Hip pain?

[Catrin]

Anyone have hip pain only on one side, and then only when you've been sleeping on that side and you roll over in the night? No pain at all any other time, and I do have tight hips which I am working on. While I do have arthritis in that hip, am wondering if it might be an SI joint problem or bursitis. As a woman, my hips have to do something odd to properly execute a KB single arm jerk, am hoping this is all it is.

I've a very high deductible plan so am avoiding the Dr right now since I know they will likely want an expensive scan...just curious if anyone has experienced this.

[ny biker]

Is it a dull ache or a sharp pain?

[Catrin]

I wouldn't call it sharp or shooting but a very strong ache that ends as soon as I've finished rolling over. Thankfully not every night as it comes and goes. No problem getting out of bed or when I get up in the morning

[Owlie]

How long has it been going on? Has it started or gotten worse since you've been gearing up for competition? Do you feel like it's the muscles or the joint?

[Catrin]

It's been going on for months, long before I started gearing up for competition. It doesn't happen as often as it once did, but the intensity is the same when it happens. It might even be a few weeks between events, it might happen every night for a week, but it doesn't stick around. It doesn't feel muscular, it is very centered on the outside of my hip - it is a point location (if that makes sense). Doesn't mean it isn't referred from somewhere else. It is the strangest thing, it only hurts in the action of rolling over when I've been lying on that side - so much that I make noise. Of course, it is the side I prefer to sleep on - so of course I roll over on that side after I fall asleep.

I've looked this up online, and can't find anything that really sounds similar. Bursitis sounds the most similar, but there are other symptoms of that which I don't have. Given the intermittent nature of it I am not really concerned that it is something serious, and if it IS bursitis then I am unsure what could actually be done for it. I already take a strong systemic anti-inflammatory for arthritis. Just curious if anyone else has experienced this and found a solution.

[OakLeaf]

When I'm trying to self diagnose I start with an anatomy chart. I take it you've localized the pain to deep in the joint capsule? I only have a tiny bit of experience with (self-diagnosed) bursitis and that was a constant dull ache in my shoulder. Best thing I could do for it was unweighted range of motion, and plenty of it. I guess that's the first thing I'd try - might help even if it's something muscle or tendon related - just waggle and swing your leg around in the hip socket several times a day, whenever you get the privacy to do it, and probably best to do both legs to avoid imbalances.

I think our spammer may have a bit of a point though, if that's the only time it happens. Changing sleep position is hard but sometimes necessary. Can you sleep on your back or change up the side you sleep on? Arrange yourself with pillows to align your pelvis and lumbar spine when you're on the affected side (and also to make it harder to roll)?

What does your coach suggest?


I wouldn't discount the possibility that it's related to your shoulder and neck, which you said are improving. It's pretty certain that you've been compensating for those in the hips, since all that fascia is connected, so it might just take some time for everything to equalize. Range of motion will help that too, as well as just being conscious of your hip and lumbar alignment all the time.

[Catrin]

I really appreciate the help in thinking this through, it is very helpful!

Oakleaf, those are good points. I have been looking at those charts, and it seems to be clearly located inside my hip joint socket. My coach seems to think that it is possible that something is moving slightly when I go to roll over in the night that shouldn't be. We KNOW that my hips are tight (especially on the opposite side), and while my neck/shoulders are improving I do still have some restriction related to that which impacts my hips and spine on the opposite side of my body from the hip pain. Now I DO get some very light arthritis related pain in my OTHER hip if I sit around too much, but that is very different (and much milder).

I've TRIED to retrain myself to not sleep on that side, but to no avail so far. Oh I can go to sleep on the other side...but I roll over in my sleep. I just can't go to sleep on my back, but I've not yet given up on that. I need to try a smaller pillow between my legs, my current pillow is large enough that my cranky knee complains when I try to use it that way. Perhaps a body pillow might be a good investment for this purpose.

Thankfully I've noticed no correlation between this happening and the days when we have our most intense competition training sessions. If this were related, then it would certainly be happening during the night after having done 200 jerks or long cycles (clean and jerk) just a few hours before because of the weird hip action women are required to do in order to complete the movement. Men have it easier since they don't have b*obs in the way and can bring the kettlebells straight down to land on their chest and then drive the bells straight back up without worrying about harming tissue. Of course, if I wasn't an F cup then that would help, but that is a different matter :o

[snapdragen]

I've had something similar, I find stretching and using a foam roller on the IT band helps.

