Why a women's forum?

[lph]

Rhetorical question. This question comes up every now and then, but it's a long time since now and we have some newcomers since then. And it seemed opportune I guess.

So why hang out on a women specific forum? I wonder about this sometimes, because irl I have plenty of male friends, and often prefer their company to female friends. But I much prefer this forum to all other mixed forums (which usually means male-dominated) I follow, and I sort of wonder what makes TE so different. I don't really believe that men and women are that different, there are huge differences between individuals after all. And I certainly don't buy into any idea that we're all one big happy supportive sisterhood either.

But I do feel that on TE, even with all our varying opinions, communication as a whole is better, more thoughtful and more understanding than on mixed forums. Maybe women in general, as a group, are better at communicating in writing, maybe the ones left here are the wishy-washy peacy ones because all the more aggressive-type girls have thrown up their hands and left ;). But especially when it comes to subtle and sensitive issues like trust, achievement, support, insecurity this forum is fantastic. Which means that even if I'm posting a purely technical, mechanical question, I feel like I'm asking good people who wish me well, not just anyone who bothers to answer.

This is an open forum of course, so there are no secrets and anyone can read it even though the vast majority of posters are women. But I feel that women tend to answer and behave differently in a women-only group than in a mixed group, especially on the subjects I mentioned above. And I think there is some kind of fellow understanding there, however small it may be, and I wonder if it maybe negates some of the fact that most of us are in effect talking to strangers. Even from my first posts, I didn't feel that you were total strangers. You were female and you were cyclists after all, how bad could you be :D

My, I'm wordy tonight. So - why are you here on TE, and is it important to you that it's a women's forum?

[Grog]

Maybe women in general, as a group, are better at communicating in writing...

Thanks for starting this discussion lph, I sometimes wonder the same. I think you're onto something about the written communication. I sometimes tell women who I encourage to visit TE that this is the only place on the Internet where people know how to spell. I find that the calibre of writing in this forum is very, very, very, unusually high, and it allows for much more nuanced discussions. Actually it reminds me of my early days on the forums that preceded the Internet as we know it today - and where, interestingly, there were very few women. But people were writing in full sentences, making points, speaking thoughtfully... which has now become extremely rare everywhere else I look (including on women forums other than TE).

This is just one part of the puzzle I'm sure, but it's the one that keep me coming back. I love Team Estrogen. (Thank you Susan.)

[Biciclista]

I could easily be on a mixed forum like bike journal, but honestly, a good percentage of MY issues have been women's specific. Saddle woes, intimidation, previous lack of being athletic.

example: my husband and I both rode bikes as little kids. When he was 6 he was riding a too large bike down a hill and crashing to stop it.
When I was 7 i was too afraid of a bike so I gave up until i was 9 and then learned to ride... carefully, with both hands...

we both have been riding since we were little kids, but our life experience was different. (I feel sorry for boys actually who might be like me) but on this forum, regularly new women show up who never rode before. Or with limited experience. Or with health and/or weight issues, not really comfortable to talk to a room full of guys about it.

That's why I'm here. I like the sister hood.

[shootingstar]

But I do feel that on TE, even with all our varying opinions, communication as a whole is better, more thoughtful and more understanding than on mixed forums. Maybe women in general, as a group, are better at communicating in writing, maybe the ones left here are the wishy-washy peacy ones because all the more aggressive-type girls have thrown up their hands and left . But especially when it comes to subtle and sensitive issues like trust, achievement, support, insecurity this forum is fantastic. .

My gut feeling tells me that coincidentally, there is a higher level of literacy in this particular (emphasis) women's forum. It doesn't necessarily guarantee more thoughtful dialogue, but ...well, it can be helpful not to say stuff without backing up with abit of evidence/examples, no matter what the woman's position would be.

I also feel cycling, particularily women who cycle regularily several times per week (recreational, transportation, racing, etc.) attracts women who share something in common: a streak of pragmatism. This certainly is true for all the cycling women I've met face to face from TE and also those who I've met personally elsewhere over the past 20 yrs when I returned to cycling.

Cycling puts a person in a particular frame of mind already: you can't fuss too much about your hair, the way how you cycle, if the weather is less than sunny, you must open yourself to abit of risk, dishevelment, vagaries of weather, etc. to enjoy cycling often and regularily.

I still think my comments apply even for the cycling woman who is more cycling chic streetwear type. They may not LOOK practical, but their heart/brain can be practical...let me cycle no matter what I wear: it gets me places, I enjoy it, etc.

So already, this could well exclude anyone who dislikes the slightest discomfort not just on the bike (but also in life in general), who doesn't want to ever get lost in a minor way (on the bike, or in life in general), who wants a totally safe, predictable environment and everything perfect in their control.

Cycling is not quite like that.

So those who cycle...share a number of tolerances, attitudes that carry over (in my opinion) from the act of cycling often to more generally, about life.

Not all women's forums are like TE. Some others have some who haven't read/travelled widely and it's reflected in their comments, others have a few women who are (in my opinion) overly sensitive/take things way too personally: they just don't know how to have an intellectual debate without feeling hurt because no one agrees with them.

Ok, so I'm getting super philosophical right now. :p

As for mixed forums, it depends which one but yes, if it's mixed, the guys' voices tend to dominate. Alot more verbal horsing around, even if harmless. More useless, totally useless jokes (ie. who has paid for sex.... was a really harmless, yet dumb-*** comment.)

[Biciclista]

Oh yeah Shootingstar, and always the man's voice holds more weight then the women's...

[alice]

1. I hadn't noticed until it was mentioned, but one reasons I've stuck around TE is because people use full sentences, actual words, and punctuation. I'm a fan of all of those things.

2. The reason I originally came to TE IS because it is a women-specific forum. I swore off bike forums after experience after experience of rude people. When reading posts on most forums, it becomes clear that if you're not an expert, you're not welcome. The last straw for me was when I posted asking for advice on potentially building/buying a fixie, and got told "you don't mean a fixie, you mean single speed." (I did mean a fixie; if I hadn't, I wouldn't have said it). The level of rudeness/pretentiousness in mixed fourums astounded and saddened me, so I decided I needed to stop spending time reading them. Then one day an internet search (for I don't even remember what), and a result from this forum came up. I read it, found it polite, and began to browse other threads, almost all of which featured people being polite, even when they disagreed. Until I have evidence otherwise, I attribute this to the mostly women aspect of the forum, and that's why I stick around.

[OakLeaf]

I know it's not a women-only space in the sense that men can't stalk us here (I feel for Silver!), but at least most men are discouraged from participation by the word "estrogen" and, if they didn't understand that, the page title "Women's Cycling Discussion Forums." :rolleyes:

I agree with Grog, and I've said it before - this forum does remind me of the old days on CompuServe. Back when people had to use their real names, people took a little more care about what they wrote. I see that here - people mostly understand that words have actual meanings, and that the other people who participate in the forum are actual people.

I'm not sure that it being a women's forum is the only thing that makes TE what it is, but IMO it's certainly part of it. I'm not a scientist of any kind, but I've read enough neuroscience and biochemistry to believe that women are not little men, not physically and not emotionally either.

I wouldn't change a thing. :) Thanks to Susan and Jeff and Snap and everyone else who keeps this thing running - and thanks to everyone who participates.

[lph]

It's interesting that so many of you pick out literacy. While being literate doesn't need to mean being civil, a certain level of attention to what you're writing does tend to weed out the most spontaneous outbursts. I regularly read a Norwegian mixed bike forum, and many people there are really extraordinarily literate, thoughtful and insightful. BUT there's also a liberal helping of the standard muckslinging trolls, and you really don't need very many of those posts to wreck an otherwise good discussion, especially if the subject is a little personal or sensitive. The trust we show each other here is IMO rooted in the overwhelming amount of friendly civility we show each other on a day-to-day basis. I think that is partly due to being women, not that men aren't civil, but that we seem to almostly completely lack those yahoo-types who pop by just to make trouble.

We're really boring, in other words. :D

[TrekTheKaty]

I'm in a male dominated profession and prefer their company, for the most part. My girlfriends are the same--not what I'd call girly, girls. Why am I here? Because I'm afraid to post a question on the "other" bike forum, for fear of being made fun of. (Yes, apparently there are stupid questions)

I've also come to appreciate the unconditional support and everyone's sense of humor here.

I also believe women are inherently better teachers and more patient. I'm here to learn from others and offer a little of my own advice, if I can.

"1. I hadn't noticed until it was mentioned, but one reasons I've stuck around TE is because people use full sentences, actual words, and punctuation. I'm a fan of all of those things."

I was on AARP.com this morning (they have excellent investment advice) and an article was followed by a question posted in "text-speak?" Really?

[emily_in_nc]

I've found female cyclists to be among the most intelligent, sensitive people I know, and the sampling here has only reinforced that "stereotype". :D

[jessmarimba]

I was on AARP.com this morning (they have excellent investment advice) and an article was followed by a question posted in "text-speak?" Really?

I can't read stuff like that without expecting my head to explode - every time I see someone shorten "you" to "u" I read it as "uhh." I type gibberish with my younger sister but that's a sister thing.

I also work in a male-dominated field, both for my paycheck-job and my fun-job, and it seems that the likelihood of mass immaturity goes up the more guys you have in one place at a time. I think it's an acceptance or competition thing among them, or something, but I'll never get it.

I just know that conversation here never deteriorates to name-calling, sexual jokes, or overly aggressive competition, and I very much appreciate that.

[WindingRoad]

I'm okay with being boring then. :)

This is a really good forum and I am happy that we can disagree and it doesn't turn into a name calling contest. Sure we may get edgy at times but there's nothing wrong with some good debate and new spins on our own personal perspectives. I have come to appreciate those that give those comments that are from an angle I maybe hadn't even considered. Trust me, I really appreciate some perspective at times.

[Cataboo]

I never really thought about the literacy aspect, but yeah, that has always been appealing about TE. And I've always been impressed by the amount of information you can get on anything, and the number of highly edcuated really smart women's cyclists there are on here.

It's also about talking to a group of women who will be supportive of even the smallest accomplishments that I know a group of men would disparage (oh, you biked 10 miles or changed your tire for the first time, big whoop)... It's about having the privacy to talk with "girlfriends" about what parts of you hurt, cause really... I'm not terribly comfortable with going into a bike shop and telling them my hoohaw hurts or got a boil, and what the heck do I do about it? I'm sure the poor bike shop guys would try to help, but I also don't ask the guys in the drug store what tampons or whatever to buy.

I know that men do get on here, and I know some of them get on to ask questions to try to help their gf's or get advice on what to do for their gf's or wives bikes... But I do find it creepy and voyeuristic when a guy hangs out here. I'm not going to tell them to leave, because it's a free country, but when you know that you're joining a forum that a large group of women have started and sought out so that they can have a female bike forum (because there are a lot of other bike forums), assuming that they want a guy around to read about their problems or whatever is a bit much... It's like the guy hanging out at the water cooler to eavesdrop when you're talking about girl stuff with a friend and trying to join in on the conversation uninvited.

I'm perfectly comfortable hanging out with men and do it a lot - and for years, I woulda said I prefer the company of males. But in the last few years, I've been making a lot more close friendships with females and it's been really nice.

[Espresso]

I'm not at all here because it's a women's forum. I'm here because in some forums you get polite, thoughtful conversation, while in others you get a bunch of rude or just plain unhelpful replies to pretty much anything you post. This is one of the former (and the only one I've come across so far for cycling), so I'm here :)

[pll]

I tend to come back to this forum not only because of the level of literacy (there is always something to read), but also because I enjoy the diversity: there are women of all ages, cyclists of all levels (from someone learning to ride to seriously competitive) and specific sub disciplines (cross, mountain bike, road cycling... to casual and everyday transportation).

