Specific Race Questions...

Countdown to race day is own, first race day that is.

I'd wanted to ask some of the more experienced racers a few related questions.

First off, I'm going to be riding unattached. Chalk it up to relocating at a bad time - meaning, I did so exactly as teams fill their spots. I was set to join a great team before my move, now in my new location, everybody's roster is full. Major bummer but there's nothing I can do about it :(

However I have done a lot of regular group rides with a variety of folks (practicing pacelines, climbing, sprints, attacks, etc), so I feel good about my pack skills. :cool:

Question: The feedback I get from people (mostly men actually) I have done group rides with is that in a typical Cat IV road race, everything/everyone gets chased down, at least initially. Is that generally true, that all attacks get chased & nobody gets to take a flyer? Obviously if the attacker is that much stronger than everyone else & then they can stay away I assume....

Question: In your typical group ride, people rotate & take turns up front. In a race while everything is still together in the main bunch, does everyone rotate & take turns up front or do you have a few riders who choose to stay up front and drive the pace of the bunch? I assume if only a handful of people stay up front & do all that work, that they do so for their own reasons such as to surge & try to break/drop the others or setup teammates. It makes sense to rotate & share the work in a breakaway but maybe not so much with the main bunch. The advice I've gotten which seems sound is to not be up front unless you have good reason to be. By the way, the local races are pretty small so we are talking a pack of maybe 15ish and as before, I'm unattached.

Lets see, what else: already have a racing license, plans to get the bike tuned at least 1 week before the race, crinkle my race number so it doesn't flap around like a kite in the wind, good warm-up on the trainer before the event.....

Finally, are there any other tips or suggestions? I've tried to read as many of the race related threads on here and there's some good stuff on there, but maybe there's additional feedback? I'm sure I've missed some things :o

I got nothing as I have never raced but I wanted to wish you luck! Let us know how it goes!

First, I have never heard of a place where all the teams are "full." Even so, you don't really need a team in a lower category race, because team coordination isn't really there a lot of the time anyway, for various reasons.

Question 1: Yes, most of the time, attacks in a cat 4 race will be chased down instantly. On rare occasions, people who know the attacker might say, oh, there's no way that'll stick. However, that doesn't matter unless the whole pack thinks the same thing. If anyone who is a threat thinks it's cool to chase, then you have to too (or the threat will get away and/or you'll get dropped).

Question 2: The main strategy of racing is to be at the front but not ON the front. This means, you want to be in front of any mayhem and crashes and big splits and surges, but you want to stay out of the wind. Yeah, some people like to drive the pace and to attack. They may do this to try to shell others, to break away, or to help teammates. The trick is being where the action is without wasting too much energy (in the back, you are wasting energy for other reasons).

While I am a fan of the race number crinkling, it's technically against the rules (and the officials can fine you). Instead, make sure the number has a sufficient number of pins in it and is pinned to be close against you when you're in the riding position. It still looks stiff enough but won't be that loud, flapping sail on your back. :p


You are reminding me that I have been slacking on cleaning my bike and putting on new tires (my first race is on Feb 13). That will have to be my snowy weekend activity.

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Originally Posted by arielmoon

I got nothing as I have never raced but I wanted to wish you luck! Let us know how it goes!

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That's kind of you, thanks for the encouragement. I wanted to spare people all the tedious details & all, but I'll post my results if anyone is curious :)

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

First, I have never heard of a place where all the teams are "full." Even so, you don't really need a team in a lower category race, because team coordination isn't really there a lot of the time anyway, for various reasons.

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Yeah it seems a bit counter intuitive, but I've gotten that response more than once. I can actually see some reasons why, for example, newer racers usually need mentoring. A team might only have so many members willing to do that, so that might be one reason why they limit members. Like you said though, team tactics at low level cat races are probably not so good. I hear many stories of teams chasing down breaks when one of their own team members is in said break :eek:

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

Question 1: Yes, most of the time, attacks in a cat 4 race will be chased down instantly. On rare occasions, people who know the attacker might say, oh, there's no way that'll stick. However, that doesn't matter unless the whole pack thinks the same thing. If anyone who is a threat thinks it's cool to chase, then you have to too (or the threat will get away and/or you'll get dropped).

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Gotcha, ok. That's confirmation there of what I'd been told and suspected. I imagine in higher category races people get a much better feel of who is a threat and who isn't, not to mention having far better tactics.

