Do I expect too much?

[jessmarimba]

My boyfriend says that I am too sensitive about being treated "like a girl."

I just went in for a basic bike fitting with the new mountain bike - mostly because I knew a lot of things felt a little off when I was test-riding it. I actually probably wouldn't have bought it except that the bike I test-rode at the shop was the same frame, but felt way better (in other words, I knew mine was fixable).

I walk in - the guy says oh, I thought you needed a road bike fitting. Mountain bikes don't really need fitted, they have a lot of wiggle room and it's just about what feels good to you.

I understand this - but - between my back, and how weird the bike felt, I wanted some help. I explain this.

He asks my height (5'7"). Asks frame size - suggests medium? large? No, small - 15.5". He observes that it's a 29er. He says the bike is too big.

Umm..ok, why don't you see me ON the bike first? Because I think I could probably have been ok on a medium frame too.

They set the bike up on a trainer on a plywood platform. Ask me to stand over it. Note that I have no standover clearance - the bike must be too big. Well, duh, of course I have no standover - you elevated the bike 2 inches, but my feet are still on the floor. If I was a guy, I would be pretty uncomfortable right now.

So we play around with seat height and saddle position, and he must've said 50 times that I just need to go ride it and see what feels right. He does eventually concede that the bike is the right size, and that it's a nice bike.

Am I expecting too much to have help making the bike feel right before I go ride it? Is there some reason that a 29er is really that big of a deal for a girl? Why the instant assumption that it will be too big? I mean, I may be a "petite" 5'7" " :p but I think I'm tall enough for big-girl wheels!

They offered to cut the bars down if I bring it in next week, but I just feel so uncomfortable going back. But I feel obligated, b/c they didn't charge me anything for the fit-tweaking. Ugh. The most helpful bike person I've met out here (least condescending? most agreeable?) works for the Trek store, so I can't bring this one there for help. But maybe all of this is just in my head, and I'm making myself feel uncomfortable at bike shops? :confused:

[Kathi]

Wow, where did you go? I've had my mtn bikes "fitted" 2x here in Denver.

The 1st fitting was when I bought my Titus and because of the price they did a full fitting. Probably spent an hour or more working on the fit. The fitter was very particular about how the bike was set up. Because of that fitting I realized my road bike really didn't fit, but that's another story.

The 2nd time the bike was fitted was 5 yrs later, I bought a new saddle from the very same shop that I bought the bike from. Attitudes have changed there, yes, they put the saddle on but when it wasn't right they wanted to charge me at least $85 to check my fit. I took the bike to my current fitter and not only did he get the saddle on properly he also raised my handlebars, new stem and made some other adjustments, all for a minimal charge.

Your BF sounds like my SO. My ski shop tells me that skis are good for 100 ski days, ski magazine says 75. My skis have 120 days on them so I'm looking at buying new ones. He keeps says "but at your weight (105 lbs) you could probably go well over 200 days.

One thing I really noticed on my old mtn bike that didn't fit is that my handling was affected. I ended up walking a lot of places that I would have been able to ride had my bike fit me better and I would have better skills than I do.

[indysteel]

I'm not sure I read what happened to be about your gender as much as flat-out bad customer service by someone who may not know much about bike fit. Have you gone there for other fittings and been satisfied with their service? If not, I'd suggest the guy just isn't a particularly good fitter. He's certainly not very good at customer service.

The fitters I've worked with are good at what they do, in part, because they listen. There's nothing dismissive about them. Even if they were of the mind that MTBs don't need to be fit like a road bike, they'd at least listen to the customer long enough to get a feel for what issues they're having or questions/concerns they have.

As for the fitter at the Trek store, does that shop specifically only fit their own bikes? If not, I'd see about getting in with him, or finding somebody new entirely.

[PamNY]

This might not be gender-related. It sounds like garden-variety incompetence.

I had an interesting discussion about an LBS with a neighbor who is a nationally-ranked athlete. Turns out he gets the same crappy service I do at this store.

[indysteel]

Can I just mention how jealous I am that you have long enough legs to fit a 29er? :p I'm 5'4 with a 29-inch inseam. It's hard enough to find a FS bike that fits. Grrrr.

[indysteel]

This might not be gender-related. It sounds like garden-variety incompetence.