I very much appreciate that general lack of aggression when one asks a question. I don't mind the occasional male point of view.

[Pax]

I come here because women's spaces are a pretty rare thing. A place where we can talk to other people who will see and most likely understand our point of view. And if they don't they will ask thoughtful questions to draw out more information... rather than telling me I'm stupid because they don't get it.

The internet is chock full of places where men gather and enjoy their own unique form of communication, I spend a LOT of time out there... I come here to regain that sense of peace that comes from a more familiar view of the world.

[Velocivixen]

I'm fairly new to cycling on a regular basis, and none of my real life friends or acquaintances ride bikes. I don't know other women who ride. So you're my virtual "friends". ;)

[NbyNW]

I hang out here because you all are awesome.

And I think the forum moderators also do a great job, setting a tone for great discussions, good humor, and combatting spam.

[macski]

I agree with the general consensus that the forum is literate, supportive and encouraging and that's the main reason I enjoy it. I like following people's journeys as they get hooked by this wonderful passion of ours. And I appreciate the honesty and friendship between posters here.

I also frequent a number of other cycling forums that are 'mixed' but in reality very male dominated. There is an Australian one that I also quite enjoy but all of them are more aggressive and the posters are very quick to criticize. There is little tolerance of beginner questions or views and people are very opinionated. I visit them much less often.

[Jen12]

Good topic!
I'm new to the forum and new to serious biking in general. While I just happened to find the forum without necessarily looking for a female-centered group, I'm quite pleased with the friendliness and lack of ego here. I've also noticed that cycling magazines are definitely male-centered. With the exception of a few ads, the last issue of Bicycling magazine featured only articles and photos centered on men. I think that says a lot about the need for a forum like this.

[Catrin]

I am here because all of you are awesome and so very supportive. When I started cycling 17 months ago I only knew one person who rode, and I really needed advice. It is great to be able to bring my little accomplishments, to (hopefully) say something that might help someone else, and just participate as I can. I am on a couple of other mixed forums, and they have their place, but they are nothing like TE!

[Miranda]

:)I love TE so much. If I had not found this web site I would not have survived some things to be a cyclists today.

Thinking back, I believe how I came across TE was through the SheBeest brand. A female staff at the lbs had told me about the brand. Of course the women's clothing at the shop was so limited I went searching the net. Then the TE web site came up.

I was so discouraged with my lbs experiences and lack of help. My too large bike caused me much pain and also in my womanhood. Trying to discuss this with the shop was a sad joke. After reading a bit on the forum I saw it really didn't what your issues were. People were here to help. So, I got brave enough to post for help.

The advice I have received here has been awesome. I don't ever make a cycling decision about something (gear, training, etc) without checking/searching this forum.

As far as BikeForums goes, I agree. When you post a question there normally it goes like this.... 1) first few responses "uh, use the search function dumb a**"... hmm, if no one ever discussed anything would you have material to search? If no discussions wouldn't your forum go stagnent and your advertisers leave etc.? dhrrrr, 2) one person half way answers of help, 3) next few posts people fight over the answer, and 4) wait... what were we chatting about... oh yea:rolleyes:... lol. UGH!:mad:

As far as literacy goes... I still speak in text somewhat... only because I use it a lot for both work and personal matters... it's not all bad as long as you can still actually type a full sentance when you need to;).

Thanks, TE:cool:.

[Mr. Bloom]

Since I am the primary source of controversy here, I'll weigh in a bit...again. I really appreciate that lph is posing this question in the positive sense of the discussion; that is, why are YOU here?

For me, the primary issue is safety...not in the physical sense though. Safety in that this is a well moderated forum where one isn't exposed to the nastiness that exists on others. While I've tried others, they lack the general sense of productive collaboration and commaraderie that you find here.

Second, I've made many friends here. As recently as yesterday, I rode with Indysteel and her husband. A couple weeks ago, I had a fun breakfast with Melavai and three generations of her family (including her father who proudly displayed his cycling jersey tan line:D). While I've riden with many of you, I consider many more of you to be "online friends". I frankly bristle at the characterization that my presence would be voyeuristic or unwholesome...there are many threads that I don't go to because I know I'll have nothing to offer;)

Third, the members of this group are generally well educated, intelligent, thought provoking, from many different backgrounds and with a broad diversity of perspectives to offer.

So, although I am male (and gender access has been a point of controversy ever since the supreme court ruled on the issue decades ago), and I have been attacked and called many names, I remain here because it is safe, generally friendly, and populated by intelligent members from multiple places and disciplines...in short, this is a good place.

[OakLeaf]

Well, back to what I said before. This is obviously a broad generalization. But anyone who wants to jump on it as a sexist statement, please read some neuroscience and then offer your opinion.

Women - generally - understand that other people (including, but not limited to, people who participate in an online forum) are actual people, just like them. Men - by and large - don't; at least not in the same way that women do.

In a geopolitical as well as a domestic setting, that means physical violence and often death. In the context of an online forum, it means respect and patience, or the lack thereof.



A couple of starting points:
http://www.amazon.com/Female-Brain-Louann-Brizendine-M-D/dp/0767920090
http://www.amazon.com/Woman-Intimate-Geography-Natalie-Angier/dp/0385498411

and a classic:
http://www.amazon.com/Different-Voice-Psychological-Theory-Development/dp/0674445449



ETA - I shouldn't even have to say this, but to avoid anything ad feminam, most of you know I'm straight, I'm married to a man, most of the people I ride with are men. I don't dislike men generally, nor do I like all women. That's not the same thing as saying that there's no difference between women and men.

[Crankin]

I generally agree with Oakleaf's point re: gender differences and my "real life" status is pretty much the same as hers. Actually, in real life I have noticed I tend to gravitate to socializing with the males when I am in large groups, social or work. I have never been a girly girl and several times I've told that I "think like a man," or that I have a "strange attitude" for a woman. And that's why I think I have gravitated to TE, and other woman cyclists in general; the women here are pragmatic and accepting and very smart. You guys accept me, even if I like wearing makeup and cooking and you know that those things are not incompatible with getting dirty or riding 100 miles.
I don't participate in any other forums. Heck, I spend too much time here on TE to do so! I did do Bike Journal for a few years and that started feeling too competitive, so I quit. Actually my DH found TE first, when he was looking to order me a pair of rain pants and then he started getting emails from TE. I joined the forums about 4 months after that. I still remember it was the dead of winter, but sunny and warmer (February), and I had gone out on my mountain bike for my first short ride of the season.
I have wondered about what might happen if I met someone in real life and they "knew" all about me from TE. I don't write stuff that is too personal, except maybe about my adult kids. It's mostly about cycling and work, and other interests. I've met and ridden with many TE members and all of them were nice people... no weirdos. Everyone is so interesting, in terms of their cycling and their lives outside of cycling. I've met and ridden with racers, tourers, new riders, bike instructors, mechanics. Where else would I have met these people?
I get uncomfortable restricting men from participating. My DH might be someone who would feel comfortable here, but he sees it as my thing; he doesn't really do any online social stuff, except once in awhile the Miyata owner forum. He is always amazed at the wealth of information I get from TE and has also met several of the TE members from around Boston. I think if someone is obviously inappropriate, it's a different story. I see plenty of trolls here, because I get up early in the AM and see those posts before they have been removed. For all I know, they could be women trolls.

[shootingstar]

I I think if someone is obviously inappropriate, it's a different story. I see plenty of trolls here, because I get up early in the AM and see those posts before they have been removed. For all I know, they could be women trolls.

Lots of monotonous work for Jeff/Susan to look after -- I didn't know about the amount of trolls. And it certainly isn't going after a women's forum /because we're women, since I look after 2 of his blogs and have to clean up spam that trolls try to comment into this blogs --nearly daily. I think there are sufficient women trolls but maybe less than men.

I simply find it easier to chat up with women here compared to other forums. In face to face interactions, I don't spend hardly any time talking about make-up, fashion and men with, other women I know well.

So to me here, it mirrors the sort of topics and depth I would talk about with any face to face cycling woman friend. Except for some deeply personal stuff.

I would be interested in knowing the women who have dropped by and then drop out, what were their reasons for dropping out of TE? That might give a clue that would confirm about this forum's general spirit and dynamic. However I think the act of writing often, helps clarify matters for a person. So women who think just abit before they write IF they like to write often, are drawn to forums.


Men are different in a sense, that many don't talk about/mention their children much at all with other people outside their immediate family. I've noticed this at work --just less talk about their families. Even for guys who are attentive parents. Things have changed in the past few decades, but still I observe this even on the Internet.

My partner subscribes and participates occasionally in several Internet listservs and maybe 1-2 forums, but I suspect he sticks to cycling since he has cycling related business and has to keep himself non-personal.

The most personal side of him on the Internet....is the blogs that I manage for his business. I probably paved the way by introducing more personal details in my blog postings, which he then, realized he better loosen up abit in his blog postings or no one /hardly anyone will read our stuff. Who wants to read pure technical stuff all the time? We're not mechanics nor academics on cycling. :p

[itself]

I like the fact that a woman can come here and discuss issues that affect woman. Things as simple as a saddle to more complicated issues of going through menopause. Women still are a minority in 2011. It's pretty sad, but I still do not think we are treated equally salary-wise in the workplace.

That being said, because I ride recumbents, BROL has been a huge support for me. Recumbents are more complicated due to different bottom bracket heights on each bike, different seats and seat heights, and making modifications are not quite that simple. Thus, the guys there have been tremendously supportive to me.

This is an amazing forum, and a wonderful resource for women...

[owlice]

Mr. Bloom, for the record, I don't see you as the primary, or even as a, source of controversy. The question this thread poses is relevant whether you post here or not (and this does not suggest that you are irrelevant!). I like having some males voices here, actually.

I like TE because of the level of discussion, and yes, the writing abilities! I know I can ask any question, don't have to apologize for including something like "panty liner" (bad idea on a bike ride, I discovered, back when I first got back in to riding) in a post, and get replies in complete sentences that are supportive and sometimes extremely amusing, too. If I need an answer broken down into plainer language, those who answer educate me without assuming I'm an idiot.

I know I can write about the stupid things I do (a great education, doing stupid things, as picking up my growling cat last Sunday exemplified) and have those here laugh with, not at, me as I laugh at myself (which is why I share the stupid things).

The board is very well moderated, which I appreciate, too. I moderate elsewhere and know some of the frustrations and challenges that go with moderation. I like how clean this board is because of its moderation. That contentious topics such as religion and politics are discouraged here helps, too; I get enough of them on Facebook!

[Biciclista]

Oakleaf,
I don't think anyone is arguing with you.
I too work in a male dominated work environment, have a husband and two sons (no daughters) so honestly for me, it's nice to go "somewhere" where for once there is not a paternalistic tone about where to go for help, advice, reassurance. This is not your daddy's forum.. This is where you go to get wisdom from women.
Need advice ? ask a woman here. How cool is that?

[jessmarimba]

Had a reply...never mind...not something to bring up in this thread.

[channlluv]

Well, now we're all curious, Jess. :)

I come here because even though I'm 80lbs overweight and have food issues, every single person here has been supportive of my cycling and swimming. Yeah, I get the occasional much-needed tough love kick in the butt about food and regular exercise. I don't take that as judging. I take that as "Come on, you can do this -- don't lose sight of your goals." A lot of women here have been through similar life experiences.

