Tour de France 2011 talk [Archive] - Women's Cycling Discussion Forums

pll

07-01-2011, 06:42 AM

Anyone else is looking forward to the start of the Tour? Yesterday was the team presentation (some weird picture galleries (http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/06/gallery/2011-tour-de-france-team-presentation-%E2%80%94%C2%A0a-casey-b-gibson-gallery_180832/attachment/2011-tour-de-france-17) -- the presentation took place in a fake Colosseum). The argyle is back on the Garmin Cervelo jersey. I like it -- a lot less black on it, so it will be easier to tell them apart from Team Sky or Leopard:

http://velonews.competitor.com/files/2011/06/GarminintroTDFintro711-017-660x439.jpg

Dr.Doo

07-01-2011, 06:58 AM

I'll be rooting for Bradley Wiggins and Team Sky.

WoooHooo it's Tour time. Jeepers! I remember watching Greg Lemond win and then Miguel Indurain's total dominance of the race.

I also remember way back in the day and hearing mention of Eddie Merckx and Laurent Fignon although Le Tour wasn't shown on Brit telly way back then.

jlnc

07-01-2011, 08:36 AM

I'm new to watching it...but looking forward to it! In the states, is it usually on ESPN? Versus?

Possegal

07-01-2011, 08:39 AM

I'm new to watching it...but looking forward to it! In the states, is it usually on ESPN? Versus?

It is on Versus. It will run live in the mornings, starting anywhere from 6 to 8 AM eastern. Then rerun in the afternoons. And then a taped version with more commentary in the evenings.

I've been known to watch it each time through the course of one day. :)

TrekTheKaty

07-01-2011, 08:43 AM

Yeah! Tour starts on my bday. I've already informed friends and coworkers I will be unavailable this month. My heart is with Team Radio Shack, but I'm picking Andy Schleck to win. Is it me or is Team Leopard/Trek the best looking team?

jlnc

07-01-2011, 09:06 AM

Thanks Possegal! 6am huh? Hmmm, maybe I will wait for the taped edition later in the day...I'm not that hardcore. (Yet!) I have a feeling it will become addictive!

ny biker

07-01-2011, 09:21 AM

Mostly it starts at 8 on Versus -- the early starts are for the big mountain stages.

I generally record the live morning broadcast with Phil and Paul, then watch that at night instead of the prime time Americanized version.

(Of course Comcast decided to "upgrade" my on-screen guide and DVR software last week, and I've been having so many problems since then that I'm worried my recordings will get messed up. As it is I need to program every day separately to make sure it gets set up right.)

Thor looked really weird in that wig...

ny biker

07-01-2011, 09:49 AM

And here's a nice little appetizer...

http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/expert-analysis/bikesnobnyc-tour-de-france-2011-viewer-s-guide

Possegal

07-01-2011, 09:52 AM

Thanks Possegal! 6am huh? Hmmm, maybe I will wait for the taped edition later in the day...I'm not that hardcore. (Yet!) I have a feeling it will become addictive!

Yeah, the 6AM ones are only a few and they are the days that they will be pedaling up the mountains for many hours. My family also does what NY biker does and DVRs the live broadcast as there is a lot more Phil and Paul in that one. I've also been known to stream it on one monitor at work, while working on the other monitor. :)

I'm going to go through withdrawal this year though, since last year I was in Rotterdam and Brussels or the first few stages. I want to be there again this year!

azfiddle

07-01-2011, 11:26 AM

We don't have cable so we are purchasing the online service for El Tour, which we did last year. You can watch live or start anytime after and watch any sections you want.

Our local Carmichael Training Center is having an open house on the next 3 Weds evenings, from 5-6:30 to watch the race, with their own commentary and free energy bars and drinks for refreshments. I think we will stop by at least once.

Roadtrip

07-01-2011, 11:47 AM

Wow. TdF. Seems like this past year just flew by. I can't believe it's July again.

I hope Andy finds his form, I'm really rooting for him, but TRS is close to my heart too!

Shannon

ny biker

07-01-2011, 11:50 AM

BTW, we should make it clear now: are spoilers allowed in this thread?

I can't watch video on my pc at work, so I usually follow major races via the live on-screen commentary on velonews.com. It can be surprisingly exciting, even though it's just words on a screen.

Also I see updates on twitter from the various cycling people I follow. I love it when Graham Watson stops at a cafe mid-race to upload photos via his ipad.

TrekTheKaty

07-01-2011, 01:32 PM

"Meanwhile, Andy Schleck doesn’t seem to have the same capacity for ruthlessness. Consider “Chaingate.” After Contador rode away from him on Stage 15, Schleck said “my stomach is full of anger.” However, he acted more like I do when my stomach is full of dessert, which is to say he got all docile and cuddly, and by the end of Stage 17 they were hugging and kissing on the top of the Tourmalet."

Um, yeah. That's true.

hulagirl

07-01-2011, 01:36 PM

23 days of heaven! I watch online and since I work from home I find something to do that allows me to watch in front of my laptop! Usually it's something like glazing tiles for a convention coming up. I LOVE Tour Time!

pll

07-01-2011, 01:38 PM

pll

07-01-2011, 01:39 PM

BTW, we should make it clear now: are spoilers allowed in this thread?

I'd vote for allowing spoilers. Should have added that to the title.

pll

07-01-2011, 01:43 PM

I'm not that hardcore. (Yet!) I have a feeling it will become addictive!

Watching cycling is a bit of an acquired taste. It takes a few days to get hang of how the teams and riders compete. The neat thing is that there are so many competitions rolled into one event: general classification, sprinters, climbers, most aggressive rider, best young rider, team classification, etc. I still find that the sprint stages are a tiny bit dull, except for the last 10 minutes or so, but the mountain stages can have me and the edge of my seat.

malkin

07-01-2011, 01:49 PM

I love the long flat stages through the countryside; complete with the Phil & Paul banter, it is the perfect set up for napping.

ny biker

07-01-2011, 01:51 PM

I still find that the sprint stages are a tiny bit dull, except for the last 10 minutes or so, but the mountain stages can have me and the edge of my seat.

This is why I like Phil and Paul. They fill up the less exciting parts of the stage with information about the history of the region, who built that castle over there in the 1300s, what the farmers grow here, stuff like that.

And France looks really good in high def.

pll

07-01-2011, 02:13 PM

but the mountain stages can have me and the edge of my seat.

Meant to say that the mountain stages can have me on the edge of my seat... And, yes, the French country side look great on TV (as does the Italian and Spanish ones). It makes me lust for the opportunity to tour there.

emily_in_nc

07-01-2011, 04:06 PM

I'm hoping we'll get Versus on our cable in Belize -- we're flying down tomorrow for two weeks. If not, we'll have to catch up online.

I pray Contador doesn't win. Would much rather see Andy or Chris (Horner) beat his azz...

pll

07-02-2011, 08:55 AM

I won't spoil it just yet, but the last 20 miles or so of the first stage were very exciting. The race is on and it will be really interesting. Now, on to get my own bike ride.

malkin

07-02-2011, 09:10 AM

Ashes, ashes,
Many of them fell down...

KnottedYet

07-02-2011, 09:18 AM

Can we make a list of on-line Tour sites for those of us who don't have TV?
(Thor will SMASH!)

Le Tour: http://www.letour.com/us/homepage_courseTDF.html

Snobby: http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/expert-analysis/bikesnobnyc-tour-de-france-2011-viewer-s-guide

Schmalz! Thor will SMASH! http://nyvelocity.com/content/features/2011/tour-day-schmalz-2011-preview

Cycling News: http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france

Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/tourdefrance/

More! We need more!

pll

07-02-2011, 12:21 PM

There are two sites I follow on Twitter that list free online video feeds (sometimes in English, some in Spanish, French, Italian and Dutch... I watch them all the same!) and that is how I managed to see the spring classics this year:

Steephill: http://www.steephill.tv/ (twitter @steephill)
CyclingFans: http://www.cyclingfans.com/ (twitter @cyclingfans)

Both also post pictures. Steephill, in particular, posts large format pictures that are a pleasure to look at.

I should add that Steephill also collects video clips after the stage, the last km, the last 5km, etc. Pretty nice.

withm

07-02-2011, 01:17 PM

I signed up to get the Versus feed online again like I did last year since my cable company does not offer that channel. Go sign in this morning, and I could not get the website to load for anything. Rebooted my computer, cleared out cookies and temp files, log in / out several times. The best I got was about 10 seconds of footage, then it froze. Even the "help" link would not work. If I can't get this to work, I want my money back!

Catrin

07-02-2011, 02:01 PM

pll

07-02-2011, 02:11 PM

Also, cycling.tv offers a free recap every day. I've had a tough time accessing their free stuff, though (too many clicks, having to install Microsoft junkware...).

azfiddle

07-02-2011, 03:58 PM

Withm,
We could not get Versus to work on Firefox or Chrome either, but finally with Explorer.

You might try that...

azfiddle

07-02-2011, 04:06 PM

Oh, and I can't get it to work on on my mac, either...

gabriellesca

07-02-2011, 05:30 PM

I LIVE for the Tour each summer - its really one of the highlights of the season for me (which is a bit sad). I'm rooting for Andy - though secretly will always wish that Christian VandeVeld had a shot at getting on the podium, but sadly I don't think its in the cards for him.

But very excited its back on - I miss Phil Ligget and Bobke when it ends! Watching it now!

Also love that it inspires me to get on my bike whenever I watch!

Trek420

07-02-2011, 05:50 PM

More! We need more!

There's an ap for that. Watching the Tour de France All Access Pass presented by Radio Shack. It'd be better on an iPad, the iPodtouch is a tiny screen but it's great to listen to Phil. This'll be great to download in the morning and listen on the train each day :)

ny biker

07-02-2011, 06:38 PM

Holy cow, could NBC Sports put anymore guys on their post-race wrap-up?? They've got this new McHugh guy, Robbie Ventura, Craig Hummer, Bob, Phil, Paul, and Todd Gogolsky. All in a short span of time.

I have to say, I prefer a time trial prologue to start the race. Jumping right in with a flat stage just doesn't have the same oomph.

Owlie

07-02-2011, 07:43 PM

Hee, my Tour talk mostly includes annoying DBF by saying things like "let's see who's got access to the best shady lab" or "it's a HGH-consumption contest!" ;)

I'm not hard-core (or patient) enough to sit and watch it. I just look up at the end and go "Oh. That's nice" and keep knitting.

Aggie_Ama

07-02-2011, 08:04 PM

I jokingly assigned teams that my animals are rooting for:

Tortilla, the manx cat obviously isn't interested in the stage unless the Manx Missile is going for the win.
Jens, the puppy, will be rooting for Leopard Trek because Jens Voigt said he can't use his name without being a fan.
Heidi our little white schnauzer loves Garmin-Cervelo because Thor is blond. But she is also a fan of BMC because I have told her to cheer for Big George Hincapie for years.

Me? Anybody but Contador. I didn't like him the first year he burst on to the scene, not sure why. I like Cadel a lot, seems really genuine and he gets pissed if the reporters encroach on his dog. I would like to see this be his year. We also tape Phil and Paul. You get funny soundbites "that was a cheeky move", a wine guide, a history lesson of the country and their banter with one another.

withm

07-02-2011, 08:57 PM

Withm,
We could not get Versus to work on Firefox or Chrome either, but finally with Explorer.

You might try that...

