New bike questions! specialized vs scott

Hi -

I've done some searches, and I've found some good information here, but I thought I would post and see if I could get some more pearls of wisdom!

I'm not that new to road biking/tris (a couple of years) but my husband and I decided I've finally outgrown my $500-bought on craigslist-doesn't fit right-terrible brakes Trek. I've been test riding at LBS, and was put on a couple of unisex bikes, which were ok, but still felt weird. At that point I thought maybe I was just a pansy and road biking was uncomfortable for everyone, and I just needed to deal with it. Then I tried a Specialized Dolce Elite...OH MAN! I couldn't believe how different it felt. I was like a new person!! I didn't feel like I was stretching, my hands didn't hurt from all the weight on them, I wasn't totally stressed out like I was going to fall over at any point, it was crazy!!

I also later test rode a Scott Contessa Speedster 15, which I *think* felt similar to the Specialized, but it's hard to tell when you have to drive back and forth between two stores. If nothing else, it's close enough that I'm sure it can be adjusted. This is important b/c my husband is buying a new bike too, and he doesn't like any of the bikes at the LBS that carries Specialized, and we can get a good deal if we buy at the same store.

Anyway - I'm kind of overwhelmed by all of this. My first question is, will the more upright women's geometry affect my speed significantly, and by how much? We do olympic tris and my goal pace is about 20-21 mph. Will I have to be on the lower handlebars the whole time to get to this speed?

2. The Scott has ultegra on the rear, 105s in the front, but a triple ring. Specialized has 105s throughout with a compact ring. Specialized (Dolce Comp) is $100 more than the Scott already, without the buying 2 bike discount if I get the Scott. Is the ultegra that much better? What about compact vs. triple? I get the difference, but I don't know how that applies to me.

3. The WSD confuses me anyway. I get it, but what I'm having a hard time understanding is what specific parts I could look at between a WSD and a unisex and say "oh, that's why it fits me differently". I think I have a long-ish torso (that's what seamstresses say when fitting me)...maybe I have short arms? I'm 5'7'' with a 32" inseam. So, maybe I don't really have a long torso, I just have no hips and they think I do. I don't know, but everyone talks about how the WSD bikes are for more petite people, and that's not me. I don't get why they fit me so well. It makes me think they DON'T fit me well and I'm actually all scrunched up and just don't know it yet. So what really changes with women's geometry? top tube length? I was told the Dolce and Ruby have the same geometry, but the measurements on the Specialized website weren't the same. I rode the Ruby and while it was really nice, it wasn't quite as good fit wise as the Dolce. I don't know if that was a geometry thing (but it shouldn't be, everyone says they're the same geometry) or just the bike tweaked a little bit.

Sorry this is so long. It's just so overwhelming, and unfortunately I'm one of those neurotic people that has to over-research everything before buying. Any advice about any of this would be awesome. Thanks!

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Originally Posted by lcinva

Hi -

I've done some searches, and I've found some good information here, but I thought I would post and see if I could get some more pearls of wisdom!

I'm not that new to road biking/tris (a couple of years) but my husband and I decided I've finally outgrown my $500-bought on craigslist-doesn't fit right-terrible brakes Trek. I've been test riding at LBS, and was put on a couple of unisex bikes, which were ok, but still felt weird. At that point I thought maybe I was just a pansy and road biking was uncomfortable for everyone, and I just needed to deal with it. Then I tried a Specialized Dolce Elite...OH MAN! I couldn't believe how different it felt. I was like a new person!! I didn't feel like I was stretching, my hands didn't hurt from all the weight on them, I wasn't totally stressed out like I was going to fall over at any point, it was crazy!!

I also later test rode a Scott Contessa Speedster 15, which I *think* felt similar to the Specialized, but it's hard to tell when you have to drive back and forth between two stores. If nothing else, it's close enough that I'm sure it can be adjusted. This is important b/c my husband is buying a new bike too, and he doesn't like any of the bikes at the LBS that carries Specialized, and we can get a good deal if we buy at the same store.

Anyway - I'm kind of overwhelmed by all of this. My first question is, will the more upright women's geometry affect my speed significantly, and by how much? We do olympic tris and my goal pace is about 20-21 mph. Will I have to be on the lower handlebars the whole time to get to this speed?