I can ask questions about food sensitivities, get great recipes I'd never have thought to try otherwise, get advice on cross training, and so much more, and not a bit of judgement with any of it. And here's a key thing: I can also OFFER advice based on my own experience and you women listen and take what I have to contribute as something valuable and you don't discount it because I'm "too fat to bike" or whatever. That actually happens in other forums. Those of you who are very fit may never know what it feels like to be made invisible and completely disregarded because of your appearance, but even so, most of the women on this board will make supportive comments, even if that's never, and will probably never, happened to them.

I was a member of BikeForums for a while and I felt relegated to their large women's Athena forum, which was hardly ever posted in when I was there, and then it was mostly people saying "Hi, I'm here." There was no real discussion, and when I tried to participate in the regular forums, I felt like I'd dropped into the middle of a frat house or something.

As for Mr. Bloom, it's nice that you like to hang out here and you've made friends here, but Silver does, too, and she has friends on the board who have missed her presence since you two split. When she said she felt like you "got TE" in the divorce, I felt her pain on that one. I think a lot of us here did. When you said you intended to keep your interactions with her civil on this board, the tone of it rankled me. I'll be honest and say it's never bothered me until right then that you are a regular on the board.

The only other male I notice on a regular basis is PsyclePath, and I appreciate his comments on bike safety issues. In fact, I'm probably wrong on this, but I can't remember him posting about much else. Although I do recall a story about him having a flat in Mobile while visiting family and having to take the tire in for repair, and the lbs wrench asking him how the Madone was, and PsyclePath asking how the guy knew he rode a Madone, and the guy saying it was because of the quality of the tire.

That's also where I learned you can fix a hole in a tire with a dollar bill long enough to get it to a shop for repair. That was you, wasn't it, Psycle?

Okay, so, yeah, open communication, tough love, non-judgmental, great recipes, great advice, lots of rah-rah support when I need it. And I love that I have virtual friends from all over the world. I feel so eclectic. <g>

Roxy

[jobob]

Mr. Bloom, for the record, I don't see you as the primary, or even as a, source of controversy.

I respectfully disagree. I do not share the above poster's view in this matter. I consider Mr. Bloom to be the primary source of the controversy here.

I always wondered why the spouse of one of our TE members hung around so much on this forum; it got to the point where he was posting continuously while she hardly ever posted.

Then, out of the blue, Mr. Bloom saw fit to post a hideous, ugly tirade while he and his wife were in the midst of a divorce. His ex-wife stopped posting on TE, much to the disappointment of many of us here. Considering the venom Mr. Bloom spewed, it was understandable, but still regrettable; in light of the bitter ex-husband's staking his "claim" to this board, I think many of us would have cut our losses and walked away as well.

Mr. Bloom is still here, obviously. He has certainly built himself quite a following here; particularly when there is any discussion of business matters, he presents himself as the voice of manly wisdom and experience. I'm sure he gets quite the ego boost posting here. I suspect that's the main reason why he is here; he's a big fish in our little pond.

I for one do not welcome his presence, but we've dealt with this many times before and the consensus is he is perfectly free to be here.

Fortunately, the TE forum now has an "ignore user" option, so those of us who do not welcome Mr. Bloom here can use that option.

Mr. Bloom's constant presence had actually been a non-issue for me until his ex reappeared (much to the delight of many of us here) and he wasted no time criticizing her for alluding to their divorce, despite the fact it was just a passing mention and there was no reference made to him.

I'm sure Mr. Bloom will once again climb up on his high horse and act the injured party -- that is his pattern whenever any criticism (real or imaginary) comes his way. That, and dropping the names of his good friends on TE, presumably to reinforce the fact that he's a great guy.

Back to the original question -- I have no problem with men occasionally posting on TE. For the reasons above, Mr. Bloom is an exception to that. Which is neither here nor there. Mr. Bloom has every right to be here, as I have every right not to welcome it.

[salsabike]

I respectfully disagree. I consider Mr. Bloom to be the primary source of the controversy here.

I always wondered why the spouse of one of our TE members hung around so much on this forum; it got to the point where he was posting continuously while she hardly ever posted.

Then, out of the blue, Mr. Bloom saw fit to post a hideous, ugly tirade while he and his wife were in the midst of a divorce. His ex-wife stopped posting on TE, much to the disappointment of many of us here. Considering the venom Mr. Bloom spewed, it was understandable, but still regrettable; in light of the bitter ex-husband's staking his "claim" to this board, I think many of us would have cut our losses and walked away as well.

Mr. Bloom is still here, obviously. He has certainly built himself quite a following here; particularly when there is any discussion of business matters, he presents himself as the voice of manly wisdom and experience. I'm sure he gets quite the ego boost posting here. I suspect that's the main reason why he is here; he's a big fish in our little pond.

I for one do not welcome his presence, but we've dealt with this many times before and the consensus is he is perfectly free to be here.

Fortunately, the TE forum now has an "ignore user" option, so those of us who do not welcome Mr. Bloom here can use that option.

Mr. Bloom's constant presence had actually been a non-issue for me until his ex reappeared (much to the delight of many of us here) and he wasted no time criticizing her for alluding to their divorce, despite the fact it was just a passing mention and there was no reference made to him.

I'm sure Mr. Bloom will once again climb up on his high horse and act the injured party -- that is his pattern whenever any criticism (real or imaginary) comes his way. That, and dropping the names of his good friends on TE, presumably to reinforce the fact that he's a great guy.

Back to the original question -- I have no problem with men occasionally posting on TE. For the reasons above, Mr. Bloom is an exception to that. Which is neither here nor there. Mr. Bloom has every right to be here, as I have every right not to welcome it.

EXACTLY. I couldn't have said it better. Thank you, Jo.

[Biciclista]

I respectfully disagree. I consider Mr. Bloom to be the primary source of the controversy here.

I always wondered why the spouse of one of our TE members hung around so much on this forum; it got to the point where he was posting continuously while she hardly ever posted.

Then, out of the blue, Mr. Bloom saw fit to post a hideous, ugly tirade while he and his wife were in the midst of a divorce. His ex-wife stopped posting on TE, much to the disappointment of many of us here. Considering the venom Mr. Bloom spewed, it was understandable, but still regrettable; in light of the bitter ex-husband's staking his "claim" to this board, I think many of us would have cut our losses and walked away as well.

Mr. Bloom is still here, obviously. He has certainly built himself quite a following here; particularly when there is any discussion of business matters, he presents himself as the voice of manly wisdom and experience. I'm sure he gets quite the ego boost posting here. I suspect that's the main reason why he is here; he's a big fish in our little pond.

I for one do not welcome his presence, but we've dealt with this many times before and the consensus is he is perfectly free to be here.

Fortunately, the TE forum now has an "ignore user" option, so those of us who do not welcome Mr. Bloom here can use that option.

Mr. Bloom's constant presence had actually been a non-issue for me until his ex reappeared (much to the delight of many of us here) and he wasted no time criticizing her for alluding to their divorce, despite the fact it was just a passing mention and there was no reference made to him.

I'm sure Mr. Bloom will once again climb up on his high horse and act the injured party -- that is his pattern whenever any criticism (real or imaginary) comes his way. That, and dropping the names of his good friends on TE, presumably to reinforce the fact that he's a great guy.

Back to the original question -- I have no problem with men occasionally posting on TE. For the reasons above, Mr. Bloom is an exception to that. Which is neither here nor there. Mr. Bloom has every right to be here, as I have every right not to welcome it.

I hate to be a copy cat, but you definitely nailed it.

[owlice]

It's not a controversy until/unless people make it one, and people are, of course, free to disagree as to whether Mr. Bloom is a source of controversy, but it's rather silly to disagree with my statement that I don't see him as one! What, you think I DO see him as one?! But I don't! :D

I recall the thread in which Mr. Bloom announced the divorce, but do not remember it being nasty. Might someone point me to that thread, please?

For the record, I have not interacted with either Mr. Bloom nor Silver (except perhaps in passing) though always appreciated both their posts. I hope they can both participate here and that both refrain from mentioning the other. Though many of us vent here about spouses/SOs/exes/kids/etc., the venting is basically anonymous, those spouses/SOs/exes/kids/etc. aren't here and aren't known to us, and that's NOT the situation with Silver and Mr. Bloom.

Clearly if someone doesn't like one or the other, one can ignore that person. I think they both have great things to say about biking, and I plan to enjoy both their posts on the subject that brought us all together on this board.

And that is all I will say on this.

[owlice]

Well, now we're all curious, Jess. :)
But on this, I'll say, yes, add me to the list of the curious! :)

[jessmarimba]

I had always wondered why he was here but never thought very deeply on the subject. Now I do see it as somewhat odd - I wouldn't be happy in silver's situation - but I can't really judge since I didn't know anything about any of it.

I enjoy that TE is a bike-related place where my boyfriend isn't involved. It allows me to be me, rather than me to be a cyclist with ~20 years less experience who has issues riding at altitude, a fear of riding downhill, and no concept of bike repair. I can speak freely and not worry about it.

(Roxy, my post before was somewhat comparing racing mountain bikes to other male-dominated forums, vs. TE being more of a trail running race laid-back, supportive, friendly atmosphere. Which is why I love racing on foot, even though I'll never be that great, but don't (at present) have much desire to race on my mountain bike. In general. There are (as always) exceptions to that. Interesting idea, but better geared towards a different thread, I think.)

[Crankin]

I don't really want to get into this discussion, but I don't remember anyone (Silver or Mr. B) making a nasty comment about the divorce, during the divorce. In fact, I didn't know they were getting a divorce, until many months , or even a year later, when Mr. B affirmed that it had happened, when, I think, someone asked. I really thought it was a joke when he said this and I remember posting this. I wouldn't have thought it was a joke if I had seen "comments."
I guess I must be too welcoming. While it does feel a little uncomfortable to have former spouses who are not happy with each other on the forum, I really don't want to exclude either of them. And, I am surprised at the quickness to judgment on this matter. It doesn't matter who was "at fault" for the split or who joined here, first. They both have been valuable members of the community and they both should be here. There are some on the forum that I know I have very different values from; it doesn't mean they should be excluded because they don't fit my mold :).

[channlluv]

Jess, I get it. It's all about being accepted for who and where you are at the moment and supported in getting to where you want to be.

I missed Bloom's "hideous, ugly tirade" during the midst of the divorce, too, but I can't imagine that doing anything to endear him to the group here.

I share stuff with my husband that I read on TE. Mostly the jokes. I don't remember who posted about Jens just finishing the first lap around Tahoe -- "Shut up, snow!" -- but DH thought that was hilarious. He shared it with all of his cycling buddies, too.

But it would never occur to him to hang out here.

Roxy

[indysteel]

It pains me that I've been implicated in this controversy. I became IRL friends with Silver and the now Mr. Bloom when they were still (seemingly) happily married. Over the course of a year or two, I rode with them/saw them at a number of rides. Mr. B and I also share a professional connection.

Their divorce saddened me, but I tried to stay out of it on TE and IRL and that's where I'd prefer to stay. I'm very glad Silver is back; I'm sad that she ever went away. I hope she doesn't doubt my sincerity in that. By the same token, I have remained friends with Mr. Bloom, and while I am not going to apologize for that, I also don't want it to be perceived as some form of side-taking in terms of Silver.

Otherwise, think of me as Switzerland.

[Biciclista]

cool, you could change your name to Indyswitzerland!

No one is implicating you...

[Owlie]

I enjoy that TE is a bike-related place where my boyfriend isn't involved. It allows me to be me, rather than me to be a cyclist with ~20 years less experience who has issues riding at altitude, a fear of riding downhill, and no concept of bike repair. I can speak freely and not worry about it.


