Help - Triple vs. Compact & loads of hills

RP...I used to live and ride where you live and ride.

I would not give up a triple if I still lived and rode there. I now have a compact double (Campy) for which I built my own custom 12-29 cassette and there are still some days here (where the climbs are different, long and mostly moderate as opposed to short and very steep, which you have a lot of) where I say, out loud, that I just want two more gear inches. No way would I want to ride my current gearing up Slug Gulch or Snows Road.

Why can't you put the triple from your current bike on to the Felt?

It's hard to say what you would be best with. I went from a triple to a compact three weeks ago when I bought my new Specialized Ruby Expert. I was wary when I ordered the compact because I didn't know how I would handle the hills. And believe me I live in the land of hills and mountains! But so far I have had no problems climbing. In fact I find that I am climbing faster and better.

My new Ruby is an 11-28 and the big rings are 50X34t

My old trek 2200 I believe has 30/42/52t
and rear 12-26

Not too much of a difference, at least I can't tell. She flies on the flats and descents. And climbs like a monkey!

I hope you find something that you like and are comfortable riding. Good luck! And please let us know what you go with. I agree with Mr. Silver and yellow, can you possibly get a triple for the felt?

triskeliongirl, you are really good at figuring out all the math on the gears! My hubby is too but he never explains things to me too clearly. I'm going to try and figure out my new bike's gears as compared to my old bike. Wish me luck! :confused:

Even though Shimano's road derailleurs are designed to handle 27 teeth, I've heard they actually can be pushed an extra tooth. SRAM makes 12-28 cassettes, which are compatible with Shimano hubs. That'll get you down to 31.9 gear inches.

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Originally Posted by yellow

I now have a compact double (Campy) for which I built my own custom 12-29

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Do you know what you used to do this? I want a 12 on my Campy 13-29, but not sure what ring to give up to get there. How do you like it?

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Originally Posted by Susan126

It's hard to say what you would be best with. I went from a triple to a compact three weeks ago when I bought my new Specialized Ruby Expert. I was wary when I ordered the compact because I didn't know how I would handle the hills. And believe me I live in the land of hills and mountains! But so far I have had no problems climbing. In fact I find that I am climbing faster and better.

My new Ruby is an 11-28 and the big rings are 50X34t

My old trek 2200 I believe has 30/42/52t
and rear 12-26

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So with this setup you are actually losing I think, your lowest gear - about 1.5 gear inches from your triple? And you are climbing better and faster? Does the Ruby weigh less than the other - do you think it's bike weight or a difference in geometry?

But back to RolliePollie and to others who have hills who have been thinking about swapping out from a triple to a compact double....
I wonder if we need to think about the type of hills that we ride.

I myself have been thinking about swapping, then I get on a hill and sometimes go in my lowest and keep saying, boy, am I glad I have my triple, and ask, why do I want to change this?

But the type of hills I have are mostly abrupt acute steep up and downs that follow each other like a camel with 7 humps or successive stairs. They are fairly short, about 1/2 to 2 miles each, anywhere between 6-12% grades. As soon as you are done with one, the next one is so close that there's maybe only a 1/4 mile between, to the next one. Some of the grade changes so I shift slightly while on the same chain ring, but if I want to maximize the downhill then I'm really shifting up 2 chainrings and then maybe another within the ring to fine tune it. Yes, I can map it out and I've gotten quite expedient at shifting minimally, but sometimes I still feel as if I'm shifting till the cows come home. There are points with terrain like this where I just don't shift after the hill anymore because I get tired of it - I coast down in the gear I already know I'm going to need for the next hill. I think I would love a double. I would lose my lowest gear if I switched.

If the hills were of a different nature, with longer distances between hills, or a greater than 6-7% really long sustained climb, then you can rest comfortably in the small ring for a time, and use the middle or outer ring for lesser grades and not be shifting so much.

What kind of hills do you have and does any of that make sense? Some people can do better on acute hills and not so good on lower grade sustained climbs. What do you do better at?

For me it's a shifting issue, like there's too many gears and I need to make big jumps. But, my problem is I can do all the gear charts I want and numerically be able to see the differences, but my brain fully can't see how the spacing between the gears on a compact double would "feel" in my riding area. I would really have to get a bike with that gearing and do a test ride. I'd hate to spend all that money to swap out and find it isn't that suitable. So, for now I stick with my triple.

Edited to add: I saw saw yellow's post where she says it's of the steep up and down nature. And that for her, 2 gear inches makes a lot of difference. I can see that, which is why I stay with the triple.