2. The Scott has ultegra on the rear, 105s in the front, but a triple ring. Specialized has 105s throughout with a compact ring. Specialized (Dolce Comp) is $100 more than the Scott already, without the buying 2 bike discount if I get the Scott. Is the ultegra that much better? What about compact vs. triple? I get the difference, but I don't know how that applies to me.

3. The WSD confuses me anyway. I get it, but what I'm having a hard time understanding is what specific parts I could look at between a WSD and a unisex and say "oh, that's why it fits me differently". I think I have a long-ish torso (that's what seamstresses say when fitting me)...maybe I have short arms? I'm 5'7'' with a 32" inseam. So, maybe I don't really have a long torso, I just have no hips and they think I do. I don't know, but everyone talks about how the WSD bikes are for more petite people, and that's not me. I don't get why they fit me so well. It makes me think they DON'T fit me well and I'm actually all scrunched up and just don't know it yet. So what really changes with women's geometry? top tube length? I was told the Dolce and Ruby have the same geometry, but the measurements on the Specialized website weren't the same. I rode the Ruby and while it was really nice, it wasn't quite as good fit wise as the Dolce. I don't know if that was a geometry thing (but it shouldn't be, everyone says they're the same geometry) or just the bike tweaked a little bit.

Sorry this is so long. It's just so overwhelming, and unfortunately I'm one of those neurotic people that has to over-research everything before buying. Any advice about any of this would be awesome. Thanks!

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You've asked a lot of questions, but I'm going to boil it to how I see it.

Get the Dolce. I'm not sure how much of a discount the bike shop is offering you and I know nothing about how your finances, but for a few hundred dollars I would go with the bike to which I had the most immediate "Oh-my-goodness-I-love-this bike" reaction. You will soon forget that you didn't get the a bigger discount in favor of you both getting a bike that you love to ride. In reading between the lines, I get the feeling that you might have some buyer's remorse if you get the Scott. That said, go on another test ride on both bikes and see if you feel the same way the second time around.

I wouldn't obsess about what makes WSD and unisex bikes different. It depends, in part, on the brand. In the end, it's better to compare specific geometries than to get hung up on the WSD label. For that matter, I have two bikes with nearly identical geometries. One I love, the other I loathe. There are lot of variables in how a bike feels to you. Some of them are more tangible than others.

As for whether an upright geometry will affect your pace. The short answer is I don't know. There are lot of factors, other than just aerodynamics, that go into that. I do know that when I'm comfortable, I ride faster, so there's that. Do you intend to use aerobars with the bike? Even with a more upright geometry bike, there are things you can do, i.e., changing out the stem, to change that to some degree.

As for gearing, that's largely a matter of preference and what kind of riding you do. You might do a search for "compact crank" to read up on the differences in practical terms. I'm of the belief that with the right cassette on a compact, you can get the the gears you need to climb. Do you which gears on your current bike you use the most? Figure that out if you can and then use Sheldon Brown's gear calculator (just google that) and run the numbers on both the Scott and the Dolce's specs. With the compact, your gears will generally be spaced farther apart (again, depending on the cassette you choose) than it is on a triple, and you may notice that when you're looking for that "sweet spot." I think there are pros and cons with triples and compacts, but in my experience, few of the issues are deal breakers one way or another. Go with the frame that fits, rides and handles best.

Those are my two cents FWIW.

I know nothing about Scott bikes, but gotta tell you that I am in love with my
Specialized Ruby Comp with a triple and my new Vita Elite. That said it truly is about fit, feel and handling. My husband also has a Specialized and is really pleased with it as well. Happy bike shopping. I just realized I have owned more bicycles than I have cars....

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Originally Posted by lcinva

I didn't feel like I was stretching, my hands didn't hurt from all the weight on them, I wasn't totally stressed out like I was going to fall over at any point, it was crazy!!

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I think this is your answer re: WSD or not.

I am 5'7" and a Trek WSD road bike fits me better than a traditional Trek road bike. And I have long arms, so I didn't think it would matter, until I rode the WSD for a few miles and suddenly realized I wasn't hunching my shoulders anymore. So really I'd say forget about the labels, think of one frame as "geometry a" and the other as "geometry b" and go with the one that feels better for you.

On the triple, the small ring will help you climb in a very easy gear. If you're racing, you probably won't use it. If the gear ratios* with the middle and large ring are what you need, then you're probably okay with the triple, unless the added weight is a concern to you.

