Gravel riding

[Catrin]

Any tips on gravel road riding? These are very remote gravel roads and they can differ greatly between the size/type of gravel used as well as the depth. Right now the tires on my mountain bike differ, I have a Mountain King on the back, and Geax Mezcal on the front. Would it be better to have the more aggressive tire on the front to help bite into that gravel, or keep it on the rear where it is?

I hope to go scouting these roads soon, but I may (and probably will) wait to do some fit related changes to my mountain bike to allow proper knee extension and make certain my neck isn't too stretched out. It feels great on single-track, but the fit has a ways to go before I can do more road-like riding with my Jamis. This isn't a surprise, we went a little small on the size deliberately. Some of the gravel roads in the are I will be riding in are VERY steep and I need to make certain my fit is correct to make sure my knees, IT band and hip stay happy.

If I can get in enough gravel riding this winter, I hope to ride in the Sub-9 Death March in early March rather than volunteer, but we will see.

[tealtreak]

The most important thing to remember with steep gravel is you have no traction when you brake!!!!!!! yikes! but true.......

[Catrin]

I want that suspension Murienn, and since I am done with single-track for now I am going to use my mountain bike, she isn't going to collect dust. Besides, when I ride off-road with my Gunnar the vibration hurts my hands too much. I really need that suspension.

Tealtreak, that is what I thought. I took my LHT on one of those roads when I still had it and it freaked me out a bit as I wasn't expecting it. Now some of the roads will be more hard-packed, but I've been told that there isn't any consistency in the shape of these roads.

[tealtreak]

I want that suspension Murienn, and since I am done with singletrack for now I am going to use my mountain bike. Besides, when I ride off-road with my Gunnar the vibration hurts my hands too much. I really need that suspension.

Tealtreak, that is what I thought. I took my LHT on one of those roads when I still had it, that is why I know I want that suspension. Now some of the roads will be more hard-packed, but I've been told that there isn't any consistency in the shape of these roads.

What i was taught (and has worked so far) is brake hard when you are on a dirt or hard packed spot (so you have traction) then "flow like water, loose grip" on the gravel part (also screaming yeeeeaaaa in your head helps! haha)

[Irulan]

Any tips on gravel road riding? These are very remote gravel roads and they can differ greatly between the size/type of gravel used as well as the depth. Right now the tires on my mountain bike differ, I have a Mountain King on the back, and Geax Mezcal on the front. Would it be better to have the more aggressive tire on the front to help bite into that gravel, or keep it on the rear where it is?

I hope to go scouting these roads soon, but I may (and probably will) wait to do some fit related changes to my mountain bike to allow proper knee extension and make certain my neck isn't too stretched out. It feels great on single-track, but the fit has a ways to go before I can do more road-like riding with my Jamis. This isn't a surprise, we went a little small on the size deliberately. Some of the gravel roads in the are I will be riding in are VERY steep and I need to make certain my fit is correct to make sure my knees, IT band and hip stay happy.

If I can get in enough gravel riding this winter, I hope to ride in the Sub-9 Death March in early March rather than volunteer, but we will see.

Catrin, I don't want you to take this wrong, but it seems to me there is a tendency to over think all this stuff. Why not just make sure the saddle is a good pedaling height(that's all you should need to do to protect your knees), and go out and put some gravel road miles on the dang thing. You will never be able to outfit a bike to fit all contingencies.

[Catrin]

Catrin, I don't want you to take this wrong, but it seems to me there is a tendency to over think all this stuff. Why not just make sure the saddle is a good pedaling height(that's all you should need to do to protect your knees), and go out and put some gravel road miles on the dang thing. You will never be able to outfit a bike to fit all contingencies.

Yes, I do tend to over think. In THIS case, however, I can't get to a good pedaling height. That was fine for the trails but not for longer distance riding.

[Irulan]

Yes, I do tend to over think. In THIS case, however, I can't get to a good pedaling height. That was fine for the trails but not for longer distance riding.

