really a good example about how to fuel for long rides as I haven't really done many since I went paleo. The first year, I was still training for tri and doing long runs (2+ hours) and somewhat longer bike rides (3+ hours). I would find that I didn't need to eat anything at all unless it was going to hit a 2 hour workout session. Then I would supplement with gels (my one, non-paleo, regular 'food'). I only drink water.

I got injured before I did my first Whole30 (when I truly cut out ALL sugar) and I've only been slowly getting back into working out regularly again a year later (ugh). The longest workouts I do now are about an hour and I don't need food for those at all. I expect that as my rides get longer, I'll use things like sweet potatoes, bananas and dates when I need the sugar. I'm really not sure what I'm going to do when running as my stomach typically can't handle solid food on a longer run, but we'll see. I may try baby food pouches. I used a couple of those in the past and while expensive, they seemed to work great (easy to carry, easy to consume, easy to digest)

I've found that beef jerky (nitrate free), dried cherries and macadamia nuts seem to work fine for me on the bike - and a banana when I get home. I've not gone for a REALLY long bike ride since going primal last July, I think the longest ride I've had since then is 40 miles.

This year I will experiment with making my own "larabars". I really like them but it would be more cost-effective to make them myself and then I've total control over the ingredients.

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Originally Posted by tulip

Beef jerky, nuts, and bananas work for me. Not as convenient as PowerBars, though. It's hard when you eliminate sugar. For drinks, I used to rely on G2, but Nuun tablets don't have sugar (I think). I'd be interested in learning some more ideas.

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They don't, but they do have xylitol which bothers some people's guts. (I find it a bigger problem off the bike, actually.)

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Originally Posted by Catrin

I've found that beef jerky (nitrate free), dried cherries and macadamia nuts seem to work fine for me on the bike - and a banana when I get home. I've not gone for a REALLY long bike ride since going primal last July, I think the longest ride I've had since then is 40 miles.

This year I will experiment with making my own "larabars". I really like them but it would be more cost-effective to make them myself and then I've total control over the ingredients.

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Threadjack: Now I want cherry, macadamia and white chocolate cookies. Good thing that would require going shopping.

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Originally Posted by SadieKate

I asked a friend who has a masters in exercise physiology and was doing research for NASA at the time about the claims of a local spin studio owner. My friend is also a cycling coach. I can't imagine that anyone wouldn't think him a credible source. Here's his answer:

I'm always a bit amazed by claims like this. I'll start by saying that it is POSSIBLE to burn 800 calories per hour while cycling. However, it is unlikely that a person without a high level of cardiovascular fitness can achieve an energy expenditure in that range, Here's how the math breaks down:

In order to burn 800 calories in an hour, a person needs to burn 800/60 or 13.34 Calories per minute. Since humans use ~5 Calories for every 1 liter of oxygen consumed that means that a person would have to AVERAGE at least 2.67 liters of oxygen consumption per minute to burn 800 calories in an hour.

-The equation if one was inclined to do the math is: (((10.8 x Watts) / Body Weight in Kg + 7) x Body Weight)/1000 = Liters per minute. So, a 70 KG person (154 lbs) pedaling at a work rate of 200 watts would be using about 2.65 liters/ min. or roughly 800 Calories. A heavier person would presumably require less energy, and a lighter person would require more.

To put this in context, most riders in the tour de france average slightly more than 200 watts on any given stage. In fact, most of the professional females I have worked with are not able to sustain workloads greater than 200 watts for more than a few minutes.

So, while it is not impossible for a STRONG rider to burn 800 calories for an hour, most would be doing well to reach the 500-600 range for an hour long ride.

Now, if they try to tell you it's because of high intensity interval training or some such thing, the bottom line still applies: 1 Liter of O2 for every 5 Calories.

I hope that my long winded response was helpful rather than confusing! :)

!

