Triathlete switching to road bike

I've been doing tris for five years riding exclusively on a tri bike (Cervelo P3), mostly middle and long distance races. After as many years of suffering saddle sores and other issues of the nether-regions, which I ascribe to long hours in aero position, I've decided to try a road bike for the majority of my training.

I've tried several saddle changes on my tri set-up and am starting to think that doing more of my training on a road geometry bike with weight distributed more on the sit-bones could alleviate some of my issues.

Any other triathletes out there who have been through this and switched to a road bike for the majority of your training? Has it helped? Any difference between a "woman-specific" geometry vs. regular?

My husband does tri as well and has heard good things about Elite bikes (especially their custom-fitting), but I'd like to ask if anyone has particular experience with other brands - just looking for a place to start. About all I know for sure is I want all-carbon. I'm on the East Coast (PA) so any specific recommendations regarding fitters is appreciated.

I enjoy the long-distance training but have been severely limited about halfway through every season because of the saddle issues, so am really hoping that switching to a road bike and just using the tri bike for race build-up will help.

I have raced tri for 13 or so years. I race long course and Iron distance. I've done all my races on road bikes with aero bar attachments. Currently, I do 90% of my training on a road bike without aero bars and it's much better for me. So naturally, I think your idea to go to a road bike is a great one.

I would try to get a bike fit first. I do bike fitting and coach triathlon. In my experience, severe saddle issues are often related to the reach on your bike being too long. Reach is affected most severely by top tube length and stem length but is also affected by seat tube angles, seat posts and saddle fore and aft position. So before buying, try to find out what top tube length would work best for you and use this to help choose the right frame. The other factors (except seat tube angle) can all be adjusted as needed when you find the right frame.

The other big factor in triathlon that seems to contribute to a lot of saddle issues is having a saddle that is too soft and/or a cut-away saddle that has broken down over time. My current favorite saddle is the WTB Deva, it's firm and flat which allows me to get the pressure on my sit bones, where it belongs, limits movement of the pelvis that you get with softer saddles and this in turn decreases chafing.

Your pedal stroke has a lot to do with saddle sores too. If you mash and rock your pelvis side to side while riding, you'll have a lot more saddle problems. Triathletes tend (not all of them of course) to mash and have poorer form in terms of pelvic stability while riding. So core strength and postural stability are also important.

Unfortunately, I don't know anything about Elite bikes and can't give you any input on that.

Hope that helps.

In addition to reach issues, I have often wondered about saddle to handlebar height differential in contributing to saddle problems. Because you are getting tilted forward, and yes, more pressure on the front of the saddle when you ride a tri bike, do those of you who spent a lot of time in this position feel saddle pressure is exacerbated by excessive saddle to handlebar drop?
For other kinds of riding, I do find that reducing the saddle-to-bar drop does help in alleviating pressure on the crotch. Wondering what the real-life verdict is for folks who are in the aero position for most of their riding.

As far as the Elite bikes, I know nothing about them, but curious what the "custom fit" piece actually means? Who fits you? Who decides your fit, and based on what? Just curious.

Ideally on a tri bike you need that drop to maximize the aero position, but this is compensated for by effectively rotating your whole cycling posture, forwards, towards the handlebars. This is the reason why tri bikes have steeper seat tube angles. So let's say I have a rider that usually rides a road bike with a 74 degree seat tube angle and we put her on a Cervelo with a 78 deg angle, We've effectively rotated her forward by 4 deg and she should be able to tolerate a lower handle bar position but it also means that her saddle has to be tilted forward by 4 deg to compensate for that. I'm simplifying this greatly, but you get the idea.

There are definite changes in body stress with this posture, more weight on the arms and shoulders, more extreme angle at the neck, knee is usually forward of the pedal axle which is harder on the knee cap although it is a more powerful position. So a full aero posture is not one that can be adopted overnight and does take some strengthening to get used to it. And some people will simply never be comfortable in this type of position. But it does not mean that a person has to have saddle pain, that's different.

The other thing about tri bike is that you are supposed to be pedaling hard enough that it takes some of the weight off the saddle. Most of us mortals can't do that for very long so I think that is a poor answer to how to address saddle pain on a tri bike.

On a road bike, lessening the saddle to bar drop does help with some of these problems.

Wahine have you left your seat tube angle in the slacker position?

I've been thinking about changing out my seat tube to get a steeper angle, so I'm curious to hear more about your set up.

Veronica

V - I still run a road bike with road geometry and tri bars because I can't have both right now but I'm looking into switching some things around on my road bike to make it closer to a tri geometry by getting a special seat post that will effectively make a virtual seat tube angle of 78 deg. Then I would buy another road bike. Or I could get a dedicated tri bike and leave my Kestrel in road bike mode. The Kestrel would make a good tri bike with some adjustments. And it looks fast. And it's an easy color to spot in transition. :D

What's the current seat tube angle on your Kestrel?

That's actually a really good question and believe it or not, I can't find the answer online. The only information I could find, and it wasn't from Kestrel was that the seat tube angle was 73.5, but that seems a little slack to me. I may have to measure it sometime.