I'm using IE 8 with XP Pro and SP#3. And made sure I had Silverlight installed, but still can't get anything to come up. Except for all the Radioshack commercials at the top of the screen.

Catrin - it's only $29.95 for the month of Versus coverage on your computer. That is IF IT WORKS! Just one month - no contracts - when the tour is over so is your access.

Tonight it looks like my cable company has dropped the NBC affiliate from our coverage - which is almost enough for me to cancel the cable entirely. I live in an area where there is no TV coverage anywhere without cable. If the sun and wind are in alignment you can get one station, and sometimes a PBS station but mostly it's snow. If you want to even watch local news you have to have cable.

azfiddle

07-02-2011, 09:13 PM

I wrote and complained to nbc sports. But I suspect we aren't the only ones!

withm

07-02-2011, 09:17 PM

I wrote and complained to nbc sports. But I suspect we aren't the only ones!

Please post if you get a response. Without the internet feed, nor NBC coverage I'm feeling like a fish without a bicycle. LOL!

Koronin

07-02-2011, 10:17 PM

We watched the live coverage on VS. Well actually hubby watched the whole thing, I only saw the last about hour and a half or so. We didn't see the NBC coverage.

Catrin

07-03-2011, 04:59 AM

Catrin - it's only $29.95 for the month of Versus coverage on your computer. That is IF IT WORKS! Just one month - no contracts - when the tour is over so is your access...

Sigh... dam*** emergency room bills...

Crankin

07-03-2011, 05:07 AM

VS is NBC.... they bought them last year.

The improvement in the high def pictures since we started watching in 1999 is incredible. While I don't sit glued to the screen for 3 hours (yesterday, I managed to see the whole thing in pieces.. a bit in the AM, some at noon, and the finish at night), I love listening to all of the details, the history, tidbits about the riders as I am going about my business in the house.

We watched part of the Giro on Universal and the video just sucked compared to the Tour. I stopped watching it on TV, and just looked at little pieces on the computer.
Funny, even though I watched some of the spring classics, with Phil and Paul, and Bobke, it doesn't feel the same as hearing them do the Tour.

Bike Chick

07-03-2011, 05:12 AM

I love the Tour and day one has already proven exciting. Team time trial is beginning now. I am so glad they brought it back this year. I love watching the teams working in a group.

Has anyone else seen Fabian Cancellara's TT bike (http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/06/tour-de-france/quick-look-fabian-cancellaras-trek-speed-concept-tt-bike_180723)? It's the coolest bike I've ever seen.

pll

07-03-2011, 05:31 AM

Sigh... dam*** emergency room bills...

Go to the Steephill site I linked above. There is an unrestricted Versus feed and also a free feed from French TV. Just tested them and they work. Of course, it's only the live version.

Correction: the Eurosport feed works, French commentary (not the channel 2 from France).

gabriellesca

07-03-2011, 06:07 PM

SO HAPPY that Garmin rocked the TTT today - I've always loved Christian and David Millar and I'm pumped they had this victor and Thor is in yellow! Yea!!!

I keep posting my Tour excitement on my FB page to crickets - none of my friends are into it and could care less. Find it so much more exciting than football or baseball.

PinkBike

07-03-2011, 06:16 PM

i love love love love the tour!
check this bike out:
team sky's pinarello in their new kit colors.
i am also pulling for anybody but contador.
i like fabian and jens voigt and tom boonen and philipe gilbert and sylvain chavanel.
have to admit i really like cavendish too (he signed my bike!!!!)
anyway, we get up early to watch the coverage, also DVR it, also have it on all day so we catch glimpses as we cruise by.
my whole month of july belongs to le tour!!!

PinkBike

07-03-2011, 06:19 PM

oh, and i read tour de schmalz every day of the tour. its not the tour without schmalz commentary! someone else already posted the link (nyvelocity).

malkin

07-03-2011, 07:42 PM

If you're wondering, "What's that they're waving?" Check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_the_regions_of_France

If nothing looks like what you're looking for, scroll down to the blue outlined Lists of Flags. You can search by animal, shapes, and of course country. My favorites are "special and fictional" and "unrecognized."

Realgone

07-03-2011, 10:09 PM

I cannot watch it the same way anymore. All I can think about is, I wonder how much they are juicing and how much Lance was juicing, though I never really doubted it. I am sure I will still enjoy it none the less.

Lauralyn

07-04-2011, 05:16 AM

I love the Tour, I record it and watch it over and over. I like Thor and Tyler Farrar on Team Garmin and would love it if they won.

bmccasland

07-04-2011, 07:45 AM

It's different this year because I'm in a new office and no one around me is interested.

MuddyTrails

07-04-2011, 08:04 AM

I'm watching the Tour as I type, on Spanish TV -- which requires incredible patience, because the commentators are really quite boring. Nevertheless, I'm very much enjoying this in lieu of siesta, especially because I used the earlier parts of the stage as inspiration for getting on the trainer :). (A girl can dream).

Anyway, I thought you'd like to know that SRM is transmitting live the stats of 10 randomly chosen riders each day. Go to their main page (srm.de) and select the coverage of the Tour 2011 to see the riders who are transmitting that day.

Happy riding, and Happy Fourth of July to those of you in the US.

MuddyTrails

pll

07-04-2011, 08:07 AM

@MuddyTrails: That's a great link. Thank you!!

@bmccasland: That means you'll discuss more TdF in this forum, right? And you may make some converts at work... Hope your knee is steadily improving.

Susan126

07-04-2011, 08:55 AM

July is one of my favorite months of the year because of:

1. My son's birthday on the 6th
2. My husband's birthday on the 13th
3. the Fourth
4. and THE TOUR de FRANCE!!!!!

I watch it religiously every July from day one until the final laps around the Champs-Élysées!!!! I started following/watching the Tour in 1999 when Lance won his first one that year.

July just isn't July without the above four events! :D

Oh and I am off during the summer months too. Bonus for being a library secretary in a middle school! :)

And did you see today's finish?! Wow Tyler Farrar was awesome. I sort of felt bad for Cavendish but oh well. And Tyler dedicated his win to his friend, Wouter Weylandt. Did you see him flash the "W" with his hands?! How great was that?! So Thor Hushovd maintains the yellow jersey.

KnottedYet

07-04-2011, 09:52 AM

So Thor Hushovd maintains the yellow jersey.

Thor SMASH! :D

MuddyTrails

07-04-2011, 10:09 AM

@pll Glad you liked the link!

Today's finish was absolutely brilliant! I'm not a big Hushovd fan, but he was quite a team player, helping Farrar win the stage. I was surprised to see JJ Rojas (Movistar) fighting it to the end. However, it was scary to see the endo by one of the riders, about 2 kms. from the finish line. Does anyone know who it was that crashed, and is he OK?

MuddyTrails

pll

07-04-2011, 10:45 AM

@MuddyTrails: It seems it was Samuel Dumoulin (http://www.equipe-cofidis.com/route/fiche-coureur.asp?id=9) from Cofidis (I infer based on the red uniform and the fact that Phil said "Samuel something" in the recap (http://www.steephill.tv/players/720/nbcsports/?title=Stage+3+Recap&dashboard=tour-de-france&id=43631832&yr=2011)).

I liked that Hushovd led and celebrated the win. Here's a blurry shot of Thor smiling and raising his fist as Tyler wins:

pll

07-04-2011, 11:01 AM

Confirmation... it was Dumoulin. He says so in Twitter (http://twitter.com/#!/SamuelDumoulin): "Fall into the last corner. I am very disappointed because the team had done a great job. Fortunately no wounds but an opportunity missed."

Jo-n-NY

07-04-2011, 11:38 AM

Catrin

07-04-2011, 11:43 AM

Trek420

07-04-2011, 11:44 AM

What gives with the UCI. Are they trying to be disliked?

~ JoAnn

They were "liked" before? :confused:

pll

07-04-2011, 11:48 AM

Thor and Cav lost all the sprint points from the intermediate sprint. Cav was tucked behind Gilbert and Thor tried to get into Gilbert's wheel. Cav responded with a slight headbutt and pushed him away (a-la-Renshaw... maybe HTC practices this). Thor offered to take the full blame and punishment.

pll

07-04-2011, 11:51 AM

Read on twitter about Cav & Thor being DQ'd in a sprint today. Anyone know why.

Also Johan was fined because of an unprofessional comment. USI just decided for this tour to change the seat position. A brand new rule. Didn't apply to other races and all the wind tunnel testing and training with the original seat position is thrown out the window. What gives with the UCI. Are they trying to be disliked?

~ JoAnn

I'd be surprised if Johan was the only one fined. It seems many of the teams were very upset and rightly so. The rule about the seats appears to be a bit vague, it had not been interpreted in that fashion the entire season... and then you force last minute adjustments that cold even injure a cyclist. Not logical.

pll

07-04-2011, 11:58 AM

I can't get any of the free video feeds to work...sniff. I did, however, get the audio daily podcast working so that is better than nothing. NEXT year I am going to get cable, even if it is only for the month of July so I can watch the TDF!

Bummer. Have you tried the Belgian "Sporza" one (the one in bold characters)? That works, too, and then you can pair it with some English audio feed. They start around 7am CST and the race is usually over by ~10:30am. The SPorza broadcast continues after the race with interviews (usually some in English) and the jersey presentations, so it can be fun if you have the time. The feed usually does not start right away... it takes a few seconds, maybe a minute to start. I usually click it, move on to a different browser tab, until I hear the Dutch chatter...

Correction: That would be flemish chatter! And the feed I mean is the following one from http://www.steephill.tv/tour-de-france/#live
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-R9ZM6BD_LFY/ThIOjLxibOI/AAAAAAAAdB8/M599XUerVwQ/s800/sporza.png

TrekTheKaty

07-04-2011, 12:11 PM

Can I switch? Go Garmin :D

KnottedYet

07-04-2011, 12:44 PM

Thor offered to take the full blame and punishment.

Thor. What a gentleman.

(wonder how much he juices?)

Thor SMASH! Literally? ;)

ny biker

07-04-2011, 01:39 PM

I'd be surprised if Johan was the only one fined. It seems many of the teams were very upset and rightly so. The rule about the seats appears to be a bit vague, it had not been interpreted in that fashion the entire season... and then you force last minute adjustments that cold even injure a cyclist. Not logical.

Riis was also fined.

http://johanbruyneel.com/blog/2011tdfblog3.html

KnottedYet

07-04-2011, 07:08 PM

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_bVXhukiAhF8/TJalx2Y8x6I/AAAAAAAAAuo/ECJ2hw1nPs0/s1600/everymanahero.gif

beccaB

07-05-2011, 11:00 AM

I love the commercials.

ny biker

07-05-2011, 11:10 AM

The really bad song in the Izod commercials is annoying me, as is the Cadillac commercial with the little boy riding his tricycle like a madman with no adult supervision. But I really like the Road ID commercials. Poor Bobke.

This is a nice article about CVV:

http://espn.go.com/blog/olympics/post/_/id/978/christian-vande-velde-puts-decade-old-disappointment-behind-him-after-ttt-win

Also Chris Horner's blog is always a good read:

http://www.cascadegranfondo.com/blog/tdf-stage-four-cutting-it-close

denda

07-05-2011, 12:43 PM

I love tour time!

pll

07-05-2011, 01:16 PM

The really bad song in the Izod commercials is annoying me, as is the Cadillac commercial with the little boy riding his tricycle like a madman with no adult supervision. But I really like the Road ID commercials. Poor Bobke.

