muscle gain

After about a year of bad nutritian and virtually no conscious exercise I have been eating better and working out for about 4 weeks (cycling, a walk/jog program and a group fitness class that has very high reps of light weights - bodypump for those familiar with Les Mills program.)

The scales have not budged at all.

I am feeling heaps better, I think my clothes are a bit loser and I am feeling better about how I look so at this stage I'm not complaining (although I do need to drop a bit to get into the healthy bmi range) ...but my question is - how much muscle can/would a woman realistically gain though a moderate exercise program (ie not one that includes heavy weights with a specific aim of bulidng muscle size).

I don't have a car so walk and cycle everywhere - so I wasn't completely sedentary even when I wasn't working out as such.

How much?
I don't know...

But I have decided to weigh myself only once a year now...

I didn't lose any weight after my first full year of cycling - but I dropped two dress sizes.

Depending on the time of year I bike between 300-670km on the road a month and I eat fairly sensibly. I also do some time on a mountain bike and a spin bike...

To date I have completed 13275km on the road since October 2004. I have "lost" only 16kg. I want to lose at least 10 more, preferably 15 at most.

But I have def built muscle in my legs and upper arms... and by mass of course, muscle is denser/heavier.

So I haven't really answered your question, but I guess what I am trying to say is - don't stress about it anymore than just being curious.

You are fitter, feel better and your clothes are looser - you are doing just fine

I was having the same problem, only over a course of months. Starting last fall, I began exercising regularly (4-5 days a week). People started asking if I'd lost weight. No, my scale says I haven't. Go shopping and SURPRISE! I've dropped a size. :D Continue working out until last week when I got an ear infection. Essentially took the week off, the first time in months. Magically, I lost 3 pounds. I think in my zeal to not "fall off the wagon" regarding exercise, I forgot that occassionally my body needs rest. At any rate, I knew that it didn't really matter what my scale said, I felt great. Don't get discouraged!

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Originally Posted by kiwi girl

After about a year of bad nutritian and virtually no conscious exercise I have been eating better and working out for about 4 weeks (cycling, a walk/jog program and a group fitness class that has very high reps of light weights - bodypump for those familiar with Les Mills program.)

The scales have not budged at all.

I am feeling heaps better, I think my clothes are a bit loser and I am feeling better about how I look so at this stage I'm not complaining (although I do need to drop a bit to get into the healthy bmi range) ...but my question is - how much muscle can/would a woman realistically gain though a moderate exercise program (ie not one that includes heavy weights with a specific aim of bulidng muscle size).

I don't have a car so walk and cycle everywhere - so I wasn't completely sedentary even when I wasn't working out as such.

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Weight does not equal fat.

BMI does not tell you what your body fat percentage is.

Muscle weighs more than fat.

If your clothes are fitting differently, you are most likely gaining muscle and losing fat. If you feel heaps better, that's endorsement enough. That's really what it's all about.

How much muscle can a woman realistically gain without shooting for big guns? That really depends on the woman. You won't look like Ahhnold. But it sounds to me as if, in only a month, your body composition has changed enough to be noticeable. That's awesome.

Some indicators that always make me feel good --

Flexing my thighs (or whatever muscle) and watching them significantly change shape when I do it.
Walking up the stairs and noticing that I'm doing it differently, less shuffling, more of an active movement (hard to understand, but I notice it).
Yes, clothes, the same clothes fitting, but looking much better
Arms slimming

You may have some of the same, or different, indicators, but I bet there are a few things that you can notice slowly shifting.

Visible muscle striations are only possible with extremely low body fat -- low enough to be uncommon for women. It's not really about strength but leanness. So we typically have stealth muscle.

I agree with Monique and am having the same issues as you. I gave up on the scale recently because the number wouldn't go down but my dress size did. I'm comfortably wearing my old clothes that had gotten a bit tight for me so I know I'm making progress. Don't get hung up on the numbers so much. I figure I'm gaining muscle and that's why the scale hasn't budged.

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Originally Posted by bounceswoosh

Muscle weighs more than fat.

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Okay, someone please explain this to me............

I thought that a pound was a pound - A pound of bricks weighs the same as a pound of feathers weighs the same as a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat....................

Are we talking mass?

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Originally Posted by Flybye

Okay, someone please explain this to me............

I thought that a pound was a pound - A pound of bricks weighs the same as a pound of feathers weighs the same as a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat....................

Are we talking mass?

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Yes.

A cubic inch of muscle is heavier than a cubic inch of fat.

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Originally Posted by Flybye

Okay, someone please explain this to me............

I thought that a pound was a pound - A pound of bricks weighs the same as a pound of feathers weighs the same as a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat....................

Are we talking mass?

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This is one of my biggest pet-peeves!

Muscle is more dense than fat...and the same weight of muscle takes up less volume than fat...so yes, you can be getting smaller and still weigh the same because a muscular size 8 woman weighs more than a fatty size 8 woman (all other things being equal, of course).

But yes, a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat.

Edited to answer the OP question:
I read somewhere that the average woman can gain about 1/4 lb of muscle in a month. It's very hard to put on actual muscle mass. That said, someone who is new to strength training is going to see faster gains than someone who is experienced. And your muscles can definitely get stronger faster than that 1/4 lb might indicate. If you are feeling better and looking better, isn't that what matters the most? :D

I understand that a pound is a pound is a pound, but -- serious question -- is the phrasing "muscle is heavier than fat" misleading or inaccurate? It seems accurate to me -- muscle is more dense; it takes up more space per unit of weight, which is why when you are not losing weight but you are noticing your pants getting looser, it's probably muscle gain and fat loss combined. But if I'm phrasing it in a way that sounds ignorant, I'd like to know!

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Originally Posted by bounceswoosh

I understand that a pound is a pound is a pound, but -- serious question -- is the phrasing "muscle is heavier than fat" misleading or inaccurate? It seems accurate to me -- muscle is more dense; it takes up more space per unit of weight, which is why when you are not losing weight but you are noticing your pants getting looser, it's probably muscle gain and fat loss combined. But if I'm phrasing it in a way that sounds ignorant, I'd like to know!

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Muscle weighs more per unit of volume than fat, which means, that for say someone who is extremely athletic and weighs like 130, with 14% body fat, 18.2 pounds of her weight will be fat, someone of the same weight, but with 30% body fat, she'll have 39 pounds of body fat, and will wear larger clothes than her more athletic counterpart.

"muscle is heavier than fat" is inaccurate, it's more that "muscle is denser than fat" that is the case - so for the same volume, it will weigh much more than fat.

does that make sense? :)

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Originally Posted by pinkychique

"muscle is heavier than fat" is inaccurate, it's more that "muscle is denser than fat" that is the case - so for the same volume, it will weigh much more than fat.

does that make sense? :)

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Yes! Absolutely. I will make an effort to use that phrasing in the future. Much more accurate, just as succinct.

BMI can be a tricky way to evaluate yourself too. I'm 5'5" and a few years ago I went and had a body fat test done alone at the Davis Sports Medicine Facility. My BF was just under 21% then, but I weighed 152 pounds - just on the edge of being okay with BMI.

V.

I saw it somewhere that a cubic centimeter (cc) of fat weighs 0.9 grams but a cc of lean muscle weighs 1.1 grams. (That's about a 20% difference) So, you can maintain the same weight while decreasing your volume!