Branding and Logos

[Wahine]

Hi Ladies.

I am expanding my little business and adding a DBA (doing business as) called Gorge Bike Fitter. I'm still in ground work phase and looking at how I am going to present my new little company branch in terms of my web presence. And there's nothing like market feedback from such an awesome group of ladies that actually use the types of services I will be providing. I already provide these services through the Physical Therapy Clinic where I work my regular job and through my coaching company but I'm trying to expand what I'm doing and work as a Bike Fitting consultant for other organizations.

As far as branding goes, a main part of what I want to convey is my expertise as a PT, multi-discipline bike racer and triathlete. I want the impression that I give online to be professional but also very approachable and to emphasize my unique background specializing in biomechanics. I'm really trying to target recreational cyclists, not just elites.

I have a couple of variations on a basic logo design, (neither of which are in digital form yet otherwise I'd share them with you). One is very basic, the feel of it is professional with much of that conveyed through the font used and the spatial organization of the type. The second one is a little freer with the font and has some whimsy to it, but not juvenile. The second definitely feels lighter with some fun and I have to admit that's the one I'm drwan to because I feel like it reflects my personality better.

So here's the question. Which bike fitter would you feel drawn to? More formal/professional vs approachable/more organic and a little arty.

Keep in mind that there will be a lot of other things about the website etc that will convey my message. I'm not relying on my logo to do it all.

Thanks in advance for your input.

[Crankin]

I think it would be more inthe words you use. For instance, if you somehow stated you are working with recreational cyclists, not just elite racers, whether they be amateur or pro, that would attract me.

[Wahine]

Thanks Crankin. The content of the website and associated blog will be very clear. What I'm not so certain on is first impression/visual impact type stuff.

[shootingstar]

Probably the 2nd one with a tiny bit of fun/whimsy and approachable in terms of visual impression....especially if you want to broaden your market base.

I assume the core message/skill is still your physical therapy expertise and experience..it needs to be since it is a skill, unlike coaching just can't be picked up without rigorous schooling plus exams and legislated certification (at least I'm aware in Canada, physiotherapists undergo lots of rigorous academic studies. But I maybe influenced having worked in a teaching/research hospital).

Wahine: I've never used a bike fitter before. Maybe it's because I spend less per bike purchase than others...under $1,000.

[rebeccaC]

When I think of the Gorge area I only think of windsurfing…..so I don’t have any idea of your market. Personally I’d want a logo to match what I want my clients to perceive of my work and me.

As to your question I'd want my bike fitter or physical therapist to be professional in action and knowledgeable.

edit...I think I’d like a different take on da Vinci’s Vitruvian Man for a bike fitters logo….most likely it’s been done though.

[Wahine]

Probably the 2nd one with a tiny bit of fun/whimsy and approachable in terms of visual impression....especially if you want to broaden your market base.

I assume the core message/skill is still your physical therapy expertise and experience..it needs to be since it is a skill, unlike coaching just can't be picked up without rigorous schooling plus exams and legislated certification (at least I'm aware in Canada, physiotherapists undergo lots of rigorous academic studies. But I maybe influenced having worked in a teaching/research hospital).



shootingstar, I was actually trained in Canada, at the University of Alberta and worked in Edmonton as a PT for 11 years before moving down here. PTs down here go through similar training, but honestly, it's not as rigorous as it is in Canada. Now before anyone jumps on me for that statement, my degree had to be compared to the equivalent US degree credit hour for credit hour before they would give me my OR license. I had more that twice the number of credits in PT related coursework than was required and that didn't include the work I did after I graduated. So you've meade me think that perhaps my Canadian training is something that could be a selling point.

rebeccaC, The Gorge is know for wind sports for sure but it's also become a very popular cycling destination for both road and mtn biking. Not only that, most of the wind junkies that come to visit bring bikes with them so they can get some other exercise on the no wind days. And, Portland is only an hour away. Portland is a huge cycling city and I'm really hoping that my unique background may help me draw some business from there.

[Wahine]

:eek:


edit...I think I’d like a different take on da Vinci’s Vitruvian Man for a bike fitters logo….most likely it’s been done though.

I actually played with this a lot. I tried to do it in a way to reflect different types of cycling postures to reinforce the idea that a bike fit can be a good thing for anyone regardless of what kind of riding they are doing. I just could not make it work. Everything I came up with was too complicated or cluttered. One simpler design I tried with an upright rider and time trial position rider kind of superimposed on each other came out looking very rated R. :eek::eek::eek:

That's when I gave up on that idea.

