Called "Sir"... Why, oh WHY?!?!

[KnottedYet]

Why does this happen to me?

For 30 years, at least once a month I am called "Sir" or referred to as "he," "him," or "son."

Sometimes the person apologizes, often they don't.

I've been walking down the sidewalk in a miniskirt and camisole and listened to people debate amongst themselves over whether I was a man or a woman. A carload of teenagers pulled up next to me and shouted, "Are you a guy or a girl?" A museum docent selling tickets looked at my son and I and said "You boys are half price as students."

Today I was at McDonalds, said "Hi" to the salesperson, gave my complicated order while looking her in the eyes, and she then said "Will that be for here or to go, Sir?"

I was wearing a lavender shirt with a plunging V-neck that accentuated my 36DD bazoongas. I had a dainty silver necklace resting in my cleavage. My chin-length hair was pinned back with a rhinestone-and-silver barrette.

Why does this happen?

When a "sir" mistake really gets to me, I rush off to the mall and buy clothes and/or makeup. I always kind of figured it's my face that makes people assume I'm a man. I am not pretty. I've got honkin' cheekbones and a big nose and a screwed up eyebrow. Today's retail therapy involved a wonderful makeup clerk at the MAC counter. I delivered my "I-just-got-called-Sir" whine, and she asked if I'm Scandinavian. (yes) She said she has a Scandinavian friend with the same broad shoulders and strong facial bone structure who also gets called "Sir" even though she is clearly a woman. After I bought my haul of make-up she gave me a hug and told me I was beautiful.

Maybe I'm not alone. But damn, it really really sucks.

ETA: by the way, MAC "Viva Glam" lipstick is pretty darn awesome. The entire purchase price goes toward MAC's HIV/AIDS project. Collect 6 empty MAC containers (from any of their makeup) and you can turn them in for a free lipstick. http://www.maccosmetics.com/product/shaded/168/966/Viva-Glam-Lipstick/index.tmpl

[shootingstar]

Strange, Knotted. Is your voice alto,...like mine? :rolleyes: I don't have a lovely soprano voice, probably because I unconsciously lower my voice when I speak English when I acquired it after leaving alot of Chinese behind which dances up and down in tones.

While you get mistaken for being male, some of us according to some folks are assumed to be born outside of North America and sucking up the jobs, social welfare system.....

During the Olympics while watching fireworks, a bunch of people in their early 30's chatted up with one guy ranting on and on how his area (Richmond) was just full of these Asians taking over the city, driving up real estate.

It still made me seethe..after hearing junk like this occasionally for past few decades. I could have turned around to say somthing since they were only 5 ft. away and said something. But it just gets tiring to defend oneself with....strangers.

Their problem, eh Knotted? :)

[KnottedYet]

Yup, I'm an alto (I sing 2nd alto).

I'm never mistaken by my voice. Never in pictures. Only in person, whether I speak or not.

It's just *weird.*

[Tiffany_S]

I have this same problem and I'm not Scandinavian!! I have 36DD chest as well. I'm 5 feet tall with short hair and I'm not a pretty girly girl so to speak. I just make it a point to point it out to them that I'm a girl and they are always embarrassed.

[zoom-zoom]

Yup, I'm an alto (I sing 2nd alto).

Me too...and 1st tenor. I'm Scandinavian, as well (first name Kirsten, maiden name ended in son). But I would kill for broader shoulders (since I have big boobs and the shoulders might help make me look more balanced AND hold up bra straps better) and some angles to my face. I am TOO soft and have no nice defined cheekbones or chin.

We can't win. :p

From the way you describe your dress, the only way these people could be thinking you're a guy is if they are completely oblivious and lacking in the ability to read social cues. That says far more about them than it does about you.

[TsPoet]

Used to happen to me all the time. I used to have to dress nice for work, and being a big gal, I wore long skirts and dark blouses, and still got called "sir". I moved to the PNW and started wearing jeans and T-shirts, and it no longer happens!? I'm assuming something happened to me (or my voice?) when I got into my mid-30s?
I don't wear makup.
Maybe you need tighter tops? :D

[channlluv]

What's up with all you Scandinavian chicks getting blessed with the big boobs?

I am rather Weeble-shaped. I barely fill out an A cup, but people often ask me when my baby's due.

At least I still look young enough to have babies. That's my silver lining.

Roxy

[Trek420]

I am TOO soft and have no nice defined cheekbones or chin.