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I agree that most those calorie burn numbers are way too high for a spin class, most people during high intensity intervals are at least at a 1:1 work/rest ratio...so 30-45 min of that class were probably spent at an easier intensity...
I have to say though, I am surprised that your friend has not seen "pro women hold more than 200 watts for more than a few minutes" I am no where near pro, and my LT is at 230, which I can sustain for 20-45 min at least...there are tons of higher level women I know who have LT numbers in the 250-300 watt range...not sure what pros he has worked with, but unless they are incredibly tiny/light, 200 watts is a pretty normal power number for a girl...

Unsurprisingly we've been around to power outputs before... http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=13750

I wouldn't necessarily trust the wattage numbers on a piece of gym equipment either, but if those are coming from a decent power meter, they're likely pretty close. ToThePeak's numbers are consistent with the ones Velogirl posted six years ago, assuming "nowhere near pro" means Cat 2-3.


Also, bake me some of those cookies.

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Originally Posted by Catrin

I now have the Nook version of the book and am looking forward to reading it before I take this on. My diet has been pretty darn clean since July, so it will be interesting to see what my body thinks of things. I will probably start a Whole30 journal on MDA to help me keep track of things - and it is good to get input. For MDA members I am Catrin there as well.

Sleep and stress relief is also key and can certainly affect our weight and weight-loss activities in ways that aren't obvious.

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Seems really odd to quote me....but I wanted to at least tie this to a thread where we've touched on the topic.

For interested members who are also on Mark's Daily Apple, I've started a Whole 30 journal there - my Whole 30 will start Saturday. I've the same username there so finding me should be easy if you are interested in following my journal. I welcome any helpful comments - and it will be interesting to see how much a difference this makes since my diet is pretty darn clean NOW. I am doing this to learn more about how MY body works, and to uncover any remaining dietary sensitivities.

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Originally Posted by Catrin

Seems really odd to quote me....but I wanted to at least tie this to a thread where we've touched on the topic.

For interested members who are also on Mark's Daily Apple, I've started a Whole 30 journal there - my Whole 30 will start Saturday. I've the same username there so finding me should be easy if you are interested in following my journal. I welcome any helpful comments - and it will be interesting to see how much a difference this makes since my diet is pretty darn clean NOW. I am doing this to learn more about how MY body works, and to uncover any remaining dietary sensitivities.

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I'll have to head over there to follow your journey. When I started my first Whole30, I was fairly clean myself (I think you are even 'cleaner' than I was) and I was quite shocked at how my body reacted to the Whole30. It was actually a bit of a challenge dealing with it from a mental perspective because I kept thinking I shouldn't be going through 'withdrawals'. My second Whole30 was somewhat easier because I'd done so much 'off roading' prior to starting that I was expecting to feel pretty crappy for awhile. Odd, I know. In both cases, by day 18 or 19, I was feeling quite amazing. Better than I'd ever felt prior...it was enlightening.

I'm not super clean now because I'm on the road, but I'm going to do a Whole60 starting the day after I'm done with travel (March 3 or 4). :)

OK so I stopped relying on my Polar and now I lost 3 Lbs, finally going the right direction :-) In my Polar's defense however, I read on their website that the strap I have (the OLD one) is only good for 2500 hours. My HRM is at least 6 years old so I'm sure my battery in the strap is dead. It went totally crazy on me last night in spin so I ordered a new one today. BTW, in case you were wondering, the NEW Polar's do allow you to change the battery in the watch AND the strap. I just like to see my HR when I'm working out for some reason. I feel odd not having my HRM on. Silly? Probably, but it makes me work out more so I can SEE what I have done.

That's great WR! Good job!

Thanks Indy. It's so hard right now with all the crazy that is my life at the moment, lol!

I hear you WindingRoad, it is odd to exercise without the HRM, I totally get that. Great news that you figured out what was going on!

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Originally Posted by WindingRoad

Thanks Indy. It's so hard right now with all the crazy that is my life at the moment, lol!

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Kudos to you for fitting exercise and diet into your life right now, WR! You rock!

When I was in law school, I had to work out. Otherwise the stress was just too much. But it was hard. I often had to workout at 10 or 11 pm. I had a step (the kind you use in aerobics classes) in my apartment, three or four videos and the world's smallest/oldest tv. I made it work somehow.