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

Question 2: The main strategy of racing is to be at the front but not ON the front. This means, you want to be in front of any mayhem and crashes and big splits and surges, but you want to stay out of the wind. Yeah, some people like to drive the pace and to attack. They may do this to try to shell others, to break away, or to help teammates. The trick is being where the action is without wasting too much energy (in the back, you are wasting energy for other reasons).

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Good point! You are definitely right about wanting to be near the front but not necessarily pulling the pack along :-)

I notice that being in the back, when the folks at the front surge, there is a sort of yo-yo or accordion effect and it is always worse at the back. I'd bet that riding in the front 1/4 of the pack is probably easier in terms of physical effort/power than being at the back.

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

While I am a fan of the race number crinkling, it's technically against the rules (and the officials can fine you). Instead, make sure the number has a sufficient number of pins in it and is pinned to be close against you when you're in the riding position. It still looks stiff enough but won't be that loud, flapping sail on your back. :p

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style points are always important ;)

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Originally Posted by aicabsolut

You are reminding me that I have been slacking on cleaning my bike and putting on new tires (my first race is on Feb 13). That will have to be my snowy weekend activity.

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Glad my question was semi-useful to ya....

Much appreciate the advice :D

While "teams" may be full (also sounds odd to me at the Cat 4 level), clubs should have room for you! If you can find a cycling club that has a presence at the races, associate yourself with them. They may also offer things like race clinics for new racers (our club does, for instance, and ANYONE can join the club and race with us).

Yes, all breaks will be chased down.

Repeat: don't be "on" the front, but being in the top 5 is a good place to be. In Cat 4 races (or higher, for that matter), once you are on the front doing the work, no one from another team is going to pull through to help you out - they want YOU to do all of the work (and yes, I unfortunately have learned this the hard way).

Enjoy and be safe. That means being predictable, and staying AWAY from the back of the pack. Will be fun to hear reports on how you are doing!

SheFly

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Originally Posted by SheFly

While "teams" may be full (also sounds odd to me at the Cat 4 level), clubs should have room for you! If you can find a cycling club that has a presence at the races, associate yourself with them. They may also offer things like race clinics for new racers (our club does, for instance, and ANYONE can join the club and race with us).

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Probably depends on your location. Up here in the PNW there are very few (like one) team that also has a purely recreational club component, at least that I know of. For the teams recruiting happens once a year in the fall and at that point the rosters close -some of it is about making sure riders are trained and safe, but a lot is also due to logistical things, like getting kits ordered. Most, well I should say all, of our teams are much smaller than yours, so having extra kits in many sizes available at any time of the year just isn't possible.

Every once in a while a rider comes along who is exceptional, one that we wouldn't want to slip away and they get invited on at in the middle of the season, but to my knowledge we've only made that exception once. At times we will recruit cross riders during the season - but that's kind of different, being much more of a solo sport, the numbers being small (generally only one or two) and it also means they will be with us for a winter training season before they represent us on the road.

I get the kit order thing, but it's not exactly mid-season right now. If a club is large, there is probably someone willing to sell you a jersey at least if you miss the order. That's really all a cat 4 needs.

On the plus side, at least most races don't charge unattached fees for the lowest categories.

I should maybe clarify, in cat 4 races, it's not always that teams won't work together (or will chase each other down, though I have seen this happen several times). A lot of the time, fitness levels and individual strengths are all over the board on a cat 4 squad. So, say you're a good sprinter. What are the odds that, as a cat 4, you will have a good leadout on your team, even if you could convince that person that you deserve to be led out? It works out. You can find some allies in the field that have a similar style to yours, and you can work together sometimes. Particularly when the fields are so small...there's a bit more sharing the load going on.

I guess its just a different culture up here. You never see a team racer with just a jersey unless they are having issues with the chamois in their team shorts. On my team, we will certainly make an exception for someone dealing with saddle sores, but we do require at minimum that all team members buy 1 jersey and 1 pair of shorts and that they wear them to race in.

Recruiting is pretty organized. All of the teams that aren't invitation only recruit in September, close their rosters in October or even earlier and get kit orders in by Nov/early Dec, so that we have them for the first races at the end of February.

We have smallish teams, but a lot of them. I can think of about 10-12 that are co-ed, ours is all women, and there are 6 or 7 more at least that are all men. They range in size from 10 or so people to probably 100 or more for the biggest co-ed teams. Our cat 4 fields these days are big - 50 rider max fields have been filling up at many races. We even have a separate women's 3's field in a lot of races these days too because we have enough racers to merit it.