[shootingstar]

Hey cool, Wahine you are an ex-Albertan. (ex-Canadian). You would have to specify total number of academic credits in Canada (and U.S.??) for people to understand or more importantly the breadth of your physiotherapy experience in terms of different types of client problems. (Alberta has been a hard fit for me..coming from British Columbia.)

It almost sounds as if you could use a professional to design that logo..

I am thinking more of a smiling cyclist...totally interwoven with the bike geometry itself....the person and bike as 1 beautiful whole. :)

[Wahine]

Hey cool, Wahine you are an ex-Albertan. (ex-Canadian). You would have to specify total number of academic credits in Canada (and U.S.??) for people to understand or more importantly the breadth of your physiotherapy experience in terms of different types of client problems. (Alberta has been a hard fit for me..coming from British Columbia.)

I like to think of myself as a transplanted Canadian. I let my Canadian roots show every chance that I get.:D
I wouldn't specifically list credit hour details or anything like that. I'd just highlight my Canadian background a bit more. While I want to come across as experienced, I think that keeping the ego factor low is important for encouraging the approachability idea.



It almost sounds as if you could use a professional to design that logo..

I actually have an art background as well and I'm quite happy with the logo ideas I have come up with. It's choosing between my 2 favorites that is the struggle. Also, I need to keep costs down so I can save up for my Sizer Cycle (http://calfeedesign.com/product/sizer-cycle/). :D

[OakLeaf]

The second one sounds more appealing to me. Surely you know someone with a multifunction scanner? :p

[lph]

Personal is attractive, but professional is key. I'd have to see the logos, I find it hard to say what I find professional and not.

[Irulan]

Probably the 2nd one with a tiny bit of fun/whimsy and approachable in terms of visual impression....especially if you want to broaden your market base.

I assume the core message/skill is still your physical therapy expertise and experience..it needs to be since it is a skill, unlike coaching just can't be picked up without rigorous schooling plus exams and legislated certification (at least I'm aware in Canada, physiotherapists undergo lots of rigorous academic studies. But I maybe influenced having worked in a teaching/research hospital).

Maybe it's different where you are, SS, but I certainly don't have the idea that coaching isn't a skill. Not just anyone can coach, just like not everyone can teach. I'm happy to discern between volunteer and paid, or certified or non-certified, or licensed. Professional coaching isn't to be discounted so lightly.

As for logos, when I was redoing mine, I showed proofs to some favored clients and professional partners. It was nice to get feedback on what they thought worked the best for image and effectiveness. It wasn't unanimous, but made it a lot easier to select the final.

[TrekDianna]

I would have to see them also, but I think not so serious. If it was too serious I would think it would not be a fun experience, it would be more like going to to a doctor's appt. And, no offense or anything, but my physical therapy appts have generally meant pain, not fun.

[Trek420]

Personal is attractive, but professional is key. I'd have to see the logos, I find it hard to say what I find professional and not.

I would have to see the art but understand that you can't release it and have to explain it. First impression is key.

It makes no difference if you're explaining "My logo conveys blah blah blah while this corporate id proposal reflects such and such etc". I often found if I had to explain a corporate identity it's a bit like explaining a joke, "well the reason this is so funny is ...". So we need to find your market and meet them where they are.

You can have a friendly approachable tone in a competitive cyclist market with materials, art, texture, words, placement, graphics or vice versa.

So are we gearing towards recreational/new cyclists who are learning the benefit and value of professional fit or are we preaching to the choir and competing with other local bike fit companies or offering a service they had to go far away for? Always remember your audience.

It's a logo. You can't please everyone but you can do a lot with a good one.

Sounds like you've narrowed it down to 2. If you haven't already done so I'd take them down to black and white. A lot of things we think of as "fuzzy, friendly and warm" like color, texture of paper or sign materials just won't be there. You can't control what people do with your logo on an ad, the back of a race jersey etc. So strip it bare bones to black and white, enlarge it, put it across the room and quick impression. What do you think? Play with it.

The most successful logos are either; square, triangular, or circular. Also once you pick it do the xerox test. Copy it, copy it again, fax that, copy it, fax it again .... and see if it holds up. That's your logo because that's what people will do to it. ;)

Have fun and good luck! Trek - California College of Art, graphic design major, class of '83 :rolleyes:

Check out this feedback http://www.seattlebikeblog.com/2014/01/03/what-do-you-think-of-cascades-new-logo/#comments

[Trek420]

I would have to see them also, but I think not so serious. If it was too serious I would think it would not be a fun experience, it would be more like going to to a doctor's appt. And, no offense or anything, but my physical therapy appts have generally meant pain, not fun.