We can't win. :p

Knott has the most amazing high cheekbones. :D I think it's your height "tall person, must be a guy." I'm short, never been called "sir".

[zoom-zoom]

What's up with all you Scandinavian chicks getting blessed with the big boobs?

My grandma looked like the Venus of Willendorf. Trust me, that is not a body type I was happy to inherit. :p I struggle every day to not be wider than I am tall, like my grandma Berniece was, heh (my younger sister is losing that battle).

[zoom-zoom]

Knott has the most amazing high cheekbones. :D I think it's your height "tall person, must be a guy." I'm short, never been called "sir".

I'll bet you're right. Height is not a good measure of sex, though. Friends of mine were recently married...she is easily 3" taller than he is.

[badger]

ugh, how horrible! the MAC person sounds wonderful, though!

when I was young (8-10ish), I got mistaken for a boy all the time. I had long hair until about 7 or 8 and one day I told my mother I wanted all cut off and have short hair. Didn't help I was a tomboy and wore boy-ish clothes.

When I was 27, again I was hit with a "I have to cut my hair off" and got a pixie cut. I was at a cafe and someone approached me from behind "excuse me, sir". As soon as I turned around it was obvious to him I was a girl and he said sorry (he was trying to sell me something, so glad he got scared off).

I must say that experience did bug me and I have not had my hair short since then.

[bmccasland]

Micky D's person is blind? Or has some very strange friends?


On the otherhand, I used to work with a male nurse, who hadn't cut his hair since he got out of the Navy some 10 years previous. Had a very nice long ponytail that he'd braid. When people saw him from the rear, and the perception of "all nurses are female", they call out, "excuse me, nurse? Ma'am?" And James would turn around where they'd also see his very bushy mustache. The looks on their confused faces was absolutely priceless!

[Owlie]

Sales clerk sounds awesome.

I haven't run into that since I was 8 or so, when I had my hair cut short. I decided not long after I was asked if I was a girl or a boy to grow my hair out!

DBF gets mistaken for a woman over the phone rather frequently.

[OakLeaf]

My grandma looked like the Venus of Willendorf.

The figurine of a goddess.

You are a goddess too. And you too, Knott.

[Crankin]

I think it must be the body type, height, etc. I have had very short hair for ten years, and I am flat chested, but no one has ever mistaken me for a guy. Perhaps it's because I am short?
Though I do see a scary resemblance to my son, who is a Marine, right after I get a haircut :eek:.

[Red Rock]

I had thae same problem growing up. I was involved in gymnastics so I kept my hair short. I still do. About 1" in the summer and 1.5" in the winter. I grew up with two brothers. I like "guy" things. Legos, playing in the sand..etc .The barbie dolls never caught my attention. Riding bikes fit into that category too.

I have been called Allen instead of Ellen many times.

I think it has bothered my parents a whole lot. I ended up getting my ears piereced to let people know I was a female.

Oh, well.....

Red Rock

[redrhodie]

Pretty is as pretty does. You're a true beauty, knot.

[indysteel]

pretty is as pretty does. You're a true beauty, knot.

+1.

[Biciclista]

NO WAY!! LOL Hey, I never thought you looked like a guy. I will agree with those of you who say it is because you are scandahoovian. who knew?
PS my very first impression of you was that you were a spinster. Definitely female.

[badger]

PS my very first impression of you was that you were a spinster.

LOL!! not sure if this is a compliment?!

:)

[Biciclista]

it's not really a compliment, it's me being honest. Of course after we spoke, I learned that she was not. My point was, it was obvious to me that she was a woman.

[Pax]

Knott has the most amazing high cheekbones. :D I think it's your height "tall person, must be a guy." I'm short, never been called "sir".

I'm right there with Knott, whenever my SO and I are out and about I inevitably get called sir (and many times without her); I have short hair, dress in shorts and t-shirts, and I'm 5'10" and she's 5' nuthin'. It gets really old.

[Tokie]

I find myself assuming that small-boned short slender men are women. Body size (height, shoulders, and especially to me leg length - long legs=female) are common cues. I think sometimes working at McD's (I did in college) you just get in a grind taking orders without REALLY looking at the face you are looking at. I mostly remember the hands I put change into. In rural Idaho, there were more missing fingers than I expected (?farm accidents). But when the mistake happens over and over, it must be troubling for you. If you were wearing baggy jeans and plaid shirts - I could see it, maybe. And as if you were a man dressed as a woman, you would want to be called "sir"? - I think maybe no, but who really knows....