Oops, forget to mention I moved & am no longer in Nor-Cal. So yeah, far less options here in the way of teams, etc. None for example have any clinics at all which is a darn shame because a bunch of the Nor-Cal teams have them regularly.

SheFly - yes ma'am :-) I promise to be close to, but not at the front. I've learned that the amount of energy you waste/spend being in the wind is astonishing! I'll post my results and it won't be too long since race day is < 30 days now.

Eden - all great points & from what I've read of some of your posts on this subject, you have been (or are still that is...) involved in organizing events so I know you speak from plenty of experience :-)

Aicabsolut - field sizes here are very small, at least compared to big metro areas & cycling hotspots. Here, there will be a distinct cat IV with their own placings, but they aren't picked separately. So everyone, IV's & P-1-2-3 & masters all get sent out together - and even then you might only have 20 total on the better days. My guess here is that it magnifies the fitness/skill variations when you have such small fields.

Thanks for all the information here. It is very exciting to finally get involved in races and compete with a great group of women. :)

Yeah, but just because a team might tell racers to wear the full kit doesn't mean you have to under USAC rules. Around here, clubs are ecstatic about getting new female racers.

Eden - shows the regional differences in racing. In fact, sounds like I am living in the TOTALLY WRONG PART OF THE COUNTRY for women's racing!

In the Northeast, we are like aicabsolut - ecstatic to get new racers, and I am always recruiting...

Glad that you get the message about ON vs. AT the front of the race :D. Of course, that's easy for you to say NOW. Let me know how that plays out :D

SheFly

If there is a pre-race meeting, do listen carefully. Some people got into trouble because they didn't show up in the staging area before going into the start area. Instead, they showed up directly on the start line (and that was a MAJOR NO NO at one race)...

At TT, some people/team got into big trouble for setting up one of those 10x10 canopy and was warming up underneath... to riding up and down the course for warm up. :rolleyes:

Enjoy your race and I'll just smile and watch all the racers suffer. :p I'm too old for this stuff anyway.

have fun...

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Originally Posted by SheFly

Eden - shows the regional differences in racing. In fact, sounds like I am living in the TOTALLY WRONG PART OF THE COUNTRY for women's racing!

In the Northeast, we are like aicabsolut - ecstatic to get new racers, and I am always recruiting...

SheFly

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I've never raced elsewhere (just up here in Washington and down in Oregon), but I have got the idea that we have a very large and very active women's field up here in the PNW (my team is all women, we have about 80 this year, most are active road racers, three quarters are cat 4s). It is an interesting experience to be in a field of 80+..... our 1,2,3 field at the Walla Walla stage race had that many last year. Thankfully this year we will have an entirely separate 3's - though it may not be too much smaller..... On the first day of registration there were already 30 or 40 women signed up.

It hasn't been that long though. Probably less than 10 years ago there weren't enough women to separate any of the fields. It used to be 1-4's all in the same races. Throw people in the deep end and they sort out quite quickly. The ones who stayed with it tended to be the strongest, and are often the women who still are winning today. Now there is almost always a separate 4's field, so it is easier to stick with it longer. It's a good thing. It means more participation. The people who are really strong can move up and those who need to develop don't end up dropped, alone and discouraged at every race. It's also meant our 3's field has had an opportunity to grow, which in turn will grow our 2's.

80 women racers in just one club? WOW :D That's really impressive! There aren't many more licensed women in the whole state of PA! But the SE PA region also compromises the MD and NJ riders, so we have a few more. But still, 30 is a good field, and I've been in races as small as 3...and they were opens. Crits are easier to get two races in, usually a 1/2/3 and a 4 or 3/4. What few road races we have for women are usually an open, but we can usually get 4's broken out. We are working on it, but it's an uphill battle! And this is an area ripe of racing!

My team does close it's roster in October. I'm not sure if other teams in this area do that. But even so, we're all tight. If an unattached girl shows up and is friendly, she'll be welcomed! It could work to your advantage, you'll have the chance to meet women that you gel with and that will be the team you join. That's the one good thing about womens racing vs. men. There's no proving ground. If you are enthusiastic, and want to race your bike, you'll be welcomed to the ranks!

A funny, hah hah moment. The 3rd ever crit I was going to do there were just two of us pre-reg. Me, and a former PRO. It was canceled, much to my chagrin. The way I saw it, she could have lapped me three times, but I'd still podium 2nd to a champion!