I will confess that I enter each year's giveaway for a a trip for the subsequent year's tour. In previous years, you had to 'spin' a wheel of fortune where you could win a yellow jersey. This year it is a "Clean Bottle" -- this is the first time I really don't want to win!

malkin

07-05-2011, 05:41 PM

Thor de France!

(Because Thor is a god and McHugh pronounces "Tour" like "Thor" unless you think Thor is pronouced like "thorn" without the "n.")

KnottedYet

07-05-2011, 07:53 PM

Tyler is my homeboy! http://seattlebikeblog.com/2011/07/05/after-getting-start-in-the-seattle-area-farrar-wins-stage-3-of-tour-de-france/

Little did I know... guess I should pay more attention, eh?

Rootin' for Tyler and Thor. How convenient! :D

ny biker

07-05-2011, 08:28 PM

You know, hats off to Cadel today. He had derailleur problems, thought they were fixed, but Big George told him to change bikes rather than take a chance on the final climb. After the bike change he had to motor to get back to the front of the pack before the climb, and he still managed to win the stage. Great job for him and Team BMC.

margo49

07-05-2011, 09:14 PM

Brilliant last 2 km...
Cadel Evans gave a lovely modest interview (Eurosport) giving credit to the rider who got him back up after the bike-change and the team in general.
Now that is a real sportsman.

That said, GO GARMIN!

Aggie_Ama

07-06-2011, 06:29 AM

Yesterday was one of the most exciting bike races I have seen in a long time. Contador looked weak though, he should have been able to pull away on a Cat 3. Maybe he just didn't have it but I have never seen him look so beatable.

Love George Hincapie and he did what was needed to get Cadel in position. Are we the only ones who think Cav is a bit silly for sitting up? This isn't the first time I have seen him do that in a race, he wants the win or none but that doesn't always translate to green. Exciting tour so far, loving it!

denda

07-06-2011, 06:40 AM

Ouch! That was a scary crash that took out the Radio Shack rider:(

roadie gal

07-06-2011, 06:51 AM

Yesterday's finish was great. I was so impressed with George Hincape's long turn at the front, and Thor's keeping up at the end. I love that he's still in yellow. I also loved that Cadel Evans pulled out the win over Contador.

This morning is a crash fest. Wow

tulip

07-06-2011, 10:46 AM

France is beautiful. Brittany is even more beautiful. That is all I can say.

bluebug32

07-06-2011, 12:09 PM

So much carnage today! But I can't say I minded watching Contador take a little spill. Keeps him humble ;)

margo49

07-06-2011, 12:39 PM

Another great finish and good to see Cav getting one finally.
And without upsetting the Classement Generale.
GO GARMIN! GO CLEAN!
Lotta people will be hurting tonight and sticking to their sheets with weeping road-rash.
There was a rumour that motorcycle camera guy was fired on the spot for taking out Sorenson - anyone know anything?

pll

07-06-2011, 01:54 PM

Sorensen was clipped by a motorcycle from Getty Images as it was trying to pass him. Knocked him off the bike and dragged the bike for 200 meters. The description and the video clip are in a VeloNews note (http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/news/crashes-ko-brajkovic-contador-leipheimer-gesink-all-hit-deck_182201/2).

bmccasland

07-06-2011, 06:42 PM

The Tour was rough today. Ouch! :eek:

Was amused by Contador's temper tamtrum, throwing his bike in the ditch. Can I have it? :rolleyes:

bluebug32

07-06-2011, 06:46 PM

The Tour was rough today. Ouch! :eek:

Was amused by Contador's temper tamtrum, throwing his bike in the ditch. Can I have it? :rolleyes:

LOL...He better his game together soon, start paying attention and riding closer to the front.

azfiddle

07-06-2011, 09:15 PM

Trek420

07-06-2011, 09:52 PM

Was amused by Contador's temper tamtrum, throwing his bike in the ditch. Can I have it? :rolleyes:

What's the saying "the bad carpenter blames his tools" :p :rolleyes: ;)

ny biker

07-06-2011, 09:53 PM

Just got home from the first of 3 open house "Watch The Tour de France" evenings at the Carmichael training center. They showed potions of the first 5 stages of the tour, with commentary and answers to questions as we watched.

I came in a little late and missed the introductions (if there were any), so I did not know the name of the person was doing the commentary (until later), but as he spoke, referring to "when I rode the tour..." and "When I talked to Tyler after the stage today..." as he pointed out moments that demonstrated good strategies, poor timing, etc., I realized what an amazing insider's perspective and insight we were getting.

Our narrator was Gord Fraser, who has some impressive Olympic and pro cycling credentials. I know he and Tyler Farrar were team mates at one time, but I got the impression he may also be coaching Tyler as well. Two of the regular Carmichael coaches were there as well.

And we got some freebies- water bottles & GU products. I'm going back next week. They're raffling off a bike fit!

Sounds like fun!!

It's high time we discussed the important issue of podium outfits. I like the black dresses worn by the women who present the stage-winner stuff, though they're almost too much for daytime. The yellow jersey women seem to have a different outfit every day. They're pretty classic styling, okay, nothing exciting. I don't like the dresses worn by the green jersey women -- white with green collar and belt. They're too sporty.

I still haven't seen the polka dot or young rider presentations. I wonder if we can see up the skirts of the polka dot dresses again this year.

ny biker

07-06-2011, 09:55 PM

What's the saying "the bad carpenter blames his tools" :p :rolleyes: ;)

I imagine he was just frustrated. One of the guys from Rabobank yelled when he crashed, and I'm pretty sure he said "motherf****r."

I don't think anyone was happy with today's route. The scenary was beautiful, though. I bet they get some cold winds on that coast!!

blue_angel

07-07-2011, 04:34 AM

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_bVXhukiAhF8/TJalx2Y8x6I/AAAAAAAAAuo/ECJ2hw1nPs0/s1600/everymanahero.gif

This is completely awesome!

I've never watched the Tour before, and have always wondered what people liked about watching others ride bikes. But after skimming through the enthusiastic comments on this thread yesterday, I decided to watch the 8 pm Stage 5 broadcast. GRIPPING! Seriously, I am now obsessed. I'm preparing to turn the TV on in a few minutes to catch the live morning broadcast. You all have created a monster!

Mako

07-07-2011, 05:01 AM

This is completely awesome!

I've never watched the Tour before, and have always wondered what people liked about watching others ride bikes.

I didn't get it either....I used to be like 'how can you watch three hours of this?'

Then I started riding and watching last year, and because of the tour endured one of the most 'unproductive' three weeks of my life!

Aggie_Ama

07-07-2011, 05:32 AM

Sounds like fun!!

It's high time we discussed the important issue of podium outfits. I like the black dresses worn by the women who present the stage-winner stuff, though they're almost too much for daytime. The yellow jersey women seem to have a different outfit every day. They're pretty classic styling, okay, nothing exciting. I don't like the dresses worn by the green jersey women -- white with green collar and belt. They're too sporty.

I still haven't seen the polka dot or young rider presentations. I wonder if we can see up the skirts of the polka dot dresses again this year.

Slight threadjack but did you see the dresses the girls wore at the Tour de Suisse? They were hideous, mid calf, not much style! I like to see the dresses too. I thought last year's polka dot girls dresses were hilarious, it was over the top like the tour. Of course I did hear all the talk about how they had matching polka dot undies.

Found a photo of the polka dot dresses, ummmmmm..... It looks very unflattering, what is that a housecoat? And the young rider dresses, nothing exciting just simple.

ny biker

07-07-2011, 09:36 AM

Slight threadjack but did you see the dresses the girls wore at the Tour de Suisse? They were hideous, mid calf, not much style! I like to see the dresses too. I thought last year's polka dot girls dresses were hilarious, it was over the top like the tour. Of course I did hear all the talk about how they had matching polka dot undies.

Found a photo of the polka dot dresses, ummmmmm..... It looks very unflattering, what is that a housecoat? And the young rider dresses, nothing exciting just simple.

Oh my eyes!!!!! It looks like they took some polka dot curtains and made frocks out of them, like Carol Burnett's version of Gone with the Wind. And I'm pretty sure those giant red dots could induce seizures.

The white ones aren't bad, kinda dull but I like the shape.

And yes, the Swiss dresses were horrible!! And what was with those hats??

KatzPajamas

07-07-2011, 05:14 PM

This is completely awesome!

I've never watched the Tour before, and have always wondered what people liked about watching others ride bikes. But after skimming through the enthusiastic comments on this thread yesterday, I decided to watch the 8 pm Stage 5 broadcast. GRIPPING! Seriously, I am now obsessed. I'm preparing to turn the TV on in a few minutes to catch the live morning broadcast. You all have created a monster!

Never really understood what the hoopla was either until I began riding and found out how difficult it is.Talk about monsters...my husband takes a week vacation to watch the Tour, we buy the Versus access so we can watch it again at our whim...This year I am right there with him! Completely awesome! :cool:

Trek420

07-07-2011, 10:02 PM

Go Norway! Thor will smash. :D

rubysoho

07-08-2011, 03:58 AM

I was finally able to watch last night. The first thing I saw was each cyclist grabbing a bag of food and whatever else they had then a few proceeded to ride with no hands, staying ahead of others, and rearrange their goodies into their back pockets. How the heck do that do that?!?!? I am so jealous. :p I still wobble a bit when I drink my water and I definitely don't keep the same speed when I drink.

ny biker

07-08-2011, 09:22 AM

Dammit!! Horner crashed and finished > 12 minutes back today. Hopefully he is not too badly injured.

Wiggins went down in the same crash and is out with a broken collarbone. Boonen abandoned due to injuries from the other day.

I hate the carnage. Prefer to see guys fighting it out, not gaining or losing time because of bad luck.

denda

07-08-2011, 10:09 AM

Man, Radio Shack is having nothing but BAD luck! I hate that some of the big name guys of the Tour are in so many of the crashes. Although I wouldn't be too upset if Contador was in a few more:o

ny biker

07-08-2011, 10:14 AM

Horner's on the way to the hospital to have his head checked out.

Update from Bruyneel: Chris fractured his nose and has a concussion and calf hematoma.

Dislike!!!

Mako

07-08-2011, 12:03 PM

Cavtastic!!!!!!

But poor Wiggins - gutted :(

pll

07-08-2011, 01:09 PM

Could we abstain from wishing crashes on any cyclist? I know Contador is the evil guy of the day, but from disliking him to wishing he would crash, there is a huge distance... I find such wishes appalling.

Horner hit his head hard. If he has a concussion (which it looks like the case, judging by his confusion at the finish line about actually having crashed and finished -- see the video from bicycling.com clip here (http://bit.ly/qJEMW5)), I hope he does not start tomorrow. It would be too dangerous if he were to fall again.

bmccasland

07-08-2011, 01:15 PM

I thought if you didn't finish a race you were out. Granted it's been a while since I've read the race rules on the official tour website. How does one go get checked out at a hospital and get back to complete a race with sufficent time to not be disqualified?

pll

07-08-2011, 01:17 PM

Horner was taken to the hospital *after* finishing the stage.

ny biker

07-08-2011, 01:19 PM

I'm really surprised they let him finish the stage. Usually if a rider is confused like that after a crash, they put him in the ambulance right away.

pll

07-08-2011, 01:25 PM

I'm really surprised they let him finish the stage. Usually if a rider is confused like that after a crash, they put him in the ambulance right away.