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Originally Posted by indysteel

When I was in law school, I had to work out. Otherwise the stress was just too much. But it was hard. I often had to workout at 10 or 11 pm. I had a step (the kind you use in aerobics classes) in my apartment, three or four videos and the world's smallest/oldest tv. I made it work somehow.

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Ha! I did the same thing when I worked in retail management. I was so stressed from my day, even though it was often very physical (on my feet, carrying clothing, re-configuring walls/displays, slinging boxes, etc) I needed ME time. I could never have gone to a class because I really needed to be alone to de-stress and my workout videos were like good friends. I made a tall box step out of a milk crate with a couple of 2 x 6 boards lashed to the bottom (and turned upside down)!

I never thought I would enjoy hitting the gym before 6am, but much to my surprise I do. I think it has to do with getting it out of the way and not having anything from my work-day hanging around in my head to distract me from what my body is doing. I still over-think ~ I can't seem to help that (and it can frustrate my trainer) but it is enjoyable and eases the stress of the coming day.

Indy, that is an amazing schedule and glad you were able to make that work for you!

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Originally Posted by GLC1968

I made a tall box step out of a milk crate with a couple of 2 x 6 boards lashed to the bottom (and turned upside down)!

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That's so clever! You're such an engineer (I mean that in a good way)!

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Originally Posted by GLC1968

I made a tall box step out of a milk crate with a couple of 2 x 6 boards lashed to the bottom (and turned upside down)!

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That's so clever! You're such an engineer (I mean that in a good way)!

Okay so I finished my Whole30 and I went completely mad! I have been eating sweets like crazy and yes I feel horrible but the mind wants what the mind wants! I have a wedding to go to and a birthday coming up so I am trying to eat clean on the days in between. I have promised myself that this will be the last birthday cake for myself that I eat. I have emotional ties to the cake my Mom made me every year without fail! My daughter has been making them for the past few years and she is moving overseas so this is a special one. But I did lose 6 pounds in those 30 days. I haven't been 144 lbs for years! I wasn't perfect on my whole30. Too much fruit and nuts and too many days eating the same thing day after day while I tried to sort it all out. If I try again, I will plan better and go longer. I cannot break 50 years of sugar addiction in 30 days apparently!

I have to say kicking sugar is sooooooo hard to do. I have been good lately. I'm not doing Paleo or Whole30 I'm just doing my own version of eating clean and more protein. A fuji apple and some almond butter can save my day when I start craving sweets though. I've been doing this almost a month and only just NOW am I getting past the craving of junk food. It's insane how strong that urge is sometimes. I have stopped eating wheat products too

Both of you are doing great! Yayyyy for both of you :)

Here is a magazine length article from the New York Times on the science behind the American junk food addiction - PamNY first posted this in another thread on this forum. I've not had time to do more than scan it, but it looks like an interesting read.

I really enjoyed that article, Catrin. I'm looking forward to reading the book when it's published.

There is also a new book called "Rich Food Poor Food" that helps folks find the healthiest choices at the grocery store. "Rich Food" - foods high in micro-nutrients and Poor Food = the opposite and/or harmful. There is a lot of discussion how manufacturers will sometimes play games with the labels to make their product look healthier than they are, and harmful ingredients to look out for. I've just ordered the book after reading the reviews and the sample on my Nook (there are a lot of graphics and charts so I got the paperback version rather than the electronic) I've read the sample and there are some very good reviews of the book. From what I've seen of this so far, it will be attractive to a broad audience.

This is a podcast (download as MP3) by the authors of "Practical Paleo" with the authors of "Rich Food Poor Food". It isn't very short, but there is a lot of good information here on what caused them to write the book and provides a nice synopsis of the book.

Download MP3 version

If you prefer to access the video through iTunes or some other format then go here to the podcast page.

http://www.livestrong.com/article/49...rate-monitors/

This is a link above that should go to a short article about HRM accuracy & depending how you set them.

One of the best general ways I have found to set them is by working the max HR number "backwards", which closest resembles your PE (perceived exersion).