[grey]

What's up with all you Scandinavian chicks getting blessed with the big boobs?

I am rather Weeble-shaped. I barely fill out an A cup, but people often ask me when my baby's due.

At least I still look young enough to have babies. That's my silver lining.

Roxy

Me too! WHAT BOOBS? In another month, with all this riding, I'll be looking for TRAINING BRAS. And yeah, I got belly. When I lose weight, the boobs go first. Then the flap-flap in the upper arms slim down, and when I get near-anorexic looking, that's when the tummy fat goes away. :rolleyes:

And the between-the-thighs fat mentioned in another thread just doesn't. Ever. Leave.

Just remember. Webbles wobble but they don't fall down. :D

[GLC1968]

Just remember. Webbles wobble but they don't fall down. :D

Yep - it came in very handy when playing rugby in college. :D

I don't know why I've never been mistaken for a man even when I had a pixie cut and hardly ever wore makeup. I often went to the store in dirty carpenter jeans and muck boots, too. But I am only 5'4", so I'm sure that plays into it.

I'm sorry Knot, that's gotta suck. I'm going to blame both your height and people's general inability to pay attention to much else than themselves...

[beccaB]

I've been mistaken for a guy too.:mad: I am amply endowed, but thin. When I was a runner I had short hair in a pixie style. I can't believe anyone would mistake me for a guy, and even the male co-workers I mentioned it to because it happened at work, were incredulous. I thought it was funny.

[surgtech1956]

I get called 'sir' once in awhile. I always thought because I don't dress feminine or girly. I wear guys shorts, shirts, jeans, don't carry a purse, don't wear makeup or hardly any, and have short hair.

[indysteel]

I'm sad to hear that any of you get mistaken for men, but as for boobs being an obvious give away as to female gender, have you seen how many men have moobs these days? It's scary!!!

[Dr.Doo]

I get called Sir and in times gone by Son or Sonny lots. I get asked to leave women's rest rooms often and I'm a shorty skinny thang (not as skinny now at a 'hefty' 125lbs - now before y'all jump on me, it's relative, I've been 100lbs all my adult life until I gave up smoking and hit menopause). However, I totally love the 'gender queerness' of it. I love how, when a man has asked for the time "Mate", how flustered they can get when I answer in a very obviously female voice. I don't suppose it helps that I don't wear women's clothing, have a shaved head and no boobs to speak of. :D

I don't think people 'see' beyond general details. My housemate and I have been mistaken for each other many, many times - especially when we were a couple - but we look nothing alike apart from we're both not tall and both average/under-weight.

[rollinat]

I don't think people 'see' beyond general details. My housemate and I have been mistaken for each other many, many times - especially when we were a couple - but we look nothing alike apart from we're both not tall and both average/under-weight.

LOL - my friend and I are still confusing the local pharmacy, only because we are both short, 40-something Scottish women - I guess they still don't really believe there can be two of us! It makes me laugh every time (I am easily amused...)

[Dr.Doo]

LOL - my friend and I are still confusing the local pharmacy, only because we are both short, 40-something Scottish women - I guess they still don't really believe there can be two of us! It makes me laugh every time (I am easily amused...)

Easily amused is no bad thing. It makes for entertaining days :D

[Hi Ho Silver]

I often get called "sir" by rather vague young clerks. I usually just stare at them until they correct themselves. But even worse, a couple times I have been asked if I was a nun ... now that really hurts!

[NbyNW]

Knott, I have no idea how you could be mistaken for a man.

[DebW]

The last couple years I've had young boys asking me if I was a boy or a girl. I think the 3 year old was keying off my unshaved legs, and the 7 year old is at "that age" (he keeps asking me if I wear a bra - I don't). I did freak someone out in the restroom at a movie theater once last year while standing around in my bike helmet. I always wear men's pants or shorts and unisex shirts and have fairly short hair.

Actually, I wish I would have been mistaken for a boy on the phone in the 70s. Instead, when I answered the phone in the bike shop, people would ask to speak to a mechanic (arg!!!, as if a woman can't be a mechanic). That used to really drive me nuts. Now people are generally please to see a woman mechanic in a shop. Though one elderly man a couple months ago ask the manager if I was his wife (as if that's the only reason a woman would work in a shop). The manager handled it well by replying that I was an experienced mechanic.

[OakLeaf]

What's your Q-angle?