I know! Did you the video I linked? He did not seem to remember crashing or understand that he had finished. How did he ride 25km in that condition? he must have simply gotten on his bike before medical personnel even looked at him.

blue_angel

07-08-2011, 01:39 PM

Horner hit his head hard. If he has a concussion (which it looks like the case, judging by his confusion at the finish line about actually having crashed and finished -- see the video from bicycling.com clip here (http://bit.ly/qJEMW5)), I hope he does not start tomorrow. It would be too dangerous if he were to fall again.

That is so insane! I can't even believe that he managed to finish the stage in that condition. It just goes to show how incredibly *trained* these guys are--they can do it on reflex.

Man, Team Radio Shack is really trapped under a cloud. Here's hoping that nothing else bad befalls any of them!

ny biker

07-08-2011, 01:52 PM

I haven't watched the video yet.

But the thing is, Bruyneel has said that he stopped and found Horner lying in a ditch, and could see he had crashed hard. So Horner did not get back on his bike without help from the team. That's why I'm surprised he continued the race. Bruyneel may be an aggressive manager but I do believe he puts the health of his riders ahead of everything. I remember a TdF a few years back where one of his key climbers crashed and then started to race again, but after a bit they spoke to him and determined he had signs of a concussion, at which point they took him from the race right away.

And even if the race doctor was busy with other riders, you would think that at some point he would have caught up with Horner to check him out.

So maybe Chris was coherent enough that the extent of his injuries was not so clear.

Regardless, I hope he recovers quickly, along with all the other injured riders.

update: nice blog post from Jani Brajkovic:

http://www.livestrong.com/teamradioshack/news_jani-brajkovic-writes-blog-with-left-hand/

denda

07-08-2011, 02:29 PM

Pll - Sorry, it was just a bad joke. I don't wish anyone to get hurt. I would really like Contador to have a strong finish and someone beat him in a very close finish.

Mako

07-08-2011, 02:58 PM

http://www.livestrong.com/teamradioshack/news_jani-brajkovic-writes-blog-with-left-hand/

Gosh, he seem like a nice chap, and has some thoughtful points!

I hope that he heals well and that team Radioshack's luck improves - they seem to have had a rough ride so far :(

Dr.Doo

07-08-2011, 03:06 PM

Cavtastic!!!!!!

But poor Wiggins - gutted :(

The Missile is awesome isn't he. Reminds me in some respects of Super Mario (Cipollini). :D

Poor Bradley...he was my pick for the maillot jaune on the Champs Elysee :(

I wonder what's going to happen with Contador. To be honest I don't think he should be riding with an unresolved doping case hanging over his head. What if he wins this Tour and the appeal to the Court of Arbitration for sport upholds the doping allegations in August? I don't think Millar and a number of others who've be caught doping should be allowed to ride in the sports most prestigious race either - or the Vuelta/Giro/Paris-Roubaix et al.

Mako

07-08-2011, 03:20 PM

The Missile is awesome isn't he. Reminds me in some respects of Super Mario (Cipollini). :D

I understand that people can see him as being arrogant, but I can't help but like the fella! Possibly Sonic the Hedgehog too?

I certainly have reservations about Contador, really not my favourite rider!
I don't wish him any harm and actually felt bad to see him all scuffed up the other day. However, all this 'unresolved business' seems to cast a bit of a shadow over the tour, especially if he won.

ivorygorgon

07-08-2011, 04:20 PM

ohhhh Chris!!!!! My heart is broken. It made me tear up to see how confused he was. I was sooooo rooting for him.

Dr.Doo

07-08-2011, 04:45 PM

I understand that people can see him as being arrogant, but I can't help but like the fella! Possibly Sonic the Hedgehog too?

I certainly have reservations about Contador, really not my favourite rider!
I don't wish him any harm and actually felt bad to see him all scuffed up the other day. However, all this 'unresolved business' seems to cast a bit of a shadow over the tour, especially if he won.

I think it's just that I believe Cav is going to become the Tours dominant sprinter like Mario was back in the day rather than any arrogance. When you're that good you're allowed to be a little big 'eaded. I adore Cav as I adored Il Re Leone. :)

I'd put money on Contador not winning this Tour. Just a feeling.

ny biker

07-08-2011, 05:13 PM

Actually, Cipo thinks Cavendish's attitude is holding him back:

http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/news/cipollini-cavendish-still-has-a-lot-to-learn_182458

This is an interesting article about head injuries:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/pro-cycling-plagued-by-head-injuries

BTW according to the twitter, Horner is spending the night in the hospital for observation but is doing better.

pll

07-08-2011, 05:20 PM

I like seeing Cavendish sprint, but I often find him arrogant (a good reason not to listen to his interviews), blaming the global conspiracy against him when he loses.

The CAS should have decided on the Contador case prior to the Tour. I do not get what the hold up was, to postpone a decision until August. Should Contador win and the CAS decide against him would be just be terrible. I still feel for Oscar Pereiro, who was second to Floyd Landis in 2006 -- I doubt that there is much personal satisfaction in being awarded the win years later.

Finally, re Horner, seeing the footage is really frightening. And now I read (in Cycling News (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/pro-cycling-plagued-by-head-injuries)) that apparently Tom Boonen also had a head injury and "other riders complained that the Belgian was a danger to the peloton". Yet he was allowed to decide himself whether to continue... If the rider could have a concussion, he should not be the one making the call. According to the article, Team Garmin Cervelo seem to be taking steps in that direction, training all the staff to follow a protocol.

PS: Article linked above is the same linked by ny_biker. Sorry for the duplication.

ny biker

07-08-2011, 05:22 PM

Great minds think alike!! :D

Dr.Doo

07-08-2011, 05:24 PM

Pot, kettle and black come to mind. Cipo's attitude was never the best :D However I do agree with him in that Cav has an awful lot to learn. There's a 'dig' at the end of that piece about him (Cipo) being steeped in cycling 'history' merely by being Italian and it being their culture and Cav being pretty much a country bumpkin...Attitude much!

Has to be said that Britain has a fantastic cycling history and heritage.

bmccasland

07-08-2011, 06:04 PM

Am home after sneaking peeks at the TdF website at the office....

:eek: Holy Cow, how on God's green earth did Horner finish that ride? :eek: I saw the film footage when I turned on The Tour at home. How scary.

Hope he gets to feeling better soon.

Jani's blog was interesting, especially his final comment.

loopybunny

07-08-2011, 06:27 PM

So maybe Chris was coherent enough that the extent of his injuries was not so clear.

Saul Raisin was coherent once in the hospital and it took a while for the bleeding to become serious enough that he slipped into a coma.

Natasha Richardson was coherent after her skiing accident as well.

It seems to me that because of the mystery surrounding brain injuries that if someone shows even the slightest possibility they may have a concussion, the injury needs to be taken very seriously.

I'm letting Chris's accident get to me a little too much. That video was just heartbreaking.

bluebug32

07-08-2011, 07:25 PM

So sad to see Horner is this condition. Also sad that he was on my fantasy team! :(

Aggie_Ama

07-09-2011, 02:15 AM

I think given the amount of things that are being learned about head injuries cycling needs to take a better stance on them. These men are pressuring themselves to be a a danger to their health and others by riding. They really need to have a way the doctors can say "NO MORE". Football is finally starting to see the light and cycling needs to follow suit. What scares me is we now know that this many head injuries can lead to life long issues but cycling seems to treat it as par for the course.

I can't believe the number of big names abandoning from crashes. And on Contador, I don't want him to crash but I do like that he is not having everything go his way. It seems like he needs a bad grand tour to bring him down a notch. I don't like him racing when he could end up banned and being stripped of any wins.

pll

07-09-2011, 05:56 AM

Talking about bad luck for a team, the situation of Movistar is particularly sad. Coming into the tour, they were dealing with the death of Xavi Tondo in a freak accident with a garage door, while Mauricio Soler has serious neurological deficits after a crash in the Tour de Suisse. During this tour, two of their young riders, Andrey Amador and Beñat Intxausti (fracture of the radius on stage 1, diagnosed yesterday -- he was in the same ambulance as Horner), were injured in a crash, and Vasil Kiryienka abandoned, sick. I've been rooting for their sprinter, José Joaquín Rojas, who is clearly putting an effort to get the green jersey. It has been neat to see him get some stages from teams with serious lead outs for their sprinters.

Things are definitely not going Contador's way. He seems tired after the Giro, and it does not look like he has a good enough team. The team has been invisible.

tulip

07-09-2011, 08:12 AM

What a great finish! I can't remember if spoilers are allowed here, so that's all I'll say.

pll

07-09-2011, 08:26 AM

Thor de France! :D

http://velonews.competitor.com/files/2011/06/ThorGarminTDFintro711-012-660x439.jpg

ny biker

07-09-2011, 08:44 PM

So, Chris is doing better, two head scans have been clear, and he's already looking forward to next year's TdF. Me personally, I think he and Jani will light things up at the Vuelta this year.

This is from this morning:

http://lockerz.com/s/118442988

And yeah, Thor is pretty amazing. And go Tejay!!!

bluebug32

07-09-2011, 08:48 PM

Is it just me or was Contador climbing with a limp of sorts? Didn't look smooth at all on the pedals. Maybe he was injured a bit more in that crash than he let on.

pll

07-10-2011, 09:10 AM

The events on today's stage were nauseating. Unreal.

Two of those events:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKuJCGV8m-w
http://www.flickr.com/photos/francetvsport/5921834685/in/photostream

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 09:19 AM

I'm stupid. I've watched that clip 4 or 5 times now and absolutely cannot see how Karpets had anything to do with it. Even in slo-mo, I just can't see how Karpets was close enough, it looks like he was a bike length ahead?

Ug, and WTF with the team car.... if I was driving and a tree was coming up, I'd make the choice to put the car in the ditch rather than wipe out a couple riders... sick.

ETA: ah, it was a TV car http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/jul/10/tour-de-france-stage-nine-live

pll

07-10-2011, 09:49 AM

It's hard to tell much from the video, so we'll have to wait maybe until tomorrow to find out... I just saw some Twitter comments and it appears Riis suggested that Contador's brake hood got caught in Karpets' saddle (Karpets is ~5.5 inches taller).

The car was apparently one with VIPs from France TV. Should have hit the brakes instead of veering into the riders. Almost took Voeckler out, too.

Update: VeloNews (http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/news/alberto-contador-hits-deck-in-stage-9-of-2011-tour-de-france-after-getting-tangled-with-vladimir-karpets_183028) quotes both Karpets and Contador -- it was an accident.

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 10:01 AM

There was an interesting comment to the Guardian story, where someone (associated with the Tour, but I don't remember who) said there have been more crashes lately, and thinks it's due to the riders being less careful now that they all wear helmets.

Reminded me of a statistic I read on automobile-related fatalities in the US. It's been holding steady around 40,000+ per year for decades, regardless of all the amazingly effective new safety additions to modern cars. People drive more aggressively the safer they feel, and only modify behaviour as the fatality rate begins to exceed the "acceptable" level.

(meanwhile I think the bike-related fatality rate in the US is something like 700+ per year... but everyone thinks biking is far more dangerous)

pll

07-10-2011, 10:08 AM

Well, today Bobke had a great one. According to him, it turns out that Contador is to blame for the nervousness of the peloton. He looks vulnerable and has crashed. Therefore, there is a sense of urgency and everybody wants to get up front... I guess Contador should swap costumes with Didi Senft for the rest of this tour.