[Irulan]

I had some very serious hip pain for many years that seemed un fixable through two rounds of PT. Very deep, sleep interference.... I finally found a massage therapist who does the deepest work I've ever had, and six month worth of regular sessions really helped. Tim did a lot of work on the interior connections relating to the psoas and pelvic attachments . Regular deep massage kept it a bay and provided the most relief. When I got rid of the clips on my mtb and went to flats,that solved it for once and for all. Regarding the massage, I actually had to sign a waiver that I understood that it was not a fluffy massage but deep work that might be painful.

[Catrin]

Thanks Irulan and Snap, it really helps to read of other experiences. Still trying to relearn my sleeping position, thankfully no flares the last couple nights so I've been sleeping well.

[ridebikeme]

I might agree with Snap on this, if I'm understanding you correctly. I do lots of stretching as well, and certainly some days are better than others. I'll include a website that I'm been visiting, some agree with him.. some do not. At any rate, it generates thought and that's always a good thing. (mobilitywod.com) I've used a tennis ball/lacrosse ball for many years, and definitely helps.

[Catrin]

I've used every rolling technique I can find and so far nothing seems to make a difference. Then again, the intermittent nature of the problem makes that a hard call to make.

Last night at my KB training group our coach hit our glutes HARD. I've also been focusing on hip ROM at various times of the day. Last night I had a repeat of the problem but the severity was greatly reduced! That has never happened, the severety has always been the same. Unsure if a coincidence or not, but will continue and see what happens.

[Irulan]

I have found a softball is the best shape for getting into the whole glute/head of the femur structure. It's much better than any roller I've tried. Plus I spend time every night on a hip opener stretching routine. Have you considered backing off on some of your activity until you get this figured out a bit?

[Catrin]

Using a softball is interesting, my lacrosse ball doesn't quite fit. We are actually taking a couple weeks break from competition training. I've noted in the past that backing off, or stopping activities entirely, seems to increase the number of times this happens. So I am monitoring things and experimenting. Last night was encouraging!

[Sky King]

Suggestions for website that shows good hip openers? My left IT band, knee, leg... issue is related to my hip/glutes. I have about 5 different stretches, exercises I do but am alway open to different ones.
Catrin, I feel for you, mine actually presents in my knee, not my hip but will wake me up sometimes when I attempt to roll over.


I have found a softball is the best shape for getting into the whole glute/head of the femur structure. It's much better than any roller I've tried. Plus I spend time every night on a hip opener stretching routine. Have you considered backing off on some of your activity until you get this figured out a bit?

[Catrin]

I actually have problems with that knee as well and have long thought it connected. Of course both places have a bit of arthritis. MWOD.com does have useful information and links to videos. Also search YouTube for mobilitywod, mwod, or Kelly Starrett. A lot of his recent videos require paid access to his site, but there are still quite a few free older videos.

[OakLeaf]

Yeah, that's one of the areas that my 6" foam ball is really good for. Trouble with a softball is it has seams ... ow. That foam ball is the best self-care tool I own because it's so versatile and portable. Big enough to hit nearly any area that I'd normally use a roller on, small enough to fit in a suitcase, just the right size for intermediate-sized muscle attachment areas like the anterior shoulder and the hamstrings.

[ridebikeme]

Softball is definitely another option! If that doesn't work, try taping 2 lacrosse balls together. One of the things that I have been doing that has really helped( in addition to the lacrosse ball) is reverse lunges, which strengthens the glutes... something that the repetitive motion of cycling hasn't helped. And the other movement is something that I call an X-out, basically you takes a resistance band put it under your feet, cross the band so it is hitting the opposite hand and pull up to your waist and hold... take lateral steps holding the resistance band and obviously make sure to go in both directions.

I hope with everything that you are doing and with all of the suggestions, that things start to give you some relief.

[Catrin]

While I am thankful for this, it is also irritating that it isn't more consistent. If it were then I would take a different approach. Thanks everyone@

[Catrin]

Apparently discussing it here in this thread has driven the problem away, not a peep out of it since I brought it up :-) My coach (40+ years of experience, also a LMT) wonders if I might have something hidden going on and he is starting to do some things that is designed to helps us determine if I really do have a problem with my lumbar spine or hip that should be looked at further. He is very conservative and strongly believes that the most important facet of his job is "to do no harm", so I trust his guidance. I am very thankful to be working with someone with his level of experience who specializes with working with the "aging athlete" population. Even with his experience he doesn't assume that he knows everything and is always working to expand his knowledge.