I had an interesting discussion about an LBS with a neighbor who is a nationally-ranked athlete. Turns out he gets the same crappy service I do at this store.

That's my take on it as well, although I do think the fitter's gender may have caused part of the disconnect. He has what I see as the "macho guy" mentality about things. Under that mentality, of course you just go out and ride the bike to figure out fit. Suck it up. Be a man about it. It's the same thought process by which they attempt to build something without first looking at the directions or drive someplace new without looking at a map. It's the I don't need help like you female wusses need help; I can do it on my own mentality.

Not to stereotype or anything. :p

[jessmarimba]

Can I just mention how jealous I am that you have long enough legs to fit a 29er? :p I'm 5'4 with a 29-inch inseam. It's hard enough to find a FS bike that fits. Grrrr.

Haha! I'm sorry. At least you don't have to wear high waters if you want "outdoor" pants? :)

True, nothing is really gender specific about that store or most of the weird vibes I've gotten elsewhere. But in the back of my mind, I always think that people would trust that I know something, or pay more attention to me, or whatever, if I was a guy. But I'm also not very aggressive or outgoing so my personality doesn't help much either!

(Wearing my hair in 2 braids probably doesn't encourage anyone to treat me like an adult...keeps it from knotting, though!)

[Biciclista]

gosh he sounds like an idiot! don't go back there. Or if you do, look for a different clerk!!

[indysteel]

Haha! I'm sorry. At least you don't have to wear high waters if you want "outdoor" pants? :)

True, nothing is really gender specific about that store or most of the weird vibes I've gotten elsewhere. But in the back of my mind, I always think that people would trust that I know something, or pay more attention to me, or whatever, if I was a guy. But I'm also not very aggressive or outgoing so my personality doesn't help much either!

(Wearing my hair in 2 braids probably doesn't encourage anyone to treat me like an adult...keeps it from knotting, though!)

If you walked into a stuffy business setting with braids, I might buy that, but a bike shop? I'm lucky to even be clean when I go into a shop. Trust me; this wasn't about you; this was about him.

[Jen12]

It does get annoying being talked down to like that. I haven't had bike issues (yet) but I took my car in to the shop once because it was leaking coolant and the guy asked me what made me think it was coolant...uh....duh...because I wasn't drinking green kool-aid under my car...

I do think that some people in specialty shops are trained a certain way and can't think past that. That may have been the problem with your bike guy.

[Irulan]

This might not be gender-related. It sounds like garden-variety incompetence.

.

what she said.
"mountain bikes don't need to be fitted". WTF?

[Aggie_Ama]

Umm I had an hour long fit on my mountain bike. And I had one guy tell me I was too small to ride a 29er. I asked him if he had heard of Willow Koerber, he said yes, I said I stood next to her and am taller than her but watched her race a 29er. Funny thing is he told my teammate she had the perfect bike for her build, she is 1/2" shorter than me, shorter inseam and has the same bike I do. Did I mention he wants to date her? I am 5'2.5" and ride a 15.5" 29er full suspension, 29" inseam. Best fitting bike ever. I do think guys tend to have misconceptions about what women will fit but people who truly know what is out there and how they fit won't tell you smaller people can't ride 29ers.

But no, my mountain bikes won't cause me pain if the fit is 1/8" off but my road bike did. However having a dialed in fit did alleviate knee and shoulder pain I was having mountain bike because it was off a lot. So yes, they need to be fit.

[smilingcat]

no stand over clearance when the bike is raised off the floor while you are straddling over it with your feet on the ground.

:confused::rolleyes::rolleyes:

like others have said garden variety incompetence. Get some one else next time.

[grey]

But in the back of my mind, I always think that people would trust that I know something, or pay more attention to me, or whatever, if I was a guy.

I often think this too. I change my approach depending on the guy, but if it's one that clearly has issues with women, I become a lot more assertive. I make it clear I know a thing or two and lay that out (even if that's the ONLY thing I know) and say it like a flat statement of fact, which it is. Usually at this point, Mr Bonehead will change his approach. Other times, there is no point in dealing with Mr Bonehead. Take your business elsewhere.

[lph]

What an idiot. So what's the difference between "needs fitting" and "it's about what feels good for you"? And insisting on that you should go ride it first, when you already had test-ridden it, and that's why you were there?

