cool, you could change your name to Indyswitzerland!
No one is implicating you...
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cool, you could change your name to Indyswitzerland!
No one is implicating you...
This is my situation. DBF doesn't "get" that I have that fear of riding downhill, that I haven't been riding for years and my bike control skills are such that I'd rather dismount and walk around an obstacle that I'm not sure I can clear on the bike.Quote:
Originally Posted by jessmarimba
I'll add to the chorus that it's a literate, supportive community where I can ask questions about nearly anything (bike-related or not) and get answers or at least commiseration.
I'm on another forum (a knitting forum!) that by its nature is mostly women. And while it is also a supportive and friendly group, I just don't have that much in common with most of its members. The conversation that isn't knitting-related largely revolves around the members' offspring. I'm not interested! I'm not a girly girl, and most of my real-life friends are men. It's a different outlook here, I guess.
Honestly after reading all the comments, I think we are just going to have to realize there is no easy answer for Mr. B or Silver. But in essence it is their issue to contend with. I don't envy either of them because that is a really awkward position to be in. I guess I'm viewing them more as people and less as male and female. I get the part about it's supposed to be a women's forum but I haven't interpreted Mr. B's comments as hostile. Possibly a bit disgruntled at times but come on they did just go through a divorce. I don't know either of them but I hope they both feel welcome to post here on TE.
So, last year I posted something addressing my name change. The debate made it evident some were offended, others didn't gauge it as offensive at all. What was consistent though was that the uninformed ones who thought it was nasty, made their attacks on me very direct and personal...akin to jobob's post above but on steroids (I recall one poster calling me directly "an idiot").
I deleted the post for a number reasons including the fact that it was blown out of proportion and the volunteer moderators should not have been called on as they were to judge the intent or to moderate such an uproar.
I did not "get TE in the divorce"...I simply continued doing what I had before...and what I intend to continue doing for the reasons I noted above...and I have moved on in my life.
Thank for the supportive PMs. For the one who made a particularly nasty PM to me this morning, I'm not sure what you intended to accomplish.
Indy: so sorry, I didn't mean to put you in the middle (I don't even know what irl is :p). No worries on my part...
Now, to all, let the issue rest.
No; it would be Switzerlandsteel. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Biciclista
Mr. Bloom referred to meeting me yesterday, and Jobob perceived that as name dropping on his part. Sorry, but I felt implicated to some degree. In the very least, I wanted to make it clear that I haven't, nor do I plan on, taking sides.
Winding Road, I was typing as you posted...and I couldn't agree more. Well said
no, that doesn't implicate you, instead it makes you a personnage! someone able to hold the lofty name of Switzerlandsteel... :D:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by indysteel
Seriously? You're telling US that???! In THIS thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Bloom
I think that in seven words you've managed to completely and thoroughly answer lph's question.
+1 with Oakleaf's latest comment/reaction.
Anyway, in terms of my some fear of heights, etc., no my dearie has been sympathetic to me and other stuff. I don't see it as a guy thing, it's just easier to discuss coping mechanisms more easily with a bunch of gals vs. with a bunch of guys. Easier to talk about such problems with a guy individually.
Mr Bloom, you were not even mentioned in this thread, until you decided to make it about you and your "controversy". Don't be surprised when you are jumped on afterwards, you are well aware of the feelings of many of the TE regulars.
Hi LPH, interesting question. In my case, I grew up around bikes and just love to read/write/talk about cycling.Quote:
Originally Posted by lph
No, it does not matter to me wheher it's a women or men or mixed forum - what matters is the content, and I see many interesting discussions here. Actually, I teand to read the bike forums more often than TE, mostly because the 'racing/training/race report/pro cycling' sections are a bit more active there, but I enjoy both BF and TE.
A few things I especially like about TE: one is that we write better than on most online environments :D Seriously, there seems to be less of that teenager-like language, made of cryptic abbreviations and terrible grammar, that is so commonly observed online... another one is that it seems to be easier to get together with TE folks, I guess there's a bit more 'online-trust' here, if such a thing exists :rolleyes:, and when we see an opportunity to meet up and ride together we go out of our way to make it happen.
Ditto.Quote:
Originally Posted by salsabike
Yup. A thread with a general question to the women here about why they choose to post on a women's cycling forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by snapdragen
I left TE for a while, partly because of physical issues that stopped me from riding but partly because of Mr. Silver. The overwhelming paternalistic tone of his posts irks me to no end. I get enough of that IRL, I don't need it when I come to a forum by and for WOMEN. Fortunately the ignore feature works well here and I don't have to be subjected to his "father knows best" tone.
