When to carb up?

[thekarens]

If you have a big ride coming up do you carb up the night before or two nights before or neither?

[ny biker]

Neither. My diet has enough carbs in it already.

[luvmyguys]

The advice that I had been given is to eat well two nights before, even up to lunch the day before, but not to go crazy the night before. The reasoning is that if you eat too much the night before, it'll still be digesting, which can drag you down the day of the event.

[ny biker]

Well, I'd say it depends on what you eat the night before. I learned the hard way not to have a Five Guys cheeseburger with fries the night before a big bike ride. And that dinner at the Mexican restaurant the night before my first-ever century was not a good idea, especially considering how nervous I was at the time. So you bring up a good point, which is to eat foods you know you can digest easily the day or two before the ride.

I will eat a slightly larger dinner than usual the night before a long ride, but it will be a tried-and-true meal that I've had many times before. Same with breakfast before the ride. I'll eat more than usual, but it will be the same waffles that I have most other mornings.

The trick is when the big ride involves a road trip with a stay at a hotel. That takes lots of planning to try to control your pre-ride meals.

[rebeccaC]

What you want to do is maximize the amount of glycogen stored in your muscles. I do it by eating my regular training diet the week before and backing off training so I’m not depleting my glycogen. I will do a very short high intensity interval ride two days before and also have a carb lunch the two days before. That and getting a good nights sleep the few days before and making sure I’m properly fueled and hydrated during the ride works well for me.

[velo]

When I did the 160 mile RAIN ride, I ate more carbs than usual the whole week before to up my glycogen stores, as Rebecca said above. The night before, I ate a light meal to not feel bloated and full. I had my on-bike nutrition figured out, eating about 200 - 300 calories per hour, a combination of carbs and protein with a little fat (peanut butter) and I started eating that around 5am for a 7am start. I usually ride about 200 miles a week and that week I rode only 100 or so miles Mon - Wed (not high intensity), leaving two full days of recovery (I did an easy walk on Thursday and Friday was no activity at all) before Saturday event. This worked out very well for me - and each person has to find what works best for themselves. Good luck on your ride!!!

[thekarens]

I appreciate all the advice. I've gone back on my diet which involves low cal/low carb, but I want to have enough juice for the ride, so I'll modify my diet that week. Hotter N Hell should be fun :-)

[shootingstar]

I don't deliberately carb up much. But make sure I eat a good supper and breakfast for long distance bike ride the next day.

The night before is to have a supper that's well balanced. Having nutritious pureed veggie soup the night before is a good thing for me plus other stuff. Breakfast which is eating stuff that digests easily, ie. waffles are great, scrambled eggs, etc. Besides I've reduced high carb in my diet long term for the past few years (very little rice now, only certain types of bread 1-2 small slices, certain types of pasta only, etc.).

[Boudicca]

I have been eating a pasta meal the night before any ride, let alone a big one, so I guess I've been doing it all wrong.

But there again, I like pasta, it's a meal that works for me, and my weight is within a pound or so of where I want it to be.

My pre-ride breakfast is oatmeal or muesli, with buttermilk and fruit (more carbs), and my in-ride meal is pb+j (or pb +_ home made marmalade) on home made bread, perhaps with a banana and sometimes an energy bar or two.

I am such a creature of habit.

[TigerMom]

I was told to carb up starting 2 days before. But you still want to try eating high fiber carbs, ie oatmeal, whole grain bread, Dream Fields pasta which has lots of fiber

Also, no fatty foods. No spicy foods. No sour foods (ie. pickled items/hot and sour soup)

Drink tons of water until your urine is a light yellow starting 1-2 days before.

[OakLeaf]

It depends on what you mean by a "big ride." If it's just a long ride that I plan to do at an easy pace, I can replenish on the road. I'd only do anything special nutritionally before a high-intensity event like a road race or gran fondo. I'll carb load before a full marathon, but not a half.

The latest I've been reading is that it's best to fat load first starting five days before your event, then deplete your body's glycogen and replenish it fully one or two days before the event.

[ny biker]

I was told to carb up starting 2 days before. But you still want to try eating high fiber carbs, ie oatmeal, whole grain bread, Dream Fields pasta which has lots of fiber

Also, no fatty foods. No spicy foods. No sour foods (ie. pickled items/hot and sour soup)

Drink tons of water until your urine is a light yellow starting 1-2 days before.

I would not eat high fiber carbs before a big ride unless my diet normally includes high fiber carbs. Otherwise the results could be extremely unpleasant.