Dr.Doo

07-10-2011, 10:43 AM

Poor Vinokourov...they were talking about it being a career ending injury. I hope, for him, that it's not.

Great to see someone else take the maillot jaune today.

tulip

07-10-2011, 10:54 AM

pll

07-10-2011, 10:55 AM

Terrible accident for Vino.

Re Chris Horner, read today that he still does not remember the entire first week of the TdF, but otherwise feels great. He twitted a picture of him having dessert (http://twitpic.com/5o7apv)... looks like a fast food place. In France, in a fast food place? :eek:

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 11:07 AM

I suppose if I'd got my brains rattled and the snot wolloped out of me, I'd be craving some McDonald's comfort food, too.

http://twitpic.com/5o76et

Mmm, french fries in France... ;)

blue_angel

07-10-2011, 11:18 AM

What a terrible bunch of crashes. I ache for Vinikourov; he was so fabulous yesterday. The media car that hit Flecha/Hoogerland (and almost Tommy) was just plain wrong. I've watched the tour since 1984 and I don't recall a car hitting a rider before (although I could have repressed it in all these years).

Tommy Voeckler is just delightful to watch, though, and I'm so glad he's in yellow. Remember in 2004 when he just couldn't believe himself. He was all smiles, just like today when he hopped with joy on the podium. He's one of my favorite riders.

Voeckler has totally won my heart. He's just an amazing cyclist--his strategy looks so well executed, he works so hard, and he just pours everything into it.

As for the car clipping those riders today, it makes me sick how cavalier those people are being with not only the outcome of the stage, but also with those riders' lives! TV France should have its filming privileges revoked for this.

Eden

07-10-2011, 11:23 AM

There was an interesting comment to the Guardian story, where someone (associated with the Tour, but I don't remember who) said there have been more crashes lately, and thinks it's due to the riders being less careful now that they all wear helmets.

Baloney.... no bike racer *wants* to crash... it hurts - it hurts all over, in lots of places that your helmet doesn't cover and it puts you out of the race, which no one wants. My husband and I have discussed why we think there have been so many crashes. Some of it is just bad luck, but we also think a lot of it is lack of a strong "patrone" and super dominant team in the race. Hate LA if you like, but I think his super strong personality (and before him guys like Eddie Mercxy and Bernard Hinault) and strong team were able to enforce a little more order in the peleton....

pll

07-10-2011, 11:25 AM

I suppose if I'd got my brains rattled and the snot wolloped out of me, I'd be craving some McDonald's comfort food, too.

http://twitpic.com/5o76et

Mmm, french fries in France... ;)

Hmm. I'd go for steak and frites, with a nice pichet of red wine. Small bistro with a view.

Possegal

07-10-2011, 11:48 AM

TV France should have its filming privileges revoked for this.

The problem with that is that then none of us get to see the Tour. They are the only ones that are filming it.

I'm sure the driver of that car is not only gone from the tour, but likely gone from their job too.

I remember watching the bike race in Philly and marveling at how the drivers were maneuvering the roads through Manayunk. It was some amazing car handling. Which makes this driver's move all the more baffling to me.

blue_angel

07-10-2011, 12:34 PM

The problem with that is that then none of us get to see the Tour. They are the only ones that are filming it.

I'm sure the driver of that car is not only gone from the tour, but likely gone from their job too.

I remember watching the bike race in Philly and marveling at how the drivers were maneuvering the roads through Manayunk. It was some amazing car handling. Which makes this driver's move all the more baffling to me.

I think TV France is only one of the stations that actually films, but perhaps I am wrong. [Edited: I just read in a news item that it was a car belonging to France 2 and France 3, which are public channels. So it wasn't TV France.] Even so, there should be a major penalty--perhaps a large fine--that they should incur as a result of this. Apparently that car was chauffeuring network executives and wasn't even filming.

And where is the public apology? I haven't seen a single news item from TV France apologizing for the crash.

Possegal

07-10-2011, 12:46 PM

I think TV France is only one of the stations that actually films, but perhaps I am wrong.
They are the only ones doing the filming. All the other stations that are showing the tour, are showing feeds from their filming.

I'm waiting to hear something from them. The silence is rather odd. The replays of that still make me a bit queasy. Could have been so much worse I suppose, but it still was so scary. Hope they are both doing OK after the fact.

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 12:52 PM

Hmm. I'd go for steak and frites, with a nice pichet of red wine. Small bistro with a view.

I don't think you are allowed intoxicants after a brain injury.

Burger and fries, steak and fries... I'd be yearning for red meat and potatoes, for sure! I suppose a burger would be easier to chew with a broken nose than a steak would be. I can't remember what I ate after I broke my nose, but I do remember that it hurt my nose *bad-bad-bad* to chew for a few weeks.

pll

07-10-2011, 12:52 PM

L'Equipe (http://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme/breves2011/20110710_195348_accident-la-voiture-exclue.html) and ASO refer to the car as "No. 800 EuroMedia". Channel 2 and 3 are from France Télévisions. They posted on their Facebook that they are distressed and that they hope the riders were not too badly injured, despite their spectacular falls:

https://www.facebook.com/FrancetvSport/posts/234294873258020

pll

07-10-2011, 12:53 PM

I don't think you are allowed intoxicants after a brain injury.

Burger and fries, steak and fries... I'd be yearning for red meat and potatoes, for sure! I suppose a burger would be easier to chew with a broken nose than a steak would be. I can't remember what I ate after I broke my nose, but I do remember that it hurt my nose *bad-bad-bad* to chew for a few weeks.

Ouch.

Aggie_Ama

07-10-2011, 04:15 PM

Things are definitely not going Contador's way. He seems tired after the Giro, and it does not look like he has a good enough team. The team has been invisible.

The irony is Contador selected the team! It has been reported team management let him hand select the team he wanted to support him.

Today's stage was sickening. I am shocked at the number of names that were expected to be in the top 25 or even on the podium that are out due to the crashes.

Tri Girl

07-10-2011, 04:20 PM

This first week of the tour has been more crash-y than I ever remember. And BIG names/contenders are out. Today's stage was horrible- I've never seen a cyclist hit by a car, and that horrified me. WOW! :eek:
Poor Vinny- could not believe how bad off he looked being drug out of that ditch. Oh my!!

Possegal

07-10-2011, 06:04 PM

pll

07-10-2011, 06:15 PM

Good heavens Hoogerland took a beating courtesy of that barbed wire. http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france/stage-9/photos/181772
His shorts are pretty much not on anymore, just to warn folks, naked butt cheek at the link above. OUCH

Ouch^2. 33 stitches. But before getting those, he finished the race, collected his polka dot jersey and wept on the podium: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJarentZE2g

Tri Girl

07-10-2011, 06:15 PM

Good heavens Hoogerland took a beating courtesy of that barbed wire. http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france/stage-9/photos/181772
His shorts are pretty much not on anymore, just to warn folks, naked butt cheek at the link above. OUCH

Dear Lord- that's horrible!!! (kinda sexy) but horrible!!! Poor guy. And then he gets back on and finishes. Rodeo men have nothing on these guys! Tough as nails. :cool:

bmccasland

07-10-2011, 06:26 PM

Good heavens Hoogerland took a beating courtesy of that barbed wire. http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france/stage-9/photos/181772
His shorts are pretty much not on anymore, just to warn folks, naked butt cheek at the link above. OUCH

:eek: Holy cow! :eek: And to think I whimpered after scratching myself on some blackberry vines while mowing the lawn this morning.
Like the tan line :cool::rolleyes:

Ouch^2. 33 stitches. But before getting those, he finished the race, collected his polka dot jersey and wept on the podium: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJarentZE2g

I liked the red dresses of the podium girls (part 2), those are much nicer than the red pokadot raincoat inspired frocks.

tulip

07-10-2011, 06:32 PM

All the cars were directed by the officials to let the Directeur Sportif of Europcar go to the front because Voeckler had requested his team car. This means pull over to the right and let the team car pass. The TV car ignored the directive and went ahead, causing the accident.

From OuestFrance.fr:

«Le véhicule incriminé avait reçu la consigne de la Direction de la course de ne pas passer et de laisser le directeur sportif de l'équipe Europcar apporter à Thomas Voeckler le bidon qu'il réclamait. Ne tenant aucun compte de cette injonction, le véhicule s'est engagé et a provoqué la chute de deux coureurs», a déclaré notamment la direction du Tour dans un communiqué, en qualifiant ce comportement d'«intolérable».

Elsewhere in the article, it says that all media cars have been doubly reminded that the safety of the riders is paramount. I imagine there will be some fallout tomorrow.

Also, Vino has been flown to Paris by helicopter for surgery tonight.

Possegal

07-10-2011, 06:35 PM

Ouch^2. 33 stitches. But before getting those, he finished the race, collected his polka dot jersey and wept on the podium: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJarentZE2g

When he wept on the podium, he might have become my new favorite rider.

I feel like I don't even want to sit down on my bum just looking at all the injury to his. :)

ny biker

07-10-2011, 06:36 PM

I am just really pissed. If you can't ride the biggest bike race in the world without getting hit by a car, what hope do the rest of us have.

I was thrilled to see Horner enjoying the Micky D's. Nowhere near as good as In 'n Out Burger, I supposed, but tasty nonetheless.

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 06:37 PM

When he wept on the podium, he might have become my new favorite rider.

Mine, too!

ny biker

07-10-2011, 06:54 PM

Now that I've finally finished watching the stage, I'm catching up on the cycling guys I follow on twitter. This is made me smile -- from Jani Brajkovic, who broke his collarbone the other day:

2h30 on a trainer. all went fine until landlord got a nervous breakdown. Ups, i guess I was a bit loud. New trainer?

As did this, from Taylor Phinney (who crashed in the Tour of Austria today) to his dad, Davis:

Happy Birthday Dad! I love you very much!!! Sorry I crashed on my head today :^\

Also, Fabian is cooking for his team tomorrow as part of a charity thing...

blue_angel

07-10-2011, 07:07 PM

I am just really pissed. If you can't ride the biggest bike race in the world without getting hit by a car, what hope do the rest of us have.

Excellent point!

Realgone

07-10-2011, 07:29 PM

KnottedYet

07-10-2011, 07:43 PM

Your 40,000 and 700 are not comaprible. Percentage is what you need to conclude that auto accidents are more prelivent or "less safe". There are 254.4 million car owners in America, bicycle owners are a fraction of that and the amount of those that ride regularly would be a fraction of the owners of bicycles.

I wasn't making any comparisons of safe and "less safe" between bikes and cars!!!!! My goodness!!!!

I was talking about the sociological phenomenon of the steady annual level of automobile-related fatalities regardless of advancing safety features of modern automobiles.

As an aside, I tossed in the bike statistic which often surprises people because they assume many more cyclists die annually than car passengers, from a purely quantitative standpoint. (i.e., they expect the numbers to be 40,000+ cyclists and 700+ car passengers)

Heavens to Betsy! Ease up!

bluebug32

07-10-2011, 07:47 PM

Oy. All these crashes are bad for my fantasy tour team ;)

malkin

07-10-2011, 08:02 PM

Angels and ministers of grace defend us!

ShubieGA

07-10-2011, 09:07 PM

it was definitely a wild stage today. So sad for Vinokourov, what a terrible injury. Loved that Voekler won, and am definitely a new fan of Hoogerland and Flecha for even finishing! Owww.

