Front brake, emergency stops

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10-26-2006, 12:30 PM
BeeLady

Front brake, emergency stops

OK - I've spent an hour doing searches for 'front brakes' and 'emergency stops' and did find one thread with some info and a TDF video on emergency stops (the video was actually of sprinters crossing the line.)

Anyway, when I'm going fast (for me that would be 25+ mph) on a downhill or fast (12 - 15+ mph) on a flat and/or curved road, what would be the correct stopping manuever? Is it true that using the front brake is safer when used at speed than at slow speed? Should I always shift my weight to the back wheel when using the front brake?

Any threads/links and/or advice will be much appreciated and I will practice over the weekend. Thanks in advance while I go cook dinner and be back shortly to read any replies.

Thanks.
10-26-2006, 12:57 PM
velogirl
Hi Lauren. Sounds like you've already got the basic concept.

I recommend practicing emergency stops every single time you ride. I try to do five of them each ride. This helps the skill become inate so you don't have to think about it when you need it.

The faster you go, and the quicker you need to stop, the further back you need to move your body weight.

Your front brake is your power brake -- it provides the stopping action. Your rear brake stabilizes the bike. If you use too much front brake you could endo. If you use too much rear brake you could skid out/fishtail.
- Apply both brakes evenly at the same time. Keep your arms as relaxed as possible.
- Look ahead, not down at the bike.
- Keep your feet parallel (9:00 and 3:00 position). You don't want your weight on the pedals because this will engage the bottom bracket and can cause you to turn.
- Move your body weight back. For very fast stops, this might mean behind the saddle. By moving your weight back, you counter the "over the bars" action of the front brake. BTW, one of the biggest mistakes I see is folks moving their body weight up (floating over the saddle) instead of back (behind the saddle). I recommend having a friend watch you until you are sure you're doing it correctly, because it's tough to feel the difference.
- Once the bike has come to a stop, step down with the foot you don't unclip, unclip the other foot at the top of the pedal stroke, and step down.
- Remember that the bike has brakes -- your body doesn't. Your body will continue to move forward through space so this will feel kinda akward.
Here's a little drill I use to help people learn how to move behind the saddle. Ride around a big open space (vacant parking lot) with enough speed that you can coast. Move your body forward and sit on the top tube. Move your body to either side. Then move your body behind the saddle and place your chest on the saddle (hands in the drops -- takes good hamstring flexibility). It's amazing how far you can move behind the saddle without ever losing stability.
10-26-2006, 01:09 PM
BeeLady

WOW - thanks so much! I am going to print your reply and take it with me!:cool:
10-26-2006, 06:35 PM
pooks

Thanks for that drill, velo.

Lauren, could you post the link you found?
10-26-2006, 09:57 PM
Kalidurga

The breaking thread that I remember included this link from Sheldon Brown,
Breaking and Turning your Bicycle, in which Sheldon specifically discusses "panic stops". Very helpful stuff.
10-27-2006, 05:15 AM
BeeLady

Here's the thread I had found earlier:

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showt...eferrerid=3855

In this thread was this from SadieKate:

Watch the very end of this video. The sprinters are "throwing" their bikes across the line. Watch their body position. The emergency stop looks just like this but you come to a full stop and may or may not clip out. I know it seems contradictory but the manuever is much the same as an emergency stop. These guys are only accelerating until that split second when they throw their bikes. Because they are not braking their bikes get pushed in front of their bodies which are also continuing to travel forward. Because you are bringing the bike to a sudden halt, you must also stop the forward momentum of your body by making sure it stays behind the saddle.

http://www.eurosport.com/cycling/tou...vid27951.shtml

Hope these links work.
10-27-2006, 06:32 AM
pooks

That video never worked for me -- maybe because I'm on a Mac?
10-27-2006, 07:39 AM
DebW
Quote:
Originally Posted by velogirl

Your front brake is your power brake -- it provides the stopping action. Your rear brake stabilizes the bike. If you use too much front brake you could endo. If you use too much rear brake you could skid out/fishtail.