This is my situation. DBF doesn't "get" that I have that fear of riding downhill, that I haven't been riding for years and my bike control skills are such that I'd rather dismount and walk around an obstacle that I'm not sure I can clear on the bike.
I'll add to the chorus that it's a literate, supportive community where I can ask questions about nearly anything (bike-related or not) and get answers or at least commiseration.

I'm on another forum (a knitting forum!) that by its nature is mostly women. And while it is also a supportive and friendly group, I just don't have that much in common with most of its members. The conversation that isn't knitting-related largely revolves around the members' offspring. I'm not interested! I'm not a girly girl, and most of my real-life friends are men. It's a different outlook here, I guess.

[WindingRoad]

Honestly after reading all the comments, I think we are just going to have to realize there is no easy answer for Mr. B or Silver. But in essence it is their issue to contend with. I don't envy either of them because that is a really awkward position to be in. I guess I'm viewing them more as people and less as male and female. I get the part about it's supposed to be a women's forum but I haven't interpreted Mr. B's comments as hostile. Possibly a bit disgruntled at times but come on they did just go through a divorce. I don't know either of them but I hope they both feel welcome to post here on TE.

[Mr. Bloom]

So, last year I posted something addressing my name change. The debate made it evident some were offended, others didn't gauge it as offensive at all. What was consistent though was that the uninformed ones who thought it was nasty, made their attacks on me very direct and personal...akin to jobob's post above but on steroids (I recall one poster calling me directly "an idiot").

I deleted the post for a number reasons including the fact that it was blown out of proportion and the volunteer moderators should not have been called on as they were to judge the intent or to moderate such an uproar.

I did not "get TE in the divorce"...I simply continued doing what I had before...and what I intend to continue doing for the reasons I noted above...and I have moved on in my life.

Thank for the supportive PMs. For the one who made a particularly nasty PM to me this morning, I'm not sure what you intended to accomplish.

Indy: so sorry, I didn't mean to put you in the middle (I don't even know what irl is :p). No worries on my part...

Now, to all, let the issue rest.

[indysteel]

cool, you could change your name to Indyswitzerland!

No one is implicating you...

No; it would be Switzerlandsteel. :)

Mr. Bloom referred to meeting me yesterday, and Jobob perceived that as name dropping on his part. Sorry, but I felt implicated to some degree. In the very least, I wanted to make it clear that I haven't, nor do I plan on, taking sides.

[Mr. Bloom]

Winding Road, I was typing as you posted...and I couldn't agree more. Well said

[Biciclista]

No; it would be Switzerlandsteel. :)

Mr. Bloom referred to meeting me yesterday, and Jobob perceived that as name dropping on his part. Sorry, but I felt implicated to some degree. In the very least, I wanted to make it clear that I haven't, nor do I plan on, taking sides.

no, that doesn't implicate you, instead it makes you a personnage! someone able to hold the lofty name of Switzerlandsteel... :D:cool:

[OakLeaf]

Now, to all, let the issue rest.

Seriously? You're telling US that???! In THIS thread?

I think that in seven words you've managed to completely and thoroughly answer lph's question.

[shootingstar]

+1 with Oakleaf's latest comment/reaction.

Anyway, in terms of my some fear of heights, etc., no my dearie has been sympathetic to me and other stuff. I don't see it as a guy thing, it's just easier to discuss coping mechanisms more easily with a bunch of gals vs. with a bunch of guys. Easier to talk about such problems with a guy individually.

[snapdragen]

Mr Bloom, you were not even mentioned in this thread, until you decided to make it about you and your "controversy". Don't be surprised when you are jumped on afterwards, you are well aware of the feelings of many of the TE regulars.

[TxDoc]

My, I'm wordy tonight. So - why are you here on TE, and is it important to you that it's a women's forum?

Hi LPH, interesting question. In my case, I grew up around bikes and just love to read/write/talk about cycling.
No, it does not matter to me wheher it's a women or men or mixed forum - what matters is the content, and I see many interesting discussions here. Actually, I teand to read the bike forums more often than TE, mostly because the 'racing/training/race report/pro cycling' sections are a bit more active there, but I enjoy both BF and TE.
A few things I especially like about TE: one is that we write better than on most online environments :D Seriously, there seems to be less of that teenager-like language, made of cryptic abbreviations and terrible grammar, that is so commonly observed online... another one is that it seems to be easier to get together with TE folks, I guess there's a bit more 'online-trust' here, if such a thing exists :rolleyes:, and when we see an opportunity to meet up and ride together we go out of our way to make it happen.

[Pax]

EXACTLY. I couldn't have said it better. Thank you, Jo.
Ditto.



Mr Bloom, you were not even mentioned in this thread, until you decided to make it about you and your "controversy". Don't be surprised when you are jumped on afterwards, you are well aware of the feelings of many of the TE regulars.
Yup. A thread with a general question to the women here about why they choose to post on a women's cycling forum.

I left TE for a while, partly because of physical issues that stopped me from riding but partly because of Mr. Silver. The overwhelming paternalistic tone of his posts irks me to no end. I get enough of that IRL, I don't need it when I come to a forum by and for WOMEN. Fortunately the ignore feature works well here and I don't have to be subjected to his "father knows best" tone.

[Veronica]

Ditto.



Yup. A thread with a general question to the women here about why they choose to post on a women's cycling forum.

I left TE for a while, partly because of physical issues that stopped me from riding but partly because of Mr. Silver. The overwhelming paternalistic tone of his posts irks me to no end. I get enough of that IRL, I don't need it when I come to a forum by and for WOMEN. Fortunately the ignore feature works well here and I don't have to be subjected to his "father knows best" tone.

I suspect men in a typical men's forum would not put up with that tone and would respond unkindly. If we were men, we'd tell him to hightail it out of our forum using some crude language. Because we're mainly women, we find better ways to deal with an unpleasant (for some) situation, thus making it a "safe" place to be.

I have wondered if the mods ever check on who is the most ignored poster. OMG, what if it's me? :D

Veronica

[Pax]

I suspect men in a typical men's forum would not put up with that tone and would respond unkindly. If we were men, we'd tell him to hightail it out of our forum using some crude language. Because we're mainly women, we find better ways to deal with an unpleasant (for some) situation, thus making it a "safe" place to be.

I have wondered if the mods ever check on who is the most ignored poster. OMG, what if it's me? :D

Veronica
I spend a lot of time on motorcycling forums and you are 100% correct. And anytime someone presents themselves as "the voice" or expert about a given topic, 100 other men will be along shortly to question/probe/debunk/argue the points made all the while using language that is almost poetic in it's depth of profanity. Then, if there were any doubt cast on the posters expertise, they would hound the guy every single time he tries to "share his expertise" in the future.

I LOVE TE! :D

[jobob]

Indysteel, I am very sorry that my comment caused you distress. That was not at all my intention.

And after many rounds of editing, I'll leave it at that.

[goldfinch]

I am very new to this forum, and I had never heard of Bloom or Silver before this thread. I probably should butt out but it isn't my nature. :) My spouse and I used to post on a particular forum. I had posted on the forum a couple of years before he started there. I was a founder and a moderator/administrator. My spouse and I split. He graciously left the forum. In return, I never talk about him at all on that forum. (For all I know he reads it, but he no longer posts there.) Awkwardness avoided.

As I understand it, Mr. Bloom remains as a forum participant and Silver is uncomfortable, rarely posting as she feels that she lost the forum in their divorce. Given that this forum is primarily for women, Bloom should do the gracious thing and leave. Silver has better rights to the place than he does.

As far as most ignored posters, in the forum I moderated we would sometimes send messages to posters that were ignored by a large number of users and suggest that they might want to change their style. We also would take into consideration the ignore list when deciding whether to ban someone.

[owlice]

What an ugly thread this has become.

[salsabike]

I don't think it is in the least ugly.

[Pax]

I don't think it is in the least ugly.

Agreed. Sometimes topics need to be discussed, even when they're not about happy or light subjects.

[indysteel]

Indysteel, I am very sorry that my comment caused you distress. That was not at all my intention.

And after many rounds of editing, I'll leave it at that.

Jo, you didn't cause me distress, dear. Like I said, I just wanted to emphasize my neutrality--for Silver's sake as much as anybody else.

[jobob]

Ah, I misunderstood, nevermind.

You now have me thinking of Switzerland.
Mmm, chocolate.
Mmmmm, very attractive time trialists. :cool:

[PamNY]

When I found this forum, I wasn't looking for or thinking about a women's group. I have certainly benefited tremendously from the guidance and emotional support; how much the gender of participants has to do with that, I can't say for sure.

I do enjoy the literate and civil atmosphere, and I like getting advice from intelligent and thoughtful people.

I like Mr. Bloom, too. Issues with his ex-wife (if there are any) are none of my business. I enjoyed posts from both of them on this forum.

[marni]

Almost every forum I have ever belonged to has ended up in a nasty flame war at some point. I have quit quite a few forums because of this. I join a forum to gain information, interact with other people who enjoy the same things I do, who have some common sense, pragmatism, a sense of humor, and can write legibly and intelligently. That is why I enjoy TE so much.

I don't want to have to leave this forum as well because of all of the nasty negative spewing currently going on.

Will everybody please go for a bike ride, blow off some steam and close this topic out.

Or better yet, start a new thread entitled flame war and everybody vent their wroth and ire and I will ignore it and then we can get back to riding and chatting as usual.

thank you very much

marni

[lph]

I'm sorry if this thread has been distressing to some, or feels ugly. Frankly I feel that any "controversy" it's brought up should be aired from time to time. I deliberately posed an open question in the first place, because I'm more interested in hearing people's general opinion about TE, and about what we feel is important and unique about it than just a "who gets to be here", which we don't really get to decide anyway. But I figured that if it being a womens forum was important to people, it would be discussed, maybe with some insight as to why. And if it's not important to many people, that would be (is!) an interesting point too.

But I'd like to add that whether you like someone or not doesn't really matter. There are people here I don't like that much, I'm sure there are people here who don't like me much, but as long as we behave we still have a right to be here. In the same vein it's possible to voice an opinion as to whether this should be purely a womens forum regardless of what you happen to think of Mr. Bloom, or PsyclePath, or any other man who sometimes posts here. To put it this way, many of us are happily married, but don't particularly want our dhs and boyfriends posting here with us. Not for any secrecy, anyone can read it as we all know, but because women-only spaces are hard to find, like someone mentioned. Especially maybe for us women cyclists.

My own opinion? Like I said earlier, I feel that women-only groups tend to express themselves differently than mixed groups. I feel that TEs unique nature has to do with the overwhelming majority of the posters being female. And yes, if I were given the choice, I would prefer it to be exclusively female.

[Kiwi Stoker]

I read and participate in a few forums. Like some have mentioned Bikeforums is a totally different world to TE. I mainly stay in the Tandem section in which there is a good feeling of helping there.

I also belong to a Art forum which is mixed, lots of men and everyone is from all around the world. It actually has been pretty good there as people post their work for comments. The forum has a guide about commenting and the moderators are pretty good in making it work. Only once did someone post a belittling comment about someone's first piece of art and that was removed. The poster was a woman which was strange. She later apologised and it hasn't been mentioned again on that thread.

You do have to show sensitivity, especially when you have an artist posting a picture of one of the Spiritual leaders he had done for his brother, but everyone was able to find merit in the work. I was expecting someone to say something inappropiate but they didn't.

I think it also boils down to what the topic is, how the forum is setup and managed and the people participating. Obviously artists both male and female on that forum can co-exist well. Possibly as art is a level playing field between the sexes.

[Orange utopia]

I am kind of new here. I posted on here for a short period a few years back under a different user name but I couldn't remember it when I started posting again this time. I just took the time to use the search function and found it, I was mom2twins back in 2005.