For sure my job doesn't help things as I spend most of my time seated in the office, and THEN, after being tied to two computers all day, I go see him and expect my body to actually do some work and be all flexible and stuff. He has given me some things to do with my hips during the day to help with that. It is quite possible that this is the heart of the problem, at least that is my hope! I am also doing more work in the evening with my toys to help loosen the tight hip flexors.

[Crankin]

I'm pretty much in the same place as you, Catrin. The session with the LMT helped, but for a day or two afterward, my *left* side started spasming. While it has bothered me occasionally, it's the right side I have the issue with. Now my left shoulder is giving me fits, but this has been an issue since I started cycling, and even before.
But, using the lacrosse ball on my spine, hips, and shoulder is keeping it at bay. I am living in fear that I have a real disc issue, but, I also sit all day, and all of this really started when I changed careers. I do get up and walk around every 45 minutes or so, but basically, she told me that my scoliosis has caused my body to compensate, in a not good way! She was the first person that acknowledged the curvature as the reason, which I have always thought.
I will be taking my 2 lacrosse balls in the ski sock with me to Portugal, and hopefully, I won't suffer too much. I'd be interested in hearing how you progress.

[Irulan]

There is a standing movement I do for hip flexibility that I have found beneficial. I will see if I can find a video of it. Think of going under a hurdle laterally with a sideways step, flexing down at the hips like a squat. If I can't find a good vid, I will make one of all my hip stretches.

[Catrin]

This sounds similar to one our coach has us do as part of our warmup, it is for the SI joint, but there isn't a step involved. I would be interested in seeing it if you find a vid of it, I think I need to start doing something in my office at least every 30 minutes to help counteract all of the sitting, it isn't helping me.


There is a standing movement I do for hip flexibility that I have found beneficial. I will see if I can find a video of it. Think of going under a hurdle laterally with a sideways step, flexing down at the hips like a squat. If I can't find a good vid, I will make one of all my hip stretches.

[OakLeaf]

Whatever it was, glad it's gone and hope it doesn't come back!


I wish I knew why I can't squat without falling over backwards ... I'm pretty skeptical of local PTs after my last experience, but maybe worth another try ... I know I have ROM issues in my feet, ankles AND low back, all of which are implicated, but how to address it I have no clue.

[Catrin]

Oh, it will be back, it's always been an "on again off again" kind of thing. Hoping I can figure out what it is so that I can have some hope of a positive change when it returns.

I also have problems squatting with a vertical torso - I CAN squat deeply, but I am bent over. We know that my ankle ROM, and probably hip flexor issues, impact this. My coach is having me work with wall squats, and also a couple of kettlebell drills, as a way to effect a change. When I've time later I will find a video or explain what that is - there are several quite different things called "wall squats".


Whatever it was, glad it's gone and hope it doesn't come back!


I wish I knew why I can't squat without falling over backwards ... I'm pretty skeptical of local PTs after my last experience, but maybe worth another try ... I know I have ROM issues in my feet, ankles AND low back, all of which are implicated, but how to address it I have no clue.

[ridebikeme]

Well, I hope that you current trend stays! Like a couple of you, my fitness job has me sitting part of the day as well... can you say OUCH? Like many of you, I'm working on flexibility quite often while I'm there and that seems to help. Have to admit the X-outs and reverse lunges are helping me, obviously my glutes were part of the issue along with tight hip flexors. Have a good and pain free week everyone!

[Catrin]

It doesn't help that I've a cranky knee, reverse lunges are dodgy these days because of that. I've that kneecap problem that comes with arthritic changes to the cartlidge underneath the knee. I AM ignoring this one, but it means I can't run more than a few minutes without knee-cap pain anymore so that door is closed for now :o Thankfully kettlebell lifting is as much a cardiovascular endurance activity as it is endurance and strength so I just keep on keeping on while avoiding those things that cause my knee to hurt - and am very careful to focus on lifting properly and allowing my body to get the rest it needs. I don't need a KB-related over-use injury if I've anything to say about it. Eventually I will allow them to look at that knee more closely, but I don't think there is much that can be done about it. I don't THINK it is a ligament or tendon problem. I CAN still row, though sometimes that also gets my knee fired up. I had an ill-advised unofficial 5-K trail run in June - it was fun but it keeps on giving.