I'm sitting here right now at the intermission of a Steve Earle concert. When his guitar player walked onstage with his male pattern baldness, masculine jaw, hint of facial hair and thick wrists, my lizard brain still said "woman." With this thread fresh in my mind, it didn't take me long to figure out that his hips were the reason.

[KnottedYet]

What's your Q-angle?

I'm sitting here right now at the intermission of a Steve Earle concert. When his guitar player walked onstage with his male pattern baldness, masculine jaw, hint of facial hair and thick wrists, my lizard brain still said "woman." With this thread fresh in my mind, it didn't take me long to figure out that his hips were the reason.

I've got an extreme q-angle.

Profoundly hour-glass curves.

Big bazoongas.

Dainty tiny (very tiny) wrists and ankles.

Always dressed "girly", always in at least a little make-up, feminine bobbed hair which is always done up in some way.

But ever since I was a teenager, I get mistaken for a man. Like I said earlier, it has happened even when wearing a camisole and miniskirt.

I just don't know.

[emily_in_nc]

It sounds like maybe it's your height more than anything else.

I'm 5'2" and have never been called "sir", even when dressed extremely unisex and right after a haircut.

That must suck, though. :(

[salsabike]

I bet the height thing is it.

You have the best cheekbones around, girl.

[marni]

I too am short, although with a scandanavian type face, not blonde, flat and I wear my hair in a number 6 buzz. My voice is somewhat low, and I am soft spoken. I am addressed as sir more often than I am as maam, even here is Texas where all the real men are real men. And the majority of women have two huge boobs rather than one fried egg like me, wear makeup unlike me, and are usually wearing coordinated jewelry, purse, cell phone, and lipstick while I wander around in ride t shirts, cargo pants and carry a wallet, so I guess I can't really blame them.

The fun thing about all this is that I also have a very high silly giggle, which I employ every time someone addresses me as sir. It may not change things but it makes me feel better. I so love flaunting stereotypes.

[OakLeaf]

Marni, if that's you in your avatar, I don't know how anyone could mistake you for a man!

[Pax]

I really think it has to do with hair, in our (US) society women are "supposed" to have long hair. I've had little kids ask me if I was a boy or a girl when I was at the pool wearing a swimsuit.

[skhill]

It's weird, but when I was heavier and did all my shopping in the women's department I got "sirred" quite a lot. Now that I'm so thin that I end up wearing boy's clothes much of the time, I don't. (Boy's shorts have usable pockets, women's size 0/2 generally don't). Still have wide shoulders and narrow hips and short hair, and sometimes wear training bras, as it's awfully hard to find AA cups elsewhere. You'd think I'd get "sirred" more now, wouldn't your?

[Trek420]

You have the best cheekbones around, girl.

She sure does, doesn't she? :p:D :cool:

[OakLeaf]

I really think it has to do with hair, in our (US) society women are "supposed" to have long hair.

White women, anyway. A lot of Black women cut their hair very closely (maybe more fashionable a couple of years back than it is now) and still look quite feminine.

But yeah - hair in combination with features goes a long way I think. There was a head-and-shoulders picture of someone in our local paper yesterday. Prominent jaw, high cheekbones, and gelled straight hair about an inch, inch and a half long. The name was kind of androgynous and the story didn't use any pronouns or gender-identifying words. I thought it was a man until another story today said it was a woman.

Can't say what I might've thought if I'd seen the rest of her body, though.

[malkin]

Dunno what to make of it.

Even dressed in a military(ish) suit with a sash and medals with a beard (a good fake beard, stuck on in bits) and a fresh boy's haircut, I couldn't even get anyone to think I was a guy. Not even the kids at school. Not strangers, not anyone.

[Possegal]

I once got a speeding ticket driving back to PA from a weekend in Ontario. I had been at a family wedding and had nice long, well painted fingernails. My hair was very long and "girly" and permed (shut up, that was the fashion then!) :)

I drove away and glanced at the ticket and saw that sex of driver was marked MALE. I asked my federal judge sibling if that was grounds to get out of the ticket - hey, wasn't me driving, clearly I'm not a male! He didn't think so.

Once when my niece was little we were at the mall and someone saw her (with her very short pixie haircut) and said - oh what a cute little (short pause) person! We just laughed as she totally looked like a little boy.