I find it really interesting that I don't actually know the answer to this.:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:;):D:D:D:D:D

That's interesting! Let us know if you find out for sure. The seat tube angle on my Bianchi is 74, which was one of the reasons I bought that bike. But am now thinking of getting something a little lighter and faster as I contemplate Olympic length races next season, so I have been pondering all this just lately.

What's ALSO interesting is that you are the second coach/PT in less than 24 hours to say---not sure that a tri bike is better than a road bike for races. Especially around here, where some of the courses are pretty hilly.

Thanks for the info. So are you saying if you could have two - you would? :D

But you would still do most of your training on your road bike.

Veronica

V. - that's exactly what I'm saying.

Salsa - Having an aero tri bike is definitely not right for everyone. First of all, having an aero bike does nothing for you if you can't maintain the aero posture and are sitting up a lot of the time. Second - aero bikes are more twitchy and don't handle as well as a road bike. Third - unless you're riding at 16 mph or more, the aero advantage is minimal, the exception to this is when it's windy. Fourth - even if you can ride aero, if makes your back sore it may be a detriment to your run.

I had a client who was super intent on riding his tri bike in competition. He has a history of back issues and in every race his run would be much slower than I would have expected given his performance in training. He also told me that the aero posture would often cause some numbness in his leg. At his last race I convinced him to ride a regular road bike, his bike times were just as fast. His run pace went down a full minute per mile over his last 3 races.

Interesting info, thanks Wahine!

I'm finally to the point where I am thinking about my bike and do I want to make any changes there. I could get a tri specific bike if I wanted. I just need to decide that it's worth it for me. :D

Veronica

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Originally Posted by Wahine

V. - that's exactly what I'm saying.

Salsa - Having an aero tri bike is definitely not right for everyone. First of all, having an aero bike does nothing for you if you can't maintain the aero posture and are sitting up a lot of the time. Second - aero bikes are more twitchy and don't handle as well as a road bike. Third - unless you're riding at 16 mph or more, the aero advantage is minimal, the exception to this is when it's windy. Fourth - even if you can ride aero, if makes your back sore it may be a detriment to your run.

I had a client who was super intent on riding his tri bike in competition. He has a history of back issues and in every race his run would be much slower than I would have expected given his performance in training. He also told me that the aero posture would often cause some numbness in his leg. At his last race I convinced him to ride a regular road bike, his bike times were just as fast. His run pace went down a full minute per mile over his last 3 races.

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Ah - Wahine! I just love it when people talk good sense!:D

I did my first tris back in the early 80s and have drifted in and out of the sport over the years since then. It is hard to avoid noticing that triathlon has become a very image-conscious sport and that there is much marketing aimed at "buying speed" through triathlon-specific gear.

While much of this hyped up gear is probably great stuff and would probably buy you extra seconds if you are at the elite level (which I am most certainly not) my belief is that most everyday triathletes would benefit more from spending their time (and hence the money they would need to earn to pay for some of these yummy toys) on better quality or more targetted training. All things do not work for all people - buying the super-flash tri bike is not always the answer.

That being said - I am a firm believer that N+1 is "the answer." N+1 is the right number of bikes to own where N is the number of bikes you already own!:D I just don't think it guarantees a faster tri!:D

Thanks all - good info. I've been fitted three times on my tri bike. After the initial fit, I went to a LBS fitter recommended by my coach. At that point, I was having not so much saddle pain but more neck pain. I don't have all the technical details as to measurements available to me here, but to give an idea the fitter put a longer stem on my bike and basically raised me up to a less-aero position.

That worked for another year and then I started to have increased saddle issues. The second fitting was with another tri coach and we decided to put me back down into a more aero position, shorter stem and slight saddle to aerobar drop. I figured I was just going to have issues either way so might as well go with the more aero position and experiment with saddles. Which brings me to my current situation.

I also think my GI tract just doesn't enjoy being in aero position either. Half-iron races I am on the bike for about 2:45 and start having a lot of gas build-up, to put it bluntly and experience a lot of upper abdominal discomfort on the run and IM distance I start sitting up and changing position to help alleviate this (and the saddle discomfort), so am losing the aero benefits anyway.

So I guess I will just start trying road bikes - maybe get some measurement info and share it here - sounds like some good technical knowledge out there.

now I wish I could find a gynecologist who is into cycling. My gyn sees my issues and just says "you should consider biking less; take some time off". Really helpful.

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Originally Posted by salsabike

What's ALSO interesting is that you are the second coach/PT in less than 24 hours to say---not sure that a tri bike is better than a road bike for races. Especially around here, where some of the courses are pretty hilly.

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The first coach who told me that was also talking about her own experiences. She is quite fast and very comfortable in the aero position. She has done four IMs--Canada three times, CDA once. She said her fastest bike time was on her old road bike (taking into account different conditions on different race days as best she could), and that she--a fast hill climber on a road bike--noticed that she loses significant climbing time on her tri bike. So even if all the things you mention are working for the athlete, a tri bike may not necessarily give an advantage.