Dogmama

07-11-2011, 04:37 AM

pll

07-11-2011, 05:12 AM

I read that Vino's surgery was successful.

Small chuckle about the commentary (don't recall which one said this) - something like "There was a small gap in the trees and off they went!"

Yup - every time I see a gap in trees, I have this urge to just ride right through them. Which is why I live in the desert. With friggin cactus & scrub brush.

That was funny. It was Phil Ligget. On a more serious note, Vande Velde and Contador seemed to agree (separate interviews) that the curve was the issue. Contador said it was not well marked and the road was narrow. Vande Velde said that curve seemed to have no end. This must have been when they saw the alluring gap in the trees...

Regarding the car incident, Luis León Sánchez, the stage winner, said the riders had been grazed by several cars before during the race. A little trivia I read yesterday: Pedro León, a winger in Real Madrid, is LL Sánchez's young brother. "León" was the first name of an older brother they both honor by pointing at the sky.

And Hoogerland was riding this morning: http://twitpic.com/5oipd1
I hope he does well tomorrow.

rubysoho

07-11-2011, 05:48 AM

the riders had been grazed by several cars before during the race.

Why is this not unacceptable??? The cars made me nervous even before a rider was hit.

pll

07-11-2011, 05:57 AM

Why is this not unacceptable??? The cars made me nervous even before a rider was hit.

I think it is unacceptable, just in case. The first time a rider was grazed by a car or motorcycle, something should have been done. It was very fortunate that Flecha and Hoogerland riders are alive. And the ASO sanction of "excluding the car" (as if the car was to blame... who is the driver, why was that car there?) is ridiculous. On days that the race goes through such narrow roads, there should be no VIP cars whatsoever, and a skeleton, minimal, media crew.

blue_angel

07-11-2011, 06:13 AM

I think it is unacceptable, just in case. The first time a rider was grazed by a car or motorcycle, something should have been done. It was very fortunate that Flecha and Hoogerland riders are alive. And the ASO sanction of "excluding the car" (as if the car was to blame... who is the driver, why was that car there?) is ridiculous. On days that the race goes through such narrow roads, there should be no VIP cars whatsoever, and a skeleton, minimal, media crew.

Why don't they use more helmet cams?

pll

07-11-2011, 06:20 AM

Why don't they use more helmet cams?

I have no idea. I was thinking of that, too. The cameras they use are sending signals to a satellite, so I assume there is some equipment constraint. However, I'm sure they could rig a camera on a motorcycle that could be controlled remotely, from a truck or office, so they can pan around, and zoom. I suspect that would cause some delays (signals traveling back and forth) relative to someone manually panning or zooming. I can bet, though, that the camera folks would be opposed to a remote solution -- I'm sure it can be fun to spend your working day in the middle of the tour, as opposed to a desk.

TrekTheKaty

07-11-2011, 07:36 AM

I am just really pissed. If you can't ride the biggest bike race in the world without getting hit by a car, what hope do the rest of us have.

Amen!

My fantasy team was a combo of Radio Shack and Team Leopard with a couple others thrown in. I can't look.

channlluv

07-11-2011, 10:10 AM

As a photographer, I'd like to defend the human artistic element in photographing and videotaping the Tour as it happens. You can't point and shoot elegant images from some remote location. The immediacy and drama of the story in the picture would be gone.

I do agree, however, that there needs to be a restriction on cars and motorcycles driven by people who are not specifically trained in how to drive in close proximity to cyclists. When that Getty Images motorcycle took out the rider a few days ago and dragged his bike 200 yards, I was horrified, but when that car hit Flecha and Hoogerland yesterday, what the hell was that driver thinking? You can see in the video that he was actually speeding up! I think the driver was trying to impress the VIPs in the car by getting them up at the front of the leaders, probably looking at them closely himself, then glanced back at the road, boom there's a tree, and he swerved out of instinct.

I could only read a few words of the French transcript about the car. Could someone translate that, please?

I'm amazed at Hoogerland back up and riding this morning. What a hero indeed.

And what someone else said about rodeo riders having nothing on cyclists. Amen! 8 seconds. Feh.

Roxy

blue_angel

07-11-2011, 10:12 AM

I'm amazed at Hoogerland back up and riding this morning. What a hero indeed.

Why is he back up and riding today? It's a rest day...

Dogmama

07-11-2011, 10:25 AM

I also wonder about the pollution coming from vehicles & the riders sucking it up. It must be really annoying to the riders - to put it mildly. Gilbert had to ride around a bunch of cars trying to get back to the peleton, thus slowing him down. Doesn't seem right. A few journalists and the team cars (1 car per team) should be the limit.

blue_angel

07-11-2011, 10:29 AM

I wonder if one car per team would be enough to carry enough replacement frames and wheels for all of the riders. Especially if there is a breakaway or other fracture on the peloton. Groups of riders are often separated by 5 minutes or more--a rider in the breakaway can't/shouldn't have to wait 4 minutes for his team car to show up with a new back wheel.

ny biker

07-11-2011, 11:10 AM

Why is he back up and riding today? It's a rest day...

They all ride during the rest days. Otherwise their bodies would think the insane effort was over and their legs would completely shut down. They struggle to ride the day after the rest day as it is.

Meanwhile, we have BSNYC's take:

http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/expert-analysis/bikesnobnycs-tour-de-france-stages-8-9-report-punitive-damages

Also the big news from Stuey and Fabian is that they have finally convinced Jens to get a twitter account.

katluvr

07-11-2011, 11:20 AM

[QUOTE=ny biker;587355]

Meanwhile, we have BSNYC's take:

http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/expert-analysis/bikesnobnycs-tour-de-france-stages-8-9-report-punitive-damages

QUOTE]

OMG! :p This was the funniest thing I have read! Still laughing, wiping tears from my eyes. Thanks for sharing!:D

Aggie_Ama

07-11-2011, 11:37 AM

Also the big news from Stuey and Fabian is that they have finally convinced Jens to get a twitter account.

Great, I will have to get on twitter. I have avoided it but if Big Jens is tweeting I may cave.

pll

07-11-2011, 12:09 PM

The Wall Street Journal has a nicely written account from yesterday: "Surviving a Tour de France Horror Show (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303812104576439862756666174.html#articleTabs%3Darticle)," by Jason Gay.

The last four paragraphs are particularly poignant.

ny biker

07-11-2011, 12:23 PM

[QUOTE=channlluv;587335And what someone else said about rodeo riders having nothing on cyclists. Amen! 8 seconds. Feh.[/QUOTE]

A few weeks ago I saw something on the news about some major league baseball player having a sprained ankle, or maybe wrist, I don't know. But it was definitely a sprain. And it was huge news to the sports guy on the tv news: Big Important Baseball Dude Leaves Game Due to Sprained Ankle/Wrist.

And all I could think was, what a pu$$y. He wouldn't last 5 minutes in a bike race.

ny biker

07-11-2011, 12:29 PM

RT andy_schleck Here we go jens voigt on twitter @thejensie

He already has > 2000 followers in less than 20 minutes.

pll

07-11-2011, 12:30 PM

Drum roll, please... Jensie is now on Twitter: @thejensie

channlluv

07-11-2011, 01:02 PM

... Big Important Baseball Dude Leaves Game Due to Sprained Ankle/Wrist.

And all I could think was, what a pu$$y. He wouldn't last 5 minutes in a bike race.

That's the best laugh I've had all day. Thanks!

channlluv

07-11-2011, 01:12 PM

And the biggest sigh of the day...

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=179581465439884&set=a.179580528773311.48230.114212335310131&type=1&theater

Fabian cooks lunch for the team to benefit the Make A Wish Foundation.

Roxy

tulip

07-11-2011, 01:17 PM

I could only read a few words of the French transcript about the car. Could someone translate that, please?

Here ya go:

"The car that was involved received the directive from the Course Referee to not pass and to allow the Europcar Directeur Sportif to bring a water bottle to Thomas Voeckler that he had requested. Ignoring this order, the car sped up and caused the crash of the two racers," said the the Tour head-honchos in a communique that considered the behavior "unacceptable."

Aggie_Ama

07-11-2011, 01:50 PM

RT andy_schleck Here we go jens voigt on twitter @thejensie

He already has > 2000 followers in less than 20 minutes.

Ironically we call our puppy Jensie! I keep telling my husband the puppy is too wimpy, I am going to get him a collar that is embroidered with TTFU so Jens Voigt doesn't take his name back. :p

channlluv

07-11-2011, 01:52 PM

Geemonetti. Thanks, Tulip.

"Unacceptable"?

Oy-freakin'-vey.

tulip

07-11-2011, 03:01 PM

What's wrong with "unacceptable?" I certainly think the driver's move was unacceptable.

channlluv

07-11-2011, 03:18 PM

It's such an understatement.

"Egregious error in judgement," maybe.

tulip

07-11-2011, 04:19 PM

It's such an understatement.

"Egregious error in judgement," maybe.

The word in French is intolérable. Perhaps my translation was understated. A better translation would be something like "completely unacceptable." It's a very strong word.

channlluv

07-11-2011, 06:03 PM

Ooohhh, well, there you go. Intolerable is stronger.

I wonder what will happen to the driver of that car. I know he's been kicked out of the Tour, but I would imagine there are more repercussions than that. I would hope so, at any rate. He ignored orders to pull over.

I can hardly wait for the post-rest day commentary tomorrow morning.

Roxy

beccaB

07-11-2011, 07:17 PM

Would unconscionable be a good word? seeing that on TV made me want to punch something.

Dogmama

07-11-2011, 07:22 PM

Would unconscionable be a good word? seeing that on TV made me want to punch something.

There are lots of good words - but none that I can use here.

ny biker

07-11-2011, 07:30 PM

Phil went with "disgraceful."

loopybunny

07-11-2011, 08:01 PM

A few weeks ago I saw something on the news about some major league baseball player having a sprained ankle, or maybe wrist, I don't know. But it was definitely a sprain. And it was huge news to the sports guy on the tv news: Big Important Baseball Dude Leaves Game Due to Sprained Ankle/Wrist.

And all I could think was, what a pu$$y. He wouldn't last 5 minutes in a bike race.

Haha! I think things like that too.

ShubieGA

07-11-2011, 08:05 PM

I think it was Pujols on the Cards. next thing you know - 15 day disabled list. Cyclists - patch up at 40kph and keep on truckin'.

Roadtrip

07-11-2011, 08:06 PM

I saw this photo online and while a little disturbing, shows the real character of the rider, Chapeaux Johnny Hoogerland!!

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/283393_10150230682881344_629866343_7448167_6827671_n.jpg

Click only if you have a strong constitution. Also a little sad that someone stood there taking photos of him in likely one of the worst moment of his life instead of climbing in to help him.

I normally wouldn't post but this dude is my new hero.

bluebug32

07-11-2011, 08:17 PM

I enjoyed BikeSnob's idea of revenge:

"If I were a Tour official, I’d start by sentencing the driver to spend the entire rest day sealed in a hamper containing the whole peloton’s dirty bib shorts. Then, I’d make him spend the remaining stages locked inside the Garmin team bus bathroom. (They don’t call Thor Hushovd the “God of Thunder” for nothing.)

Finally, once the Tour was over, I’d tie him to a chair Clockwork Orange–style and make him listen to an edited recording consisting entirely of every single one of Paul Sherwen’s tedious French châteaux facts. I can hear it now:

“Did you know, Phil, that the Chateau du Fromage was built in 1620 by Louis XIII’s cousin in order to house his extensive collection of fragrant cheeses?”