OK, so when you are at your "jogging with a friend" intensity, i.e. sweating, working, but at a steady sustainable pace, and enough wind left over to chat a short sentenance, i.e. "how was your day?", that's about 75% of your MHR. So...

Take that number of BPM as your HR and DIVIDE by 0.75 (i.e. 75%) and use THAT number as your "max HR" in the manual override setting in your monitor.

***my Polar is a F6... it's...OK (right side button)...scroll up, settings...user...view user extra settings...HR Max...<<<this is where you override the max "stock number", i.e. 220-your age is "stock set"

I found this suggestion of calculating backwards from a Spinning instructor forum I use for support. And I think tho it's simple, it's pretty close/good.

I field tested it road cycling once when I was sprinting on a hill to escape a chasing dog. By the time I escaped I was truly near my Max...i.e. seeings black spots, nausea, ready to pass out literally. Since I use a Garmin outside, I was able to pinpoint my heart rate on the route with the dog chasing and look at the number. That number as my max ties out with my 75% backwards equation. Hope this makes sense.:rolleyes:

Sooooooo... I concurr that I think your calories are overestimated. Alot of people make that mistake. Over-eat based upon calorie burn over-estimation. I usually ask "is your monitor set correctly? Or when was the last time you re-checked your current fitness level against the last time you re-set it?"

Hope this helps!:)

p.s. IF the gym spin bike has a computer that picks up HRMs, the "stock settings" for calorie burn was set for a 150lbs male approx age 30s...if memory serves me right from when one of my gym's I taught at had them (was Spinning bike brand)...thus you can see the inaccuracy assumptions right there

Thanks Miranda! OK the dog story just made me LOL! About a year or so ago I did manually set my HR Max and VO2 on my F6 and had good reading after that. I think since the strap battery has been dying the readings were progressively getting crazier until it was showing me at over 200 BPM. I recently bought a new Polar F7 and oddly it doesn't seem to have the ability to manually set those things BUT it's also giving me very realistic calorie burns so go figure, maybe they improved something? All I want to know is my calories is that too much to ask :-O No seriously, I feel at least so far the new F7 is giving pretty good readings, they aren't way off from treadmills or even MyFitnessPal's website which before they were way off. The new F7 also has the ability to change the friggin' battery yourself thank goodness.

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Originally Posted by WindingRoad

Thanks Miranda! OK the dog story just made me LOL! About a year or so ago I did manually set my HR Max and VO2 on my F6 and had good reading after that. I think since the strap battery has been dying the readings were progressively getting crazier until it was showing me at over 200 BPM. I recently bought a new Polar F7 and oddly it doesn't seem to have the ability to manually set those things BUT it's also giving me very realistic calorie burns so go figure, maybe they improved something? All I want to know is my calories is that too much to ask :-O No seriously, I feel at least so far the new F7 is giving pretty good readings, they aren't way off from treadmills or even MyFitnessPal's website which before they were way off. The new F7 also has the ability to change the friggin' battery yourself thank goodness.

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YW:) Glad it was of some help! Ya, I know, I just sent my F6 in to get serviced and the battery changed. Hmm, there outta be a way to override if you needed to. I have emailed and called the place where I sent mine to for service. It was from a Polar web site. This place was in Ann Arbor, MI (800)-742-4478. But, it sounds like it's still working ok with the new one. It's SO hard to get those pounds off! I'm struggling with some of my own *sigh*. Good Luck!:cool:

I would have kept my old F6 but I spilled gasoline on it last summer and ever since the face has been badly pitted. I buffed a bunch of it out but then my LCDs started burning out too. I am a little surprised they didn't have the override on the new model. I wonder why they opted not to do that. Don't feel alone, I'm still struggling too. I quit weighing, it is just driving me nuts it fluctuates so much I am now just going by size and clothes.

I got a new Polar HRM in early 2012...now the watch is all beat up from playing with Kettlebells at the gym. It was too late by the time I noticed this, so now I will just use it for riding I think. I think there is a way to do that over-ride in the new versions but it isn't intuitive. I will check it out tonight and see if I can retrace my steps on how I did it.