You know what the difference is between a physical therapist and a terrorist? You can negotiate with the terrorist :rolleyes: ;)

[TrekDianna]

You know what the difference is between a physical therapist and a terrorist? You can negotiate with the terrorist :rolleyes: ;)

"like"

[Sky King]

without the visual is a bit tough. Sounds like you want something that doesn't brand you as bike fitter to the pros :) so number 2 may be the way to go. Can't wait to see them

don't forget to look into trademark and/or copyright

[Wahine]

Thanks for all the feedback ladies, there's lots of good information here. Trek420 - thank you for such a detailed, informative response. It's very kind of you to so freely share your expertise.



It makes no difference if you're explaining "My logo conveys blah blah blah while this corporate id proposal reflects such and such etc". I often found if I had to explain a corporate identity it's a bit like explaining a joke, "well the reason this is so funny is ...". So we need to find your market and meet them where they are.

Exactly.



So are we gearing towards recreational/new cyclists who are learning the benefit and value of professional fit or are we preaching to the choir and competing with other local bike fit companies or offering a service they had to go far away for? Always remember your audience.

Well here's my thoughts on this. The more elite riders/racers will get their bike fit if they want it (I know several elites that wouldn't let anyone change anything about their riding position) and they'll either go to someone at the club shop if they have a fitter or they'll ask around. I have a very good reputation in town, so I'll get plenty of those types of riders if they're looking.

What I see that I would like to change is the average cyclist and especially recreational female cyclists that won't go for a fitting because they think that's something that just serious riders do or they are intimidated by the egos and attitudes at some of the ohter shops. This is the group I want to draw in, not just because it's a relatively untapped market here, but also because I feel like to could help these people a lot and the work would be very gratifying.



Sounds like you've narrowed it down to 2. If you haven't already done so I'd take them down to black and white. A lot of things we think of as "fuzzy, friendly and warm" like color, texture of paper or sign materials just won't be there. You can't control what people do with your logo on an ad, the back of a race jersey etc. So strip it bare bones to black and white, enlarge it, put it across the room and quick impression. What do you think? Play with it.

The most successful logos are either; square, triangular, or circular. Also once you pick it do the xerox test. Copy it, copy it again, fax that, copy it, fax it again .... and see if it holds up. That's your logo because that's what people will do to it. ;)

Check. I'm actually my design choice is weighted heavily on this concept.

Thanks again.

[maillotpois]

Interesting thread. I'd love to actually see the design to weigh in. I would go with the more creative/whimsical one, but that's based on what I chose to do with my business.

I'm in a very "professional" profession (law), but went fairly lighthearted in terms of both my logo and my website, which reflects the logo. Most people who do my job (private judge and mediator) have terribly boring websites with a horrible picture of themselves. And the written content is generally just their CV/resume. I worked with a (cyclist) friend and he came up with a fun visual website that is VERY different from others in my field. I don't get a lot of business "from" the website - no one in my field does. (It's all word of mouth and referrals). But I like to think I'm providing something that shows a sense of creativity when people are evaluating whether to use me. Creativity is critical in what I do.

Here's mine:
http://www.BurkeADR.com

Would love to see yours when you have something on paper.

[Wahine]

Thanks for the feedback Sarah. I like the simplicity of your logo and I really like the way your page is set up. Very cool.

I will post images of the logos when I get a better draft of them done. Right now, they are so rough that the first impression would not be right. I wanted the feedback mostly so I could decide how much time and effort to put in to what direction. Based on what I'm hearing, I'm going to develop both logos to near completion (and maybe even a third). Once I've done that I'll start another thread with a poll maybe.

[rebeccaC]

this is kinda what I was thinking about….maybe not such a blatant take on the da Vinci image :)


http://www.smugmug.com/photos/i-9c9PwSB/0/M/i-9c9PwSB-M.jpg

[Irulan]

Nice concept but for me it doesn't speak to the cycling piece.

[smittykitty]

Sounds like the perfect reason to come visit the Gorge. There is a large market out there looking for just what you offer (especially female). Good Luck and can't wait to see you're final logo.

[Wahine]

This G will be a prominent part of both logos. It's how I carry out the rest of the text that will result in two different "feels".16889

This is certainly not the final draft of the G

The third logo will be different all together.

[Dogmama]

I love the G.

My $.02 about serious vs lighter logos...

I would lean towards the serious logo and here's why. As a female cyclist, I find that I don't get taken seriously. So, a lighter, fluffy logo would not appeal to me. I would want somebody who I feel is professional and serious.

Just my experience.

[Trek420]

Check. I'm actually my design choice is weighted heavily on this concept.

Thanks again.

You're welcome. You'll get our bill ;)