Anyway, I left because life got in the way and I stopped ridding for a long time. I came back because I like the feel of community here. I like thinking that I can ask a question or voice a concern and there won't be a lot of sarcastic replies.

I have another forum I am a member of that is women only. We are all motherss of twins and most of us have been together for 8-9 years. Used to have a public board that would often get trolls and nosey husbands but then we went private a few years ago and made an agreement that we wouldn't give our dh's or other men access.

However, that was a different kind of place. We didn't get a lot of new members and by that time we were mostly a set group that had been together a long long time and it had stopped being a support group for parenting twins and more of just a hang out place for friends. Even then I was in the minority and against going private. I didn't even care if men wanted to participate as long as they were civil. But i was out voted.

[Crankin]

I could care less if men want to be on TE. As long as everyone adheres to the philosophy of the forum.
Paternalistic? I get that feeling from other posters, not just the male ones. The changing a flat thread brought that out and most of it was directed toward me! Maybe paternalistic isn't the right word, but there was a lot of "what's wrong with you?" in that thread. I decided to go out on a limb by posting my true issues and fears, and some responded with the comment that I was acting like a dependent woman, just get with it. And the one that bothered me the most was from someone I actually have met. A few of you were gracious enough to PM me and ask if I was offended by your comments, and honestly it wasn't the comments from those of you who sent a PM that made me feel badly.
I am not experienced in the ways of forums, because TE is the only one I participate in. Sometimes I read articles on various sites and look at the comments underneath. The level of vehemence and overall stupidity amazes me, so I have no desire to participate in anything else on line. A few weeks ago, I posted a link to an article about my former exchange student in Velo News. I could not believe the nasty comments people posted about him at the end of the article. So, my take is that in general, people are uncomfortable with things or people that are different from them, those who have had success, or those with more money. The level of anger against men in general, surprises me. Believe me, I've met my share of azzholes, and they come in both genders.

[redrhodie]

To put it this way, many of us are happily married, but don't particularly want our dhs and boyfriends posting here with us. Not for any secrecy, anyone can read it as we all know, but because women-only spaces are hard to find, like someone mentioned. Especially maybe for us women cyclists.


I would hate it my bf was here, because I think I'd have to further edit everything I wrote. This is my space. Although I never say anything that outrageous, I still speak my mind and don't want to have to watch every punctuation mark. We don't fight a lot, but we do debate whether it's hot or cold all the time, if you know what I mean. :rolleyes:

[snapdragen]

Sometimes I read articles on various sites and look at the comments underneath. The level of vehemence and overall stupidity amazes me, so I have no desire to participate in anything else on line. .

Crankin, I've stopped reading any comments attached to a news article online. They always seem to bring out the worst in humanity, it's so depressing.

[Blueberry]

Snap - better words of wisdom were never spoken....

[maillotpois]

I have wondered if the mods ever check on who is the most ignored poster. OMG, what if it's me? :D

Veronica

We didn't want to tell you.....


:p

[administrator]

Lots of monotonous work for Jeff/Susan to look after

Actually, Snap does almost all the heavy lifting in this regard, and we rely on forum members to notify us of the trolls/spammers. Usually, by the time I get the notification in my inbox, she has already taken care of it! Many thanks to Snapdragen and our other moderators!!

[spokewench]

I like TE because it is civil. Sometimes I have to distance myself from other forums because they are so "un-civil". It is also nice to talk to other women about female issues and get the perspective that is a female perspective vs. a male perspective. I do not believe that is in any way prejudicial to men. The beauty of life is that we are all different.

Even this thread has, on the whole, been civil. Of course, there are different opinions, but most of them have been thoughtfully presented. This is what I appreciate about this forum and am glad that it exists even though I hardly ride a bike anymore after living and breathing bikes for years.

[Pax]

We didn't want to tell you.....


:p
LOL!!! :p

[lph]

LOL!!! :p

How would we know she asked? ;)

[Veronica]

Hey, stop picking on me! I'm telling... moderators, oh moderators Pax and MP are picking on me! :p

Veronica

[Chile Pepper]

I hadn't really thought about it before, but the only other forum on which I actively participate is also a women's forum. I don't post as frequently here, but I still have a sense of connection, and I care about the other members. The high levels of civility and literacy certainly contribute to the experience!

[Kerry1976]

I can only comment to the original question as I joined this forum in October 2010.

I was directed here by a good friend who runs my favorite in the world online women's running forum. I knew when she pointed me here that it was the right place for me.

My only forum memberships are this for biking and that one for running. The running forum is a password-protected-women-only forum. However, many of us are also friends on FB and there have been meet ups. We've also done secret santa exchanges too - total fun!

In general, I have sought women's forums for information and assistance. There are just some things in running (and biking) that are best answered by women, for women. I've learned so much on both forums and my life is better for it. Beyond that, especially on the running forum (as I've been an active member for a good 3 or 4 years now), I honestly can call those women my friends, my sisters, etc.

When I started Weight Watchers in January 2011, I took a look at the forums. However, the first few threads I saw were somewhat argumentative and dismissive of people. I am sure that is not indicative of the whole of the WW threads, but I can say I've never since returned to use, let alone even look at, the WW boards.

[snapdragen]

Ooh Kerry1976 - the WW forums are a nest of vipers! I ran away as fast as I could... :D I only looked at the General section, and found it too much.

[snapdragen]

Hey, stop picking on me! I'm telling... moderators, oh moderators Pax and MP are picking on me! :p

Veronica

You again? Must you always be the tattle-tale? :rolleyes::D:rolleyes::D

[shootingstar]

Yay, snapdragon and adminstrators who clean up the litter on the forums!

[snapdragen]

Actually, Snap does almost all the heavy lifting in this regard, and we rely on forum members to notify us of the trolls/spammers. Usually, by the time I get the notification in my inbox, she has already taken care of it! Many thanks to Snapdragen and our other moderators!!

I think Adventure Girl gets to many of them before me -- she's a stealth one... :cool:

[Veronica]

I think Adventure Girl gets to many of them before me -- she's a stealth one... :cool:


And she never tells us about her adventures anymore. :(

Veronica

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

On any online community or forum, each one of us are liked more by some people and not especially liked by other people. That's just human nature. There are various members here that have a tone that sort of creeps me out whenever they post, but they have just as much right to be here as I do and I wouldn't dream of suggesting they should leave TE. And I'm sure there are those who wish I would just disappear. Oh well, in this world we can neither like everyone or be liked by everyone!
If Silver and Mr.Bloom both stopped alluding to their personal bitter divorce issues on here, and quit using TE to bait each other and take public swipes at each other knowing they were both reading, then there would be little problem. It reminds me of children of divorced parents who learn that it can be to their advantage to play the parents off each other. Divide and conquer.

Is it not possible for Mr.Bloom and Silver to focus their posts on other things in their lives for a while and about biking, and refrain from responding to each other and indirectly alluding to each other in ways intended to provoke? Why pull the entire forum into a personal battle, regardless of the sex of either party?
Maybe time for all of us to act like grownups. Personally, I feel it speaks poorly for all of us to take sides and dive so enthusiastically into the drama. It doesn't represent or do credit to this wonderful and positive online community we all love.

[GLC1968]

I know I'm a little late on this thread, but in my opinion, TE isn't great because we are women, TE is great because of the type of women we are individually.
I have belonged to many other all-women forums and none of them can come close to the civilty and commraderie that we have here. Hell, they often devolve into flame wars faster than BikeForums could ever hope to!

There are two other forums that I frequent that have a similiar vibe to TE. Both of them are very, very well moderated. I'm going to give credit both to the moderators and admins here, and to us as a community. We are an accepting lot. We don't tolerate stupidity/ego/flames...people who like those types of interactions just don't hang out here for long because we don't feed it. It does wonders for creating a comfortable space!

[Grog]

I love TE because of how it deals with controversy. :D

[Melalvai]

I mostly wanted to stay out of this discussion but I've been inexorably pulled in, partly because I'm waiting on someone and I have time to kill and things to procrastinate. (Speaking of killing time, a few weeks ago we had time to kill so we went looking for a watch that my daughter had asked for...)

lph, thanks for starting the thread. That was brave of you. It made me nervous but now the discussion has gone on for 6 pages without erupting all out into a flame war I feel safe enough to respond.

I like Team Estrogen because you can ask a question and get an answer without a ton of judgments. That has been my experience with other forums. I don't think that characteristic is because women are nicer people, I think it is because this forum is heavily moderated. I'm a big fan of active moderation and I am not a fan of unlimited freedom of speech...Is it heresy to freely say that? lol

I strongly dislike exclusive clubs. I would not like a women-only TE where men are excluded. (And since a male is one of our moderators that would be inappropriate.) How do any of us know that any of us are really women? For all most of you know, I could be a 60 year old 300 pound gorilla. (ha, thought I was going to say man, didn't you?) (I type pretty good for a gorilla!)

I like the self-proclaimed males with whom I've interacted on TE. I like most of the women here. I notice a few males who sign on just long enough to ask "What bike should I get for my girl?" or "Help my girlfriend with her girly-bit problems!" I'm really glad we can help them.

I would welcome my husband on TE, I would see it as something that we could share. I'm ok that he's not interested. I tell him the stories about what goes on here. :) He does find it interesting to have my perspective on a highly-moderated forum, because he runs his own forum (heavily moderated) and has experience on lightly-moderated forums.

Even in paradisiacal TE, not everyone is going to like everyone or agree with each other, and how boring would that be if we did. People will post things that offend others. People will take offense at posts. In fact I have been offended at a post here and there, and a person here & there has been offended by something I said. My experience on TE has been largely safe and supportive, and those moments of discomfort few and mild.

Some of us seem to remember events differently, that is apparent. That happens to me sometimes. My husband & daughter have this memory which I can't seem to shake: they believe that I tried to get rid of the (old & broken) couch when we moved last year. I sort of see where they came up with that idea, and I've tried to explain that I had genuinely believed that neither of them cared about the old couch, and as soon as I realized that they were attached to it I dropped the idea of replacing it. Yet no matter how many times I try to correct their version of this history, they still remember it that way, and are suspicious that I might make more attempts on their treasured memories! Well, all I can do is try to live an upright life and they'll either change that belief about me, or not, and if it's the worst inaccuracy that is believed about me to my dying day, I've probably gotten off light!

[snapdragen]

If Silver and Mr.Bloom both stopped alluding to their personal bitter divorce issues on here, and quit using TE to bait each other and take public swipes at each other knowing they were both reading, then there would be little problem. It reminds me of children of divorced parents who learn that it can be to their advantage to play the parents off each other. Divide and conquer.

Is it not possible for Mr.Bloom and Silver to focus their posts on other things in their lives for a while and about biking, and refrain from responding to each other and indirectly alluding to each other in ways intended to provoke? Why pull the entire forum into a personal battle, regardless of the sex of either party?
Maybe time for all of us to act like grownups. Personally, I feel it speaks poorly for all of us to take sides and dive so enthusiastically into the drama. It doesn't represent or do credit to this wonderful and positive online community we all love.

I don't see where either silver or Mr. B have done a lot of talking about their split. silver mentioned it in her return thread, Mr B responded by saying something along the lines of remaining civil. I would assume the best thing would be for both of them to put each other on ignore.

I am glad to see this thread has not degenerated into an ugly mess, it well could have.

[maillotpois]

For all most of you know, I could be a 60 year old 300 pound gorilla. (ha, thought I was going to say man, didn't you?) (I type pretty good for a gorilla!)


You aren't a camel????

:eek:

[snapdragen]

You aren't a camel????

