I totally agree with you, Indy. I wear makeup and don't like chipped nails, but I also love getting dirty. No one would call me a girly-girl. And I have been getting out of my comfort zone much more lately.
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I totally agree with you, Indy. I wear makeup and don't like chipped nails, but I also love getting dirty. No one would call me a girly-girl. And I have been getting out of my comfort zone much more lately.
One of the things that held me back from returning to cycling initially was that I viewed a bike with gearing as a "technical" piece of equipment that I had to learn. I had no one to ask...until I met dearie but not in a cycling context initially at all. The gearing was a mystery to me since I had a one-speed bike as a child. Of course this is not confirming that women are less technically oriented ...it's how some women were socialized as girls.Quote:
Indy: I tend to think there's a stronger perception among women that it's unsafe or overly difficult, complicated and/or intimidating. Of course, I have no statistics to back this up; it's just what I've gathered after years of reading bike forums.
itself: On our group ride, there may be 20 men, and only 3 women. But one of those women can dust just about any guy out there and at rest stops, pulls out her lipstick to "freshen up".
Thorn: I tend to agree with sfa and that it has to do with childcare. I keep tabs of the commuters that I see on my ride and also see about 10 to 1, male to female. But one thing I've noticed is that female cyclists are either young 20-somethings or older 55+. Rarely do I see women in between.
But now with computers and some girls getting used to technology at a younger age, a bike should be less of a mystery.
Wow, a great roadie woman who freshens up her lipstick during her ride. I haven't quite met someone like that yet.
I agree Thorn, that I also see it's either younger women or women with grown children, who might appear to have greater schedule flexibility to cycle commute.
In my social group of good female friends (over 80% don't have children, they are older women, ages 50-70) that I know, most of the women I've known before I returned to cycling, choose other types of regular exercise. They are all users of public transit but also drive or choose to rent a car. Only 1 long-term friend cycles often. She has no children.
However I've known a few (not many) committed women cycle-commuting and cycling for transportation several times/week who have children....these women belong to cycling advocacy organizations.
Now that you mention it, the one woman I met on the commute with kids was quite commited to the idea, but she talked about having to coordinate with her kids and get them to help her out with the schedule change.Quote:
Originally Posted by shootingstar
ok, point taken. I guess I'm a tomboy who isn't into dressing up and wearing make up so my apologies in painting the girly girl riders with the same brush :o
I've ridden my cyclrocross in a dress as well, but I don't consider myself a girly girl.
I agree that childcare is definitely a factor in both commuting and recreational riding (or not, as the case may be). Fear is too--of the mechanical and of being hit. Figuring out gears was kind of intimidating, since the last bike I had was a single-speed kid's bike with a coaster hub. The prospect of changing a tube myself was also pretty intimidating. I had a moment of "WHAT DO I DO?!" on Thursday when I got a flat tire, and I know I know what to do, because I've changed several. I think women tend, for whatever reason, to be socialized to be/intrinsically are (like many behavioral tendencies, I believe it's a combination) more cautious.
There may also be a body image thing at play for some women. Perhaps some feel that they need to wear lycra in order to participate, and they find the thought of being seen in public in spandex mortifying, or at least uncomfortable. I also remember seeing an article in Cooking Light. There's a regular feature called "I tried it", involving either exercise or some kind of spa treatment or something. This particular article featured spinning. The author of the column said that she initially didn't want to try it because she was afraid that it would make her thighs huge. Make of that what you will.
On childcare and recreational (not-commuting) riding: I remember reading an interview with a woman who's a former racer and now a coach (or something of the sort). I cannot remember her name or where I read the interview, unfortunately--I pasted this quote into an e-mail I sent to my BF:
“The reality is—and this is my experience coaching lots of people—is that if a guy wants to go out for a three hour ride, he doesn't say, 'Will you want the kids for 3 hrs?' Whereas when a woman wants to spend that kind of time on a bike, there's a negotiation that goes on with their partner or whoever who can watch the kid. So there's always that. And then there's a limited amount of time that they have—at least as far as elite cycling goes—an limited amount of time to make or break before they decide whether they're going to move on to something else.”
That's awesome. I could not pull that off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Muirenn
The biggest male/female difference I see is in tolerance of inclement weather. Seems that fewer women are out when it's cold or rainy.
Quite a few people react with surprise when I go out in winter.
A little bit ago I read this article on this very topic. http://www.grist.org/biking/2011-06-...economy-stupid
Societal and cultural expectations play a significant role for women that is not fully applied to the men's side - and I believe this is true beyond bike commuting.
An area's bicycling infrastructure plays a role as well as geography. I have talked with a few new or interested commuters and Portland has a few obstacles - getting across the Willamette River (and not being overrun by the bike commuters who tend toward the inconsiderate side), the hills, some of the confusing road ways and required connections to get around the freeway interchanges, 2-way to 1-way convergences. I am approached on those issues by more women than men.