* My first road bike had a triple, and the new one has a compact double. I have problems with climbing thanks to asthma so my concern was that the easiest gear with the compact double had to be very similar to the easiest gear with my triple. Sheldon Brown's gear calculator helped me confirm that they were darn near exactly equal. You can use it to compare the gearing on the two bikes you're looking at. http://sheldonbrown.com/gears/

I have a Specialized Secteur Elite Compact, which is a mens' frame. A mens' bike fits me better, I have a long torso. My previous road bike was a Giant OCR 3W, and it just never felt right, plus it was a triple, I was always searching for the right gear, but that could have just been that bike. I have been happy with my Specialized and plan on upgrading to another Specialized.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lcinva

3. The WSD confuses me anyway. I get it, but what I'm having a hard time understanding is what specific parts I could look at between a WSD and a unisex and say "oh, that's why it fits me differently". I think I have a long-ish torso (that's what seamstresses say when fitting me)...maybe I have short arms? I'm 5'7'' with a 32" inseam. So, maybe I don't really have a long torso, I just have no hips and they think I do. I don't know, but everyone talks about how the WSD bikes are for more petite people, and that's not me. I don't get why they fit me so well. It makes me think they DON'T fit me well and I'm actually all scrunched up and just don't know it yet. So what really changes with women's geometry? top tube length? I was told the Dolce and Ruby have the same geometry, but the measurements on the Specialized website weren't the same. I rode the Ruby and while it was really nice, it wasn't quite as good fit wise as the Dolce. I don't know if that was a geometry thing (but it shouldn't be, everyone says they're the same geometry) or just the bike tweaked a little bit.

Sorry this is so long. It's just so overwhelming, and unfortunately I'm one of those neurotic people that has to over-research everything before buying. Any advice about any of this would be awesome. Thanks!

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Don't worry. I'm the same way.
Re: WSD. I'm about your height and inseam. In many brands, I do need the WSD, though I can often easily use a size smaller than what I need based on my leg length alone in a unisex frame. Go with the bike that feels right. At our height, there's not a lot of difference between the unisex frame and the WSD in most brands anyway. Maybe a top tube that's a bit shorter.

And no, the geometry of the Ruby and Dolce are not the same. They used to be, but then Specialized introduced the Amira and retooled the Ruby into a purely plush carbon bike.
I don't feel any slower on a WSD bike. I can go faster and further because I don't feel like my shoulders and neck are going to give out.

My first road bike was a Specialized Dolce Sport Triple. I liked it, and I did a brutal climb with it successfully (triple!), although it had a lower-end components (Tiagra/Sora). I then also bought a men's LeMond (I have a long torso and wide shoulders, so I don't need a WSD) which was a lighter, faster bike. I rode both and liked them both, but the LeMond was soon my favorite.

I later decided I wanted a Scott carbon bike, and ended up selling the Dolce to help pay for the Scott. I just picked up my Contessa Foil yesterday (it's an aero bike but pretty similar geometry to the other Contessas) and got it with a compact Dura-Ace. I just completed a 104 mile century today with a ton of climbing, and it was GREAT. Definitely would not have had such a good time on that ride on the Dolce.

Now, I don't know what the newer Dolces are like (mine was a 2010), and as someone else said, the bike fit is important. So I guess what I'm saying is I've had both bikes and I prefer the Scott; it's up to you which one you like more.

test ride, test ride, test ride, test ride :) Some of us need WSD, some of us do not. What is THE bike for one woman may not work for another with similar proportions...so test ride and test ride some more :D Many bikes feel good in the parking lot so see if they will allow you to take it for a longer ride.

"WSD" changes between manufacturers - for some there doesn't appear to be any real difference in the geometry, for others there are. Women traditionally have longer legs and a shorter reach than men (proportionally speaking).

As far as triples vs compact doubles...I will go with a triple every time. I like the smaller range between the gears and my knees/legs really appreciate that as well. We each have to decide ourselves on which works best for us and our preferred riding styles. I don't often use my small chain around home (central Indiana), but I certainly do in southern Indiana!

I get the "over-thinking" thing as I do that WAY too much - as those who were members when I joined as a very new cyclist who didn't have her first bike yet will remember :o Welcome to TE, and in case I didn't mention it... test ride, test ride, test ride :)