“NOOO! Make it stop! I can’t take it anymore!”

I know it’s cruel, but the punishment should fit the crime."

http://www.bicycling.com/tour-de-france/expert-analysis/bikesnobnycs-tour-de-france-stages-8-9-report-punitive-damages?page=0,0

Deborajen

07-11-2011, 09:58 PM

tulip

07-12-2011, 04:28 AM

I was wondering when the French-bashing would begin...I seriously doubt it was on purpose. The driver overcorrected to avoid the tree. He or she should not have been passing to begin with.

I rather like the tidbits about the chateaux and villages. It's great exposure for alot of very economically depressed small towns to have the Tour pass through. I've been watching Eurosport coverage and they don't give as much information on the regions and towns. I miss those stories.

pll

07-12-2011, 04:32 AM

I just read on Cycling News in an article about Johnny Hoogerland that "Race director Jean-Francois Pescheux apologized and said it was a scandalous thing that happened." Is something getting exaggerated in the translation or is this suggesting the car rammed the cyclists on purpose? With all of the politics in TDF I'd wondered if it could have been deliberate, but surely a French TV car wouldn't nearly take out Voekler. On the other hand, the car rammed right into Flecha. Hoogerland was being very nice about it and said he doesn't think it was done on purpose.--

It is hard to exaggerate about what happened, hyperbole is nearly impossible. It was scandalous, intolerable, disgraceful, etc. It was an officially accredited car that hit the riders (which implies some sort of vetting -- of course, they do not vet based on driving skills, but they might reconsider that). The riders could have been severely hurt or worse.

The notion that it hitting the riders was on purpose is ludicrous in my view. Hopefully, the police is involved and that the driver was stopped that day and checked for traces of alcohol. I'm with Tulip -- I enjoy hearing a little of the history and factoids of each region.

pll

07-12-2011, 06:00 AM

Here's a cute picture, from an ITV (UK) photo gallery (http://www.itv.com/tourdefrance/2011/race-guide/the-story-of-the-2011-tour-de-france-in-pictures/):

http://www.itv.com/tourdefrance/2011/race-guide/30731e53-c5fc-4e34-a08b-1b0f93fc1b90/PreviewFile.jpg.ashx

blue_angel

07-12-2011, 06:38 AM

Every time I see Tommy Voeckler I just want to pinch his cheeks!

Deborajen

07-12-2011, 06:41 AM

I was wondering when the French-bashing would begin...I seriously doubt it was on purpose. The driver overcorrected to avoid the tree. He or she should not have been passing to begin with.

Wait - One of my favorite riders is Thomas Voekler!

I'll grant you that I'm a little suspicious. There is a lot of history in the Tour, and some of it is the French not always being particularly good sports about their countrymen not winning. But like I said, did something get lost in the translation? And you answered that part. :)

There are boneheads in every country. Maybe this driver was one of them (besides being a lousy driver and not following directions). France is kind enough to invite the world to be their guests and participate in this event. Yes, it's a beautiful country, too!

MuddyTrails

07-12-2011, 09:09 AM

I'm really enjoying this ongoing Tour commentary thread, especially since the Tour never fails to disappoint as the summer's most interesting telenovela :)

Off day, or ride day, there are always comment-worthy news, though some I'd put in the category of gossip... And in that vein, Spanish newspaper El Pais is commenting as a gossipy aside that the car that hit Flecha and Hoogerland was driven by a well-known French sports commentator. However, I can no longer find that juicy tidbit in the coverage. It might have been edited out, and I failed to bookmark the piece. What is more interesting is the interview with Flecha, who was very much upset at how no one has apologized in person for the accident, only Proudhomme presented his apologies to the team director. He doesn't have kind words for Voeckler either.

And we have the first withdrawal for doping, Russian rider Alexander Kolobnev, of Team Katusha. In fact, the entire team was subjected to doping controls on 6 July, and El Pais is also reporting that the team expects another of their riders, a "close friend" of Kolobnev's to also show positive. Kolobnev's positive was for a diuretic, hydrocloriotazide (sp?), originally designed as an anti-hypertensive medicine, and which masks the use of other doping substances. Since the positive is for a substance that also has a medical use, withdrawal is not mandatory, but Kolobnev has "chosen" to retire from the race.

As the French would say, plus ça change, plus la même chose...

MuddyTrails

blue_angel

07-12-2011, 09:24 AM

He doesn't have kind words for Voeckler either.

Why is that? It's not like the crash was Voeckler's fault! I also think it's somewhat shocking that there's been no public apology to the riders from the driver and the media company.

MuddyTrails

07-12-2011, 09:37 AM

@blue_angel:

Apparently, Voeckler looked back, saw the accident and took the opportunity to launch an attack. At least that is how Flecha and the interviewer perceived it. I must say that I am not privy to the internal moral code of the peloton, so I can't very well say what social rule V. seems to have broken, other than making the best of someone else's misery, which is not very nice. I leave it to others on the forum to clue us into that. Here's Flecha's answer to the question, "what did you think when you saw Voeckler accelerate after the accident?":

"Pues lo veo normal dentro de lo que es Voeckler, porque va así en todas las escapadas, sembrando cizaña. Antes, justamente, Casar, otro del grupo, le había echado una bronca porque atacaba bajando después de pelear por los puntos de la montaña, en vez de esperar a los que no los disputábamos. Iba con la fijación del maillot amarillo, le daba todo igual. Ya le conocemos, me habría sorprendido lo contrario."

Translation: "I see it as normal, given who Voeckler is, since that is how he operates in all the escapes, sowing discord. Just prior, Casar, another in the group, had reprimanded him because he was attacking on the descent after fighting for the mountain points, instead of waiting for those of us who were not challenging for those. He was fixated on the yellow jersey, he didn't care. We know him, I would have been surprised had he acted otherwise."

I don't ride in groups, and I know nothing of the ethos of the peloton, or road racing, but from the commentary, it is clear that there is an expectation of not abusing other's misfortune (or perhaps, not being so crass about it?).

MuddyTrails

blue_angel

07-12-2011, 09:44 AM

Interesting! I'm equally ignorant of the mores of group/peloton/race riding. But what I find particularly curious is how Flecha's comment is diametrically opposed to all of the tv commentators' observations about V's behavior post-crash. I think in the first moments, Voeckler had no way of knowing just how bad that crash was. But within moments the remaining 3 of the breakaway were riding tightly together and were conferring amongst themselves. The commentators specifically pointed to V as the leader of the breakaway holding them back in order to get more details and to see how to proceed.

I'm not really sure what Flecha would have wanted Voeckler to do under the circumstances--sacrifice the gap? Abandon his plans to capture the yellow jersey? What happened to Flecha and Hoogerland was awful and totally unfair, but the Tour is still a competition, and there can only be so much cooperation amongst competitors. Flecha's comments, to me, sound a bit like sour grapes. Although I'll be the first to concede that I may be missing some of the finer points of strategy.

channlluv

07-12-2011, 09:51 AM

Didn't I see Voekler making the kill sign across his throat, signaling "No attack" to slow down the other breakaway riders shortly past the accident in order to wait for the ones who crashed?

Roxy

withm

07-12-2011, 09:54 AM

Why is that? It's not like the crash was Voeckler's fault! I also think it's somewhat shocking that there's been no public apology to the riders from the driver and the media company.

Oh I'm sure they have lawyered up and been advised not to comment. Yes it's shocking, and arrogant that the incident even happened during the Tour, but really, it's not that much different from any other impatient motorist that accidently knocks down a cyclist, when if they could have slowed down or stopped until it was clear and safe to pass (God forbid it costs you 10 additional seconds to avoid an accident). I would not expect an apology, nor an admission of guilt. Surely they will have no contact with the victims, and will simply let the lawyers and insurance companies fight it out. How the driver will live with himself is another story.

The video is pretty damning evidence and I think they will be hard pressed to come up with a creative defense. Perhaps in a few days they will issue a statement.

blue_angel

07-12-2011, 09:54 AM

Didn't I see Voekler making the kill sign across his throat, signaling "No attack" to slow down the other breakaway riders shortly past the accident in order to wait for the ones who crashed?

Roxy

That's what I remember as well.

bmccasland

07-12-2011, 10:29 AM

ny biker

07-12-2011, 10:36 AM

my 2 cents... FWIW... the driver should have hit the brakes, or hit the tree. But a natural reaction is to swerve, unless one is a very well trained sunt car driver. Most of us had driving lessons when we were teenagers, then everything else we've learned is from the school of hard knocks. As humans we tend to over-react - thus swerving wider than necessary.

But seems to me that the people in that car should be publically apologizing.

Maybe I'm just cranky because I woke up this morning feeling like crap and went to PT anyway. (tummy decided it hated me, knee and I are on speaking terms)

The driver should not have been moving in the first place. He should have been pulled over at the side of the road. That's what race managment had instructed him to do. They told him to pull over so Voeckler's team car could pull up and give him water.

And if he had not been told to pull over, he was supposed to honk the horn to warn the riders that he was passing. He didn't do that, either.

bluebug32

07-12-2011, 10:46 AM

TrekTheKaty

07-12-2011, 10:56 AM

Fav part of today's stage so far? Thor handing his shoe into the team car :eek:

My sis thinks I'm a stud because i can drink while riding ;)

I've only recently gotten brave enough to open anything bigger than a gel while riding. No Kind bar has gone overboard yet!

ny biker

07-12-2011, 11:05 AM

blue_angel

07-12-2011, 11:41 AM

bmccasland

07-12-2011, 11:42 AM

On a completely different note, I'm getting REALLY sick of that Nissan Leaf commercial where everything runs on gas. I nearly threw my coffee mug at the TV! On the other hand, I could watch that cute, fluffy dog from Traveler's protect his dog house all day. :p

I'm with you there. Funny thing about moving to the PNW - they seem to think that everyone has either hydroelectric power or wind generated electricity. Living in other parts of the country, I've had my electricity generated by: gas fire plants, coal fire plants, and nuclear. So I'm amused by the conception of electric cars being "clean." Your may not crank an gasoline powered electric generator to make your morning toast, but the power plant were your electricity is coming from is doing just that.

I kind of like the kid racing madly on his tricycle, even if he is a tad "unsafe" and bonks his head on the couch. I want to be that kid, having the joy of racing madly. Other night saw the long version, and it was even more fun.

Yeah, the fluffy doggie protecting his bone is cute. Not even to go for a walk.

KathiCville

07-12-2011, 11:49 AM

[Yeah, the fluffy doggie protecting his bone is cute. Not even to go for a walk.[/QUOTE]

I've seen that Travelers Insurance commercial so many times now I can't get the darned jingle out of my head! :):)

bluebug32

07-12-2011, 11:51 AM

The Izod commercial is still the one that I hate the most. The song is soooo bad, and the models frolicking in the water remind me of Derek and his friends playing at the gas station in Zoolander.

Nice win by Griepel today.

Yes, down with Weezer! Go find your own brave new world...

Speaking of annoying songs, I wonder how long Michelob will keep the same commercial with Lance and his fake buddies going?

pll

07-12-2011, 12:15 PM

My two cents re the Voeckler situation... First, here is a video clip that shows the exchange between Voeckler and Luis León Sánchez after the accident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGJ928miSS8
The exchange starts around 0:50. Phil and Paul interpreted this as Voeckler asking the break to slow down. Anyone speaks Dutch here?