My work place has a casual dress code, but I see women more likely to be dressed above the "code" than men. So I do think that plays into the expectations and what it takes to successfully bike commute on a regular basis.
We do have lockers and showers, which is a big help and we have indoor, secure parking. Of that, however, the rack system requires lifting the bike. This is a challenge for some due the the height of the racks, weight of the bike (we have 2 commuters with electric assist bikes). We also have an overflow area located on the 3rd floor (2nd of 2 floors of parking). This entails taking your bike to the freight elevator (not far from the indoor bike room) or riding up the 2 ramps.
The cool thing now is one of our VPs has started some bike commuting and has offered to be an advocate for improvements. So, I am meeting with some local, successful program managers on how they have managed facilities. I think if we work to have thoughtful solutions we can address areas that for men have been no big deal.
Since our company's move to downtown Portland and because I am so excited that I have the opportunity to bike commute every day I seem to have also become our bike advocate so I am hoping to make changes and improvements that address some of the barriers.
Hanging bike hooks or something involves lifting bike high enough onto rack..I just dislike those systems intensely. I'm 5'1" and I'm not going to be continuously strong in my upper body (even if I got stronger) @ 52 yrs. and onward.Quote:
Of that, however, the rack system requires lifting the bike. This is a challenge for some due the the height of the racks, weight of the bike
Isn't just designing cycling support systems for women....but for people who want to cycle a huge part of their lifespan.
Well, I guess it just means cycling for me no matter who cycles also.
There's also the personal safety implications of commuting, and I wonder how much of that factors in for other women. My commute takes me through some rough neighborhoods. I'm fortunate to work in the same building as DH, so I always have a commute buddy. Other women aren't so lucky...
SO true! My DH isn't near as bad as other husbands I know, but it's still the mentality that I need to ask him to "babysit" his own children! Even though we both work full-time jobs, I'm still the "caretaker" and he's the "Bread-winner". He runs a family business and often works 12 hour days, sometimes 6 days a week. If I want to go for a bike ride, I either take the kids with me or schedule a babysitter. It is a lot to coordinate and you have to be dedicated. There's a lot of sacrifice and compromise involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Owlie
I have a friend and they've worked it out so that they each get two evenings a week:M & W, T & R. They take turns. On Sundays he goes for a ride in the AM and she in the PM. It's worked out well for them.
Based on what my friends share, this doesn't surprise me a bit. It makes me sad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Owlie
We finally added a child watch program at the Y where I serve on the board. For a a long time, we just didn't have space, but we were able to carve out some space as part of a bigger remodel. It's been beyond popular. This Y is not a family Y per se, so it wasn't completely clear to us if our demographic (youngish, urban, a lot of singles) would use it. They have. In droves. It makes me happy to provide a service that allows moms (and dads) to work out and have some badly needed "me" time. Plus, they're setting a good example for their kids.
Safety concerns are the #1 reason I don't commute. This is 2 fold:
1. I work downtown. Utah drivers can be disrespectful enough when you are in a car, let alone a bike without a bike lane. I don't feel comfortable with the routes available to get to my office. Winter weather would only compound this.
2. Personal safety. Granted Salt Lake isn't nearly as dangerous as many big cities, I'm still leery of some areas.
Changing clothes, hair, etc. don't bother me. My bike could hang out in my cube all day. I don't have kids at the moment, so child care isn't a factor. It's exclusively safety.
I will add that I don't particularly like having nasty hair all day. My head sweats when I ride. A lot. And my hair takes forEVER to dry, so washing it in the sink in the common bathroom at work isn't really a great idea either (my office shares a building with a lot of other tenants).
At least it fits in a ponytail now, but it still looks disheveled for the rest of the day if I bike commute.
Some days I don't care (I don't have to dress up for work) but sometimes I just get tired of looking gross in public. I don't think I could bike commute at all if I had to look human at my job.
I do see more men than women on my daily commute. When I'm doing after-work riding do I see a lot more women. I'll add that I probably fall in the "girly" range; I like make up and LOVE riding in my skirts (but I wear spandex & tank tops for my commuting). It's possible to commute and still look good; where there's a will there's a way.
I agree with the body issue thing too. One of my close friends likes to exercise and does what she can to get fit - but her body type doesn't make it easy. The reason she told me she didn't want to bike was that she was "too huge" for it, and didn't want to look like a joke. I did my best to convince her she was worried over nothing, and that all sorts of people bike. Oh the other hand, we do all know people judge us. I've seen some comments on other bike forms....
I have no comment about juggling kids, not too many people I know have them and there is no kids/cyclist overlap in my friend circle at all.
I live too far from work to commute, but, if I lived closer, I can see some potential issues because I'm the one who is always stopping and shopping on my way home.
No kids, but Pick up Dogfood on the way home please. Can you pick up milk? Can you grab some groceries? Can you ... ugh I swear I stop somewhere just about every day.
I have been trying to ride my bike to the grocery store for small shops (6 mi round trip) to the farmers market (7 mi rt), to the stable to ride my horse (14 mi rt). I'm loving it!