Is it just me, or do the forks have an unusual bend/rake in them? Any sign the bike was in a front end collision?
Usually the forks keep more-or-less the same rake as the head tube....
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Is it just me, or do the forks have an unusual bend/rake in them? Any sign the bike was in a front end collision?
Usually the forks keep more-or-less the same rake as the head tube....
It is an unusual rake. When I first saw it, I thought the same thing, but convinced myself it was made that way. Now that I've got the fork out of the frame, I can see that the steering tube is bent. Thanks for making me take another look at that. Most of the reason the fork looks bent back is because the steering tube is bowed. But the fork blades are slightly out of line also. I did take a short ride on this bike before dismantling it, and it rode straight. Usually you can tell if a fork is bent by the way it rides. Now the question is whether I should try and straighten it or leave it as is.
There is a tool specially for that - an old guy in a little Swiss valley fixed mine with it in 1982. Looks like something out of a gynecololgists's consulting room.
[thought : maybe Lise has got one LOL]
It is problematic to do tho' and generally not recommended I thought - metal fatigue and all that. The forks have to equally bent out of shape to start with as I recall (like when you ride straight into something and you endo and the bike forks get bent backwards (ie towards the frame))
Might pay to get advice
That's quite the story, Margo. And quite the imago of the gyno room and the old Swiss guy. Can you elaborate? What happened to your bike to require this service?Quote:
Originally Posted by margo49
Here's a picture showing the bends in the 3-speed fork. Almost a crimp in the steerer 1/4 way up from the bottom. And a definite push-back on the blades too. I'm aware of metal fatigue, but unsure where the fatigue point would be on this fork. It's made of such heavy-gage steel that I doubt I could bend it without an 8 foot lever arm anyway. So probably best to leave it alone or take it to a pro, as you suggest. The stem on this bike is also damaged - difference of 1.5 mm in the diameter 90 degrees apart. The headset locknut had to be tapped off the stem.
I ran dead-straight into something (can't remember what - probably because I didn't get left with any scars !) .After consultation with Other Messengers (which I was at that time in London) it was decided to leave it as the bend didn't go far enough back to affect the steering/wheel movement.
I rode all thru France for a month, took the train under The Alps to Geneva and then north to the Rhine with the BF of those callow youth-ful days. We stopped in this tiny village with a little river running thru it, on the banks of which was a little run-down shed and a handpainted sigh saying "velo". Inside this real old racer (ex-TdF) had all this old stuff. We chatted in a mixture of French, English and German and told our stories then he noticed the angle of the fork and offered to fix it. Reckoned "pas de probleme" and "ca ne fait rien"
He took out this tool with like a clamp on one end and a kind of ratchet at the other end of which was a bar a bit wider than the distance between the forks. Then he clamped it to the frame and extended the ratchet so the bar was pressing the inside (side facing the fame) of the forks (both). Then he ratcheted it slowly on out thereby pushing the forks outward (ie to their original angle) till I said "when".
This was on a Raleigh Touring 14 (1980) so it was steel.
Worked like a treat and never had any trouble. Tho' I was sweating a bit that there was some invisible fracture and imminent shear-off or something for a few hundred km's. Then I forgot about it.
I see the crimp on the top 1/3 clearly and the actual fork-y part looks suspiciously straight to me (even tho' it is not attached to the bike for perspective). Have you managed to find a picture or specs for the model so you can check the angle?
I'd make a good gynecologist, don't you think?
This is a 1954 frame, and I suspect that the fork damage could have happened decades ago. On the steerer tube, you can see where the top edge of the lower head race was rubbing the tube and has worn down a 3 cm wide patch of steel. Given the thickness of this tube, I don't think the 1 mm worn depth makes any difference. If it's really been this way for decades, and I believe it was ridden regularly through most of it's life, then it's plenty strong as is and maybe I shouldn't try to straighten it. It's really a matter of how much money I want to put into it and how much I'm really going to use it. The only way this bike might see much use is if I give it to my daughter and her BF who live in the city and commute 2 miles to school. Just to replace the parts that really need to be replaced (rims, pedals, grips, stem) is going to cost ~$120. Getting the fork repaired or replaced would at least double that. I'd be happy to hear opinions of what other people would do with a 1954 three-speed, whether you'd value it more as original as possible or update parts or replace the fork and repaint the frame or just keep it running for minimal $$. I really started this just as a fun project to learn from and keep me busy.
Finally got the bottom bracket apart. Thanks to some advise from Popoki_Nui, I torched the bb shell today. It took 3 tries with the torch, taking it hotter each time. I got it too hot to touch, but didn't bubble the paint (surprising). After each warming, I'd try wrenching the cup, soak in some liquid wrench, then try wrenching again. On the 3rd try, it still wouldn't budge even when quite hot, then let the liquid wrench soak in for 10 minutes, then it finally came. The cup was quite stiff to turn all the way out. I haven't yet worked on the fixed cup - ran out of time today.
Interestingly, there was a sleeve of metal flashing inside the bb shell blocking the holes to the other tubes. After I removed it, lots of grit came out. There were also a couple pieces of flatish white stuff about 1 cm in size.
Nice job. Given the age of the bike, you may well have a real enamelled frame. That could explain why the paint didn't bubble.
Real enamel is a glass-like substance, baked on the frame in a similar manner to today's powder coating...but MUCH more durable. Modern "enamel paint" was developed as a cheaper, but less durable substitute to real enamelling, and will almost always bubble and burn when you torch it. If your bike has a real enamel finish, it's another reason to keep it and restore it.
Good luck with the fixed cup.
Popoki_Nui, you are a wealth of information.Quote:
Originally Posted by Popoki_Nui
TY. Just trying to help....Quote:
Originally Posted by DebW
Today I finally got a chance to take the torch to the fixed cup on the 3-speed. I had 2 more items in my favor this time: bought a fixed wrench made for the 16 mm raised flats on the cup (unfortunately only 7 inches long so not a whole lot of leverage), and realized that I could use my headset press to hold the tool firmly in place. After three torch sessions and soaking in liquid wrench while hot, it finally yielded to DH's arm strength. [I don't feel bad about that because I loosen the other side after he'd failed.] So now I have a bare 3-speed frame and can give it the rust treatment, then begin reassembling. I still have the fun of the 3-speed hub waiting for me. Sturmey Archer oil is in the mail and should arrive in a couple days.
Woohoo! That's a good start to 2007.
Thank you for sharing this. I love bikes like these, and while I have no advanced mechanical skills to speak of, it's thrilling to read about your progress. (Yes, I am pretty nerdy...)
The 3-speed is going back together. The frame has been rust-treated for a month now, so I started putting parts back on. First the bottom bracket. The cups and spindle are slightly pitted, so it's not the smoothest bb in the world, but not too bad. I did have a problem screwing the adjustable cup in far enough and had to force it the last 2 revolutions. Maybe it's never been screwed that far before (was a bit loose when I got it).
I pressed the headset cups back into the headtube, then discovered that the fork didn't align properly with the cups because of how much it's bent. So I did a little cold bending of the steerer tube with a vise, pipe, and mallet. It's now straighter and aligns with the cups well enough to assemble, but binds at one point. Maybe someday I'll want to invest in a new fork for this bike, but for now I'm going to reassemble it and see how it rides. Felt like the frame gained 10 lb when I put the fork back on.
Also reattached the chaincase and did some de-rusting on that. Next task: cotterpins. Will they fit or will I be filing them down? You never know until you try.
That bike and I were born the same year (1954). I hope if I get all bent out of shape someday, I can get you to put ME back together too! :)
looking good Deb!