[Pax]

I had an older woman in Alabama actually grab me by the arm to pull me out of the women's restroom, she said "young man, you are in the wrong place!!!". I gently pulled my arm out of her grasp, cupped my breasts (which were at the same level as her nose), and said "ma'am, I am a woman". Her reply??? "well with that hair, who could tell". :rolleyes:

[Biciclista]

Pax, the hair thing is getting to me. Women in this day and age often have really short hair. Where are these people coming from???
But yeah, have you seen the breasts on some guys (bleah) !!!

[jessmarimba]

Once when my niece was little we were at the mall and someone saw her (with her very short pixie haircut) and said - oh what a cute little (short pause) person! We just laughed as she totally looked like a little boy.

I was bald for so long as an infant that my mom had my ears pierced to distinguish that I was a girl. I guess even dressing me in pink wasn't enough (though, from photos, I pretty much ran around in a diaper & t-shirt for a year or two, so it's no wonder people were confused).

I had a pixie cut once. It looked bad enough on me, but I got really tired of people referring to me as a guy that I won't do it again. I don't have much of a figure (or cheekbones) though, so I wasn't too surprised by it. I actually pondered auditioning for an all-male drum corps to see how long til I was caught.

[goldfinch]

I've never had it happen to me. My hair is very short and has been for years. But I am only 4'11'' so I default to woman I guess. Plus, I tend towards round.

Who knows what triggers these mistakes. It seems weird to me.

[GLC1968]

Yeah, the hair thing really surprises me, too. I often have super short hair (like less than an inch short) and while I do make a point of trying to remember to wear earrings when my hair is that short, no one has ever mistook me for a guy.

Maybe there is a regional difference, perhaps? Thinking back, I'm sure that super short hair on a woman would probably have been entirely too modern for most of the people I knew when I lived in the Poconos...so maybe it somewhat depends on where you live?

[spokewench]

Maybe some people are kind of dumb, huh?

Just saying:)

Giggle . . . giggle - snort!:D

[surgtech1956]

I was given a 'senior' discount last week at a fast food restaurant, at least I didn't get called 'sir' that day too.

[Miranda]

Knot... I'm sorry this happened to you. Some people are just idiots. Only buy that stuff from the cosmetics counter if you want. Not because it's suppose to be more womanly.

Though I'm feminine looking, I've always been a Tom-Boy at heart. Mother Nature gave me a little bit too much testoterone in the womb. It's usually how I view things, or what I say, that makes people go... :eek: ...whoa, I can't believe a woman would say/do that. Sometimes it feels like a lot work trying to sugar coat things and pretend to be something you're not in life. Most of the time I just don't... only when I feel like I really have to:rolleyes:.

[malkin]

Maybe some people are kind of dumb, huh?

Just saying:)

Well, that would 'splain it, wouldn't it?

[KnottedYet]

Knot... I'm sorry this happened to you. Some people are just idiots. Only buy that stuff from the cosmetics counter if you want. Not because it's suppose to be more womanly.


Oh, no, I love make-up! (I'm especially fond of lipstick.) Don't worry, I don't buy stuff I don't truly want.

I'm also one heck of a tomboy, but even as a little kid I was the kind of tomboy who wore skirts.

Maybe the salesclerk had a point - maybe it's my height and broad shoulders. I try to be amused by it, but after 30 years of being mistaken it does tend to grind on the soul.

I totally get the dismay transgendered people feel - being identified as the gender you *know* is wrong for you really, really, really sucks!

[hulagirl]

Me too!!! All the time! At least 2-5 times a month.
I'm 5'8", 145 lbs, I don't even own make up, and my earrings are the same ones that have been in my ears for almost 3 years. (little hoops) My hair is about 1" long if that. 34D, tan. ***-kicker.

I think it has something to do with intelligence. For real. It happens here in Hawaii ALL THE TIME. Rarely on the mainland. Go figure.

[Trek420]

Well, that would 'splain it, wouldn't it?

'splains a lot of things :rolleyes:

[Velocivixen]

I'm not saying this applies to you Knotted, but I can usually tell male from female by the way the person moves. Doesn't matter about heights, shoulders, hips, lips, cheekbones or clothes. Even the most beautiful transgendered men dressed as women, with beautifully done hair and makeup, with "femininely" shaped bodies cannot confuse me once I see how they move. I cannot describe it but there is "something" that tells me male from female.

[sgtiger]

Knott, your curves alone scream female and I don't agree with your self assessment that you are not pretty. The people who think you're a dude need their vision checked.

[marni]

dear crankin, thank you.