Apply both brakes evenly at the same time. Keep your arms as relaxed as possible.
Arms relaxed? In a hard braking manuever, most of your body weight is on your arms (so that your body slows when the bike does) and therefore your arms can't be relaxed, but are working rather hard. OK, you did say "as relaxed as possible".
Quote:
Originally Posted by velogirl

Keep your feet parallel (9:00 and 3:00 position). You don't want your weight on the pedals because this will engage the bottom bracket and can cause you to turn.
No weight on pedals? You couldn't move your weight back without putting some weight on the pedals. Certainly if you are behind the saddle, there is weight on the pedals. I agree with 9:00 and 3:00, but I think weight distribution in a hard stop is hands (momentum throws you there) and pedals (to maintain proper body position low and back) and usually a little bit on the saddle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by velogirl

Move your body weight back. For very fast stops, this might mean behind the saddle. By moving your weight back, you counter the "over the bars" action of the front brake.
I think it's important to be in the drops here so that as your momentum is thrown forward onto your hands, you have something solid in front of your hands to brace against. Maybe STI levers are better than the older brake-only levers in this regard, but hoods don't give you much to brace your forward momentum against. I'm always in the drops if I think I might have to brake. Though a true "panic stop" might require braking from the hoods on occassion. And the "weight back" follows naturally from keeping your weight low and your arms almost straight to brace yourself against your own momentum.
10-27-2006, 01:06 PM
Mimosa

I've had two emergency brakes this year.

One because a car failed to see me while I had the right of way (and I was going at a reasonable speed since I was coming of a bridge). The only thing you can think of is 'Brakes ... now!'. And then you stop instantly but the momentum will cary your body forward thus making you fly (half) over the steering wheel. However your feet are still attached so you do a very stupid looking thumble with the whole bike. But I did break in time to miss the front of the car with minimal damage to me.

And the second time because (unexpectantly) a car did an emergency stop right in front of my nose. And I had to pull the brakes real hard to prevent me from going through the rearwindow. This time however I was able to catch the forward/side movement by managing to remove my left foot (somehow :confused: )

If you really really need an high emergence brake then just that your chances because the alternative could be worse. And I am still amazed how fast these current road brikes can stop, almost instantly ...
10-27-2006, 01:31 PM
velogirl

Quote:

Originally Posted by DebW

I think it's important to be in the drops here so that as your momentum is thrown forward onto your hands, you have something solid in front of your hands to brace against. Maybe STI levers are better than the older brake-only levers in this regard, but hoods don't give you much to brace your forward momentum against. I'm always in the drops if I think I might have to brake. Though a true "panic stop" might require braking from the hoods on occassion. And the "weight back" follows naturally from keeping your weight low and your arms almost straight to brace yourself against your own momentum.

That's how we teach the skill -- in the drops. But the reality is that if you have to stop quickly, you need to be able to do it wherever your hands are. If a car pulls in front of me and I've got my hands on the hoods, I'm not going to move them to the drops first to do an emergency stop.
10-27-2006, 01:34 PM
velogirl

Quote:

Originally Posted by DebW

No weight on pedals? You couldn't move your weight back without putting some weight on the pedals. Certainly if you are behind the saddle, there is weight on the pedals. I agree with 9:00 and 3:00, but I think weight distribution in a hard stop is hands (momentum throws you there) and pedals (to maintain proper body position low and back) and usually a little bit on the saddle.

Yeah, I guess that's confusing too. See what happens when I try to write things quickly. You want your weight evenly distributed between both feet. One mistake we see folks do a lot is one leg down (6:00) and weighted so the bike begins turning. You don't want that to happen in an emergency.

Regarding arms, you don't want to lock them out. Keeping the elbow joint slightly bent will help with handling. Locking it out will cause you to bobble.

You say tomato, I say tomato (that's not very effective when written).

:)