:eek:

Hmmmmmm ///looks with slant eyes/// do we allow camels on TE?

[administrator]

Hmmmmmm ///looks with slant eyes/// do we allow camels on TE?


Only if they are properly attired:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j307/littlemrsl/camels.jpg

photo credit: http://acolorfullife.wordpress.com/2008/03/11/colorful-camels/

[snapdragen]

Only if they are properly attired:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j307/littlemrsl/camels.jpg

photo credit: http://acolorfullife.wordpress.com/2008/03/11/colorful-camels/

Oooh...can we buy those in the TE store!!!!!!??????

[zoom-zoom]

Oooh...can we buy those in the TE store!!!!!!??????

I think that would give me saddle sores... :eek:

[maillotpois]

It doesn't really look like a wicking material.

[lph]

And really - don't they have a style a little more flattering?? Pompoms have never done anything for me.

I just noticed - little piece of trivia coming up. The closest camel, the one slobbering profusely all over the place, is, according to our camel guide in Jordan this winter, "looking for the ladies!"

[Bike Writer]

LPH, thank you for starting this thread, as usual, I am a bit late to the party.

I like the TE forum because I can ask a question and get a variety of good answers. The interactions are mostly professional and very helpful, it is a supportive community. It seems like most of the posters here are self confident women who can get along in the world pretty good. No matter what the level of confidence is we often have areas of significant weakness and it is in those areas that our online sisters help us out the most.

I feel safe here, not because it's mostly all women but because no question is too dumb and all questions get respectfuly treated. I'm a straight single woman and in real life I have about an equal mix of men and women friends. Each perspective fills a different role or need. I live in a male dominated profession and hold my own just fine.

In my experience most women will be harder on women than men will and that's what I really like most about this forum, you are all very supportive but we know what females can accomplish so we hold our feet to the fire and expect the best we can offer. That's real sisterhood, to me anyway. I couldn't let this thread go by without throwing in my own 2 cents.

[salsabike]

In my experience most women will be harder on women than men will and that's what I really like most about this forum, you are all very supportive but we know what females can accomplish so we hold our feet to the fire and expect the best we can offer. That's real sisterhood, to me anyway. I couldn't let this thread go by without throwing in my own 2 cents.

Nice! I really like this.

[emily_in_nc]

Oooh...can we buy those in the TE store!!!!!!??????

Definitely high-viz! :D

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

I think that would give me saddle sores... :eek:

Those are some of those 'French saddles'. lol!

[GLC1968]

And really - don't they have a style a little more flattering?? Pompoms have never done anything for me.

I just noticed - little piece of trivia coming up. The closest camel, the one slobbering profusely all over the place, is, according to our camel guide in Jordan this winter, "looking for the ladies!"

Hmmm, he might have better luck if he weren't dressed like the ladies!

[grey]

I'm here because I have learned SO MUCH from all of you, at all levels of riding - meaning even things that may not apply to me, I can understand and share with someone I am riding with IRL who has some of those issues.

It's a very supportive forum - we honestly help each other and it's a great group of strong, independent, educated women who post here. I would never post in a male-dominated forum, as someone else said earlier, I get enough of the patronizing all-knowing tone from men on rides (thankfully the biggest offender in our group has moved away).

[deeaimond]

I joined this forum when I first started cycling a few years ago. I rode mostly alone, or with a group of much older men. They were nice but it was good to be able to read more about cycling stuff from a woman's perspective. I don't have much mechanical interest. Just interest in cycling, as a leisure activity.

The women here are very interesting, many have interests outside of cycling that they also share on this forum. They have experiences I would not be able to experience, and they also have the wisdom of years. It has opened my eyes as a younger person as to how multifaceted a woman's life should be and how it should not be just about family or work.

I don't ride often now because of the kind of work hours I keep, the variety o interests I have and the nature of my social life (non-cycling friends, lots of socialising now that I've been single again this year, living in a cosmopolitian city, lots of partying every weekend.. oops... Plus a variety of various physical ailments that keeps me on and off the bike. most recently i strained my back) I still hope for more frequent riding though. :)

I still visit this forum alot because I enjoy reading what all of you have been up to, and all the other stuff. This is I think the only forum that I visit regularly. Alot of other forums have too much 'airheadedness' where the whole thread is one line questions and few people have answers for anything (this is very general in terms of just looking through threads) so there isnt much to learn about or read :p

So yup, I enjoy this forum because I've learnt many things from on here over the years, and I find the women on this forum very accomplished and interesting role models :)

[Selkie]

TE folks are very generous in sharing their knowledge, support, and kindness.

I consider some folks here friends, even though I've never met them. I've gotten to know them, over the years (or at least have found their online personalities & character compatible with mine). There are people whom I find annoying but I'm sure that there are a lot of TE'ers who don't dig me. As long as there is mutual respect that we can agree to disagree, it's more than acceptable to me.

The diverse backgrounds, opinions and perspectives are interesting and I must admit, make me consider things that I might not have otherwise. It's made me more tolerant and understanding. And I miss some of the folks who've disappeared (Corsair Mac, Nanci, etc).

This is also a place where I can find people who are demographically similar to me: married, child-free by choice, athlete, reader, and dog mama!

[Becky]

This is also a place where I can find people who are demographically similar to me: married, child-free by choice, athlete, reader, and dog mama!


This! You ladies understand these parts of my life too, not just the athletic parts, and that means a lot to me.

[indysteel]

This! You ladies understand these parts of my life too, not just the athletic parts, and that means a lot to me.

Add me to that list (well, I'm a cat mama, but still....). While I'm fortunate that I have friends IRL who share that same demographic, I still feel like a bit of an odd ball because I don't have kids and, for a long time, was still single. So, it's nice to have a forum where children and romantic relationships are not the focus. Not that I have anything against kids, women with kids, or relationships; it's just not something I want to talk about all the time.

[Jo-n-NY]

I found TE in 2005 when I got my first road bike and needed to begin looking for cycling clothes. I was amazed at the selection and variety and bragged to my cycling friends of where to go for the best selection of womens cycling apparal.

Then I ventured to the forum and learned so much. My dh is in the bicycle business but I learned so much about what women need and want from the cycling industry and often relay the info to him. I found this forum to offer a wealth of info and I am always passing on to others who now also found this a great place to shop.

~ JoAnn

[redrhodie]

I have just realized another thing that keeps me here. You are all so inspiring! I can't wait to see what you're all up to, from long rides to short commutes, you always tell a good story. It's very motivating.

[Catrin]

... So, it's nice to have a forum where children and romantic relationships are not the focus. Not that I have anything against kids, women with kids, or relationships; it's just not something I want to talk about all the time.

This :) I am the only single/divorced person my age I know who doesn't have kids. I would love to be a cat mama but allergies are too bad these days, therefore I am a bike-mama instead ;) It is wonderful to be on a forum where relationships aren't the main focus.

I also would like go say that I really appreciate the level of literacy here and communication. Even in those times come when things get a little...warm, the flames do not get nearly as bad as other forums I've been on over the years. I think at least part of this is a result of our efforts over the years to get to know each other in person at every chance - which is another thing I like very much about TE.

[Kerry1976]

This :) I am the only single/divorced person my age I know who doesn't have kids. I would love to be a cat mama but allergies are too bad these days, therefore I am a bike-mama instead ;) It is wonderful to be on a forum where relationships aren't the main focus.


Oh my goodness - this is so me - divorced/single with no kids. I would have a cat but my landlord doesn't allow it. I couldn't agree more!

[Crankin]

You know, I think this is also the reason I stayed with TE. I can't stand the constant blathering about kids that most women do and I have two kids! This was a serious problem for me when my children were small and it earned me the reputation of being "cold" in the eyes of neighbors and parents of my kids' friends (not my own friends). My older son castigated me for grading papers at his Little League games when he was 11 or 12, so I know the perception was probably true. I didn't want to engage in the kid boasting and teacher bashing that went on at such venues. And I must say, it continues... now the boasting centers on who is married, engaged, having kids, or in grad school/professional school.
A sort of related story. As my DH dropped me off in front of the arena for graduation and I was walking in with a colleague, I heard someone call my name. It was the mother of one of my younger son's HS friends, standing there with her daughter. The daughter was actually in another program in my department, something that made me feel very old! Anyway, she asked me who was graduating (duh, I was carrying my cap and gown) and I am sure she fully expected me to say the name of one of my kids. When I said it was me and that (jokingly) I felt the need to get another master's degree and change careers at age 57, she looked incredulous. Like I would have any other interests or desires at this age. This is a woman I've known tangentially for years and I could tell she just didn't get it.
And that is what I love about TE. You get it.

[Trek420]

Even in those times come when things get a little...warm, the flames do not get nearly as bad as other forums I've been on over the years.

That's because we can always ask "is it hot in here or is it just me?"

Also we do flame but articulately and well :) Who was it who said ... I think it was W. Churchill "Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip." :D

I <3 TE, long live TE :cool:

[Biciclista]

You know, I think this is also the reason I stayed with TE. I can't stand the constant blathering about kids that most women do and I have two kids! This was a serious problem for me when my children were small and it earned me the reputation of being "cold" in the eyes of neighbors and parents of my kids' friends (not my own friends).


Crankin, you're onto something very important about the atmosphere at TE.
It's not that we don't love our kids (I have two wonderful sons) but that we are actively trying to improve ourselves and not HIDING behind our kids to ignore our own lives. We all know women like that. Their own souls are obfuscated (OH I ALWAYS WANTED TO USE THAT WORD) by their kids. If you completely focus on your children, you can ignore the holes in your lives. Some women are like that with their partners too. If I natter on and on about my partner, I can ignore the fact that I am falling apart...

Here on TE we're all actively trying to improve our lives, what by riding bikes or running, eating better, setting a good example, pursuing education, reading good novels.... THAT is the cool thing about this community.

[sundial]

It all started with a pair of cycling shorts. :)

I came across TE when I was searching for a cycling short and found that TE offered the best selection of quality gear for ladies at an attractive price point. When I had a question about a product it was so nice to be able to talk to Susan personally to ask her opinion about a product and more often than not she would make a recommendation for something that was even more appropriate for my body type and distance riding. I cannot express enough my appreciation for that kind of customer service. TE continues to lead the industry in that respect.

When I joined the forum, I found it to have a very civil tone as set forth by the moderators and it continues to be so to this day. It is refreshing to be able to come here to express our opinions, which are generally well received in a safe and supportive environment. I appreciate the different perspectives from various cultures as it has prompted me to do some soul searching on several occasions. I continue to be amazed at how we can connect with others on an emotional level through a portal.

I do wish Susan and her company continued success and may we enjoy the benefit of their labors.

[indysteel]

You know, I think this is also the reason I stayed with TE. I can't stand the constant blathering about kids that most women do and I have two kids! This was a serious problem for me when my children were small and it earned me the reputation of being "cold" in the eyes of neighbors and parents of my kids' friends (not my own friends). My older son castigated me for grading papers at his Little League games when he was 11 or 12, so I know the perception was probably true. I didn't want to engage in the kid boasting and teacher bashing that went on at such venues. And I must say, it continues... now the boasting centers on who is married, engaged, having kids, or in grad school/professional school.
A sort of related story. As my DH dropped me off in front of the arena for graduation and I was walking in with a colleague, I heard someone call my name. It was the mother of one of my younger son's HS friends, standing there with her daughter. The daughter was actually in another program in my department, something that made me feel very old! Anyway, she asked me who was graduating (duh, I was carrying my cap and gown) and I am sure she fully expected me to say the name of one of my kids. When I said it was me and that (jokingly) I felt the need to get another master's degree and change careers at age 57, she looked incredulous. Like I would have any other interests or desires at this age. This is a woman I've known tangentially for years and I could tell she just didn't get it.
And that is what I love about TE. You get it.