When I meet people like this I try to remember that they probably have a set of general rules they spout to all customers and that usually work reasonably well, partly because they're true, partly because many customers are casual riders who don't really care that much about the final result and won't come back. But they won't start listening to me until they've been through the routine, and I'm still there. Annoying, but then, bike shop employees around here are often just random young dudes who happen to like taking bikes apart, not seasoned salesmen.

Hope you find a better bike shop, or a way to grin through the nonsense!

[pll]

They offered to cut the bars down if I bring it in next week, but I just feel so uncomfortable going back. But I feel obligated, b/c they didn't charge me anything for the fit-tweaking.

Do not feel obligated to go back. I assume that store is where you bought the bike, so they should fit you properly, anyway (and they didn't). Go to your Trek store or to a place Kathi could recommend.

[Velocivixen]

I have not read the posts following what you wrote because two very important things come to mind and I want to say them before I forget. They did NOT do much of a bike fitting plus had bad customer service, so you shouldn't have had to pay anyway! Seriously. second you mention that the most helpful place sold Trek-that shouldn't matter. I bought a Surly from a shop way over in Portland, but will take it to the LBS which is a huge Trek dealer. They will do the mechanical work for me and are very helpful. You don't owe that place anything. If you do take your bike to the Trek place and they don't charge for basic tweaks, I would at least buy something there even if it's small.

[Velocivixen]

Also there are salespeople and then there are specially trained bike fitters. Was this person their "bike fitter"? Or just someone who worked there? When dealing with sales help I usually get the general "one size fits all" advice, then as lph posted, eventually when I'm still there I get more in depth and specific information.

There is a LBS in Portland owned by a professional bike racer. They have nice bikes and good customer service, but when I asked about what fitting services they offered they said they "don't really offer that". When I test rode bikes there they sort of eyeballed the saddle height, etc.

[limewave]

That sounds like really poor customer service. I hate that, sorry you had to go through that! Ugh!

I was fitted for my mountain bike back in the spring when I was shopping. The fitting was an hour or so long. They also had me try medium and small frames, varying length stems and swept vs. flat bars. They went all out and I felt like they treated me like I was a pro. Which is why I feel so much better about buying a bike from them afterall.

[Aggie_Ama]

The Trek store will likely do the fitting but may charge. I had my road bike re-fit at a Trek/Specialized exclusive store. They had no problem fitting my Cannondale and never treated me poorly when I brought it for service. In fact that is how they won me as a loyal customer. They also are patient with my personality, teach me to do things if I request so and will do many minor repairs for free (long before I bought a bike there). DH and I now have bought two bikes each from them and race for them. I have referred many newbies to them, even my CFO who wanted to get an old bike his daughter had for college tuned up. He said they treated him like he had a top of the line bike.

And that is how you do customer service! So no you don't expect too much. Everyone should be treated like they are important because they are. Their feelings should listened to no matter how silly they sound to the fitter or customer service person. If they handle everyone like you I am not sure how they stay open!

[jessmarimba]

It is a trek-owned factory store, so I would feel weird about bringing a Niner there! But they're also not very close by and I'd like to find someone in town anyway. I have some friends who do very affordable maintenance and would likely cut the bars down, etc. for me.

I did tweak saddle height and setback on my own a bit and the bike feels pretty solid now. I think I can ride it safely as-is (well, if I can ever pick a saddle!) until I know how it feels a little better.

Thanks for all of your reassurances. I had been starting to wonder if something about me just screamed "moron!" when I went into bike shops. I somehow don't get that feeling when I take my car in, though that might be why I've always taken it to the same place :)

[Koronin]

That's just poor to bad customer service. My issue with my LBS is they think because I'm a woman I have to purchase women specific things be that bikes, accessories, clothes ect. They do not get that I prefer men's stuff (other than shoes). I have no problem at all taking a bike there for service. Their head mechanic is awesome. He really knows bikes and is really good at helping you and answering questions. For good customer service otherwise I prefer our old LBS back in Charlotte, they are awesome but are too far away now. Otherwise I've found 2 places in Raleigh I like. One is a Trek dealer (most likely where my next bike will be bought at) and the other is Performance for all the accessories. Every time we've been there they have been awesome with their customer service, and they don't care I prefer men's jerseys, saddles, ect. Heck they'll even help me find what I'm wanting in the men's section of the store. (Both stores have been that way, the one in Raleigh and the one in Cary).