I learned something new about riding yesterday

[wabisabi]

Our cycling group braved the weather and rode yesterday (first 30 miles pretty good, last 20 in the Rain--not sprinkles, rain, the kind that drips into your shoes...). Anyway, a very nice young man who is also a pro rider and down from Alaska to train rode with us, ahem, older folks.(he rode back pacing the women's group, which shows that he is also a very intelligent young man...)

My friend pointed out his legs and how much he was spinning. Now, I think that I spin fairly consistently (somehow my knees got to be 56--how did that happen? :rolleyes: I experimented with riding behind him at the same pace and spinning at the same cadence, and it felt really weird, kind of hard, actually. I asked him about it later on a hill, and he said that yeah, it is actually kind of hard to master. As a junior rider, they had to ride for miles and miles in a 39x19 or so gear so that the legs didn't hurt, but felt like jello at the end of the ride. He also said that at the end of a race he often would be riding at a couple of gears higher than he should be just due to being tired. I found that with more spinning, I did not feel as anaerobic on the hills as I normally do when I am pushing, and even played with using my triple a little more. I'm definitely going to work more with this--it was great to learn more about spinning in a real life situation.

[Grog]

I agree that you have to SPIN, 90 rpm or a bit more if you can get comfy doing it. It's weird at first, but it's necessary.

However, I find that advice very hard to follow on club rides, where my average cadence rarely goes over 75-80 rpm (whereas it would be closer to 88 on a solo ride). I find that I am not comfortable riding at a high cadence in a pack, especially if there is someone I don't know/trust in front of me. Others feel the same??

[RoadRaven]

I agree that spinning is supposed to be the "right" thing to do... however my partner, who rides in the top grade in the local club, and who came 5th in NZ in his class in the National champs last year, finds that spinning hurts his knees - and has, after many attempts, resigned himself to limiting spinning.

When I did some fitness tests recently - all hooked up to machines etc - they found that when I spin, my heart goes up, when I drop my cadence, and grind more, my heart rate drops. So I am more efficient at a slower cadence...

[Robbin_G]

I feel like a flopping fish above 80, but I'm trying to do the "right" thing. :D

[wabisabi]

Looking at these variations, we can appreciate why some are sprinters, some climbers, etc., and how some of the ability is the luck of the (genetic) draw.

[LittleBlackDuck]

Hi Everyone :) .

I'm new to this site and new to cycling as a sport so aren't yet familiar with all the lingo.

So "spinning". From this thread I gather it's when you do high cadences so that the effort of your legs feels less? Am I right? How hard is it supposed to feel when you spin?

Thanks for any replies :) .

LBT

[Nokomis]

One of the guys that frequently rides with us tried to convince me to increase my cadence. It's tough. I find my natural rythm is slower - think Jan Ulrich (slow) vs. Lance (omg fast). As long as my knees aren't out & floppy, I'm doing okay :D

I am working on increasing cadence, but haven't been able to get to where I can do that and not get tense like I should be sprinting... mentally it feels that I'm putting more calories into moving my legs than moving the bike, and that feels like wasted energy :confused:

[Grog]

Ullrich may have "slow" cadence, but that's compared to Armstrong. Armstrong will often pedal at a cadence of 110 rpm, and climbs at a cadence of close to 90. Ullrich will spin at about 90 on a fast day, and has been seen climbing at 60 rpm. But on flats I doubt you will see him at less than 75-80 rpm, which is still much faster than most people who find it funny to spin.

I know it is counter intuitive, but it's important that you learn to spin. Plus, you'll develop your heart much more, and become capable of going further and longer.

Enjoy the ride!

[triflor]

Some people are mashers, they push out at lower cadences on higher gears. They tend to have bigger legs (Grog pointed out Ullrich's cadence... look at his size too!)
Some are spinners, they have high cadence and use lower gearing.
It definately is partly genetic, the way you are built will dictate how much you can change this. But being able to do both at times is very beneficial.
It goes to the standard statement though, "Train your weakness, race your strength."

[traveller_62]

Hi Everyone :) .

I'm new to this site and new to cycling as a sport so aren't yet familiar with all the lingo.

So "spinning". From this thread I gather it's when you do high cadences so that the effort of your legs feels less? Am I right? How hard is it supposed to feel when you spin?

Thanks for any replies :) .

LBT

Welcome, LBD!

The term, spinning, is often used refer to a relatively high pedaling cadence (> 90 rpm). (It is also the name of a type of indoor cycling exercise where you are on a stationary bike and go through an interval training routine set to music)

How hard it feels depends on how fast you are trying to go, what your gearing is, and the steepness of the terrain. On an stationary bike or trainer it is a common training technique to keep a relatively high cadence as you increase the resistance (it would be like trying to keep a high cadence as you climb a steep hill). This technique is excellent at increasing muscular power in your legs. In situations like this...it can feel very very hard!

It is also a common technique on a stationary bike to take most of the resistance off the wheel and spin at a very high cadence (>120 rpm). This is not something you would typically do on the road but as an exercises it helps to promote supple leg muscles.

As you will see from reading the other posts the most efficient cadence for an individual riding on the road can vary quite a bit depending on the individual and the type of riding they do. In general a cadence in the range of 80-90 rpm is considered the most efficient...but it really depends on a combination of the terrain, fitness level of the cyclist, and the gearing on the bike. I typically try to ride with a cadence of 90 but on a long steep climb that will drop to 60....or lower!

What kind of cycling do you do?

[Grog]

Some people are mashers, they push out at lower cadences on higher gears. They tend to have bigger legs (Grog pointed out Ullrich's cadence... look at his size too!)


Yeah, but what I pointed out that "mashing" here is relative. Ullrich's usual cadence is about 80 rpm. Of course, compared to Armstrong's 110, that's "mashing", but compared to the average person on a bike, that's fairly fast.

[yellow]

I agree that spinning is supposed to be the "right" thing to do... however my partner, who rides in the top grade in the local club, and who came 5th in NZ in his class in the National champs last year, finds that spinning hurts his knees - and has, after many attempts, resigned himself to limiting spinning.
It's a fine line for some of us. I now feel "comfortable" spinning at 90-100, BUT like your friend, if I do that for a very long ride without variation, my patellar tendons hurt, and badly at that. I liken it to an "overuse" injury, not unlike tennis elbow or ITBFS. If I ride a route with varied terrain (that is, it includes some hills that require me to slow my cadence down to 80-85 or so), then my patellar tendons are fine.

I think the point is to find a cadence that helps reduce fatigue (i.e., is more efficient) and doesn't result in pain. For some of us a high cadence causes pain and thus may not always be a good thing!