I don't understand unless the seatpost is not long enough. All of my mountain bikes will extend to an appropriate hieght for long distance ( road style) pedaling....11 miles of gravel road climbing for example. I don't think I could ride certain trails without this. I routinely change my seat height - full extension for almost any sort of climbing, about 1/2'-1" lower for extremely rolling terrain, and lots lower for full on descending. There are plenty of trail I ride at full extension, probably 80% of them When I do clinics we mark the climbing height on everyone's seatpost for reference.

What I'm trying to say is I can't imagine anyone having a mountain bike that you can't get to correct pedaling height. If you are riding with your seat generally too low, well no wonder you are having problems. Seat too low can feel awkward and cause knee pain, and it's certainly not very efficient.

[Catrin]

The bike is 1 size small because of fit issues, I and my fitter worked this out at the beginning. It is fine for single-track and feels great, but it isn't right for road riding. If I get the seat post up any higher (which it will do as we replaced the original seatpost with a very long one), I am then in too aggressive a position for my neck - it can't be stretched out because of whiplash & arthritis. It won't be a very expensive fix, I just need to save up for it. It is a pain to be sure, and we knew when we worked this out that this might be eventually necessary. Every other mountain bike we looked at that was the right size would have stretched my neck out far too much...and the consequences of that isn't pleasant. Even before the whiplash injury I couldn't tolerate my neck to be stretched too far - though I didn't know why.

So, while it sounds like over-thinking, it isn't. I just need to bring up the stem and handlebar to accommodate the higher saddle height - and it needs to go up quite a bit. This will make me more upright of course, and my fitters original concern was that would have had me too upright for single-track and would have caused weight distribution problems. It never felt too low on the trails, but as soon as I hit pavement with it I was very aware of it.

If my skills had advanced enough that I could have ridden long distances on the trail without stopping it would have eventually become a problem and another solution would have needed to be found, but it wasn't a problem on the trails I was riding (and miss). I know it wasn't helping me with efficiency, I don't think it affected my crash/ride ratio. I was only riding every couple of weeks so it probably wasn't really affecting my knees...

[goldfinch]

I ride on ratty gravel roads. I think the more aggressive tread on the front makes sense. The rear tire will follow.

[Hi Ho Silver]

Riding on gravel can be challenging. Sometimes the front tire will be knocked off track by deep gravel (similar to when trying to plow through deep sand), so steering occasionally requires body english and upper body strength. I would put the biggest (i.e., fattest) tire on the front so that you have maximum flotation and the wheel has more momentum to resist being knocked off track. Also, try to read the trail ahead and avoid those ares that have built up piles of gravel like downward sloping sides of curves. Braking can be iffy, especially on curves. Always be prepared to use body english when braking so that you can control the inevitable skiding. Generally, riding on gravel requires staying alert and being able to "manhandle" the bike to compensate for the surface being so unpredictable.

[Bike Writer]

I ride a fair amount on gravel roads because there are so many where I live and the country side is beautiful. About the only thing I can add to the discussion is the bit about gravel roads and consistency. There is none. On the same stretch of road you can traverse between big chunky gravel to smooth hard pack dirt. Of course add into the mix clay and it's a never ending fluid shifting terrain. Also add into the mix that road commissions regularly grade the roads so that one day you might take a ride on hard pack that is almost like a paved road except with the washboard effect and go down that same road a day later when the road has been graded and now you are surfing through big chunks but not dodging the potholes and washboard.

Have fun!

For sure, it keeps it interesting!

[Sky King]

okay, I am throwing out food for thought. Have you considered a "fat bike" yet? the bigger tires will give you the float and the cushion you may need for the physical limitations. Here is Tad, one of our friends on his Surly Pugsley. He loves, loves it for gravel. We also have friends on Salsa Mukluk, Surly Trolls and the new Surly Krampus will be out in the spring.15619

[Catrin]

okay, I am throwing out food for thought. Have you considered a "fat bike" yet? the bigger tires will give you the float and the cushion you may need for the physical limitations. Here is Tad, one of our friends on his Surly Pugsley. He loves, loves it for gravel. We also have friends on Salsa Mukluk, Surly Trolls and the new Surly Krampus will be out in the spring.