Pretty amazing what I CAN do, given my less than perfect bits and pieces, and I am very thankful for that :-) I may never compete at a high level, but I am doing it more for the fun of it and the social interaction than anything else. May all of our cranky bits and pieces work well this week and pain stay away for all of us! I wish that I had an option to try a standing desk at work, but they won't spring for that and I am not about to - unsure that would work with my job anyway. Have a good week all!

[OakLeaf]

Just a thought since you mentioned a standing desk, have you ever tried a kneeling chair? Loved mine, honestly I should probably dig it back out of storage.

[Catrin]

No, I think I've looked into it but it was a budget breaker at the time. Hadn't reconsidered it, but it is worth researching it again, I can always save up for it if it looks like a good idea. I do have to swing back and forth between computers, I wonder if can you easily do that with those?

[OakLeaf]

As long as I had a good hard chair pad so the casters won't catch in the carpet, it wasn't a problem for me to turn 60-ish degrees from facing my computer to facing my client. But with a cranky low back/hip, it might be more problematic. At very least you'd need to be conscientious about alternating which foot you use to push off. It is worth spending a bit of extra money just so you don't get a rickety one that you're constantly having to tighten the bolts, and it's been a while since I looked at them, so no idea what they might cost these days.

[Sky King]

Soaking up knowledge :) I know for me, with squats and anytype of side to side lunge I have to remember to focus on using my glutes, and hinging from the hip first. I tend to want to overload my quad and that causes my knee to cave in. My mantra is "stick your butt out first" and it seems to help. I can't step to the side at all when I am in any sort of squat, admire those who can.

[Catrin]

Sadly it's returned, but at a much lower intensity. So much lower that I can tell there is also groin pain at the same time. The Mayo Clinic website says that pain on the outside of the hip is usually muscular in nature while problems with the actual hip tends to present with inner thigh/groin pain. Interesting information. My coach is going to test a few things tonight to see if we can narrow things down a bit. It is encouraging that the pain intensity is several degrees lower, so I must be doing something right! Still hoping hip and knee issues are connected. Meanwhile I am saving in case I wind up having to get some kind of imagery done...

[ridebikeme]

My athletic training professor in college always stressed that we look "above" and "below" the injury, quite often the problem is another area of the body. And if it isn't, it's certainly connected. Of course, that was a thousand years ago, but still a very valid point.

[Irulan]

Maybe I'm missing the obvious, but have you tried laying off your workout for a few weeks? There are other things too- DH had a few problems like this. Hr had an inflamed bursa which two cortisone shots took care of.

[Catrin]

It is the days I work out that I don't hurt at night...so I am not going to take a break. The longer between sessions, the more my sleep is interrupted by my hip.

My coach thinks it related to my being seated all day so am experimenting with making changes there to open my hips up during the day using some things he showed me last night. I know a really good chiropractor who I will see if things continue.

[OakLeaf]

Way back when, Knott suggested a McKenzie maneuver for helping realign the pelvis, where you do standing lumbar extensions x 10 every two hours. As I remember it (which I probably don't :rolleyes: ) you stand with feet sitbone width apart and weight on all four corners of the feet, heels of the hands right below the PSIS, knees straight but unlocked, then do gentle lumbar backbends, taking two to three seconds to extend and the same to return upright, and making sure you keep your pelvis over your feet and backbend, rather than thrusting your hips forward.

Now I probably remember that completely wrong, but just as something to get you out of seated position periodically, you might try that.


Another thing that's cured all manner of hip issues with me is ardha chandrasana (half moon pose). Might try that at home a couple times a day, either by itself or alternating with pavritta ardha chandrasana ("rotating airplane").

[Irulan]

Oh! Sitting all day.... #1 cause of low back and hip issues.

[Irulan]

Here is what I do for hip opening band stretches. I've been told to hold stretches anywhere from 30 seconds to 5 minutes.
1. Hamstring stretch with band. I play with the angle and rotation
17397
2. IT band stretch with band. Play with angles
17400
3. opener band stretch
17399
4. Hip flexor stretch ( lots of variotions out there)
17401
5. modified pigeon pose
http://www.yogajournal.com/images/article/BASICS_211_MOD1.jpg

I then follow up with a seated twist,
this:
http://www.stretchify.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/back-stretch-for-parkinson.jpg

and some foam roller/softball work.

[Catrin]

Irulan, thanks!