You've touched on another big reason that I like TE. IRL, I'm surrounded by woman who treat growing older like an affliction. They're not physically active, they often have a host of health issues, they don't aspire to do anything particularly new or dynamic with their lives or careers, etc., etc.

The women on TE, however, offer far more exciting and positive examples of what we can accomplish and do as we age. Yes, we usually admit that our bodies and minds are changing with age, but it's rare that I hear anyone here really let that stop them. I realize that at age 41, I'm hardly "old," but I do spend a fair amount of time thinking about what the next 30 or more years of my life are going to look like, especially since I have a younger husband that I'd very much like to keep up with. I want to be active and fully engaged in life year after year. You ladies really inspire me to do that and to think big.

[Biciclista]

I'm going to be 60 this year, that IS old. But I'm going to fight it every single step of the way.

And TE is one of the ways.

[Veronica]

I'm going to be 60 this year, ....

Really?

If I think about the age of your kids, it makes sense. But with the rides you do and your zest for life, I'd have guessed early 50s!

60 as a number sounds old, but the reality doesn't have to be. I think I like "experienced" better than old. :D

Veronica

[OakLeaf]

I'm going to be 60 this year, that IS old.

Naw. When I was 15, 60 was old. Now that I'm 51, 60 is young. :p


I do enjoy the range of ages we have here.

[maillotpois]

Crankin, you're onto something very important about the atmosphere at TE.
It's not that we don't love our kids (I have two wonderful sons) but that we are actively trying to improve ourselves and not HIDING behind our kids to ignore our own lives. We all know women like that. Their own souls are obfuscated (OH I ALWAYS WANTED TO USE THAT WORD) by their kids.


I like this observation! As one of the few working moms in my daughter's class I feel a bit out of it all - don't even bring up the double centuries and the 600k brevet. It's weird enough that I run my own business and work all over the Bay Area up to 10 hour days. And I love my kid (and my husband). But I have a life, too, and I'm always working on making it better/more interesting.

And I agree with V on the 60 thing. :)

[Bike Writer]

I'm going to be 60 this year, that IS old. But I'm going to fight it every single step of the way.

And TE is one of the ways.

60 can't be old - heck I'm almost there myself! I'll go out on a limb and say that for the women of this forum 60 is the new 40. There are examples all around here of women doing things in their 50's and 60's that people stopped engaging in during their 40's in years past. Our stories are so inspirational to one another and a big contributing factor for what keeps people around here.

[indigoiis]

There are differences. We have different bodies, even if some of us are boyish in build. We experience things guys don't (like monthlies, and menapause) and we have some concerns that frankly only a small percentage of guys are concerned with.

[Biciclista]

60 can't be old - heck I'm almost there myself! I'll go out on a limb and say that for the women of this forum 60 is the new 40. There are examples all around here of women doing things in their 50's and 60's that people stopped engaging in during their 40's in years past. Our stories are so inspirational to one another and a big contributing factor for what keeps people around here.

whether you think 60 is old or not is not the point. Go to Walmart where you will see just how old 60 can be.
My point is we aren't laying down and giving up. At TE, this is where you can find self-empowered women who are trying to NOT be old at 60, 50, 40...
and to be healthy at all the other ages..
women that do brevets! what a tiny little group you are!

[snapdragen]

I get what you're saying Mimi, there is 60 years young, and 60 years old. You are in the young category.

I'll never forget the look on my friend Aurora's face when she found out I was the same age as her mom. "But....my mom is old!" :D

[indysteel]

I get what you're saying Mimi, there is 60 years young, and 60 years old. You are in the young category.

I'll never forget the look on my friend Aurora's face when she found out I was the same age as her mom. "But....my mom is old!" :D

And that's really the point I was getting at. If "young" women simply used what they saw in the general population to define what being 50/60/70 looks like....well, we'd be pretty discouraged by what was in store for us. To come here, however, and see so many shining examples of women who are defying the perception that any given age is "old" is incredibly illuminating and empowering.

Of course, that same logic applies at younger ages to. When I joined TE at age 36, I was pretty inspired by people my own age who were kicking some serious butt athletically. I'm still pretty inspired (and humbled) by these same women.

[lph]

Their own souls are obfuscated (OH I ALWAYS WANTED TO USE THAT WORD)

:D :D That is a WONDERFUL word!

I love your points, both about not overengaging in our kids, and about few hangups about age.

[PamNY]

I find the TE attitude about age -- or lack of attitude -- very helpful. Age comes up occasionally, but no one would even think of using age to define what I can or should do.

I agree with most of the TE positives that have been listed in this thread. The one that was completely unexpected for me is how inspiring I find other women's stories. Many of you (probably most) are going farther and faster than I ever will, but that doesn't matter at all.

Whether it's a triathlon, a mountain biking trail, or transporting a child in a trailer, we are all learning, growing and facing new challenges. I treasure this positive influence in my life.

[Norse]

I originally came here when I was searching for some female-specific advice on bike saddles. I have stayed for many of the reasons already articulated by others. Where else can I come and talk about biking in a non-flaming forum, discuss pets, gardening, food, ... and Diva cups! :D

[Crankin]

Maillotpois, I always felt "out of it" compared to other mothers. And yet, almost all of the other women i worked with had kids, but they had no other life between their kids and teaching and other family commitments. Heck, if we hadn't found our "cycling" friends, around the time both of our kids had flown the coop, I am not sure we would be able to stand being around our "regular" friends. It's interesting that this couple has no kids; they are younger than us, but we are well matched in terms of what we do athletically. Our other friends "humor" us when talk about our rides, but they are OK with it. Still, it seemed more acceptable when I was running to the gym and it was DH and DS who were riding.
Mimi, that word is awesome. Seriously, one of my non-riding close friends has the same attitude as me regarding the kid thing, but she is overweight and complains about it constantly. The other friend talks about what she "used" to do. I can barely stand it.
The best advice I received from my mom, before she died was to make sure that DH and I developed an interest we could do together. Both of my kids were in middle school at the time and could be left alone finally; she knew we needed more than going out to dinner and the movies.

[lph]

I find the TE attitude about age -- or lack of attitude -- very helpful. Age comes up occasionally, but no one would even think of using age to define what I can or should do.

Actually, more often than not it's the other way round. I see posts joyfully proclaiming "I'm so and so old, and I'm the oldest in my training group/triathlon club/beginners class. How cool is that!". People here revel in finding out how much they can do at whatever age, how they're never too old to try something new, and so many others cheer them on. That spirit is so dominant here that one of the only things that might get you somewhat flamed is saying that you've given up trying to do something. But I think it's just enthusiasm speaking, we so want everyone to feel that sense of achievement.

[Owlie]

I'm in a very different place in life from most of you, so I occasionally feel left out of discussions, but I still feel I can contribute something to the forum...provided the rest of you don't get there first!

I believe I touched on this up-thread, but I'm part of a knitting forum. (SadieKate actually introduced me to TE from over there when I was looking to buy a bike! Thanks SadieKate!) They're a wonderfully supportive bunch, it's a well-moderated forum...but I rarely feel like I can contribute anything. Odds are good that if it's not about knitting (I'm not good at answering "how do I do this?" questions without something in my hand), it's about their kids/grandkids/significant others. It may be that knitting is a more "domestic" hobby than cycling is, but it seems that online, many of these women become entirely wrapped up in their kids or Mothering. It's not my cup of tea at all.

And may I just add to the chorus by saying that you all are inspiring. :)

[SadieKate]

I believe I touched on this up-thread, but I'm part of a knitting forum. (SadieKate actually introduced me to TE from over there when I was looking to buy a bike! Thanks SadieKate!)

You're welcome! Can you now kick me in the arse to get started knitting again? :p

[snapdragen]

You're welcome! Can you now kick me in the arse to get started knitting again? :p

C'mere, I can help with that.... :p

[sundial]

Go to Walmart where you will see just how old 60 can be.

Oh I know what you mean! My area is NOT cycling friendly by any means and by that I mean that there are no lockers to store bikes at work, no bike lanes, roads with big shoulders, etc. There are limited rec areas at the park and very few walking trails so it's no surprise that obesity is on the rise.

[jobob]

Many of you (probably most) are going farther and faster than I ever will ...


Heh. Among the many things I've learned from the TE community is do not underestimate yourself, and never say never.

:cool:


Great thread, ladies.

[SadieKate]

C'mere, I can help with that.... :pHey, invitation only! :p

[salsabike]

So while Snap kicks SK's butt, I am going to try to answer lph's question, why a women's forum?

I like women, as a gender, and I like men, as a gender. There are individuals of each gender that have traits I don't like much, but they're in the minority. I know a lot of really great women. They don't all have to be cyclists, or even athletes, although most of them want to be active and find ways to be active that they like. I know a whole lot of totally awesome men as well. I am married to one, and most of my close friends also have husbands who are really wonderful. I don't seem to prefer one gender over the other and it bothers me a little when I hear people say that they do, whichever gender it is.

I like this forum because I like women as a group, I guess. I think most of them, whether they like or do the same things I do or not, are interesting, strong, adventurous characters who learn a lot about life and people and themselves over time and thus have a lot of perspective to offer, have varied interests and talents that I like to hear about, and care about the world and the living things in it. Women in a group can be a real force for good stuff. That isn't always true but it often is, and I'm not sure I think that about men in a group.

And I have no idea whether I made enough sense there or not, but it's about the best I can do by way of explanation. :)

[Bike Writer]

whether you think 60 is old or not is not the point. Go to Walmart where you will see just how old 60 can be.
My point is we aren't laying down and giving up. At TE, this is where you can find self-empowered women who are trying to NOT be old at 60, 50, 40...
and to be healthy at all the other ages..
women that do brevets! what a tiny little group you are!

Yes. Not giving up or giving out. I believe what inspires people who come here is to see living proof that what they are thinking about or considering doing is indeed possible. Someone in their 40's or 50's and more, or any age for that matter, that is wondering to themselves "is it possible, can I still do this, dare I?" comes to the forum and sees examples of every day women doing the very thing (and much more!) that they are wondering if they are up to doing. This certainly even applies to younger moms who are considering themselves "over the hill" because they feel bogged down with child care and the responsabilities of adulthood, taking care of the family and managing a household and all the chores that come with it. They don't see any "out" or light at the end of the tunnel, then they come here and read about other moms who do it and are living the life they want to aspire to.

This community is so much more than an information exchange. It's an empowerment exchange. (sorry that is such an overused and tired word but I can't think of another at this moment, sheesh and I call myself bike writer:mad:).

[zoom-zoom]

So while Snap kicks SK's butt, I am going to try to answer lph's question, why a women's forum?

I like women, as a gender, and I like men, as a gender. There are individuals of each gender that have traits I don't like much, but they're in the minority. I know a lot of really great women. They don't all have to be cyclists, or even athletes, although most of them want to be active and find ways to be active that they like. I know a whole lot of totally awesome men as well. I am married to one, and most of my close friends also have husbands who are really wonderful. I don't seem to prefer one gender over the other and it bothers me a little when I hear people say that they do, whichever gender it is.

I like this forum because I like women as a group, I guess. I think most of them, whether they like or do the same things I do or not, are interesting, strong, adventurous characters who learn a lot about life and people and themselves over time and thus have a lot of perspective to offer, have varied interests and talents that I like to hear about, and care about the world and the living things in it. Women in a group can be a real force for good stuff. That isn't always true but it often is, and I'm not sure I think that about men in a group.