Same with drinking water -- I don't drink more before a big ride because I drink plenty of fluids every day.

You should be doing training rides leading up to an important event, and the food and beverages you have before the event should be similar to what you have learned is best for you based on what you eat and drink before the training rides.

[shootingstar]

If it's just a long ride that I plan to do at an easy pace, I can replenish on the road. I'd only do anything special nutritionally before a high-intensity event like a road race or gran fondo. I'll carb load before a full marathon, but not a half.

High intensity...can also mean cycling 100+ km. with 2 loaded panniers of my own baggage with several hills along the way. In temp at least 25-30 degrees C. Then back to back each day for 3-4 days of same length, same temp. and cars whipping along ..

I think different people have different food tolerances. I have eaten spicy foods the night before and think nothing of it. As long as the same meal is counterbalanced by a healthy neutral carb and liquid. Then breakfast next day is not spicy.

If I eat a big breakfast...I try to at least finish 1 hr. before I start cycling a long bike touring ride with pannier weight. It works for me and I don't have to worry about the washroom ..

Oatmeal with some milk for me works well for breakfast plus other stuff.

[thekarens]

I know people who wouldn't blink at 100. At my stage of endurance 62 is a challenge, and I'm working towards 100. My longest ride so far is 54 and I bonked at 51, almost didn't make it back.

[OakLeaf]

But my point is, it isn't the distance, it's the intensity. One of the great things about cycling is exactly that as long as you keep the pace something that's easy for YOU, you can literally ride all day and into the night. When you're doing that, you can stay abreast of nutrition by what you eat and drink along the way. It takes a higher intensity before you start depleting glycogen.

[shootingstar]

I'm sorry Oak, my heart is now thinking of my partner who is concocting his 1,500 km. trip across British Columbia and Alberta. He's 70. To be done within 2 wks. He's booked all his accommodation. There are 3 mtn. ranges in B.C. to cross.

You really truly need to understand what intensity means for each person. They feel it in their body..the exhaustion. (Day after day.)

When he was 59 he did 4,300 km. across Canada....every day except 3 days scattered about, 100 km. Every day. Intensity is on body and mind. Mountain ranges and flat, boring prairie with headwinds. We have to take into account wind velocity on headwind/crosswind that can affect performance and creates cycling intensity not anticipated at all for several hrs. Could he have cycled into the night for 8-10 hrs.? No. This is not racing but it is intense. Eating properly is critical. One doesn't want to carry a ton of food because the bike baggage is heavy already. (So one hopes in some vast empty stretches in Canada and U.S. there will be a corner store in a village, a farmers' fruit stand...)

There's a part of me worried more than I have in the past. (Maybe it's several cyclists who have killed by cars in Canada on long distance touring within the past 2 months.)

I make it sound like torture. It doesn't need to be, but there are some difficult hrs. on end, where your mind and body must focus hard to finish for the day.

There are times as cyclist also, I wish I didn't know certain things (the hard stuff about long distance cycling) even though it makes me an empathetic partner for him after he tells me his rides, eating at the end of each day.

[OakLeaf]

No, maybe you're not understanding what I'm saying. The OP was asking about super-charging her glycogen stores. That's literally not possible for a multi-day event. Recovery nutrition as well as on-bike nutrition will be super important for your DH, and for anyone doing an event of that nature. But he could eat an entire candy factory the night before he left and not make the slightest difference in the glycogen reserves he had on the third day. It just doesn't work that way.

[thekarens]

But my point is, it isn't the distance, it's the intensity. One of the great things about cycling is exactly that as long as you keep the pace something that's easy for YOU, you can literally ride all day and into the night. When you're doing that, you can stay abreast of nutrition by what you eat and drink along the way. It takes a higher intensity before you start depleting glycogen.

Gotcha, so I need to find the sweet spot regarding pace. That makes sense.

[Skippyak]

I am not sure that bonked is the same thing to all people (other than the obvious British bonk). I think some people think they have bonked when they have just not ridden enough, or were not ready or come out of the gate too fast etc etc.

[rebeccaC]

I am not sure that bonked is the same thing to all people (other than the obvious British bonk). I think some people think they have bonked when they have just not ridden enough, or were not ready or come out of the gate too fast etc etc.

I would call that muscular fatigue rather than a bonk. Hypoglycemia (bonking/hitting the wall) and even dehydration have different symptoms than muscular fatigue. With both of the later eventually the brain wants to protect itself by shutting some of the bodies systems down. Both also give emotional and cognitive warning signs, bonking more so. Irritability is one of my early signs. No one bonks without ignoring several warning signs that could have corrected the problem. I'd call it just needing to know our bodies :)

[zoom-zoom]

It takes a higher intensity before you start depleting glycogen.