Oooooh, very nice! A new bike won't be in my budget for a long time to come, but I will be interested to see if people start riding these in the two major gravel/trail races over the next couple of years.

[Sky King]

I hear you on that. One of my best biking friends just had the bike hermit, aka my DH. rebuild her Santa Cruz because it fits her so well and she has major issues too. The frame is still solid so he basically replaced everything, including a new front fork and she is one happy rider. She took it on all of our gravel road trips this summer and had a blast

[emily_in_nc]

Oooooh, very nice! A new bike won't be in my budget for a long time to come, but I will be interested to see if people start riding these in the two major gravel/trail races over the next couple of years.

What would happen if you sold your current MTB? Since you say it is a size too small, perhaps selling it and putting the proceeds towards a fat-tired bike would be the way to go for gravel road riding?

[Catrin]

Are the gravel roads near enough to make this financial and time effort worthwhile? Won't you have to travel?

Are there any greenways or rail-trails near your home you could ride? Something that will be easier on your body than singletrack or gravel? I did used to skid/crash on gravel when I was younger. Didn't really care. But kids can take a lot more than adults in that regard.

I don't want to give up off-road riding entirely - and the greenways and rail-trails around here aren't fun to ride. At least to me they aren't. I would have to travel a bit to get to where I want to ride, but I won't go gravel riding without a partner. They are too remote to ride solo, so having a partner is (to me) a requirement and hopefully we can car-pool.


What would happen if you sold your current MTB? Since you say it is a size too small, perhaps selling it and putting the proceeds towards a fat-tired bike would be the way to go for gravel road riding?

I love my Jamis....and I've so much sunk into it that I wouldn't get much out of it. It is also customized to meet my fit needs which probably makes it less attractive to someone else. It is, however, a thought that I will consider. I also hate to get rid of it in case it turns out that I can return to single-track in a year or two...

[emily_in_nc]

I love my Jamis....and I've so much sunk into it that I wouldn't get much out of it. It is also customized to meet my fit needs which probably makes it less attractive to someone else. It is, however, a thought that I will consider. I also hate to get rid of it in case it turns out that I can return to single-track in a year or two...

Makes sense, Catrin. It's one of those things you should wait on for a year+ anyway just to see if the gravel riding "sticks" and if you are able to return to single-track. When you know the answer to both of those questions, hopefully the best way to go will be clear. :)

[ridebikeme]

I'm fortunate to have LOTS of gravel around the area that I live, so ride quite often. As others have mentioned, it certainly depnds on the consistency of the gravel/dirt. Generally I ride a mtn bike as well, and often not have Kenda Small Block 8's on both front and rear. Most of our roads are remote, but often used with people driving them, four wheelers and snowmobiles in that time of the season. It's too bad that you didn't live closer,the shop is hosting its annual Turkey Tro ride next weekend and the majority of it is on gravel. However, the last ten miles are on pavement, but the fun part is that it is all downhill :)

Whatever you decide to Catrin, have fun relax and take in everything around you... it's certainly a different experience. And "yes" some people do ride 'fatbikes' in some of the gravel races.

[Catrin]

I am really looking forward to it! While it is sad that I need to step away from the singletrack, at least for now, I choose to look at this as a way to explore other types of riding. Good to know about the Kenda Small Blocks, I think my tires will be fine when I switch the front and rear.

I am volunteering at the Gravel Grovel on the Saturday of Thanksgiving weekend, and I am taking my Jamis with me. While I will be working the event most of the day, I am going to take a break and check out how my lovely bike feels on those gravel roads. With those nice wide tires and that suspension, it should be sweet! I also don't clip in, and I suspect that won't change on gravel either - at least not until I get accustomed to it. Sadly it is further away from me than the trails were, but that's ok. The event is in the same area I will be riding, and I intend to participate in the Death March there in March (even though I will only be competing with myself), assuming I can find a partner. Partners are required for that event.

I won't ride long distances until we get the fit adjusted, but I will raise the saddle as far as I can without wrecking my neck and check it out in two weeks ;)