And I have no idea whether I made enough sense there or not, but it's about the best I can do by way of explanation. :)

I totally get this...and I could have written the exact same post. :)

[SadieKate]

And I have no idea whether I made enough sense there or not

Blah-blah-Snap kicks SK's butt-blah-blah-blah.






Actually, that was some magnificent cerebral pontificating, dahling. :D

[salsabike]

I was ALSO going to say that some of the forum members make me laugh a lot!

Of course, whether they MEAN to be amusing, like, on PURPOSE, or they're just....I will leave that to yourself to determine. Miss SK.

Blahblahblah Ginger, I believe is that dog's name....

Thbtthpptthhh!:p

[maillotpois]

So while Snap kicks SK's butt...


This thread is worthless without pictures.

[luv2climb]

Yes. Not giving up or giving out. I believe what inspires people who come here is to see living proof that what they are thinking about or considering doing is indeed possible. Someone in their 40's or 50's and more, or any age for that matter, that is wondering to themselves "is it possible, can I still do this, dare I?" comes to the forum and sees examples of every day women doing the very thing (and much more!) that they are wondering if they are up to doing.
That is exactly why I sometimes post videos of myself climbing steep hills. Yes they're full of heavy breathing instead of the annoying music most people seem to prefer, but that is the reality of climbing and it shows that I really am putting out the effort to do as well as I can, given the fact that I am in my forties and still at least 20 pounds over ideal weight. Climbing hills and permanently modifying my eating habits caused me to lose 64 pounds since last May.

Even though I'm still a newbie, most people have been very friendly and supportive. The only time I had a problem was when certain posters misinterpreted one of my threads. I came across as boastful to them, when I was simply grateful that I had gained enough strength and lost enough weight to finally be able to pass someone instead of being passed constantly, which can be demoralizing sometimes.

[tangentgirl]

I'm here because I heard there was a keg. After checking the back yard, and the basement, and the garage, I realized it was the party over on Maple St., not this one, but this place was full of such cool folks, I decided to stick around anyhow.

I don't have too many close female friends, and the ones I do have don't really ride. I can't remember if I was looking for women's bike clothing and found TE and then the forums, or if I was looking for women's bike forums and found the store, but apparently I was looking for something I could relate to when I found this place. Stuff here is interesting and informative, and the people are awesome.

Hooray for literacy! Hooray for troll-catching! Hooray for the microbrews in the fridge, which are way better than the Bud Light that was probably in the keg on Maple.

[SadieKate]

*like*

[Flybye]

Among other things-
I am here because the forum isn't laden with pornographic pictures of women, the "F" bomb, and responses to questions that insult the poster's intelligence.

[Biciclista]

Among other things-
I am here because the forum isn't laden with pornographic pictures of women, the "F" bomb, and responses to questions that insult the poster's intelligence.

no kidding. Although I confess to having posted a naked picture of Lance on his bike several years ago here (the thread was quickly locked and thrown away.. :( ) but that still hangs on my wall in my studio. ;)

[Veronica]

I have a nearly pornographic picture of myself here. :D

Veronica

[jobob]

:eek:

[luv2climb]

I have a nearly pornographic picture of myself here. :D

Veronica
I have pornographic-sounding videos of myself here:p:D

In my last post I forgot to mention a few things, as I was tired. I am also a member of BikeForums. Like another poster in this thread, I am overweight. I started a thread in the General Cycling subforum asking why so many people put music over their ride videos. It turned into a bit of a debate, but stayed civil. A couple of the male Clydes there suggested that I should upload a ride video. At first I was hesitant because I figured all the Sir Lance-a-wants on there would scoff at my slow climbing speed. Finally I agreed to make a video and it ended up being very popular:D One of the guys who first suggested I make the video sent me a PM telling me about the Clydesdale/Athena subforum. He suggested posting the video there and told me it is a very supportive, friendly forum where people are rarely insulting. He was right. When I posted the video it was very well received.

Since then I have posted many videos there and contributed to many threads. The people there are the friendliest on BF.

The Road Cycling subforum is the opposite. I tried posting some of my videos in the ride video thread there. They were ignored, while the "cool people" with the super expensive high-tech toys, 20 mph average speeds, and super-annoying music over their videos got rave reviews:rolleyes: I even explained that I posted the videos to show what the average recreational cyclist is capable of if they are determined enough. I mentioned that I am an overweight female. Still no responses. That was the reaction I was afraid of in the beginning when people first said I should make a video.

I also got ignored when I posted pictures of my road bike in the pictures threads. Since I don't own a carbon wonder bike worth thousands of dollars, I was deemed unworthy:rolleyes:

I also have access to BF's Women's Cycling subforum, but I no longer post there. After banging heads with several members there, I figured my warped sense of humor and cynical nature are not compatible with most of the posters in that forum.

[Crankin]

Mimi, I saved that picture of Lance in my documents folder!!!

[Biciclista]

Mimi, I saved that picture of Lance in my documents folder!!!

Glad to know someone else got it :cool::D

[Catrin]

Was this last year, I seem to remember something...

[Biciclista]

no, it was at least 3 or 4 years ago

it was 2007 and if you send me your email address it can be yours

[jobob]

no, it was at least 3 or 4 years ago

it was 2007 and if you send me your email address it can be yours

Do you have a watercolor version? :D

[pll]

You can buy an original print.... if you have some $18k around:

http://www.artnet.com/AUCTIONS/Pages/Lots/24613.aspx

[Biciclista]

No, I have not done a watercolor of it :D and wow, $18k!!!!!

[jessmarimba]

You can buy an original print.... if you have some $18k around:

http://www.artnet.com/AUCTIONS/Pages/Lots/24613.aspx

Guess I'd better start saving now!

[jobob]

No, I have not done a watercolor of it :D and wow, $18k!!!!!


Makes me want to take painting lessons ;)

[channlluv]

Ditto, but I'd go with Fabian or Thor.

[Selkie]

Mimi, I saved that picture of Lance in my documents folder!!!

You vixen you!

[Brandi]

I can't spell or read! What am I doing here? How did I get here? Who is Lance Armstrong?
wuv u all!!!!

[Brandi]

Ditto, but I'd go with Fabian or Thor.
Mmmmmmm Thor or the blond guy from True Blood!

[redrhodie]

I can't spell or read! What am I doing here? How did I get here? Who is Lance Armstrong?
wuv u all!!!!

Because we wuv you too! ;)

[Brandi]

Because we wuv you too! ;):o ty!

[Grits]

Mmmmmmm Thor or the blond guy from True Blood!

That would be Eric, and, YES, I agree! Can't wait for it to start back;)

[Bethany1]

I happened to find this forum after doing a Google search. I am a member of Bike Forums and found it was a good site. They were helpful in my frustrations of being a new rider and I didn't feel like I was ignored because I was a woman. I just felt ignored due to lack of experience. I do like the aggressiveness of Bike Forum and always find a laugh with the banter or the crazy opinions, but unless you live and breathe cycling, most of the topics aren't in my league. The biggest help is the advocacy and safety one since I know I need the most help in that.

My expertise is in quilting not cycling so I'm constantly learning as I go through both forums. There aren't any women cyclists where I live so I'm on my own for everything and in my own personal acheivements.

I'm usually intimidated by women forums as in some of the quilting and/or the brand of sewing machine sites can get downright mean and ugly. I've found guys just are just harmlessly obnoxious in responses but women are out to stab you in the back if you don't fit the forum ideals. I haven't found this to be true in the few days I've been here and that's refreshing.

[PamNY]

I'm usually intimidated by women forums as in some of the quilting and/or the brand of sewing machine sites can get downright mean and ugly. I've found guys just are just harmlessly obnoxious in responses but women are out to stab you in the back if you don't fit the forum ideals. I haven't found this to be true in the few days I've been here and that's refreshing.

I've had experience with a vicious sewing forum -- it was truly comical that people could get so nasty over sewing.

I'm glad you found this group. It's a great place for information and support.

[Owlie]

I'm usually intimidated by women forums as in some of the quilting and/or the brand of sewing machine sites can get downright mean and ugly. I've found guys just are just harmlessly obnoxious in responses but women are out to stab you in the back if you don't fit the forum ideals. I haven't found this to be true in the few days I've been here and that's refreshing.

I feel this particular forum is less clique-y than the other one (predominantly women) I'm on. They're by-and-large nice people, but part of the reason I don't go there much anymore is that "the rules" didn't seem to apply to a particular group of people. For example, one relatively new member posted something about her pregnancy in a general forum. A member of The Group (and mod) replied that she wasn't allowed to post such things because "there are a number of people on this board who are dealing with infertility and they don't want to read about this." Members of The Group were allowed, however, to go on about their pregnancies and offspring at length in those same general forums. :rolleyes:

[Biciclista]

Owlie, I would have trouble with a forum like that.
If I wanted to post about my custom bike they might say that was prohibited because a lot of people can't afford a custom bike and they don't want to read about it?

:cool:

[Cataboo]

You make me & my poor shoddy bikes feel inadequate everytime you show off your beautiful orange bike with its chrome bling.

[Biciclista]

snort. you had better report me then. LOL

[Cataboo]

Oh, first you make me feel inadequate, and now you publicly mock me over it.

[Biciclista]

ROTFL!
the fact is, you have more bikes than I do and I'm jealous. Peope shouldn't be able to list more than 3 bikes so that other people don't get their hearts broken.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

i think people shouldn't be allowed to list more than two bikes, so I don't feel inadequate. :D

[Catrin]

Well, certainly not more than two STEEL bikes so my bikes don't get jealous :D

[Owlie]

See, I don't think anyone should be allowed to list more than one entry-level bike because I might feel inadequate. So there. :p:D

[Catrin]

See, I don't think anyone should be allowed to list more than one entry-level bike because I might feel inadequate. So there. :p:D

heheheh :)

[Biciclista]

I'm glad we're not really like that.

[Antaresia]

I have only had good experiences with female oriented forms, so I immediately signed up when I found this one - I found it by accident when goggling something else.

Lets face it, we live in a world where 90% of laundry detergent commercials feature women, and 95% of sport-related commercials feature men. I don't think that men really relate to that kind of life experience, or even think about it. I don't think they understand that they get to be default gender, and we get to be represented as the "token chick" in most things. Or how men's sports/physical activities are held in much higher esteem. You might think that kind of thing dosen't matter when asking a question about internal hub shifters, but that attitude does come out in subtle ways.

In a form about physical activity, it's nice to have a like-minded, judgment-free group of people to talk to. I would much rather ask questions here than bikeforms, though I do do enjoy lurking there and reading back-post of interest.

I don't like to think of myself as either "girly-girl" or "practical" (as disturbing as it is to make those two options opposites); because I'm a quite a mix of both.

It's a really nice community here.

[channlluv]

Hey, Bethany, we can be harmlessly obnoxious, too. Just hang around a bit. And welcome.

As for listing bikes, I'm fighting the urge to go buy a new Cannondale just to impress you people. Sheesh.

Although I could use a new bike. I only have the '07 Ruby Comp and a 16-year-old steel-frame Palomar mtb. That thing weighs 37 lbs with my tool kit and water bottles!

Dang it. I do love the carbon, but I'm not crazy about the paint job.

Roxy

[Cataboo]

ROTFL!
the fact is, you have more bikes than I do and I'm jealous. Peope shouldn't be able to list more than 3 bikes so that other people don't get their hearts broken.

We both still only have 1 butt.

[Biciclista]

does this forum make my butt look big?

[Owlie]

does this forum make my butt look big?

Is there a right answer to this question?

[Biciclista]

:cool:

in a woman's forum, you bet!

[Cataboo]

does this forum make my butt look big?

no, it & your bikes make your butt look fast