Bonus -- at lower intensity the body burns a relatively higher percentage of body fat...booyah!!!

[Skippyak]

I would call that muscular fatigue rather than a bonk. Hypoglycemia (bonking/hitting the wall) and even dehydration have different symptoms than muscular fatigue. With both of the later eventually the brain wants to protect itself by shutting some of the bodies systems down. Both also give emotional and cognitive warning signs, bonking more so. Irritability is one of my early signs. No one bonks without ignoring several warning signs that could have corrected the problem. I'd call it just needing to know our bodies :)


Irritability is so subjective though. I did a 7K climb century a couple of weekends ago and I sure was not bonking and I was really irritable that despite having done all the advertised climbing (as per my garmin 910), I was still climbing for another 20 miles LOL.

[Catrin]

It really pays to pay attention to what your body is telling you. My coach tells me that there is research that shows women's bodies often are unable to take advantage of 'carb loading' the day before an event. I am sure that some women ARE able to take advantage of this but it pays to track things. Keep a journal of both what you eat and how you feel before/during/after a significant effort until you nail down what works for you.

[TigerMom]

I was told to carb up starting 2 days before. But you still want to try eating high fiber carbs, ie oatmeal, whole grain bread, Dream Fields pasta which has lots of fiber

Also, no fatty foods. No spicy foods. No sour foods (ie. pickled items/hot and sour soup)

Drink tons of water until your urine is a light yellow starting 1-2 days before.

Don't know the accuracy of this article, but I just got it in the email in case any of you are interested.
http://beta.active.com/nutrition/Articles/How-Glycemic-Index-Affects-What-You-Should-Eat-Before-and-During-a-Race.htm

[OakLeaf]

Bonus -- at lower intensity the body burns a relatively higher percentage of body fat...booyah!!!

Well, that's true that of the total calories you burn, a higher percentage of them is from fat. But at higher intensity you still burn more fat. You just have to burn glycogen and replenish glucose on top of it. And the higher intensities aren't sustainable, by definition. Anyone, whatever their level of fitness or deconditioning, can ride 5 miles a whole lot faster than they can ride 100. That's the fat-burning benefit of lower intensity - that you can do it all day. If you only have a fixed amount of time for your workouts, you still get more fat loss with higher intensity.

[jusdooit]

Interesting discussion. I only input is that if the OP bonked on a ride it probably has more to do with on the bike nutrition than foods eaten prior to the ride.

[thekarens]

Interesting discussion. I only input is that if the OP bonked on a ride it probably has more to do with on the bike nutrition than foods eaten prior to the ride.

Can't argue with that. I've just been trying to get the whole thing together, both pre ride nutrition and during the ride.

[indysteel]

I was told to carb up starting 2 days before. But you still want to try eating high fiber carbs, ie oatmeal, whole grain bread, Dream Fields pasta which has lots of fiber

Also, no fatty foods. No spicy foods. No sour foods (ie. pickled items/hot and sour soup)

Drink tons of water until your urine is a light yellow starting 1-2 days before.

LOL. I rode my best century after some of the hottest Thai food I've ever had! I think it's a matter of knowing what your body does and doesn't tolerate.

[Triskeliongirl]

If you are on a low carb diet, then read the paleo diet for athletes. It explains how to time carbs, and what types around your riding. I also eat low carb, but the night before a long/high intensity ride I will eat a sweet potato. If carbs aren't bad for you in general, then your plan to just eat a more balanced diet the week before the event is good.

But I can ride a century on low carb, since I use low carb to control mild type I diabetes, but to do it you need to train yourself to burn a higher ratio of fat to carbs, ride at moderate not high intensities, and drink a protein drink with electrolytes (Jay Robb) on the bike so u can fuel your rides with the by products of amino acid metabolism (you can deaminate amino acids to carbon skeletons which feed into the TCA cycle). But this is a way of life for me, not something I would do on a single ride, or attempt to do for the first time, on a long event ride.

[jusdooit]

Nutrition is so individual & unfortunately takes a lot of trial and error. I usually eat some type of pasta dish the evening before.Then breakfast is either cheese grits or english muffin with peanut butter. I don't tolerate real food on the bike well, so I use a gel every 10-14 miles depending on the intensity of the ride.