In El País (http://www.elpais.com/articulo/deportes/Luis/Leon/pedaladas/elpepidep/20110711elpepidep_6/Tes), the write up suggests that León felt pushed to continue as if nothing had happened, lest they gift everything to the French man, that Voeckler was only thinking of the yellow jersey:

El accidente no inmutó a Voeckler lo más mínimo -"solo pensaba en el maillot amarillo, que le esperaba en la meta", dijo Luis León-, quien siguió como si nada, sin mirar para atrás, forzando a sus compañeros de fuga a seguir [...] so pena de regalarle todo al pequeño francés.

The Spanish press seems to really dislike Voeckler. I saw one note in which he was qualified of "antipathetic and disagreeable".

BikeDutchess

07-12-2011, 03:12 PM

First, here is a video clip that shows the exchange between Voeckler and Luis León Sánchez after the accident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGJ928miSS8
The exchange starts around 0:50. Phil and Paul interpreted this as Voeckler asking the break to slow down. Anyone speaks Dutch here?

I do! :)

At 0:23 the commentators state "the men now have to wait" followed by descriptions (in tones of disbelief) about the incident. At 0:46, one says "what do you do when you're a Voeckler?", the other interjects "he rides on", the first continues "with 36 km to go." Then more comments about the incident, how they've never seen anything like it, etc. There is no suggestion in any of this by the commentators that Voeckler is asking to slow things down.

pll

07-12-2011, 04:36 PM

I do! :)

At 0:23 the commentators state "the men now have to wait" followed by descriptions (in tones of disbelief) about the incident. At 0:46, one says "what do you do when you're a Voeckler?", the other interjects "he rides on", the first continues "with 36 km to go." Then more comments about the incident, how they've never seen anything like it, etc. There is no suggestion in any of this by the commentators that Voeckler is asking to slow things down.

Thanks! I think it is generally interesting how the same event can have different commentary in different countries.

Eden

07-12-2011, 04:37 PM

Having been there (been in races where there have been crashes) I can so understand. You have an instant to decide what to do. I'd be willing to bet with the violence of that crash Voeckler figured neither guy would be getting back up or at very least would not be able to maintain the pace (which in fact neither could). He was in contention for the yellow jersey - which is a huge thing and didn't want to give that up. He didn't wait - but I don't think he particularly attacked the two guys who fell either. In the reality of it, it was likely not the wrong thing to do, had he and the others waited the whole break probably would have ended up back in the pack or lost enough time to lose yellow - the fallers certainly did - in fact they fell through it and finished up behind - given the horrible crash, its not a big surprise and they were both super courageous for just finishing.

The long and short of it - bike racing is a competition. It is dishonorable to attack someone who's down from a crash, a mechanical, or a nature break, but if you know that they are out or if there is something else in the race that is not under your control that requires responding to, then they are fair game. You have to remember that there almost 200 other guys that were racing too and while they may have waited for their own crash victims to catch up (and had someone more "dangerous" been up the road, its likely the peleton never would have waited as much as they did) they were certainly not going to slow down to maintain the gap while the break re-organized itself.

No one faulted the break for not slowing down when there was the big crash in the field. Technically that was taking advantage too - it certainly helped Voeckler, who may not have ever gotten far enough ahead to gain yellow and indeed appeared to be thinking more about polka dots earlier in the race. It was just a little less personal, as it didn't occur within their sight.

bmccasland

07-12-2011, 05:32 PM

The Road ID commercials, when "Bobke" is trying to get someone to go for a bike ride with him. :p:D

Deborajen

07-12-2011, 05:33 PM

Personally, I think the whole "waiting" thing has gotten a little out of hand. When Lance Armstrong waited for Jan Ulrich after Jan flipped end over end off the ravine, that was a gesture of respect. Lance didn't want to beat Jan that way, and he wanted to make sure Jan was o.k. But TDF is still a race. Nobody waits in running, or in car racing, or in horse racing. Voekler was going for the yellow jersey - it's the main prize for gosh sakes, and it isn't unsportsmanlike to have that on your mind. It would have been really exciting to watch the five-man breakaway group work together and then race to win at the end. Two of them were cheated out of that chance by the crash, but why do the other three have to give up their chance, too?

I don't think Voekler did anything wrong. I don't blame Flecha for being pi$$ed about getting run off the road when he could've won the stage, but what would he have done if the tables were turned? There's a lot of strategic work and a lot of team effort and group effort involved which make the sport interesting to watch. But bad luck happens, too.--

Deborajen

07-12-2011, 05:37 PM

The Road ID commercials, when "Bobke" is trying to get someone to go for a bike ride with him. :p:D

Those crack me up! :D:D

ny biker

07-12-2011, 06:13 PM

Um...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/07/gallery/2011-tour-de-france-stage-10-photos-by-casey-b-gibson_183554/attachment/2011-tour-de-france-186

"The Banette Wheat girl in the publicity caravan."

So many questions. How many hours in a row does she have to be in that thing? Is she sitting down? Is there A/C in there or do they just let her swelter??

bmccasland

07-12-2011, 07:01 PM

bluebug32

07-12-2011, 07:06 PM

^^ LOL. And what if she's celiac!?

I like the Bobke commercials and I also love that Cannondale Evo...the DH and I are definitely drooling over that bike.

buffybike

07-12-2011, 07:36 PM

2nd on the Evo. The commercials overall arent nearly as good as last year, though. In fact, i dont even think i could purchase an Izod product ever again. Their commercials are just so ridiculous...and that song! Geeeeeezzzz.

buffybike

07-12-2011, 07:43 PM

Whats with the riders having their tongues hanging out? Is it suppsed to help control breathing or something? Just curious.

marni

07-12-2011, 08:25 PM

supposedly it makes them look like they're working hard. The one time I tried it I swallowed a bug.

lesson learned.

marni

beccaB

07-13-2011, 06:54 AM

Oh.. wait.. we're not supposed to swallow bugs? Uh Oh...

channlluv

07-13-2011, 09:40 AM

Bugs = Bonus Protein

I'm sick to death of that Izod commercial, too. It's so horribly superficial. Who surfs in a collared shirt, for crying out loud? And that "race" with one whole car? Please. It's stupid. And the song is stupid. And I used to love Izod. In 1983.

I wish there was a way to email the PTBs and tell them to axe that commercial. (Powers That Be)

I like Fluffy protecting his bone and stuff, though. Cute.

Roxy

withm

07-13-2011, 09:59 AM

Sigh - I'm watching it online via Versus (when it works that is), and we don't get any commercials. I did see Bobke looking for a riding buddy, which was pretty funny, when watching the Tour at a restaruant one morning but for most of the time, they didn't have the sound on. Sheesh? Finally the owner (avid cyclist) came in and turned it on. Perhaps I'll go back Sat & Sun to watch again?

I finally got the Versus website to work - sometimes. Last night I think it took 5 hours to watch a 3 hour race due to computer and Versus glitches.

pll

07-13-2011, 10:32 AM

KathiCville

07-13-2011, 04:17 PM

+1 on the annoying Izod commercial! I wonder if the advertisers realize that they might LOSE customers when their ditties are overplayed to the point that desperate watchers keeping the TV on mute as much as possible to avoid hearing...it...one...more...time.

I LOVE the furry little guy guarding his doghouse, but I'd like the peloton to run over the jingle singer at this point, LOL!!! :D ... The Bobke commercials are cute, in part because there seem to be enough versions to keep 'em from growing too stale. (Of course, we're only half way through the Tour, so the jury's still out. :-).... I suppose the advertisers all subscribe to the theory that there's no such thing as bad publicity, even if you're driving your potential customers bananas!

bluebug32

07-13-2011, 04:30 PM

Remember the Saab "Born from Jets" commercial that they played incessantly during the Tour a few years ago? Whenever the Izod commercial comes on, I just remind myself that it could be worse. We can only hope that Izod will go the way of Saab...

Marquise

07-13-2011, 04:57 PM

The absence of commercials with Tour All Access is great but it seems like access keeps getting worse and it wasn't exactly perfect to start. I think I'll be watching with commercials tonight if I want to see today's stage at all. Frustrating!

withm

07-13-2011, 05:11 PM

I was able to watch about 1/2 hour on line today, then the whole thing died - kept getting Versus error messages. Sheesh - they are charging $ for this, owned by a huge conglomerate. You'd think they could provide a half decent internet experience. Seems like they do not have nearly the capacity to serve their paying customers.

Dogmama

07-13-2011, 05:19 PM

Whats with the riders having their tongues hanging out? Is it suppsed to help control breathing or something? Just curious.

Michael Jordan used to stick out his tongue when he went for a particularly hard play. But he didn't dart it around like a lizard...

malkin

07-13-2011, 06:44 PM

I laughed out loud the first time that Izod ad came on, well, at Bobke too, but that was because Bobke is so cute and funny unlike those Izod kids who are absurd.

ny biker

07-13-2011, 07:19 PM

I like that the little dog is worried about a cat burglar.

Also, I really want this:

http://www.hbstache.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=HooTFU%5FWomens%2DGrey

Possegal

07-13-2011, 08:52 PM

I always stay away from this thread in the day until I get home and watch the tour. Don't want to be spoiled. I love how today, all the posts are about commercials. :)

I seriously don't even know what IZOD one you are all talking about. I must have selective amnesia, and that isn't a good effect for a commercial to have!

azfiddle

07-13-2011, 09:15 PM

I have also found the online subscription "sub-optimal". I got a few minutes and then it disappeared.

I'm not happy about it!

My DH and I went back to Carmichael Training Systems office again tonight and got the narration of highlights from Gord Fraser again. So cool - he was able to show us exactly when people made moves that worked or didn't work. His "man" Tyler Farrar was just a bit too late. They showed us statistics from Andre Greipel, including his power meter output for the last 3 km from Stage 7, when he placed 3rd. He had repeated spikes of 1000 watts and then went up to 1600 watts on his final sprint!!! For comparison, a normal rider (like one being trained through Carmichael Training Systems) would be at about 250 watts riding in El Tour de Tucson, at a point where they had rhythmic breathing and found it hard to talk.

There are a lot of freebies, too- dinner (last week pizza, this week some nice sandwiches and a pasta salad) and promo packets of GU, Probars and fruitition bars. They've gotten a few people to sign up for their spin classes though (including my DH).

buffybike

07-14-2011, 04:58 AM

Anyone missing morning rides because you're watching the Tour? (raises hand)

I know, I know...I could go for a morning ride and watch the Primetime Show at 8pm, but I just can't wait to see what happens. Especially now that they're in the mountains.

pll

07-14-2011, 05:19 AM

pll

07-14-2011, 05:22 AM

I like that the little dog is worried about a cat burglar.

Also, I really want this:

http://www.hbstache.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=HooTFU%5FWomens%2DGrey

I like this one better: http://stomachofanger.com/

(I have their "Shut up legs" one!)

blue_angel

07-14-2011, 05:36 AM

The slogan on the hbstache shirt is better, but the design of the stomachofanger.com shirt is irresistible.

pll

07-14-2011, 05:55 AM

I just noticed now that the Handlebar Mustache t gives a donation to the Jayden Foundation. Hoogerland is an ambassador for it (http://www.stichtingjayden.nl/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=125&Itemid=44). CyclingNews (http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/post-that-stopped-hoogerland-to-be-auctioned-for-charity) reported that the post that he hit might be auctioned for Jayden's benefit.