I suspect men in a typical men's forum would not put up with that tone and would respond unkindly. If we were men, we'd tell him to hightail it out of our forum using some crude language. Because we're mainly women, we find better ways to deal with an unpleasant (for some) situation, thus making it a "safe" place to be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pax
I have wondered if the mods ever check on who is the most ignored poster. OMG, what if it's me? :D
Veronica
I spend a lot of time on motorcycling forums and you are 100% correct. And anytime someone presents themselves as "the voice" or expert about a given topic, 100 other men will be along shortly to question/probe/debunk/argue the points made all the while using language that is almost poetic in it's depth of profanity. Then, if there were any doubt cast on the posters expertise, they would hound the guy every single time he tries to "share his expertise" in the future.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica
I LOVE TE! :D
Indysteel, I am very sorry that my comment caused you distress. That was not at all my intention.
And after many rounds of editing, I'll leave it at that.
I am very new to this forum, and I had never heard of Bloom or Silver before this thread. I probably should butt out but it isn't my nature. :) My spouse and I used to post on a particular forum. I had posted on the forum a couple of years before he started there. I was a founder and a moderator/administrator. My spouse and I split. He graciously left the forum. In return, I never talk about him at all on that forum. (For all I know he reads it, but he no longer posts there.) Awkwardness avoided.
As I understand it, Mr. Bloom remains as a forum participant and Silver is uncomfortable, rarely posting as she feels that she lost the forum in their divorce. Given that this forum is primarily for women, Bloom should do the gracious thing and leave. Silver has better rights to the place than he does.
As far as most ignored posters, in the forum I moderated we would sometimes send messages to posters that were ignored by a large number of users and suggest that they might want to change their style. We also would take into consideration the ignore list when deciding whether to ban someone.
What an ugly thread this has become.
I don't think it is in the least ugly.
Agreed. Sometimes topics need to be discussed, even when they're not about happy or light subjects.Quote:
Originally Posted by salsabike
Jo, you didn't cause me distress, dear. Like I said, I just wanted to emphasize my neutrality--for Silver's sake as much as anybody else.Quote:
Originally Posted by jobob
Ah, I misunderstood, nevermind.
You now have me thinking of Switzerland.
Mmm, chocolate.
Mmmmm, very attractive time trialists. :cool:
When I found this forum, I wasn't looking for or thinking about a women's group. I have certainly benefited tremendously from the guidance and emotional support; how much the gender of participants has to do with that, I can't say for sure.
I do enjoy the literate and civil atmosphere, and I like getting advice from intelligent and thoughtful people.
I like Mr. Bloom, too. Issues with his ex-wife (if there are any) are none of my business. I enjoyed posts from both of them on this forum.
Almost every forum I have ever belonged to has ended up in a nasty flame war at some point. I have quit quite a few forums because of this. I join a forum to gain information, interact with other people who enjoy the same things I do, who have some common sense, pragmatism, a sense of humor, and can write legibly and intelligently. That is why I enjoy TE so much.
I don't want to have to leave this forum as well because of all of the nasty negative spewing currently going on.
Will everybody please go for a bike ride, blow off some steam and close this topic out.
Or better yet, start a new thread entitled flame war and everybody vent their wroth and ire and I will ignore it and then we can get back to riding and chatting as usual.
thank you very much
marni
I'm sorry if this thread has been distressing to some, or feels ugly. Frankly I feel that any "controversy" it's brought up should be aired from time to time. I deliberately posed an open question in the first place, because I'm more interested in hearing people's general opinion about TE, and about what we feel is important and unique about it than just a "who gets to be here", which we don't really get to decide anyway. But I figured that if it being a womens forum was important to people, it would be discussed, maybe with some insight as to why. And if it's not important to many people, that would be (is!) an interesting point too.
But I'd like to add that whether you like someone or not doesn't really matter. There are people here I don't like that much, I'm sure there are people here who don't like me much, but as long as we behave we still have a right to be here. In the same vein it's possible to voice an opinion as to whether this should be purely a womens forum regardless of what you happen to think of Mr. Bloom, or PsyclePath, or any other man who sometimes posts here. To put it this way, many of us are happily married, but don't particularly want our dhs and boyfriends posting here with us. Not for any secrecy, anyone can read it as we all know, but because women-only spaces are hard to find, like someone mentioned. Especially maybe for us women cyclists.
My own opinion? Like I said earlier, I feel that women-only groups tend to express themselves differently than mixed groups. I feel that TEs unique nature has to do with the overwhelming majority of the posters being female. And yes, if I were given the choice, I would prefer it to be exclusively female.
I read and participate in a few forums. Like some have mentioned Bikeforums is a totally different world to TE. I mainly stay in the Tandem section in which there is a good feeling of helping there.
I also belong to a Art forum which is mixed, lots of men and everyone is from all around the world. It actually has been pretty good there as people post their work for comments. The forum has a guide about commenting and the moderators are pretty good in making it work. Only once did someone post a belittling comment about someone's first piece of art and that was removed. The poster was a woman which was strange. She later apologised and it hasn't been mentioned again on that thread.
You do have to show sensitivity, especially when you have an artist posting a picture of one of the Spiritual leaders he had done for his brother, but everyone was able to find merit in the work. I was expecting someone to say something inappropiate but they didn't.