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Originally Posted by mudmucker

But the type of hills I have are mostly abrupt acute steep up and downs that follow each other like a camel with 7 humps. They are fairly short, about 1/2 to 2 miles each, anywhere between 6-12% grades. As soon as you are done with one, the next one is so close that there's maybe only a 1/4 mile between, to the next one. Some of the grade changes so I shift slightly while on the same chain ring, but if I want to maximize the downhill then I'm really shifting up 2 chainrings and then maybe another within the ring to fine tune it. Yes, I can map it out and I've gotten quite expedient at shifting minimally, but sometimes I still feel as if I'm shifting till the cows come home. There are points with terrain like this where I just don't shift after the hill anymore because I get tired of it - I coast down in the gear I already know I'm going to need for the next hill. So I have maybe 20 seconds of coasting. I think I would love a double. I would lose my lowest gear if I switched.

If the hills were of a different nature, with longer distances between hills, or a greater than 6-7% really long sustained climb, then you can rest comfortably in the small ring for a time, and use the middle or outer ring for lesser grades and not be shifting so much.

What kind of hills do you have and does any of that make sense? Some people can do better on acute hills and not so good on lower grade sustained climbs. What do you do better at?

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I ride hills like yours. Rollers. A compact works just fine for me. I have friends who prefer standard doubles and others who prefer triples on the same terrain. If having the triple is such a pain for you, then it's fine to consider whether the compact will be a welcome change. You need to weigh that annoyance with your dependency on your current granny gear.

yeah, I know I need to weigh it. I would want to swap to an 11-28. And there are other options with the compact, like swap out to a mt cassette and rear derailleur. But the hills aren't that bad. I've been trying not to use the last small cog, but only the second to the last and see how my knees fare. Right now I have a 12-27 with a 30 for the smallest. I'd lose 2.8 gear inches.

2.8 gear inches isn't a huge amount, and the weight and stiffness of the new bike may offset that. However, if you're really struggling now, then that may be enough of a difference to make your ride miserable. OTOH, if you have a better time riding without shifting constantly, then maybe that will encourage you to ride those hills more, and your fitness will improve fast. Not wasting any time getting your momentum up downhill and not shedding momentum too fast by having to shift so much couldn't hurt either on hills of that length.

I don't need to be encouraged to do the hills, that's what I have in most every direction from the house. So when I ride in my area, that's what I have. I usually see improvement by the very next bike ride.

I'm not really struggling right now. I just don't want to spend all that money if it ends up not being suitable.

I don't have a new bike. It's the same bike.

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Originally Posted by maillotpois

No, there are plenty of compacts on the Death Ride. I just don't use one. ;)

We have folks on our team who do have compacts. Our racer boys don't need anything else with them, but we have some folks who use the compact with a shimano XTR or XT mountain bike rear derailleur and big cassette. That seems to be the best option. However, you do lose your big power gear if you use that. (Which I do.) Most of our people have triples.

Good for you for setting a big goal for yourself. It is a very doable ride if you prepare, pace yourself, and keep your sense of humor throughout the day.

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how many compacts can run as 9 speeds? I thought that those were speed specific. I am intrigued!

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Originally Posted by mudmucker

I don't need to be encouraged to do the hills, that's what I have in most every direction from the house. So when I ride in my area, that's what I have. I usually see improvement by the very next bike ride.

I'm not really struggling right now. I just don't want to spend all that money if it ends up not being suitable.

I don't have a new bike. It's the same bike.

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Oh, sorry, I was confusing you with the OP.

So, of course, get a new, lighter, stiffer bike with a compact ;). But seriously, in the long run, that's probably better than upgrading your groupset if you have the $$. If you aren't struggling now, I don't think 2.8 gear inches will be all that noticeable.

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Originally Posted by yellow

RP...I used to live and ride where you live and ride.

I would not give up a triple if I still lived and rode there. I now have a compact double (Campy) for which I built my own custom 12-29 cassette and there are still some days here (where the climbs are different, long and mostly moderate as opposed to short and very steep, which you have a lot of) where I say, out loud, that I just want two more gear inches. No way would I want to ride my current gearing up Slug Gulch or Snows Road.

Why can't you put the triple from your current bike on to the Felt?

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Yellow - I haven't tried Slug Gulch or Snows Road yet...I don't think I'd make it! I'm sure you remember Miller Hill...the hill on Cable Rd/Mace Rd...well, that about does me in. I can't imagine riding that hill without my granny gear. I typically go around the long way through downtown Camino to avoid riding it!

So I found out I can probably get Felt to put a triple on the FW15 or FW25. That makes me feel better. Next week, I'm going to go test ride a couple of Felts in Sacramento. I'm hopeful that I'll love them, but we'll see. This thread has awesome info...I'm so glad I asked the question!