My right hip has calmed...but now my LEFT one is strongly complaining. Can't figure out if it is my SI joint or referred from my lumbar spine, but I think it more likely to be my hip. I am going to make an appointment tomorrow with my Chiro, it is time to consult with someone. Again there is more relief after a hard workout, and much more discomfort when I am resting, but it is time to figure this out. Because exercise, even intense exercise, provides relief I am not concerned that it is an actual injury. Could be something needs released, or an imbalance causing the problem. In a way it is good that I can't afford an expensive scan like an MRI or CT scan, it's been my experience in the past that every time we've done that that all it did was to side-track our attention to things noted in the scans that turned out to be totally unrelated.

[Irulan]

I seriously doubt it is an injury. My experience is that it's just life and use, and then having to be very persistent to figure out how to best deal with it. Two rounds of PT did nothing; but changing my bike pedals was almost immediate relief. The right massage person was huge. Maintaining my regime is huge.

[Catrin]

Agreed, if it were an injury then using it would hurt. Just gotta figure out the correct movement pattern so that whatever is cranky will calm down.

[Catrin]

My chiro figured it out in about 3.2 seconds this morning :-) Apparently my lateral core stability is bad enough that lots of weird trigger points have developed, and my upper body has been doing all of the work in my high-volume competition training. While I DO have a bit of hip arthritis, he doesn't think it has anything to do with this. Apparently this can cause the intermittent & inconsistent cross-body symptoms that I've been experiencing. So he gave me some rather odd, and difficult, breathing exercises, and I will be meeting with him for a couple of sessions for some ART. He said things will calm as we release those trigger points and as I work on my lateral core stability. I had no idea!!!

He remembers how bad my left shoulder used to be, and while it will never be perfect, he is amazed at how functional it now is and how far I've come. All due to my current coach :-)

[OakLeaf]

Yay for progress! Good luck with the rest of the treatment.

Care to share the breathing exercises? My diaphragm and intracostals are implicated in a lot of my issues, and I've actually wondered if it's more my sternum than my clavicles that is displaced.

[Catrin]

Ryan told me that the nature of my problem does impact my clavicles, as well as many other little bits and pieces.

Hopefully I can describe this well:

Lay on your back in the "deadbug" position, legs bent at 90 degrees. Press both of your hands into your sides, just beneath your ribs. Breath...but NOT with your chest, only in/with your stomach. It sounds simple but, for me at least, it is difficult. At first I am only to do this for 5-6 repetitions.

Does that make sense?

[tulip]

Pilates really helps with my hip issues. In fact, I haven't had any hip issues since it made Pilates an almost-everyday thing. I recommend you find a classical Pilates teacher who understands modifications. Pilates improves strength, flexibility and posture and is very balancing. You might want to consider dropping your heavy workouts in favor of going to a classical Pilates studio. No need for one-on-one instruction, although that's nice . Mat classes are very effective. Just stay away from pseudo-Pilates, Pilates-inspired or, heaven forbid, "yogates." Most "Pilates" classes taught in gyms are useless at best and harmful at worst.

[Catrin]

Well, something good is happening :cool: Pretty much as soon as I started the breathing exercises my chiropractor and the lateral core exercises my coach gave me, my hip symptoms have almost disappeared. Time will tell if this has "solved" it, but there seems a connection.

In other fronts, we've settled on my first competition date in February! I HAD been planning on early December (in New Jersey), but that is a bit too soon. I've come a long way, but I won't be quite ready for December. I ALSO want my first competition to be in driving distance, not a very expensive trip to the east coast! My two training partners will be coming with me, so all three of us will debut at the kettlebell competition platform party at the same time :D They are both much younger than I, so they help me stay humble on my progress. I've come a long way, but it does take a bit longer at 55 than 25.

[emy99]

Suggestions for website that shows good hip openers? My left IT band, knee, leg... issue is related to my hip/glutes. I have about 5 different stretches, exercises I do but am alway open to different ones.
Catrin, I feel for you, mine actually presents in my knee, not my hip but will wake me up sometimes when I attempt to roll over.
you can find stretching and using a foam roller on the IT band helps

[Sky King]

yep, I foam roll every day and lots of "fun" stretching My injuries of youth are just catching up to me:)

you can find stretching and using a foam roller on the IT band helps

[Catrin]

For me I've found working on hip mobility has worked much better on my IT Band and hammies than rolling ever did, but that's just been my experience recently.