[velo]

Nutrition is so individual & unfortunately takes a lot of trial and error. I usually eat some type of pasta dish the evening before.Then breakfast is either cheese grits or english muffin with peanut butter. I don't tolerate real food on the bike well, so I use a gel every 10-14 miles depending on the intensity of the ride.

I think this is important to talk about. I am an "on the bike" eater. Anything over about 35 miles or two hours and I do want to eat something. This is not the case for everyone. If I'm going to ride a century, I snack along the way and usually enjoy a small sandwich around lunch time. I have a couple of friends who are just like justdooit and want nothing more than gels and electrolyte replacement in water. Everyone is different, so we shouldn't rule any particular method out based on our own experiences. The most important thing is to figure it out ahead of time. I would never ride a century with only a 50 mile ride under my belt. The old, "if you can do 50, you can do a metric, you can do 80, you can do 100" doesn't hold water. Particularly in heat, which is a whole other story that gets dehydration into the mix. That will kill you. Literally.

[thekarens]

FWIW it's worth I'm not jumping to a century. 54 was my longest. This Saturday I'm going to try 60 and next weekend 62 at Hotter N Hell if there isn't too much wind and I do fine this weekend. I hope to build up to a century, but not until next year.

Oh and 54 was my longest, but not my only 50 miler.

[velo]

I didn't mean to offend, Karen. I apologize. I either didn't convey what I meant to say or it was taken not as it was intended. I just wanted to say how important hydration is on the bike for a hot, long ride. Again, I'm sorry.

[thekarens]

I didn't mean to offend, Karen. I apologize. I either didn't convey what I meant to say or it was taken not as it was intended. I just wanted to say how important hydration is on the bike for a hot, long ride. Again, I'm sorry.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to sound offended. I wasn't offended at all. I just didn't want anyone to think I was crazy enough to jump from 50 to 100 because I agree, unless you're very fit that's not going to work.

I'm taking my Camelbak, 2 24oz bottles and there's rest stops every 10 miles at Hotter N Hell. For this weekend we have a sag driver so if it's too much or too hot I can catch a ride.

[rebeccaC]

FWIW it's worth I'm not jumping to a century. 54 was my longest. This Saturday I'm going to try 60 and next weekend 62 at Hotter N Hell if there isn't too much wind and I do fine this weekend. I hope to build up to a century, but not until next year.

Oh and 54 was my longest, but not my only 50 miler.

You should do well on the 100k with a number of 50 mile's already done and your ride on Saturday. You'll know Saturday if your nutrition/hydration plan works well or if you need to think about a few changes. I just looked at the route map and you can also head south on the 50 mile route about 1/3+/- of the way into the 100k if it's too hot or if there is a strong wind coming from the west.

Hotter N Hell :eek:....hopefully not!!! :)

Enjoy the ride!!!!

[Susan Otcenas]

But my point is, it isn't the distance, it's the intensity. One of the great things about cycling is exactly that as long as you keep the pace something that's easy for YOU, you can literally ride all day and into the night. When you're doing that, you can stay abreast of nutrition by what you eat and drink along the way. It takes a higher intensity before you start depleting glycogen.

This, exactly.

Our bodies don't actually store all that many calories as glycogen (what, 1500 or so?) and you don't actually want to deplete that, or you will bonk. Sooo, after a couple of hours on the bike, ALL your energy need to come from a combination of what you eat during the ride and stored fat.

Oak is exactly right. At low intensities, you can ride nearly forever. Randonneurs do it all the time. We ride ridiculously long distances over crazy long hours. What we ate the night before or the day before has very very little bearing on how well we ride. At anything more than a few hours, it's the intensity at which you ride, coupled with your fueling during the ride, that will determine your performance on the ride.

(I just finished an 881 mile brevet. I think I ate pizza the night before. I like pizza. Might have had some wine too. And a gin & tonic... ;) Much more important was the 30,000+ calories I ate DURING the ride! )

Mostly, don't overthink it. Eat something you like, something that isn't too heavy or spicy, and don't overeat. Other than that, it doesn't really matter all that much. Really.

Susan

[Skippyak]

I really enjoyed the TDF glimpses into the feed bags of the riders, those Spanish guys had hardly anything in their feed bags, of course there may be misinformation and product placement here.
I monitor my calorie (estimated) out my 910 (imperfect science) but flat centuries don't even use 2000 calories for me, in a 6 hr century ride with an average HR of 140 (resting 55). So between liver and muscle glycogen and some calories in my bottle and breakfast, and my capacious fat stores. it is all good LOL.