I think it also boils down to what the topic is, how the forum is setup and managed and the people participating. Obviously artists both male and female on that forum can co-exist well. Possibly as art is a level playing field between the sexes.
I am kind of new here. I posted on here for a short period a few years back under a different user name but I couldn't remember it when I started posting again this time. I just took the time to use the search function and found it, I was mom2twins back in 2005.
Anyway, I left because life got in the way and I stopped ridding for a long time. I came back because I like the feel of community here. I like thinking that I can ask a question or voice a concern and there won't be a lot of sarcastic replies.
I have another forum I am a member of that is women only. We are all motherss of twins and most of us have been together for 8-9 years. Used to have a public board that would often get trolls and nosey husbands but then we went private a few years ago and made an agreement that we wouldn't give our dh's or other men access.
However, that was a different kind of place. We didn't get a lot of new members and by that time we were mostly a set group that had been together a long long time and it had stopped being a support group for parenting twins and more of just a hang out place for friends. Even then I was in the minority and against going private. I didn't even care if men wanted to participate as long as they were civil. But i was out voted.
I could care less if men want to be on TE. As long as everyone adheres to the philosophy of the forum.
Paternalistic? I get that feeling from other posters, not just the male ones. The changing a flat thread brought that out and most of it was directed toward me! Maybe paternalistic isn't the right word, but there was a lot of "what's wrong with you?" in that thread. I decided to go out on a limb by posting my true issues and fears, and some responded with the comment that I was acting like a dependent woman, just get with it. And the one that bothered me the most was from someone I actually have met. A few of you were gracious enough to PM me and ask if I was offended by your comments, and honestly it wasn't the comments from those of you who sent a PM that made me feel badly.
I am not experienced in the ways of forums, because TE is the only one I participate in. Sometimes I read articles on various sites and look at the comments underneath. The level of vehemence and overall stupidity amazes me, so I have no desire to participate in anything else on line. A few weeks ago, I posted a link to an article about my former exchange student in Velo News. I could not believe the nasty comments people posted about him at the end of the article. So, my take is that in general, people are uncomfortable with things or people that are different from them, those who have had success, or those with more money. The level of anger against men in general, surprises me. Believe me, I've met my share of azzholes, and they come in both genders.
I would hate it my bf was here, because I think I'd have to further edit everything I wrote. This is my space. Although I never say anything that outrageous, I still speak my mind and don't want to have to watch every punctuation mark. We don't fight a lot, but we do debate whether it's hot or cold all the time, if you know what I mean. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by lph
Crankin, I've stopped reading any comments attached to a news article online. They always seem to bring out the worst in humanity, it's so depressing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crankin
Snap - better words of wisdom were never spoken....
We didn't want to tell you.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica
:p
Actually, Snap does almost all the heavy lifting in this regard, and we rely on forum members to notify us of the trolls/spammers. Usually, by the time I get the notification in my inbox, she has already taken care of it! Many thanks to Snapdragen and our other moderators!!Quote:
Originally Posted by shootingstar
I like TE because it is civil. Sometimes I have to distance myself from other forums because they are so "un-civil". It is also nice to talk to other women about female issues and get the perspective that is a female perspective vs. a male perspective. I do not believe that is in any way prejudicial to men. The beauty of life is that we are all different.
Even this thread has, on the whole, been civil. Of course, there are different opinions, but most of them have been thoughtfully presented. This is what I appreciate about this forum and am glad that it exists even though I hardly ride a bike anymore after living and breathing bikes for years.
LOL!!! :pQuote:
Originally Posted by maillotpois
How would we know she asked? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pax
Hey, stop picking on me! I'm telling... moderators, oh moderators Pax and MP are picking on me! :p
Veronica
I hadn't really thought about it before, but the only other forum on which I actively participate is also a women's forum. I don't post as frequently here, but I still have a sense of connection, and I care about the other members. The high levels of civility and literacy certainly contribute to the experience!
I can only comment to the original question as I joined this forum in October 2010.
I was directed here by a good friend who runs my favorite in the world online women's running forum. I knew when she pointed me here that it was the right place for me.
My only forum memberships are this for biking and that one for running. The running forum is a password-protected-women-only forum. However, many of us are also friends on FB and there have been meet ups. We've also done secret santa exchanges too - total fun!
In general, I have sought women's forums for information and assistance. There are just some things in running (and biking) that are best answered by women, for women. I've learned so much on both forums and my life is better for it. Beyond that, especially on the running forum (as I've been an active member for a good 3 or 4 years now), I honestly can call those women my friends, my sisters, etc.
When I started Weight Watchers in January 2011, I took a look at the forums. However, the first few threads I saw were somewhat argumentative and dismissive of people. I am sure that is not indicative of the whole of the WW threads, but I can say I've never since returned to use, let alone even look at, the WW boards.
Ooh Kerry1976 - the WW forums are a nest of vipers! I ran away as fast as I could... :D I only looked at the General section, and found it too much.
You again? Must you always be the tattle-tale? :rolleyes::D:rolleyes::DQuote:
Originally Posted by Veronica