Avidd - yep I have been taking my vitamins; anything in particular you suggest for weight loss?

Catrin - which model do you have?

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Originally Posted by WindingRoad

Avidd - yep I have been taking my vitamins; anything in particular you suggest for weight loss?

Catrin - which model do you have?

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I've the Polar FT60. I forgot to check it out last night for the override, will try to remember tonight.

Mine isn't as nice as that, mine is an F7. It may not have those features.

I haven't really lost much more weight but I started checking measurements about 4 weeks ago, as of yesterday I have lost 2 inches off my waist. It's so wierd. I could tell my clothes were definitely fitting better but when it comes the the scale, it's just not moving much. So odd. Do any of you experience this?

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Originally Posted by WindingRoad

I haven't really lost much more weight but I started checking measurements about 4 weeks ago, as of yesterday I have lost 2 inches off my waist. It's so wierd. I could tell my clothes were definitely fitting better but when it comes the the scale, it's just not moving much. So odd. Do any of you experience this?

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It sounds like you are adding muscle and losing fat - which is the ideal :)

Great job, WR!!!!

I wish I could find a Facebook post that one of DH's friend recently posted. It showed the progress of a woman who was participating in a Crossfit type program. Her weight actually had gone up from the mid-120s to the mid-130s, but she looked so much thinner and fitter at the heavier weight. It really illustrated the point that body composition is far important than the scale.

Awesome to hear that Indy :-) Especially since I've been a little self conscious lately. I was getting worried I was doing something all wrong. Maybe I should just not even weigh myself. It drives me nuts and makes me crazy trying to figure it all out, lol. I can tell my clothes are fitting better and that's gonna have to be good enough because my scale hates me ;-)

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Originally Posted by WindingRoad

Awesome to hear that Indy :-) Especially since I've been a little self conscious lately. I was getting worried I was doing something all wrong. Maybe I should just not even weigh myself. It drives me nuts and makes me crazy trying to figure it all out, lol. I can tell my clothes are fitting better and that's gonna have to be good enough because my scale hates me ;-)

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It isn't a bad idea to take a break from the scales, many do. It gets so easy to focus on that number even though it doesn't give the whole story. What matters is our body composition and THAT it can't tell us. It sounds to me like you have dialed in what works for your body - it isn't easy to lose fat and gain muscle at the same time and that is what you are doing from the sounds of it :) WTG!

Yeah; I've been a little frustrated myself with the scale of late. I don't want to absolve myself of all responsbility for this because I do have a really bad sweet tooth, but my thyroid condition has not made it easy to keep a check on my weight. When the hyperactivity has been uncontrolled, I've lost a few pounds but my appetite has also increased....such that when I get the thyroid back under control with medication, my weight has crept up because I haven't simultaneously controlled my appetite. Plus, it's been challenging not to overmedicate, as I have to keep adjusting my doseage downward.

So, I have about five pounds I arguably need to lose. I'm working out six days a week on average and do a fair amount of resistance work, so that part of the equation is good, but the rest of it is frustrating. I'm trying to focus on the positive, too, though. There have been times in this process that I didn't have the energy to work out nearly never day. I wasn't sleeping well and I lost some muscle strength (Graves Disease can weaken muscle), so the fact that I'm working out consistently, sleeping through the night most nights, upping my weights and generally feeling a lot more energetic is great.

Indy sorry so late to respond on this, crazy schedule here. I can only imagine how hard it is with Grave's. I have a hard enough time with not having GD getting motivated to get out and do what I need to do. I've seen several patients with Grave's Disease in our clinic and they are not nearly as motivated as you to treat themselves properly. You are an inspiration so you know.

Thank you, WR. That's a very kind thing to say. I have to admit that as GD gies, I have it easy. My case has been mild compared to many. It's more that it messes with my head. Add in perimenopause, and "normal" becomes a moving target.

I have been watching my diet a bit more and have dropped a few pounds, so that's good. I have to really watch it though. When I get hungry, I turn into a crazy person. So, I have to make sure I have a healthy snack within easy reach.